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Evidence mainstream islam facilitates radicalism? (Read 61514 times)
moses
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Re: Evidence mainstream islam facilitates radicalism?
Reply #390 - Jun 8th, 2013 at 9:17pm  
A few more from the qur'an (this is only a small sample)

Quote:
2.216 : Fighting is prescribed for you, and ye dislike it. But it is possible that ye dislike a thing which is good for you, and that ye love a thing which is bad for you. But allah knoweth, and ye know not.


Fighting and killing is prescribed for muslims, it is obligatory. 

Quote:
4.95 : Not equal are those believers who sit (at home) and receive no hurt, and those who strive and fight in the cause of allah with their goods and their persons. allah hath granted a grade higher to those who strive and fight with their goods and persons than to those who sit (at home). Unto all (in Faith) Hath allah promised good: But those who strive and fight Hath he distinguished above those who sit (at home) by a special reward,-


The muslim killer is a grade higher than a muslim who does not go out and kill.

Quote:
8.41 : And know that out of all the booty that ye may acquire (in war), a fifth share is assigned to allah,- and to the messenger, and to near relatives, orphans, the needy, and the wayfarer,- if ye do believe in allah and in the revelation We sent down to Our servant on the Day of Testing,- the Day of the meeting of the two forces. For allah hath power over all things.


Proof positive that islam is a aggressive and oppressive. (you don't get booty if you stay at home peacefully, you have to invade to get it)

Quote:
8.69 : But (now) enjoy what ye took in war, lawful and good: but fear allah: for allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.


More proof that invasion and theft of other people's property is the right of muslims.

Quote:
8:74 Those who believed and left their homes and strove for the cause of allah, and those who took them in and helped them - these are the believers in truth. For them is pardon, and bountiful provision.


muslim killers are granted pardon and bountiful provision.

Quote:
9.111 : allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs (in return) is the garden (of paradise): they fight in his cause, and slay and are slain: a promise binding on him in truth, through the Law, the gospel, and the qur'an: and who is more faithful to his covenant than allah? then rejoice in the bargain which ye have concluded: that is the achievement supreme.


allah owns the believers, their duty is to slay and be slain in the cause of allah

Quote:
9.39 : Unless ye go forth, he will punish you with a grievous penalty, and put others in your place; but Him ye would not harm in the least. For allah hath power over all things


It is the sacred duty of muslims to be islamic killers, if you don't go allah will punish you and put others in your place

Quote:
22.58 : Those who leave their homes in the cause of allah, and are then slain or die,- On them will allah bestow verily a goodly provision: Truly allah is he who bestows the best provision


allah guarantees to reward those killers who leave home and slay or are slain in islam's name

Quote:
48:19 And much booty that they will capture. allah is ever mighty, wise.

48:20 allah promiseth you much booty that ye will capture, and hath given you this in advance, and hath withheld men's hands from you, that it may be a token for the believers, and that he may guide you on a right path.


allah promises the muslim killers booty

Quote:
61.4 : Truly allah loves those who fight in his cause in battle array, as if they were a solid cemented structure.


allah truly loves the muslim killers

Of course the muslims and their groveling apologists will continue to lie, and tell us that it really doesn't mean what it says
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Soren
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Re: Evidence mainstream islam facilitates radicalism?
Reply #391 - Jun 8th, 2013 at 11:01pm  
Karnal wrote on Jun 7th, 2013 at 11:55pm:
Wait.  I have a challenge. Name one religious order binding all Muslims to carry out atrocities of the foulest kind.

One will do. 



Koran.
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Karnal
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Re: Evidence mainstream islam facilitates radicalism?
Reply #392 - Jun 8th, 2013 at 11:27pm  
I say, old chap, is that post-hermeneutic turn, or...?
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« Last Edit: Jun 8th, 2013 at 11:42pm by Karnal »  
 
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Karnal
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Re: Evidence mainstream islam facilitates radicalism?
Reply #393 - Jun 8th, 2013 at 11:33pm  
moses wrote on Jun 8th, 2013 at 9:17pm:
A few more from the qur'an (this is only a small sample)

Quote:
2.216 : Fighting is prescribed for you, and ye dislike it. But it is possible that ye dislike a thing which is good for you, and that ye love a thing which is bad for you. But allah knoweth, and ye know not.


