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« Created by: buzzanddidj on: Mar 14th, 2013 at 12:43pm »

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So are they illegal now? (Read 6398 times)
Maqqa
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So are they illegal now?
Mar 12th, 2013 at 10:46pm
 
Some lefties here believe that these people are saying that "claiming asylum" is not illegal therefore it absolve these people from illegally entering Australia. This is despite the Migration Act and Un Refugee convention saying otherwise. We'll put that aside for a second because if they are not illegal then there's no need to deport them. You don't deport someone who is in Australia legally.

Back to the story.

These illegals are detained as per the Migration Act. The Migration Act also provide prosecutions via the Criminal Code.

They have broken out of detention. Any criminals who breaks out of their detention are further prosecuted.

So should these illegals now have these breakouts count against them ie they've broken Australian law the second time and the UN Refugee convention requires them to adhere by all laws of the country they are claiming asylum.



Quote:
http://au.news.yahoo.com/a/-/newshome/16348676/five-asylum-seekers-attempt-nauru...

A group of asylum seekers has attempted to escape from the Nauru regional immigration processing centre.

The Department of Immigration says five people breached the fences of the Nauru centre yesterday.

One man is understood to have made it into town.

An Immigration Department spokeswoman says the five detainees were soon returned to the centre.

There have also been three new cases of self-harm at the centre.

The men are receiving medical care on Nauru.

The centre opened in August as part of the Australian Government's plan to deal with irregular boat arrivals, but processing has been delayed.

On Tuesday afternoon the Government announced that asylum seekers on Nauru will be able to start the process to apply for refugee status from March 18.

Two service providers have been awarded contracts to assist them.

The Nauruan justice secretary will decide whether they are valid.

The Government says the assistance should not be taken as an indication that offshore arrivals will be considered ahead of those who come to Australia through regular channels.
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Bill 14% is not the alcohol content of that wine. It's your poll number
 
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Dnarever
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Re: So are they illegal now?
Reply #1 - Mar 12th, 2013 at 10:59pm
 
they've broken Australian law the second time and the UN Refugee convention requires them to adhere by all laws of the country they are claiming asylum.

They still havn't broken any Australian Law.

This may surprise you but Nauru is not part of Australia and is not subject to Australian Laws.
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philperth2010
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Re: So are they illegal now?
Reply #2 - Mar 12th, 2013 at 11:14pm
 
Perhaps this will clear it up for you Macca.....No need to thank me!!!

Quote:
'Asylum seekers', 'illegal immigrants' and entry without a visa            

Advisory Guideline

The legal status of people who have entered Australia by boat without a visa is complex and potentially confusing. Their entry is not legally authorised but is not a criminal offence. The Australian Government usually refers to such entrants as "unauthorised boat arrivals" or "irregular maritime arrivals" but they are also "unlawful non-citizens" under the Migration Act.

Entrants by boat without a visa are entitled to seek asylum and, in practice, almost all of them do so. If the Government’s initial processing suggests they may have a valid case, they are classified as "asylum seekers" and allowed to stay in Australia while the claim is being finally determined. They remain "unlawful non-citizens" until their claim is approved (whereupon they get a permanent protection visa) or they receive a "bridging visa" pending finalisation of their claim. If their claim is rejected, they have not committed an offence but are liable to deportation.

Most entrants by boat without a visa do not seek to evade the authorities upon arrival. Instead, they seek to establish a legal right to stay as a refugee. Their position is very different from those people, including many who arrive with a short-term visa, who seek to remain permanently in the country on a clandestine basis (that is, "over-stayers").

In these circumstances, great care must be taken to avoid describing people who arrived by boat without a visa in terms that are likely to be inaccurate or unfair in relation to at least some of them. This can arise, for example, if the terms can reasonably be interpreted as implying criminality or other serious misbehaviour on the part of all or many people who arrive in this manner.

Depending on the specific context, therefore, terms such as "illegal immigrants" or "illegals" may constitute a breach of the Council’s Standards of Practice on these grounds. The risk of breach can usually be avoided by using a term such as "asylum seekers" although in some cases, of course, the context may require reference to their unlawful or unauthorised entry or their status as unlawful non-citizens pending determination of their claims (if they do not have bridging visas).

http://www.presscouncil.org.au/document-search/asylum-seekers/?locatorgroupid=66...
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If knowledge can create problems, it is not through ignorance that we can solve them.
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philperth2010
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Re: So are they illegal now?
Reply #3 - Mar 12th, 2013 at 11:22pm
 
Quote:
http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/abbott-called-on-illegal-slur-20121...

