Australian Politics Forum - How many old people leave everything to a church ?

corporate_whitey Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 8896 Archivist	Re: How many old people leave everything to a church ? Reply #120 - Mar 17^th, 2013 at 2:00am Not everyone is well enough, they already destroyed me, i feel safer with my family and proximity to the Church to protect me from atheists till the judgement...
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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: How many old people leave everything to a church ?
Reply #121 - Mar 17^th, 2013 at 4:25am

Quantum wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 12:37pm:

Bobby. wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 11:47am:

Quote:

how educated people were 1000, 2000, 3000, etc years ago

Education was very poor in those times.
Only very few people could read & write.

Quantum - you're a fool & Gizmo is smarter than you although that wouldn't be hard.

Very few people could type 50 years ago. Does that make every one back then uneducated? Reading and writing back then was limited due to the limited availability of written materials as well as writing ones. That doesn't make people stupid. By your reasoning Einstein was a moron because he didn't watch YouTube videos.

But it does make them uneducated. I didnt say "smarter"did i. I said "educated". Changing what i said so you can knock it down is a strawman - your favourite "tactic" it seems. If you had a proper argument you woudlnt need tactics.

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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: How many old people leave everything to a church ?
Reply #122 - Mar 17^th, 2013 at 4:27am

Quantum wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 12:40pm:

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 12:21pm:

Quantum wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 11:43am:

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 5:21am:

That is because most churches (and others are offshoots from same) are from the old days before ppl were educated and new about science. We are growing out of that now but the churches remain.

SOB

When exactly do you think that people got "educated" and learnt about "science"?

You actually show how uneducated you are with your ignorance on just how educated people were 1000, 2000, 3000, etc years ago. You're another modern day angry atheist that acts as if humans were living in caves up till 100 years ago. Also typical of people like you is the attitude that intelligence and Christianity are opposite to each other and only atheist have a brain. Funny enough thought despite your continual suggestions that religious people are dumb and atheists are smart, you happen to be the stupidest person on this forum. Your post above is proof of that.

Hahaha. You believe in an invisible sky fairy that controls your entire life and listens to you. Now THAt is funny!

SOB

Exactly my point spot. Your no different to a racist or sexist person. It is the same attitude that creates those other isms. In your mind anyone who is not an atheist is an idiot. That is an extremely closed minded view and you have done nothing to support that position.

Nope. Not "anyone" just you.

Meanwhile in the rational real world of evidence there are no fairies. It has nothing to do with "racism" because believing in fairies isnt a race. It isnt a gender either. Its an irrational thing and if you actually do believe it and arent pretending (for whatever reason) then you need help. Its primitive. Its how we explained things before we know how things worked.

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« Last Edit: Mar 17^th, 2013 at 4:33am by Sir Spot of Borg »

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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: How many old people leave everything to a church ?
Reply #123 - Mar 17^th, 2013 at 4:28am

Quantum wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 1:56pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 12:54pm:

Quantum wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 12:40pm:

In your mind anyone who is not an atheist is an idiot.

Except that it is true ...
.
.
.
.
.
Idiot, however, does not mean uneducated ...

Wow. More evidence of the sickness spreading through atheism today, hence why many atheist try to separate themselves from them. Atheism today has simply become another worldview that positions itself as intellectually superior to all else and looks down on anyone who doesn't conform. It on the one hand will blame all religion for all of the world problems, whilst being unable to self reflect and see in its self the very traits it condemns in others. Even agnostics are not immune from being looked down upon by today's atheist. If you don't actively hate those who have any form of belief you're listed with the "idiots". Hardly a sign of having real intellectual superiority.

Its an irrational fictional world view.

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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: How many old people leave everything to a church ?
Reply #124 - Mar 17^th, 2013 at 4:34am

longweekend58 wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 2:56pm:

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 12:19pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 11:53am:

and it is only in relatively recent times that science wasn't done almost entirely by the Church as was art literature and music. The positive atheist contribution to history is largely nonexistent

Because everyone was religious back in the old days. Now we know better - or some of us do.

SOB

if you are trying to use yourself as an example of the value of atheism may I suggest that you do your argument irreparable harm! you are the stupidest poster on here and that in a group that has some pretty dumb posters.

Awww look the troll had nothing to add as usual . . .

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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: How many old people leave everything to a church ?
Reply #125 - Mar 17^th, 2013 at 4:35am

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 3:14pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 2:29pm:

how else can someone justify a belief in something that doesn't exist?

This happens very regularly. Post-modern atheists are no exception. Generally, the modern-day atheist is an egalitarian and a believer in equality. Where does equality exist? Where does the complete harmonious society exist? It doesn't. They are nothing but ideals and thus mental images in the heads of the modern day atheist.