Fighting and killing is prescribed for muslims, it is obligatory. 

Quote:
4.95 : Not equal are those believers who sit (at home) and receive no hurt, and those who strive and fight in the cause of allah with their goods and their persons. allah hath granted a grade higher to those who strive and fight with their goods and persons than to those who sit (at home). Unto all (in Faith) Hath allah promised good: But those who strive and fight Hath he distinguished above those who sit (at home) by a special reward,-


The muslim killer is a grade higher than a muslim who does not go out and kill.

Quote:
8.41 : And know that out of all the booty that ye may acquire (in war), a fifth share is assigned to allah,- and to the messenger, and to near relatives, orphans, the needy, and the wayfarer,- if ye do believe in allah and in the revelation We sent down to Our servant on the Day of Testing,- the Day of the meeting of the two forces. For allah hath power over all things.


Proof positive that islam is a aggressive and oppressive. (you don't get booty if you stay at home peacefully, you have to invade to get it)

Quote:
8.69 : But (now) enjoy what ye took in war, lawful and good: but fear allah: for allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.


More proof that invasion and theft of other people's property is the right of muslims.

Quote:
8:74 Those who believed and left their homes and strove for the cause of allah, and those who took them in and helped them - these are the believers in truth. For them is pardon, and bountiful provision.


muslim killers are granted pardon and bountiful provision.

Quote:
9.111 : allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs (in return) is the garden (of paradise): they fight in his cause, and slay and are slain: a promise binding on him in truth, through the Law, the gospel, and the qur'an: and who is more faithful to his covenant than allah? then rejoice in the bargain which ye have concluded: that is the achievement supreme.


allah owns the believers, their duty is to slay and be slain in the cause of allah

Quote:
9.39 : Unless ye go forth, he will punish you with a grievous penalty, and put others in your place; but Him ye would not harm in the least. For allah hath power over all things


It is the sacred duty of muslims to be islamic killers, if you don't go allah will punish you and put others in your place

Quote:
22.58 : Those who leave their homes in the cause of allah, and are then slain or die,- On them will allah bestow verily a goodly provision: Truly allah is he who bestows the best provision


allah guarantees to reward those killers who leave home and slay or are slain in islam's name

Quote:
48:19 And much booty that they will capture. allah is ever mighty, wise.

48:20 allah promiseth you much booty that ye will capture, and hath given you this in advance, and hath withheld men's hands from you, that it may be a token for the believers, and that he may guide you on a right path.


allah promises the muslim killers booty

Quote:
61.4 : Truly allah loves those who fight in his cause in battle array, as if they were a solid cemented structure.


allah truly loves the muslim killers

Of course the muslims and their groveling apologists will continue to lie, and tell us that it really doesn't mean what it says 


All nice quotes, but show me where the Koran specifies killing - you’ve added this.

It specifies fighting. Struggle. Jihad.

You’re as guilty of violent jihad as any terrorist if you think the Koran means killing every time it says fighting. Fighting refers to struggle - booty to what you get along the way. The Koran is a book for warriors.

And yes, the Koran does not mean what you’ve chosen to add. Want to ask an expert?

Ask FD. Even he will tell you. We’ve been through this many times before, you know.

Still, nice try. Like to post clear and unequivocal evidence? I’m all ears. It should not be hard, given what you’ve said.

An apologist? Moi? This is the view of mainstream Islam. Look it up.
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Karnal
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Re: Evidence mainstream islam facilitates radicalism?
Reply #394 - Jun 8th, 2013 at 11:33pm  
moses wrote on Jun 8th, 2013 at 9:17pm:
A few more from the qur'an (this is only a small sample)

Quote:
2.216 : Fighting is prescribed for you, and ye dislike it. But it is possible that ye dislike a thing which is good for you, and that ye love a thing which is bad for you. But allah knoweth, and ye know not.


Fighting and killing is prescribed for muslims, it is obligatory. 