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/opinion/asylum-seekers-are-not-illegal/story-...

http://www.aph.gov.au/binaries/library/pubs/bn/sp/asylumfacts.pdf

ANU international law professor Don Rothwell said it was clear it is not illegal to enter Australia without a visa and seek asylum.

''Any person who arrives at Australia's borders, whether it be at an airport or harbour or being intercepted by navy patrols is entitled to present an asylum claim to Australia,'' he said.



Either the professor is incorrect or you and Abbott are Macca.....Care to call the Professor a liar Macca???
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If knowledge can create problems, it is not through ignorance that we can solve them.
Isaac Asimov (1920 - 1992)
 
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Maqqa
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Re: So are they illegal now?
Reply #4 - Mar 12th, 2013 at 11:42pm
 
philperth2010 wrote on Mar 12th, 2013 at 11:22pm:
Quote:
http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/abbott-called-on-illegal-slur-20121...

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/opinion/asylum-seekers-are-not-illegal/story-...

http://www.aph.gov.au/binaries/library/pubs/bn/sp/asylumfacts.pdf

ANU international law professor Don Rothwell said it was clear it is not illegal to enter Australia without a visa and seek asylum.

''Any person who arrives at Australia's borders, whether it be at an airport or harbour or being intercepted by navy patrols is entitled to present an asylum claim to Australia,'' he said.



Either the professor is incorrect or you and Abbott are Macca.....Care to call the Professor a liar Macca???



Your references says they are able to present themselves to make an asylum claim. This is correct - present themselves once they have crossed the border.

But before they do so - they are illegal under the Migration Act and subject to deportation

Upon making the claim - deportation is suspended until their claims are assessed

There's nowhere in your article that refuted the fact with references to the Migration Act

The Professor has not said it was not illegal. He simply said (in the inverted commas) they have the right to present themselves

The professor has not made any comment about them entering the country without papers - which is what Abbott was referring to
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Bill 14% is not the alcohol content of that wine. It's your poll number
 
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philperth2010
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Re: So are they illegal now?
Reply #5 - Mar 13th, 2013 at 12:12am
 
Maqqa wrote on Mar 12th, 2013 at 11:42pm:
philperth2010 wrote on Mar 12th, 2013 at 11:22pm:
Quote:
http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/abbott-called-on-illegal-slur-20121...

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/opinion/asylum-seekers-are-not-illegal/story-...

http://www.aph.gov.au/binaries/library/pubs/bn/sp/asylumfacts.pdf

ANU international law professor Don Rothwell said
it was clear it is not illegal to enter Australia without a visa and seek asylum
.


''Any person who arrives at Australia's borders, whether it be at an airport or harbour or being intercepted by navy patrols is entitled to present an asylum claim to Australia,'' he said.



Either the professor is incorrect or you and Abbott are Macca.....Care to call the Professor a liar Macca???



Your references says they are able to present themselves to make an asylum claim. This is correct - present themselves once they have crossed the border.

But before they do so - they are illegal under the Migration Act and subject to deportation

Upon making the claim - deportation is suspended until their claims are assessed

There's nowhere in your article that refuted the fact with references to the Migration Act

The Professor has not said it was not illegal. He simply said (in the inverted commas) they have the right to present themselves

The professor has not made any comment about them entering the country without papers - which is what Abbott was referring to



Accept the Professor did comment on people seeking asylum entering Australia without a Visa and he did say it was not illegal!!!

it was clear it is not illegal to enter Australia without a visa and seek asylum

Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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If knowledge can create problems, it is not through ignorance that we can solve them.
Isaac Asimov (1920 - 1992)
 
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Maqqa
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14% - that low?!

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Re: So are they illegal now?
Reply #6 - Mar 13th, 2013 at 12:14am
 
philperth2010 wrote on Mar 13th, 2013 at 12:12am:
Maqqa wrote on Mar 12th, 2013 at 11:42pm:
philperth2010 wrote on Mar 12th, 2013 at 11:22pm:
Quote:
http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/abbott-called-on-illegal-slur-20121...

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/opinion/asylum-seekers-are-not-illegal/story-...

http://www.aph.gov.au/binaries/library/pubs/bn/sp/asylumfacts.pdf

ANU international law professor Don Rothwell said
it was clear it is not illegal to enter Australia without a visa and seek asylum
.


