Australian Politics Forum - Was the Vietnam war a War Crime?

Karnal

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Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime?
Reply #195 - Jan 26^th, 2013 at 5:48pm

None of the "peacekeeping action" that constituted the Vietnam war for our side was technically a war. That doesn’t exempt those involved from the Geneva Convention on the treatment of prisoners of war. The evidence of war crimes is there, and if there was a solid enough international legal framework, those responsible in Australia and the US could legally be indicted and prosecuted.

I’m referring to both Tonkin incidents, as I doubt there would be a need for a second if the US was found to be faultless in the first. Still, these incidents were only instrumental in getting force approved by the US Congress. The international standards that apply today were not as applicable during the height of the Cold War, and anyway, war courts and tribunals are only ever established by a victor against the vanquished.

What’s amazing today, 37 years on, is being able to walk the streets of Hanoi and be made to feel welcome. Same in Cambodia, same in Laos. Sure, the dollar is a powerful motivator, but we’re talking about an entire region where everyone knows someone who was killed by a US bomb, bullet, landmine, flamethrower or nepalm attack. Everyone.

A few years after the "Amerikan war", the Vietnamese had to do some peacekeeping action of their own in Cambodia. If you want my idea of a just war, there it is: getting rid of the Khmer Rouge. In Cambodia, you see very few people over 50, and they’ve forgiven us too. You see?

All are forgiven unconditionally and loved beyond measure.

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BigOl64

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Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime?
Reply #196 - Jan 26^th, 2013 at 6:00pm

Karnal wrote on Jan 26^th, 2013 at 12:41pm:

The only person I’m engaging on the subject of Nam is the only other poster here who was there. What were you, Light? Gunner?

Warfy is younger than me and since I was only 8 yrs old at the end of that conflict I doubt he was one of your 'brothers in arms'.

This post in nothing more than mindless accusations and inane drivel, if this 'evidence' you gathered from youtube is worth anything, send it to the Hague as there is no limitation on war crimes. But i suspect it will be viewed with the same bemusement by them as it was by us.

Move a long nothing to see here.

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gizmo_2655

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Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime?
Reply #197 - Jan 26^th, 2013 at 6:06pm

Karnal wrote on Jan 26^th, 2013 at 5:48pm:

None of the "peacekeeping action" that constituted the Vietnam war for our side was technically a war. That doesn’t exempt those involved from the Geneva Convention on the treatment of prisoners of war. The evidence of war crimes is there, and if there was a solid enough international legal framework, those responsible in Australia and the US could legally be indicted and prosecuted.

I’m referring to both Tonkin incidents, as I doubt there would be a need for a second if the US was found to be faultless in the first. Still, these incidents were only instrumental in getting force approved by the US Congress. The international standards that apply today were not as applicable during the height of the Cold War, and anyway, war courts and tribunals are only ever established by a victor against the vanquished.

What’s amazing today, 37 years on, is being able to walk the streets of Hanoi and be made to feel welcome. Same in Cambodia, same in Laos. Sure, the dollar is a powerful motivator, but we’re talking about an entire region where everyone knows someone who was killed by a US bomb, bullet, landmine, flamethrower or nepalm attack. Everyone.

A few years after the "Amerikan war", the Vietnamese had to do some peacekeeping action of their own in Cambodia. If you want my idea of a just war, there it is: getting rid of the Khmer Rouge. In Cambodia, you see very few people over 50, and they’ve forgiven us too. You see?

All are forgiven unconditionally and loved beyond measure.

And the fact that you would even say that proves that you weren't there, and most likely, never saw combat in the remote possibility that you did ever serve in the armed forces.

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It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
Bobbythebat

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gizmo_2655 Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 16010 South West NSW Gender:	Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime? Reply #198 - Jan 26^th, 2013 at 6:06pm double post..
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Karnal Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 96708	Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime? Reply #199 - Jan 26^th, 2013 at 6:06pm There are those with eyes who will not see. Light forgives them unconditionally, but we know that these dupes will manifest that which they hath invoked. Forgiven.
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Karnal

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Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime?
Reply #200 - Jan 26^th, 2013 at 6:11pm

gizmo_2655 wrote on Jan 26^th, 2013 at 6:06pm:

Karnal wrote on Jan 26^th, 2013 at 5:48pm:

None of the "peacekeeping action" that constituted the Vietnam war for our side was technically a war. That doesn’t exempt those involved from the Geneva Convention on the treatment of prisoners of war. The evidence of war crimes is there, and if there was a solid enough international legal framework, those responsible in Australia and the US could legally be indicted and prosecuted.

