Australian Politics Forum - The academics who hate free speech

cods Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 88048	Re: The academics who hate free speech Reply #15 - Apr 17^th, 2013 at 9:41am we all know what happened in the British Universities during the 20s and 30s..shame MI5 didnt...
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Peter Freedman

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Re: The academics who hate free speech
Reply #16 - Apr 17^th, 2013 at 9:43am

cods wrote on Apr 17^th, 2013 at 9:39am:

Dnarever wrote on Apr 17^th, 2013 at 8:45am:

But just as when people get older and wiser they abandon left-wing silliness so do students

I seem to have gone the other way but that may have just been a responce to the Howard dishonesty.

Could be just that as people gain wealth that what is in their personal best interests change.

yet you go with gillard...nothing more dishonest than she... oh well its all in the mind as they say..

what offends one pleases another.. funny old world...

what is your ideal labor party dna.... do they really stand for what you believe in?

cods, this topic is about free speech at a university. It has nothing to do with Gillard.

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Peter Freedman Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 5275 Wellington Gender:	Re: The academics who hate free speech Reply #17 - Apr 17^th, 2013 at 9:45am cods wrote on Apr 17^th, 2013 at 9:41am: we all know what happened in the British Universities during the 20s and 30s..shame MI5 didnt... And what the f-ck has THAT got to do with this topic?
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Kat

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Re: The academics who hate free speech
Reply #18 - Apr 17^th, 2013 at 10:17am

Peter Freedman wrote on Apr 17^th, 2013 at 9:45am:

cods wrote on Apr 17^th, 2013 at 9:41am:

we all know what happened in the British Universities during the 20s and 30s..shame MI5 didnt...

And what the f-ck has THAT got to do with this topic?

Well, they were apparently hotbeds (pun unintended) of homosexuality and
Communism, and produced some of Britain's most famous traitors.

Perhaps Cods believes our unis are the same.... Wink

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Dnarever

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Re: The academics who hate free speech
Reply #19 - Apr 17^th, 2013 at 10:23am

cods wrote on Apr 17^th, 2013 at 9:39am:

Dnarever wrote on Apr 17^th, 2013 at 8:45am:

But just as when people get older and wiser they abandon left-wing silliness so do students

I seem to have gone the other way but that may have just been a responce to the Howard dishonesty.

Could be just that as people gain wealth that what is in their personal best interests change.

yet you go with gillard...nothing more dishonest than she... oh well its all in the mind as they say..

what offends one pleases another.. funny old world...

what is your ideal labor party dna.... do they really stand for what you believe in?

nothing more dishonest than she

The spin about Gillard’s dishonesty is just that, it is based on the proposition that she told one lie, in reality she had inadvertently broken a promise which had little impact, compared to Howard who took a lie into every election campaign and had many between it is clearly no contest, Even Abbot tell more pork pies than Gillard.

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Postmodern Trendoid III

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Re: The academics who hate free speech
Reply #20 - Apr 17^th, 2013 at 10:40am

Kat wrote on Apr 17^th, 2013 at 10:17am:

Peter Freedman wrote on Apr 17^th, 2013 at 9:45am:

cods wrote on Apr 17^th, 2013 at 9:41am:

we all know what happened in the British Universities during the 20s and 30s..shame MI5 didnt...

And what the f-ck has THAT got to do with this topic?

Well, they were apparently hotbeds (pun unintended) of homosexuality and
Communism, and produced some of Britain's most famous traitors.

Perhaps Cods believes our unis are the same.... Wink

I am not sure you'd call it today a hotbed of homosexuality, but there are gays and lesbians throughout the Humanities and Social Sciences. There's a whole sub-discipline of literature devoted to them. Often it takes the form of pointing out the plainness of the "heteronormative" world, and that gays and lesbians are "different" and hold the key to "diversifying" this "boring" world.

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Dnarever

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Re: The academics who hate free speech
Reply #21 - Apr 17^th, 2013 at 10:52am

cods wrote on Apr 17^th, 2013 at 9:39am:

Dnarever wrote on Apr 17^th, 2013 at 8:45am:

But just as when people get older and wiser they abandon left-wing silliness so do students

I seem to have gone the other way but that may have just been a responce to the Howard dishonesty.

Could be just that as people gain wealth that what is in their personal best interests change.

yet you go with gillard...nothing more dishonest than she... oh well its all in the mind as they say..

what offends one pleases another.. funny old world...

what is your ideal labor party dna.... do they really stand for what you believe in?

