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longweekend58

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Re: Elite Schools Spend $20 Million A Year On Upgrades
Reply #120 - Mar 20^th, 2013 at 3:05pm

Swagman wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 10:20am:

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 9:31am:

Why do some of you ppl call the government "socialist" and yet want them to fund private businesses?

SOB

It's the party in Govt that is being branded 'socialist'.

GOVT is NOT funding private business. Funding is a handout.

Think of Private schools as a sub-contractor. They are being paid for delivering a service that the Govt is obliged to provide. Instead of costing them $1 per head it costs Govt 30c per head. The 70c they save can be spent elsewhere on other essential Govt services.

Think of it another way, say the Govt nationalised schools. They would have to find that extra 70c per head and also find additional money to accommodate the extra 30% of student numbers.

Unless they went into massive unsustainable debt other Govt services would be cut. Dole would be less, pensions would be less etc etc etc

Savvy? Huh

Huh

its a very good analogy. the trouble is the lefties dont like the fact that private schools outperform public ones by a massive margin.

AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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Lobo

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Re: Elite Schools Spend $20 Million A Year On Upgrades
Reply #121 - Mar 20^th, 2013 at 3:10pm

John Smith wrote on Mar 19^th, 2013 at 8:35pm:

Lobo wrote on Mar 19^th, 2013 at 7:43pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Mar 19^th, 2013 at 7:37pm:

Lobo wrote on Mar 19^th, 2013 at 7:29pm:

I'm old enough to remember when Private and Catholic schools received no govt funding.

I was fortunate enough that my parents could afford to send me to both C of E and Catholic Private schools. (Family thing.)

Even so, I firmly believe that the greater percentage of govt funding should go into the public school system.

it still does. public students get around 50% more per head from govt than private students.

Personally I'd prefer it to be 75%+......

why? Governments already provides for education ... if you feel it isn't good enough and want to go private, you should pay, not the taxpayer

That was 75%+ to public schools, John.

"What's in store for me in the direction I don't take?"-Jack Kerouac.

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Andrei.Hicks

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Re: Elite Schools Spend $20 Million A Year On Upgrades
Reply #122 - Mar 20^th, 2013 at 3:12pm

Lobo wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 3:10pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 19^th, 2013 at 8:35pm:

Lobo wrote on Mar 19^th, 2013 at 7:43pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Mar 19^th, 2013 at 7:37pm:

Lobo wrote on Mar 19^th, 2013 at 7:29pm:

I'm old enough to remember when Private and Catholic schools received no govt funding.

I was fortunate enough that my parents could afford to send me to both C of E and Catholic Private schools. (Family thing.)

Even so, I firmly believe that the greater percentage of govt funding should go into the public school system.

it still does. public students get around 50% more per head from govt than private students.

Personally I'd prefer it to be 75%+......

why? Governments already provides for education ... if you feel it isn't good enough and want to go private, you should pay, not the taxpayer

That was 75%+ to public schools, John.

Yes yes, heaven forbid the people who pay in the most in tax actually get some funding towards their own kids eh?

Higher income earner should just be a cash cow.

Amazing how so many people who pretty much pay in over the course of a year, less than what a lot of us pay in a month - get free healthcare, free transport passes, free schooling for their kids, help to pay bills.

Then still complain and demand more?

The "I am entitled" Generation.

Anyone who lives within their means suffers from a lack of imagination - Oscar Wilde

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adelcrow

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Re: Elite Schools Spend $20 Million A Year On Upgrades
Reply #123 - Mar 20^th, 2013 at 3:19pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 3:12pm:

Lobo wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 3:10pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 19^th, 2013 at 8:35pm:

Lobo wrote on Mar 19^th, 2013 at 7:43pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Mar 19^th, 2013 at 7:37pm:

Lobo wrote on Mar 19^th, 2013 at 7:29pm:

I'm old enough to remember when Private and Catholic schools received no govt funding.

I was fortunate enough that my parents could afford to send me to both C of E and Catholic Private schools. (Family thing.)

Even so, I firmly believe that the greater percentage of govt funding should go into the public school system.

it still does. public students get around 50% more per head from govt than private students.