I’m referring to both Tonkin incidents, as I doubt there would be a need for a second if the US was found to be faultless in the first. Still, these incidents were only instrumental in getting force approved by the US Congress. The international standards that apply today were not as applicable during the height of the Cold War, and anyway, war courts and tribunals are only ever established by a victor against the vanquished.

What’s amazing today, 37 years on, is being able to walk the streets of Hanoi and be made to feel welcome. Same in Cambodia, same in Laos. Sure, the dollar is a powerful motivator, but we’re talking about an entire region where everyone knows someone who was killed by a US bomb, bullet, landmine, flamethrower or nepalm attack. Everyone.

A few years after the "Amerikan war", the Vietnamese had to do some peacekeeping action of their own in Cambodia. If you want my idea of a just war, there it is: getting rid of the Khmer Rouge. In Cambodia, you see very few people over 50, and they’ve forgiven us too. You see?

All are forgiven unconditionally and loved beyond measure.

And the fact that you would even say that proves that you weren't there, and most likely, never saw combat in the remote possibility that you did ever serve in the armed forces.

What are you saying? I’ve never been to Vietnam, Laos or Cambodia?

You don’t want to see my service record, son. It puts yours to shame, I can tell you that much.

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... Gold Member Offline Posts: 23673 WA Gender:	Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime? Reply #201 - Jan 26^th, 2013 at 7:15pm A little background reading for the bullshitters among us. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Boy_Who_Cried_Wolf
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gizmo_2655

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Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime?
Reply #202 - Jan 26^th, 2013 at 7:53pm

Karnal wrote on Jan 26^th, 2013 at 6:11pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Jan 26^th, 2013 at 6:06pm:

Karnal wrote on Jan 26^th, 2013 at 5:48pm:

None of the "peacekeeping action" that constituted the Vietnam war for our side was technically a war. That doesn’t exempt those involved from the Geneva Convention on the treatment of prisoners of war. The evidence of war crimes is there, and if there was a solid enough international legal framework, those responsible in Australia and the US could legally be indicted and prosecuted.

I’m referring to both Tonkin incidents, as I doubt there would be a need for a second if the US was found to be faultless in the first. Still, these incidents were only instrumental in getting force approved by the US Congress. The international standards that apply today were not as applicable during the height of the Cold War, and anyway, war courts and tribunals are only ever established by a victor against the vanquished.

What’s amazing today, 37 years on, is being able to walk the streets of Hanoi and be made to feel welcome. Same in Cambodia, same in Laos. Sure, the dollar is a powerful motivator, but we’re talking about an entire region where everyone knows someone who was killed by a US bomb, bullet, landmine, flamethrower or nepalm attack. Everyone.

A few years after the "Amerikan war", the Vietnamese had to do some peacekeeping action of their own in Cambodia. If you want my idea of a just war, there it is: getting rid of the Khmer Rouge. In Cambodia, you see very few people over 50, and they’ve forgiven us too. You see?

All are forgiven unconditionally and loved beyond measure.

And the fact that you would even say that proves that you weren't there, and most likely, never saw combat in the remote possibility that you did ever serve in the armed forces.

What are you saying? I’ve never been to Vietnam, Laos or Cambodia?

You don’t want to see my service record, son. It puts yours to shame, I can tell you that much.

Not during combat ops for sure...Maybe peace time stationing.

And I don't have a service record...I'm only 49, so I was too young to be caught up in the conscription.

p.s I did have cousins and uncles who went, and they'd all have shot themselves (or someone else) rather than say the type of crap you've been spouting.