''Any person who arrives at Australia's borders, whether it be at an airport or harbour or being intercepted by navy patrols is entitled to present an asylum claim to Australia,'' he said.



Either the professor is incorrect or you and Abbott are Macca.....Care to call the Professor a liar Macca???



Your references says they are able to present themselves to make an asylum claim. This is correct - present themselves once they have crossed the border.

But before they do so - they are illegal under the Migration Act and subject to deportation

Upon making the claim - deportation is suspended until their claims are assessed

There's nowhere in your article that refuted the fact with references to the Migration Act

The Professor has not said it was not illegal. He simply said (in the inverted commas) they have the right to present themselves

The professor has not made any comment about them entering the country without papers - which is what Abbott was referring to



Accept the Professor did comment on people seeking asylum entering Australia without a Visa and he did say it was not illegal!!!

it was clear it is not illegal to enter Australia without a visa and seek asylum

Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes



quote his exact words then
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Bill 14% is not the alcohol content of that wine. It's your poll number
 
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philperth2010
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Re: So are they illegal now?
Reply #7 - Mar 13th, 2013 at 12:35am
 
Maqqa wrote on Mar 13th, 2013 at 12:14am:
philperth2010 wrote on Mar 13th, 2013 at 12:12am:
Maqqa wrote on Mar 12th, 2013 at 11:42pm:
philperth2010 wrote on Mar 12th, 2013 at 11:22pm:
Quote:
http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/abbott-called-on-illegal-slur-20121...

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/opinion/asylum-seekers-are-not-illegal/story-...

http://www.aph.gov.au/binaries/library/pubs/bn/sp/asylumfacts.pdf

ANU international law professor Don Rothwell said
it was clear it is not illegal to enter Australia without a visa and seek asylum
.


''Any person who arrives at Australia's borders, whether it be at an airport or harbour or being intercepted by navy patrols is entitled to present an asylum claim to Australia,'' he said.



Either the professor is incorrect or you and Abbott are Macca.....Care to call the Professor a liar Macca???



Your references says they are able to present themselves to make an asylum claim. This is correct - present themselves once they have crossed the border.

But before they do so - they are illegal under the Migration Act and subject to deportation

Upon making the claim - deportation is suspended until their claims are assessed

There's nowhere in your article that refuted the fact with references to the Migration Act

The Professor has not said it was not illegal. He simply said (in the inverted commas) they have the right to present themselves

The professor has not made any comment about them entering the country without papers - which is what Abbott was referring to



Accept the Professor did comment on people seeking asylum entering Australia without a Visa and he did say it was not illegal!!!

it was clear it is not illegal to enter Australia without a visa and seek asylum

Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes



quote his exact words then


The quote posted was cut and pasted from the article provided!!!

Quote:
But ANU international law professor Don Rothwell said it was clear it is not illegal to enter Australia without a visa and seek asylum.

''Any person who arrives at Australia's borders, whether it be at an airport or harbour or being intercepted by navy patrols is entitled to present an asylum claim to Australia,'' he said.

http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/abbott-called-on-illegal-slur-20121...
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If knowledge can create problems, it is not through ignorance that we can solve them.
Isaac Asimov (1920 - 1992)
 
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philperth2010
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Re: So are they illegal now?
Reply #8 - Mar 13th, 2013 at 12:41am
 
Anyway I am off to bed.....Goodnight all!!!

Smiley Smiley Smiley
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If knowledge can create problems, it is not through ignorance that we can solve them.
Isaac Asimov (1920 - 1992)
 
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Maqqa
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14% - that low?!

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Re: So are they illegal now?
Reply #9 - Mar 13th, 2013 at 12:45am
 
phil Quote:
Accept the Professor did comment on people seeking asylum entering Australia without a Visa and he did say it was not illegal!!!

it was clear it is not illegal to enter Australia without a visa and seek asylum




Quote:
''Any person who arrives at Australia's borders, whether it be at an airport or harbour or being intercepted by navy patrols is entitled to present an asylum claim to Australia,'' he said.