Quote:
4.95 : Not equal are those believers who sit (at home) and receive no hurt, and those who strive and fight in the cause of allah with their goods and their persons. allah hath granted a grade higher to those who strive and fight with their goods and persons than to those who sit (at home). Unto all (in Faith) Hath allah promised good: But those who strive and fight Hath he distinguished above those who sit (at home) by a special reward,-


The muslim killer is a grade higher than a muslim who does not go out and kill.

Quote:
8.41 : And know that out of all the booty that ye may acquire (in war), a fifth share is assigned to allah,- and to the messenger, and to near relatives, orphans, the needy, and the wayfarer,- if ye do believe in allah and in the revelation We sent down to Our servant on the Day of Testing,- the Day of the meeting of the two forces. For allah hath power over all things.


Proof positive that islam is a aggressive and oppressive. (you don't get booty if you stay at home peacefully, you have to invade to get it)

Quote:
8.69 : But (now) enjoy what ye took in war, lawful and good: but fear allah: for allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.


More proof that invasion and theft of other people's property is the right of muslims.

Quote:
8:74 Those who believed and left their homes and strove for the cause of allah, and those who took them in and helped them - these are the believers in truth. For them is pardon, and bountiful provision.


muslim killers are granted pardon and bountiful provision.

Quote:
9.111 : allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs (in return) is the garden (of paradise): they fight in his cause, and slay and are slain: a promise binding on him in truth, through the Law, the gospel, and the qur'an: and who is more faithful to his covenant than allah? then rejoice in the bargain which ye have concluded: that is the achievement supreme.


allah owns the believers, their duty is to slay and be slain in the cause of allah

Quote:
9.39 : Unless ye go forth, he will punish you with a grievous penalty, and put others in your place; but Him ye would not harm in the least. For allah hath power over all things


It is the sacred duty of muslims to be islamic killers, if you don't go allah will punish you and put others in your place

Quote:
22.58 : Those who leave their homes in the cause of allah, and are then slain or die,- On them will allah bestow verily a goodly provision: Truly allah is he who bestows the best provision


allah guarantees to reward those killers who leave home and slay or are slain in islam's name

Quote:
48:19 And much booty that they will capture. allah is ever mighty, wise.

48:20 allah promiseth you much booty that ye will capture, and hath given you this in advance, and hath withheld men's hands from you, that it may be a token for the believers, and that he may guide you on a right path.


allah promises the muslim killers booty

Quote:
61.4 : Truly allah loves those who fight in his cause in battle array, as if they were a solid cemented structure.


allah truly loves the muslim killers

Of course the muslims and their groveling apologists will continue to lie, and tell us that it really doesn't mean what it says 


All nice quotes, but show me where the Koran specifies killing - you’ve added this.

It specifies fighting. Struggle. Jihad.

You’re as guilty of violent jihad as any terrorist if you think the Koran means killing every time it says fighting. Fighting refers to struggle - booty to what you get along the way. The Koran is a book for warriors.

And yes, the Koran does not mean what you’ve chosen to add. Want to ask an expert?

Ask FD. Even he will tell you. We’ve been through this many times before, you know.

Still, nice try. Like to post clear and unequivocal evidence? I’m all ears. It should not be hard, given what you’ve said.

An apologist? Moi? This is the view of mainstream Islam. Look it up.
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Karnal
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Re: Evidence mainstream islam facilitates radicalism?
Reply #395 - Jun 8th, 2013 at 11:33pm  
moses wrote on Jun 8th, 2013 at 9:17pm:
A few more from the qur'an (this is only a small sample)

Quote:
2.216 : Fighting is prescribed for you, and ye dislike it. But it is possible that ye dislike a thing which is good for you, and that ye love a thing which is bad for you. But allah knoweth, and ye know not.


Fighting and killing is prescribed for muslims, it is obligatory. 

Quote:
4.95 : Not equal are those believers who sit (at home) and receive no hurt, and those who strive and fight in the cause of allah with their goods and their persons. allah hath granted a grade higher to those who strive and fight with their goods and persons than to those who sit (at home). Unto all (in Faith) Hath allah promised good: But those who strive and fight Hath he distinguished above those who sit (at home) by a special reward,-


The muslim killer is a grade higher than a muslim who does not go out and kill.