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"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
Bobbythebat

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Soren

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Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime?
Reply #203 - Jan 26^th, 2013 at 7:56pm

Karnal wrote on Jan 26^th, 2013 at 6:11pm:

What are you saying? I’ve never been to Vietnam, Laos or Cambodia?

You don’t want to see my service record, son. It puts yours to shame, I can tell you that much.

He is saying that you are an outrageous poof banging on about your SE Asian sex tours, nailing little brown lads for $10 a trick as if they were tours of Nam and the war zone.

What did you think he was saying???

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KJT1981 Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 1822	Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime? Reply #204 - Jan 26^th, 2013 at 8:36pm Karnal would have to be at least 62 to have been in Vietnam.
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Karnal Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 96708	Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime? Reply #205 - Jan 26^th, 2013 at 8:49pm KJT1981 wrote on Jan 26^th, 2013 at 8:36pm: Karnal would have to be at least 62 to have been in Vietnam. So you keep saying, love. That all depends though, doesn’t it. I’ll let you in on a little trade secret, boys: they’re not brown in Vietnam. Mind you, they’re all brown inside, eh?
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Soren

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Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime?
Reply #206 - Jan 26^th, 2013 at 8:55pm

Karnal wrote on Jan 26^th, 2013 at 8:49pm:

KJT1981 wrote on Jan 26^th, 2013 at 8:36pm:

Karnal would have to be at least 62 to have been in Vietnam.

So you keep saying, love. That all depends though, doesn’t it.

I’ll let you in on a little trade secret, boys: they’re not brown in Vietnam.

Mind you, they’re all brown inside, eh?

You've been drilling for 'brown' long enough, eh?

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Karnal Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 96708	Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime? Reply #207 - Jan 26^th, 2013 at 9:11pm Sure. I’ve had you more times that I’ve had vegemite sandwitches. After a while, boys, it’s time to move on. Things haven’t been the same since the old Kraut’s colostomy. How about you, KJT? You up for it, love?
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Swagman

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Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime?
Reply #208 - Jan 26^th, 2013 at 9:18pm

Karnal wrote on Jan 26^th, 2013 at 6:11pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Jan 26^th, 2013 at 6:06pm:

Karnal wrote on Jan 26^th, 2013 at 5:48pm:

None of the "peacekeeping action" that constituted the Vietnam war for our side was technically a war. That doesn’t exempt those involved from the Geneva Convention on the treatment of prisoners of war. The evidence of war crimes is there, and if there was a solid enough international legal framework, those responsible in Australia and the US could legally be indicted and prosecuted.

I’m referring to both Tonkin incidents, as I doubt there would be a need for a second if the US was found to be faultless in the first. Still, these incidents were only instrumental in getting force approved by the US Congress. The international standards that apply today were not as applicable during the height of the Cold War, and anyway, war courts and tribunals are only ever established by a victor against the vanquished.

What’s amazing today, 37 years on, is being able to walk the streets of Hanoi and be made to feel welcome. Same in Cambodia, same in Laos. Sure, the dollar is a powerful motivator, but we’re talking about an entire region where everyone knows someone who was killed by a US bomb, bullet, landmine, flamethrower or nepalm attack. Everyone.

A few years after the "Amerikan war", the Vietnamese had to do some peacekeeping action of their own in Cambodia. If you want my idea of a just war, there it is: getting rid of the Khmer Rouge. In Cambodia, you see very few people over 50, and they’ve forgiven us too. You see?

All are forgiven unconditionally and loved beyond measure.

And the fact that you would even say that proves that you weren't there, and most likely, never saw combat in the remote possibility that you did ever serve in the armed forces.

What are you saying? I’ve never been to Vietnam, Laos or Cambodia?

You don’t want to see my service record, son. It puts yours to shame, I can tell you that much.

Wasn't aware Aussie females were in combat roles in Vietnam or have you had a sex change? Huh

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Karnal Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 96708	Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime? Reply #209 - Jan 26^th, 2013 at 9:39pm Better ask KJT about that one, son. She’s onto it.
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Poll
Question: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime?
yes 12 (42.9%) no 15 (53.6%) not sure 1 (3.6%) Total votes: 28 « Created by: Bobby. on: Jan 25^th, 2013 at 8:27am »