Being a materialist, how does the post-modern atheist reconcile this? How can you critique religion from a materialist standpoint, but then go on to believe in immaterial ideas yourself?

Religious people are consistent on this point. Rarely do they try and justify their religion on material and/or empirical grounds. They do it, rather, on faith. But the materialist cannot justify their ideals on faith, as they would break one of their cardinal rules. So how does it ground equality when no empirical evidence of it exists?

It is doubly ironic that the post-modern atheist also gets these ideas of equality, harmony etc from religion. Atheists did not invent them; they inherited them from the past. They want to bring the religious heaven down to earth; establish nirvana in the phenomenal realm.

Today's peculiar brand of atheism is not as smart as it thinks it is. They just swallow slogans without thinking them through to their consequences.

Wow. Someone trying to claim what atheists "believe". I see you arent even trying to back it up though.

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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: How many old people leave everything to a church ?
Reply #126 - Mar 17^th, 2013 at 4:38am

Quantum wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 3:26pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 2:29pm:

what a pile of utter hogwash .... I call them idiots not because I am intellectually superior, but because in my opinion, anyone that believes in fairy tales, ogres, mystical beings that rule over the world or any other such nonsense can only be described as an idiot ...

I didn't say you were intellectually superior. I said you position yourself as being intellectually superior. Then you went ahead and posted the above in defense of that accusation. I rest my case.

Quote:

how else can someone justify a belief in something that doesn't exist? If anyone is looking down at anyone it is the religious zealots with their holier than though attitude ... get over yourself .. you want to believe it, fine, , but, in return I claim the right to believe that you are an idiot for doing so ... again, it's a faith thing ... you don't need to understand it, it is just what I believe ... or is that whole faith things solely reserved for when religious nuts cannot explain themselves?

Interesting that you claim not to tell people what to believe, but you will call people idiots for believing it anyway.

Person 1: I believe in Jesus
Person 2: You should not believe that

Person 1: I believe in Jesus
Person 2: You are an idiot for believing that

I fail to see the difference except person 2 in the first example is better mannered.

I dont say either thing to a religious nut. In real-life they are dangerous and can freak out and do weird things if you say anything about their irrational beliefs. However on here where you cant touch me and you insult and troll me all the time you are fair game because of your belief in fairy tales. Luckily society is moving on. There are less and less of you. Eventually it will be considered a mental aberration and hopefully treated somehow to fix it.

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corporate_whitey Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 8896 Archivist	Re: How many old people leave everything to a church ? Reply #127 - Mar 17^th, 2013 at 7:43am If the church reinvigorates itself and its social services in a Franciscan manner, I will sever all ties with the Atheist State and only recognize the Church...
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Postmodern Trendoid III

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Re: How many old people leave everything to a church ?
Reply #128 - Mar 17^th, 2013 at 9:17am

John Smith wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 9:57pm:

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 4:45pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 4:16pm:

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 3:14pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 2:29pm:

how else can someone justify a belief in something that doesn't exist?

This happens very regularly. Post-modern atheists are no exception. Generally, the modern-day atheist is an egalitarian and a believer in equality. Where does equality exist? Where does the complete harmonious society exist? It doesn't. They are nothing but ideals and thus mental images in the heads of the modern day atheist.

Being a materialist, how does the post-modern atheist reconcile this? How can you critique religion from a materialist standpoint, but then go on to believe in immaterial ideas yourself?

Religious people are consistent on this point. Rarely do they try and justify their religion on material and/or empirical grounds. They do it, rather, on faith. But the materialist cannot justify their ideals on faith, as they would break one of their cardinal rules. So how does it ground equality when no empirical evidence of it exists?

It is doubly ironic that the post-modern atheist also gets these ideas of equality, harmony etc from religion. Atheists did not invent them; they inherited them from the past. They want to bring the religious heaven down to earth; establish nirvana in the phenomenal realm.

Today's peculiar brand of atheism is not as smart as it thinks it is. They just swallow slogans without thinking them through to their consequences.

you want to compare belief in a fictional overlord to equality and harmony etc? Shocked

we can strive for things like equality, it is simply a way in which we would like to improve humanity as we see it . We cannot strive to become gods ... unless you are insane like whitey... A rather poor example I think.

But without an empirical or material base, equality remains a belief.
Equality doesn't exist, as you state, rather, you strive for it. It is almost identical to the Buddhist who strives for Nirvana - it's all in the mind!

There's nothing wrong with having beliefs and ideals, but it's a bit rich to badger the immaterialists when you use similar methods.

Firstly, you likened atheism to equality, not me, personally I don't see the connection but since you asked,
equality does exist, and you are right, I strive for it ... I have some equality in my immediate family ... how can I measure it? well one way of measuring it is by the fact that I have to cook even though I don't like cooking , I take turns changing nappies even though I don't want to .. these are all measurements I can use to justify that equality exists .. how can you justify that god exists?