Quote:
8.41 : And know that out of all the booty that ye may acquire (in war), a fifth share is assigned to allah,- and to the messenger, and to near relatives, orphans, the needy, and the wayfarer,- if ye do believe in allah and in the revelation We sent down to Our servant on the Day of Testing,- the Day of the meeting of the two forces. For allah hath power over all things.


Proof positive that islam is a aggressive and oppressive. (you don't get booty if you stay at home peacefully, you have to invade to get it)

Quote:
8.69 : But (now) enjoy what ye took in war, lawful and good: but fear allah: for allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.


More proof that invasion and theft of other people's property is the right of muslims.

Quote:
8:74 Those who believed and left their homes and strove for the cause of allah, and those who took them in and helped them - these are the believers in truth. For them is pardon, and bountiful provision.


muslim killers are granted pardon and bountiful provision.

Quote:
9.111 : allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs (in return) is the garden (of paradise): they fight in his cause, and slay and are slain: a promise binding on him in truth, through the Law, the gospel, and the qur'an: and who is more faithful to his covenant than allah? then rejoice in the bargain which ye have concluded: that is the achievement supreme.


allah owns the believers, their duty is to slay and be slain in the cause of allah

Quote:
9.39 : Unless ye go forth, he will punish you with a grievous penalty, and put others in your place; but Him ye would not harm in the least. For allah hath power over all things


It is the sacred duty of muslims to be islamic killers, if you don't go allah will punish you and put others in your place

Quote:
22.58 : Those who leave their homes in the cause of allah, and are then slain or die,- On them will allah bestow verily a goodly provision: Truly allah is he who bestows the best provision


allah guarantees to reward those killers who leave home and slay or are slain in islam's name

Quote:
48:19 And much booty that they will capture. allah is ever mighty, wise.

48:20 allah promiseth you much booty that ye will capture, and hath given you this in advance, and hath withheld men's hands from you, that it may be a token for the believers, and that he may guide you on a right path.


allah promises the muslim killers booty

Quote:
61.4 : Truly allah loves those who fight in his cause in battle array, as if they were a solid cemented structure.


allah truly loves the muslim killers

Of course the muslims and their groveling apologists will continue to lie, and tell us that it really doesn't mean what it says 


All nice quotes, but show me where the Koran specifies killing - you’ve added this.

It specifies fighting. Struggle. Jihad.

You’re as guilty of violent jihad as any terrorist if you think the Koran means killing every time it says fighting. Fighting refers to struggle - booty to what you get along the way. The Koran is a book for warriors.

And yes, the Koran does not mean what you’ve chosen to add. Want to ask an expert?

Ask FD. Even he will tell you. We’ve been through this many times before, you know.

Still, nice try. Like to post clear and unequivocal evidence? I’m all ears. It should not be hard, given what you’ve said.

An apologist? Moi? This is the view of mainstream Islam. Look it up.
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Yadda
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Re: Evidence mainstream islam facilitates radicalism?
Reply #396 - Jun 8th, 2013 at 11:39pm  
Karnal wrote on Jun 8th, 2013 at 11:27pm:
moses wrote on Jun 8th, 2013 at 9:17pm:
A few more from the qur'an (this is only a small sample)

Quote:
2.216 : Fighting is prescribed for you, and ye dislike it. But it is possible that ye dislike a thing which is good for you, and that ye love a thing which is bad for you. But allah knoweth, and ye know not.


Fighting and killing is prescribed for muslims, it is obligatory. 

Quote:
4.95 : Not equal are those believers who sit (at home) and receive no hurt, and those who strive and fight in the cause of allah with their goods and their persons. allah hath granted a grade higher to those who strive and fight with their goods and persons than to those who sit (at home). Unto all (in Faith) Hath allah promised good: But those who strive and fight Hath he distinguished above those who sit (at home) by a special reward,-


The muslim killer is a grade higher than a muslim who does not go out and kill.

Quote:
8.41 : And know that out of all the booty that ye may acquire (in war), a fifth share is assigned to allah,- and to the messenger, and to near relatives, orphans, the needy, and the wayfarer,- if ye do believe in allah and in the revelation We sent down to Our servant on the Day of Testing,- the Day of the meeting of the two forces. For allah hath power over all things.