Personally I'd prefer it to be 75%+......

why? Governments already provides for education ... if you feel it isn't good enough and want to go private, you should pay, not the taxpayer

That was 75%+ to public schools, John.

Yes yes, heaven forbid the people who pay in the most in tax actually get some funding towards their own kids eh?

Higher income earner should just be a cash cow.

Amazing how so many people who pretty much pay in over the course of a year, less than what a lot of us pay in a month - get free healthcare, free transport passes, free schooling for their kids, help to pay bills.

Then still complain and demand more?

The "I am entitled" Generation.

Its more to do with govt handouts going to the needy rather than going towards manicured tennis courts and school excursions to Paris.
Its just another case of welfare going to those that dont need it and sucking all taxpayers dry just to buy votes.

Go the Bunnies

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Andrei.Hicks

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Re: Elite Schools Spend $20 Million A Year On Upgrades
Reply #124 - Mar 20^th, 2013 at 3:27pm

Not at all.
Funding should be the same flat level to all kids - public and private.

No child should not receive public funding for their education.

Then private schools should charge on top of that and state schools just keep to the funding level.

That way parents who choose to fund their child through fees get more - because as you all know and agree - you should always get something for your money.

What on earth would be the point in paying for an education when the state is funding other kids for free if its no better??

Anyone who lives within their means suffers from a lack of imagination - Oscar Wilde

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John Smith

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Re: Elite Schools Spend $20 Million A Year On Upgrades
Reply #125 - Mar 20^th, 2013 at 9:54pm

longweekend58 wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 3:04pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 9:19am:

longweekend58 wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 8:25am:

it is far cheaper for the govt to pay 30% LESS per student using the private model than a fully public one. ideology aside, it makes zero sense to pay $9Bpa

the argument that i smade by the independant schools themselves? it's not like they wouldskew the figures in their favour now would they.

oh the irony from the forums least numerate poster

haveing trouble coming up with a response are you?

Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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John Smith

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Re: Elite Schools Spend $20 Million A Year On Upgrades
Reply #126 - Mar 20^th, 2013 at 9:56pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 3:27pm:

Not at all.
Funding should be the same flat level to all kids - public and private.

No child should not receive public funding for their education.

Then private schools should charge on top of that and state schools just keep to the funding level.

That way parents who choose to fund their child through fees get more - because as you all know and agree - you should always get something for your money.

What on earth would be the point in paying for an education when the state is funding other kids for free if its no better??

the public school funding is there ... for all the kids ... you chose to forgo it for private that is your choice and you should pay.

Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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John Smith

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Re: Elite Schools Spend $20 Million A Year On Upgrades
Reply #127 - Mar 20^th, 2013 at 9:58pm

Swagman wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 10:20am:

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 9:31am:

Why do some of you ppl call the government "socialist" and yet want them to fund private businesses?

SOB

It's the party in Govt that is being branded 'socialist'.

GOVT is NOT funding private business. Funding is a handout.

Think of Private schools as a sub-contractor. They are being paid for delivering a service that the Govt is obliged to provide. Instead of costing them $1 per head it costs Govt 30c per head. The 70c they save can be spent elsewhere on other essential Govt services.

Think of it another way, say the Govt nationalised schools. They would have to find that extra 70c per head and also find additional money to accommodate the extra 30% of student numbers.

Unless they went into massive unsustainable debt other Govt services would be cut. Dole would be less, pensions would be less etc etc etc

Savvy? Huh

Huh

Sub contractors are private businesses .... and that analogy doesn't apply anyway ... govt subsidise schools, not pay them .

the rest of your claims are unsubstantiated claims put out by the private schools themselves .. I'm sure it helps them when arguing for extra funding.

Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: Elite Schools Spend $20 Million A Year On Upgrades
Reply #128 - Mar 21^st, 2013 at 6:12am

longweekend58 wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 3:05pm:

Swagman wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 10:20am:

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 9:31am:

Why do some of you ppl call the government "socialist" and yet want them to fund private businesses?

SOB

It's the party in Govt that is being branded 'socialist'.