Ok. So the immaterial made material. Kind of like when the religious claim to be doing god's work - the immaterial made material.

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Postmodern Trendoid III

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Re: How many old people leave everything to a church ?
Reply #129 - Mar 17^th, 2013 at 9:18am

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Mar 17^th, 2013 at 4:35am:

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 3:14pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 2:29pm:

how else can someone justify a belief in something that doesn't exist?

This happens very regularly. Post-modern atheists are no exception. Generally, the modern-day atheist is an egalitarian and a believer in equality. Where does equality exist? Where does the complete harmonious society exist? It doesn't. They are nothing but ideals and thus mental images in the heads of the modern day atheist.

Being a materialist, how does the post-modern atheist reconcile this? How can you critique religion from a materialist standpoint, but then go on to believe in immaterial ideas yourself?

Religious people are consistent on this point. Rarely do they try and justify their religion on material and/or empirical grounds. They do it, rather, on faith. But the materialist cannot justify their ideals on faith, as they would break one of their cardinal rules. So how does it ground equality when no empirical evidence of it exists?

It is doubly ironic that the post-modern atheist also gets these ideas of equality, harmony etc from religion. Atheists did not invent them; they inherited them from the past. They want to bring the religious heaven down to earth; establish nirvana in the phenomenal realm.

Today's peculiar brand of atheism is not as smart as it thinks it is. They just swallow slogans without thinking them through to their consequences.

Wow. Someone trying to claim what atheists "believe". I see you arent even trying to back it up though.

SOB

The point, which you missed, was that immaterial ideas and concepts are very hard to substantiate.

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Re: How many old people leave everything to a church ?
Reply #130 - Mar 17^th, 2013 at 9:20am

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Mar 17^th, 2013 at 4:35am:

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 3:14pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 2:29pm:

how else can someone justify a belief in something that doesn't exist?

This happens very regularly. Post-modern atheists are no exception. Generally, the modern-day atheist is an egalitarian and a believer in equality. Where does equality exist? Where does the complete harmonious society exist? It doesn't. They are nothing but ideals and thus mental images in the heads of the modern day atheist.

Being a materialist, how does the post-modern atheist reconcile this? How can you critique religion from a materialist standpoint, but then go on to believe in immaterial ideas yourself?

Religious people are consistent on this point. Rarely do they try and justify their religion on material and/or empirical grounds. They do it, rather, on faith. But the materialist cannot justify their ideals on faith, as they would break one of their cardinal rules. So how does it ground equality when no empirical evidence of it exists?

It is doubly ironic that the post-modern atheist also gets these ideas of equality, harmony etc from religion. Atheists did not invent them; they inherited them from the past. They want to bring the religious heaven down to earth; establish nirvana in the phenomenal realm.

Today's peculiar brand of atheism is not as smart as it thinks it is. They just swallow slogans without thinking them through to their consequences.

Wow. Someone trying to claim what atheists "believe". I see you arent even trying to back it up though.

SOB

Is it in dispute that atheists believe there is no god?

You do know there's no proof of this claim, therefore it's a belief? no..err...of course you don't.

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John Smith

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Re: How many old people leave everything to a church ?
Reply #131 - Mar 17^th, 2013 at 9:21am

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Mar 17^th, 2013 at 9:17am:

John Smith wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 9:57pm:

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 4:45pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 4:16pm:

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 3:14pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 2:29pm:

how else can someone justify a belief in something that doesn't exist?

This happens very regularly. Post-modern atheists are no exception. Generally, the modern-day atheist is an egalitarian and a believer in equality. Where does equality exist? Where does the complete harmonious society exist? It doesn't. They are nothing but ideals and thus mental images in the heads of the modern day atheist.

Being a materialist, how does the post-modern atheist reconcile this? How can you critique religion from a materialist standpoint, but then go on to believe in immaterial ideas yourself?

Religious people are consistent on this point. Rarely do they try and justify their religion on material and/or empirical grounds. They do it, rather, on faith. But the materialist cannot justify their ideals on faith, as they would break one of their cardinal rules. So how does it ground equality when no empirical evidence of it exists?

It is doubly ironic that the post-modern atheist also gets these ideas of equality, harmony etc from religion. Atheists did not invent them; they inherited them from the past. They want to bring the religious heaven down to earth; establish nirvana in the phenomenal realm.

Today's peculiar brand of atheism is not as smart as it thinks it is. They just swallow slogans without thinking them through to their consequences.

you want to compare belief in a fictional overlord to equality and harmony etc? Shocked

we can strive for things like equality, it is simply a way in which we would like to improve humanity as we see it . We cannot strive to become gods ... unless you are insane like whitey... A rather poor example I think.