It is more a case of the conservatives standing for what I don't believe in.

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Peter Freedman

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Re: The academics who hate free speech
Reply #22 - Apr 17^th, 2013 at 12:14pm

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Apr 17^th, 2013 at 10:40am:

Kat wrote on Apr 17^th, 2013 at 10:17am:

Peter Freedman wrote on Apr 17^th, 2013 at 9:45am:

cods wrote on Apr 17^th, 2013 at 9:41am:

we all know what happened in the British Universities during the 20s and 30s..shame MI5 didnt...

And what the f-ck has THAT got to do with this topic?

Well, they were apparently hotbeds (pun unintended) of homosexuality and
Communism, and produced some of Britain's most famous traitors.

Perhaps Cods believes our unis are the same.... Wink

I am not sure you'd call it today a hotbed of homosexuality, but there are gays and lesbians throughout the Humanities and Social Sciences. There's a whole sub-discipline of literature devoted to them. Often it takes the form of pointing out the plainness of the "heteronormative" world, and that gays and lesbians are "different" and hold the key to "diversifying" this "boring" world.

I think that's what you call freedom of speech.....

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longweekend58

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Re: The academics who hate free speech
Reply #23 - Apr 17^th, 2013 at 5:59pm

Mnemonic wrote on Apr 17^th, 2013 at 1:41am:

longweekend58 wrote on Apr 16^th, 2013 at 11:42pm:

if you've ever worked in a university you would know that it is THE left-wing organization in the country.

You're assuming there aren't any "fatcats" in universities. I am pretty sure academics who teach commerce or economics courses would be pretty right-wing, as anyone interested in running businesses and wants to make money would be. There's also the academics teaching law and you know how lawyers like to get rich by charging you lots of legal fees. It's amazing how a piece of paper with writing on it can earn you $10k-$100k. Lawyers love manipulating the world to make themselves richer and I doubt they're going to leave the money to the homeless. There you have it. Here are your right-wingers in universities.

longweekend58 wrote on Apr 16^th, 2013 at 11:42pm:

A friend of mine who worked in a uni was reprimanded for having a picture of Howard in his cubicle. Pictures of Keating however were acceptable.

You're basing your claim on the experience of a friend? Whoever said that to your friend was expressing their opinion and yet you assume they represent the entire university.

longweekend58 wrote on Apr 16^th, 2013 at 11:42pm:

But just as when people get older and wiser they abandon left-wing silliness so do students when they leave the rarefied air of universities.

That wasn't my experience. For me it was the other way round. While I was at university, I was too busy studying to care about what was happening in the rest of the world. Nothing else mattered except assignments, exams and marks and the pride I got when I handed in great work and got good marks. I was too interested in my own success to care about anything else (a right-wing attitude). Not all students care about politics.

Finishing my studies and leaving university was like taking off my rose-coloured glasses. I looked at the world around me and saw imperfection. Life wasn't as simple as getting the right answer on the exam. I realised I was a pretty lucky guy to be studying at university and free of debt. A lot of other people weren't so lucky, many of them having to borrow money to study. The reason why I was free of debt was because my family was free of debt. My parents paid off their mortgage a long, long time ago. My parents could afford to support me in my studies and I was a good saver.

I realised that if you came from a family who owned a home where the mortgage still hadn't been paid off, it was likely that the next generation would be facing the same problem. There was therefore a hierarchy. Below me were people having financial difficulties because of the failure to pay off their mortgage. Above me were people earning $100k or above who weren't willing to share the extra money they earned. These people were living "above their means." They had money they didn't need.

Successful people become blind to the hardships of people below them and continue accumulating wealth without caring. If I hadn't been struck down by a medical condition, I probably would have ended up with right-wing views. I have been blinded by my success once before and I don't intend to let that happen again. The reason why I am not a right-winger is because I am not a heartless person who doesn't have a penny to spare.

so you claim my position is invalid because it is my personal experience and then use as proof, your own experience???

well that gave me a good chuckle!

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longweekend58

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Re: The academics who hate free speech
Reply #24 - Apr 17^th, 2013 at 6:00pm

Dnarever wrote on Apr 17^th, 2013 at 8:38am:

longweekend58 wrote on Apr 16^th, 2013 at 11:42pm:

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Apr 16^th, 2013 at 11:14pm:

It is interesting this attempt to silence came from academics and not students.

if you've ever worked in a university you would know that it is THE left-wing organization in the country. A friend of mine who worked in a uni was reprimanded for having a picture of Howard in his cubicle. Pictures of Keating however were acceptable.