GOVT is NOT funding private business. Funding is a handout.

Think of Private schools as a sub-contractor. They are being paid for delivering a service that the Govt is obliged to provide. Instead of costing them $1 per head it costs Govt 30c per head. The 70c they save can be spent elsewhere on other essential Govt services.

Think of it another way, say the Govt nationalised schools. They would have to find that extra 70c per head and also find additional money to accommodate the extra 30% of student numbers.

Unless they went into massive unsustainable debt other Govt services would be cut. Dole would be less, pensions would be less etc etc etc

Savvy? Huh

Huh

its a very good analogy. the trouble is the lefties dont like the fact that private schools outperform public ones by a massive margin.

Nope. What the "lefties" dont like is private businesses getting funding and taking money away from places that actually need it.

SOB

Whaaaaaah!
I'm a
Moron!

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longweekend58

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Re: Elite Schools Spend $20 Million A Year On Upgrades
Reply #129 - Mar 21^st, 2013 at 7:09am

John Smith wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 9:56pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 3:27pm:

Not at all.
Funding should be the same flat level to all kids - public and private.

No child should not receive public funding for their education.

Then private schools should charge on top of that and state schools just keep to the funding level.

That way parents who choose to fund their child through fees get more - because as you all know and agree - you should always get something for your money.

What on earth would be the point in paying for an education when the state is funding other kids for free if its no better??

the public school funding is there ... for all the kids ... you chose to forgo it for private that is your choice and you should pay.

lets hear you support that principle if govt decided that there shoudl be no child-care subsidy. you want childcare? pay for it yourself! And I'm tipping once your kids reach school age you might find your attitude to private school funding will change too when you haev to choose between the bogan public school and the first-rate private school.

AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: Elite Schools Spend $20 Million A Year On Upgrades
Reply #130 - Mar 21^st, 2013 at 7:10am

John Smith wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 9:58pm:

Swagman wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 10:20am:

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 9:31am:

Why do some of you ppl call the government "socialist" and yet want them to fund private businesses?

SOB

It's the party in Govt that is being branded 'socialist'.

GOVT is NOT funding private business. Funding is a handout.

Think of Private schools as a sub-contractor. They are being paid for delivering a service that the Govt is obliged to provide. Instead of costing them $1 per head it costs Govt 30c per head. The 70c they save can be spent elsewhere on other essential Govt services.

Think of it another way, say the Govt nationalised schools. They would have to find that extra 70c per head and also find additional money to accommodate the extra 30% of student numbers.

Unless they went into massive unsustainable debt other Govt services would be cut. Dole would be less, pensions would be less etc etc etc

Savvy? Huh

Huh

Sub contractors are private businesses .... and that analogy doesn't apply anyway ... govt subsidise schools, not pay them .

the rest of your claims are unsubstantiated claims put out by the private schools themselves .. I'm sure it helps them when arguing for extra funding.

well we could get govt estimations instead but you have clearly shown that you only accept figures that support your position so why would anyone bother?

AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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Andrei.Hicks

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Re: Elite Schools Spend $20 Million A Year On Upgrades
Reply #131 - Mar 21^st, 2013 at 7:12am

longweekend58 wrote on Mar 21^st, 2013 at 7:09am:

John Smith wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 9:56pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 3:27pm:

Not at all.
Funding should be the same flat level to all kids - public and private.

No child should not receive public funding for their education.

Then private schools should charge on top of that and state schools just keep to the funding level.

That way parents who choose to fund their child through fees get more - because as you all know and agree - you should always get something for your money.

What on earth would be the point in paying for an education when the state is funding other kids for free if its no better??

the public school funding is there ... for all the kids ... you chose to forgo it for private that is your choice and you should pay.

lets hear you support that principle if govt decided that there shoudl be no child-care subsidy. you want childcare? pay for it yourself! And I'm tipping once your kids reach school age you might find your attitude to private school funding will change too when you haev to choose between the bogan public school and the first-rate private school.

I think you are absolutely right there.