But without an empirical or material base, equality remains a belief.
Equality doesn't exist, as you state, rather, you strive for it. It is almost identical to the Buddhist who strives for Nirvana - it's all in the mind!

There's nothing wrong with having beliefs and ideals, but it's a bit rich to badger the immaterialists when you use similar methods.

Firstly, you likened atheism to equality, not me, personally I don't see the connection but since you asked,
equality does exist, and you are right, I strive for it ... I have some equality in my immediate family ... how can I measure it? well one way of measuring it is by the fact that I have to cook even though I don't like cooking , I take turns changing nappies even though I don't want to .. these are all measurements I can use to justify that equality exists .. how can you justify that god exists?

Ok. So the immaterial made material. Kind of like when the religious claim to be doing god's work - the immaterial made material.

nothing like it .....

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Postmodern Trendoid III

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Re: How many old people leave everything to a church ?
Reply #132 - Mar 17^th, 2013 at 9:24am

Emma wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 11:09pm:

I commend John Smith and the Last Nail.

MM ?? you do try to take this topic off by ranting about atheists, as if all atheist have some temple, like your religious. You are a long way off course.

I think Quantum is another who seeks to disrupt... Q ? you are very obvious in your games. No smarter tham MM ... sorry about that.. Wink

'post-modern atheists' ffs?? Shocked

unlike religion... atheists tend to be individuals... not members of some bolstering group.

Think beyond your usual confines fellas,, or never understand... and always be followers of sky gods. Roll Eyes

At no point do you engage with the subject matter brought forth.

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Postmodern Trendoid III

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Re: How many old people leave everything to a church ?
Reply #133 - Mar 17^th, 2013 at 9:25am

John Smith wrote on Mar 17^th, 2013 at 9:21am:

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Mar 17^th, 2013 at 9:17am:

John Smith wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 9:57pm:

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 4:45pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 4:16pm:

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 3:14pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 2:29pm:

how else can someone justify a belief in something that doesn't exist?

This happens very regularly. Post-modern atheists are no exception. Generally, the modern-day atheist is an egalitarian and a believer in equality. Where does equality exist? Where does the complete harmonious society exist? It doesn't. They are nothing but ideals and thus mental images in the heads of the modern day atheist.

Being a materialist, how does the post-modern atheist reconcile this? How can you critique religion from a materialist standpoint, but then go on to believe in immaterial ideas yourself?

Religious people are consistent on this point. Rarely do they try and justify their religion on material and/or empirical grounds. They do it, rather, on faith. But the materialist cannot justify their ideals on faith, as they would break one of their cardinal rules. So how does it ground equality when no empirical evidence of it exists?

It is doubly ironic that the post-modern atheist also gets these ideas of equality, harmony etc from religion. Atheists did not invent them; they inherited them from the past. They want to bring the religious heaven down to earth; establish nirvana in the phenomenal realm.

Today's peculiar brand of atheism is not as smart as it thinks it is. They just swallow slogans without thinking them through to their consequences.

you want to compare belief in a fictional overlord to equality and harmony etc? Shocked

we can strive for things like equality, it is simply a way in which we would like to improve humanity as we see it . We cannot strive to become gods ... unless you are insane like whitey... A rather poor example I think.

But without an empirical or material base, equality remains a belief.
Equality doesn't exist, as you state, rather, you strive for it. It is almost identical to the Buddhist who strives for Nirvana - it's all in the mind!

There's nothing wrong with having beliefs and ideals, but it's a bit rich to badger the immaterialists when you use similar methods.

Firstly, you likened atheism to equality, not me, personally I don't see the connection but since you asked,
equality does exist, and you are right, I strive for it ... I have some equality in my immediate family ... how can I measure it? well one way of measuring it is by the fact that I have to cook even though I don't like cooking , I take turns changing nappies even though I don't want to .. these are all measurements I can use to justify that equality exists .. how can you justify that god exists?

Ok. So the immaterial made material. Kind of like when the religious claim to be doing god's work - the immaterial made material.

nothing like it .....

You sound a bit vague. Are you having trouble exemplifying your abstract concepts?

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John Smith

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Re: How many old people leave everything to a church ?
Reply #134 - Mar 17^th, 2013 at 9:27am

... wrote on Mar 17^th, 2013 at 9:20am:

You do know there's no proof of this claim, therefore it's a belief? no..err...of course you don't.

John Smith wrote on Mar 16^th, 2013 at 9:59pm:

do you think it is at all logical for me to create a mythical being from outer space, lets call it a wegorman, and ask you to provide evidence that it doesn't exist? bugger your an idiot

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