You have never been in a Medical, legal, economics etc type campus have you.

very very obviously you never have!!!!

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: The academics who hate free speech
Reply #25 - Apr 17^th, 2013 at 6:01pm

Dnarever wrote on Apr 17^th, 2013 at 8:41am:

I think that the campus over reacted even though I do find Mr Howards picture and comments to be quite offensive.

it is of no concern that YOU find it offensive. free speech and the free expression of ideas is supposed to be the lifeblood of universities. Instead, we get this kind of censorship/

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: The academics who hate free speech
Reply #26 - Apr 17^th, 2013 at 6:02pm

Dnarever wrote on Apr 17^th, 2013 at 10:23am:

cods wrote on Apr 17^th, 2013 at 9:39am:

Dnarever wrote on Apr 17^th, 2013 at 8:45am:

But just as when people get older and wiser they abandon left-wing silliness so do students

I seem to have gone the other way but that may have just been a responce to the Howard dishonesty.

Could be just that as people gain wealth that what is in their personal best interests change.

yet you go with gillard...nothing more dishonest than she... oh well its all in the mind as they say..

what offends one pleases another.. funny old world...

what is your ideal labor party dna.... do they really stand for what you believe in?

nothing more dishonest than she

The spin about Gillard’s dishonesty is just that, it is based on the proposition that she told one lie, in reality she had inadvertently broken a promise which had little impact, compared to Howard who took a lie into every election campaign and had many between it is clearly no contest, Even Abbot tell more pork pies than Gillard.

and 29% of the country agrees with you while 71% are looking forward to ditching her into obscurity.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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The_Barnacle

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Re: The academics who hate free speech
Reply #27 - Apr 18^th, 2013 at 9:38pm

Quote:

This particular corflute pictured then-Prime Minister John Howard and his quote “we will decide who comes to this country and the circumstances in which they come.” On one particular day of O-Week, The Club displayed this corflute proudly at our stall

My opinion on this is that "context" is very important.

We all know the context in which John Howard said this quote. It was during the Tampa stand off, which at the time was front page news.

On the other hand we have a group of conservative students with this placard in the midst of a ethnically and culturally diverse university campus. In this context it could easily be seen to be potentially racist.

As much as the right like to play the victim I don't think this was a case of left v right. This was just a case of academics defusing a potentially dangerous situation. Which they have every right to do.

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The Right Wing only believe in free speech when they agree with what is being said.

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JC Denton Gold Member Offline Posts: 5471 Gender:	Re: The academics who hate free speech Reply #28 - Apr 18^th, 2013 at 10:10pm bugger me dnaver, you claim otherwise but youre a naked partisan fvking hack. you are a joke son
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Mnemonic

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Re: The academics who hate free speech
Reply #29 - Apr 18^th, 2013 at 11:31pm

longweekend58 wrote on Apr 16^th, 2013 at 11:42pm:

But just as when people get older and wiser they abandon left-wing silliness so do students when they leave the rarefied air of universities.

longweekend58 wrote on Apr 17^th, 2013 at 5:59pm:

so you claim my position is invalid because it is my personal experience and then use as proof, your own experience???

Your position is that as people get older and wiser, they become more right-wing. Firstly, my experience doesn't support your position. In fact, as I described, I became disgusted with right-wing views. Secondly, it's a bit silly talking about "proof" when you haven't presented any for your own claim. It is fine with me, however, if you just wanted to say that for fun.

I wasn't even out of prove you wrong. Many of the left-wingers in universities may indeed be youthful idealists, but that doesn't mean all left-wing ideology was about being young and idealistic. I am no idealist. In fact, it's the other way round. I am a realist and I consider right-wing ideology to be unrealistic. I don't worship ideals and I agree that a lot of the ideas put forward by youthful left-wing idealists are silly, but so are a lot of right-wing ideas.

I think your belief that all left-wingers are youthful idealists is wishful thinking. No doubt, the idea excites you. How great it would be if all left-wingers were youthful idealists who grew up and realised their ideas were stupid, that they took off their rose-coloured glasses. Well, here is my advice to you. Why don't you take off your rose-coloured glasses and realise the world isn't that simple?

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