Anyone who lives within their means suffers from a lack of imagination - Oscar Wilde

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longweekend58

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Re: Elite Schools Spend $20 Million A Year On Upgrades
Reply #132 - Mar 21^st, 2013 at 7:22am

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Mar 21^st, 2013 at 6:12am:

longweekend58 wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 3:05pm:

Swagman wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 10:20am:

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 9:31am:

Why do some of you ppl call the government "socialist" and yet want them to fund private businesses?

SOB

It's the party in Govt that is being branded 'socialist'.

GOVT is NOT funding private business. Funding is a handout.

Think of Private schools as a sub-contractor. They are being paid for delivering a service that the Govt is obliged to provide. Instead of costing them $1 per head it costs Govt 30c per head. The 70c they save can be spent elsewhere on other essential Govt services.

Think of it another way, say the Govt nationalised schools. They would have to find that extra 70c per head and also find additional money to accommodate the extra 30% of student numbers.

Unless they went into massive unsustainable debt other Govt services would be cut. Dole would be less, pensions would be less etc etc etc

Savvy? Huh

Huh

its a very good analogy. the trouble is the lefties dont like the fact that private schools outperform public ones by a massive margin.

Nope. What the "lefties" dont like is private businesses getting funding and taking money away from places that actually need it.

SOB

I know that you wont understand the answer but another reader may so here goes.

there are for example 2000 students needing to go to school. If they all go to public school it will cost $22Mpa. If they all fo to private school it costs the govt $15M - a saving of $7M.

But you say just dont pay the $15M at all and make the saving even more! However there is a problem in that simplistic argument. The vast majority of private schools are low-fee ones of around $3000 per student per year. Take out the govt funding and parents would be up for $10,500pa which the vast majority could not afford and the rest will not. Estimates are that around 80% (or more) of private students would return to the public system. So to alter that calculation accordingly, you take back the $15M in private subsidies and then have to pay $17.6M extra in public school money to handle all the extra students

do you see how this works? the private sector actually saves the govt money which is why no govt, no matter how ideologically determined, is going to change this system.

The debate ALWAYS centres on 10 elite schools and never on the vast majority and is why the debate is never honest and why it is always ignored by govt.

AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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Swagman

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Re: Elite Schools Spend $20 Million A Year On Upgrades
Reply #133 - Mar 21^st, 2013 at 7:33am

John Smith wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 9:56pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 3:27pm:

Not at all.
Funding should be the same flat level to all kids - public and private.

No child should not receive public funding for their education.

Then private schools should charge on top of that and state schools just keep to the funding level.

That way parents who choose to fund their child through fees get more - because as you all know and agree - you should always get something for your money.

What on earth would be the point in paying for an education when the state is funding other kids for free if its no better??

the public school funding is there ... for all the kids ... you chose to forgo it for private that is your choice and you should pay.

Even if everyone paid the same amount of tax you still wouldn't have a valid point.

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John Smith

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Re: Elite Schools Spend $20 Million A Year On Upgrades
Reply #134 - Mar 21^st, 2013 at 8:12am

longweekend58 wrote on Mar 21^st, 2013 at 7:09am:

John Smith wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 9:56pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Mar 20^th, 2013 at 3:27pm:

Not at all.
Funding should be the same flat level to all kids - public and private.

No child should not receive public funding for their education.

Then private schools should charge on top of that and state schools just keep to the funding level.

That way parents who choose to fund their child through fees get more - because as you all know and agree - you should always get something for your money.

What on earth would be the point in paying for an education when the state is funding other kids for free if its no better??

the public school funding is there ... for all the kids ... you chose to forgo it for private that is your choice and you should pay.

lets hear you support that principle if govt decided that there shoudl be no child-care subsidy. you want childcare? pay for it yourself! And I'm tipping once your kids reach school age you might find your attitude to private school funding will change too when you haev to choose between the bogan public school and the first-rate private school.

bugger your an idiot ... I do pay for my kids childcare. Any subsidy I may get I get because they give it to me, not because I sought it. That's the way the childcare system is and I play by their rules. .. if they remove the subsidy it won't change a thing for me.

Don't try to judge me by your standards, just because you're a selfish old goat who only cares about themselves it doesn't mean I do as well.

Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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