Where did the professor mention the word VISA???
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Bill 14% is not the alcohol content of that wine. It's your poll number
 
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Infarction
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Re: So are they illegal now?
Reply #10 - Mar 13th, 2013 at 5:48am
 
I can't figure out if Maqqa is the ultimate troll, or just completely retarded.
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Armchair_Politician
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Re: So are they illegal now?
Reply #11 - Mar 13th, 2013 at 6:03am
 
Maqqa wrote on Mar 13th, 2013 at 12:45am:
phil Quote:
Accept the Professor did comment on people seeking asylum entering Australia without a Visa and he did say it was not illegal!!!

it was clear it is not illegal to enter Australia without a visa and seek asylum




Quote:
''Any person who arrives at Australia's borders, whether it be at an airport or harbour or being intercepted by navy patrols is entitled to present an asylum claim to Australia,'' he said.



Where did the professor mention the word VISA???


He didn't, because you cannot even board a flight in Auckland bound for Sydney without a passport (and, depending on the country your passport says you are from, a visa). They won't even let you through Customs to the gate.
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Sir Spot of Borg
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Re: So are they illegal now?
Reply #12 - Mar 13th, 2013 at 6:24am
 
Maqqa wrote on Mar 12th, 2013 at 10:46pm:
Some lefties here believe that these people are saying that "claiming asylum" is not illegal therefore it absolve these people from illegally entering Australia. This is despite the Migration Act and Un Refugee convention saying otherwise. We'll put that aside for a second because if they are not illegal then there's no need to deport them. You don't deport someone who is in Australia legally.

Back to the story.

These illegals are detained as per the Migration Act. The Migration Act also provide prosecutions via the Criminal Code.

They have broken out of detention. Any criminals who breaks out of their detention are further prosecuted.

So should these illegals now have these breakouts count against them ie they've broken Australian law the second time and the UN Refugee convention requires them to adhere by all laws of the country they are claiming asylum.



Quote:
http://au.news.yahoo.com/a/-/newshome/16348676/five-asylum-seekers-attempt-nauru...

A group of asylum seekers has attempted to escape from the Nauru regional immigration processing centre.

The Department of Immigration says five people breached the fences of the Nauru centre yesterday.

One man is understood to have made it into town.

An Immigration Department spokeswoman says the five detainees were soon returned to the centre.

There have also been three new cases of self-harm at the centre.

The men are receiving medical care on Nauru.

The centre opened in August as part of the Australian Government's plan to deal with irregular boat arrivals, but processing has been delayed.

On Tuesday afternoon the Government announced that asylum seekers on Nauru will be able to start the process to apply for refugee status from March 18.

Two service providers have been awarded contracts to assist them.

The Nauruan justice secretary will decide whether they are valid.

The Government says the assistance should not be taken as an indication that offshore arrivals will be considered ahead of those who come to Australia through regular channels.


Maqqa - not only are they not illegal but they dont enter australia until they are given a visa!

Seriously why do you persist in this?

SOB
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Whaaaaaah!
I'm a 
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- edited by some unethical admin - you think its funny? - its a slippery slope
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philperth2010
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Re: So are they illegal now?
Reply #13 - Mar 13th, 2013 at 7:03am
 
Maqqa wrote on Mar 13th, 2013 at 12:45am:
phil Quote:
Accept the Professor did comment on people seeking asylum entering Australia without a Visa and he did say it was not illegal!!!

it was clear it is not illegal to enter Australia without a
visa
and seek asylum




Quote:
''Any person who arrives at Australia's borders, whether it be at an airport or harbour or being intercepted by navy patrols is entitled to present an asylum claim to Australia,'' he said.



Where did the professor mention the word VISA???




Maqqa wrote on Mar 13th, 2013 at 12:45am:
phil Quote:
Accept the Professor did comment on people seeking asylum entering Australia without a Visa and he did say it was not illegal!!!

it was clear it is not illegal to enter Australia without a
visa
and seek asylum




Quote:
''Any person who arrives at Australia's borders, whether it be at an airport or harbour or being intercepted by navy patrols is entitled to present an asylum claim to Australia,'' he said.



Where did the professor mention the word VISA???



ANU international law professor Don Rothwell said it was clear it is not illegal to enter Australia without a
visa
and seek asylum.

''Any person who arrives at Australia's borders, whether it be at an airport or harbour or being intercepted by navy patrols is entitled to present an asylum claim to Australia,'' he said


No need to thank me Macca......Perhaps you should invest in a pair of reading glasses???

Smiley Smiley Smiley

http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/abbott-called-on-illegal-slur-20121...
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If knowledge can create problems, it is not through ignorance that we can solve them.
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BlOoDy RiPpEr
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Re: So are they illegal now?
Reply #14 - Mar 13th, 2013 at 7:23am
 
i cant see why we just don't call them 'Government hand out country shoppers.'
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