Proof positive that islam is a aggressive and oppressive. (you don't get booty if you stay at home peacefully, you have to invade to get it)

Quote:
8.69 : But (now) enjoy what ye took in war, lawful and good: but fear allah: for allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.


More proof that invasion and theft of other people's property is the right of muslims.

Quote:
8:74 Those who believed and left their homes and strove for the cause of allah, and those who took them in and helped them - these are the believers in truth. For them is pardon, and bountiful provision.


muslim killers are granted pardon and bountiful provision.

Quote:
9.111 : allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs (in return) is the garden (of paradise): they fight in his cause, and slay and are slain: a promise binding on him in truth, through the Law, the gospel, and the qur'an: and who is more faithful to his covenant than allah? then rejoice in the bargain which ye have concluded: that is the achievement supreme.


allah owns the believers, their duty is to slay and be slain in the cause of allah

Quote:
9.39 : Unless ye go forth, he will punish you with a grievous penalty, and put others in your place; but Him ye would not harm in the least. For allah hath power over all things


It is the sacred duty of muslims to be islamic killers, if you don't go allah will punish you and put others in your place

Quote:
22.58 : Those who leave their homes in the cause of allah, and are then slain or die,- On them will allah bestow verily a goodly provision: Truly allah is he who bestows the best provision


allah guarantees to reward those killers who leave home and slay or are slain in islam's name

Quote:
48:19 And much booty that they will capture. allah is ever mighty, wise.

48:20 allah promiseth you much booty that ye will capture, and hath given you this in advance, and hath withheld men's hands from you, that it may be a token for the believers, and that he may guide you on a right path.


allah promises the muslim killers booty

Quote:
61.4 : Truly allah loves those who fight in his cause in battle array, as if they were a solid cemented structure.


allah truly loves the muslim killers

Of course the muslims and their groveling apologists will continue to lie, and tell us that it really doesn't mean what it says 




All nice quotes, but show me where the Koran specifies killing - you’ve added this.

It specifies fighting. Struggle. Jihad.

You’re as guilty of violent jihad as any terrorist if you think the Koran means killing every time it says fighting. Fighting refers to struggle - booty to what you get along the way. The Koran is a book for warriors.

And yes, the Koran does not mean what you’ve chosen to add. Want to ask an expert?

Ask FD. Even he will tell you. We’ve been through this many times before, you know.

Still, nice try. Like to post clear and unequivocal evidence? I’m all ears.

It should not be hard.






Yes, coz, actually, the moslems intent is to always engage in fighting the disbelievers without killing them.

Everybody knows this.

Ask Lee Rigby, he'll tell ya.



People like yourself, are a facilitators and apologists of murderers, K.

That is my opinion.








"....the death of those who are killed for the cause of God gives more impetus to the cause, which continues to thrive on their blood."

ISLAMIC scholar, Sayyid Qutb
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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31
 
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Yadda
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Re: Evidence mainstream islam facilitates radicalism?
Reply #397 - Jun 8th, 2013 at 11:48pm  
Quote:

"It is not for any prophet to have captives until he hath made slaughter in the land....."

Koran 8.067

Koran [8:67 above] is instructive to moslems.

Instructive.

Instructive.

Instructive.

Koran 8.067 means that, it teaches moslems, that they should beleaguer and slaughter the enemies of ISLAM, in the land, so as to terrorise them, and so as to cower them, and to make them afraid of moslems.

So that later, moslems will more easily be able to defeat, and enslave a pliant, fearful enemy of ISLAM.

ISLAM wants all disbelievers, to fear moslems!
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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31
 
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Karnal
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Re: Evidence mainstream islam facilitates radicalism?
Reply #398 - Jun 8th, 2013 at 11:50pm  
Ah, but Y, how would you know?

Mind you, you can find Muslims who believe this. They do exist.

The rest of the world - more than a quarter of the global population - don’t believe it at all.

And if they did, you’d be dead.

How do I know? Read the Koran on welcoming strangers. I.e, read the FULL Koran.

If you read Leviticus, you’d think God’s chosen people were complete bastards. And who knows?

Maybe they were.
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Karnal
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Re: Evidence mainstream islam facilitates radicalism?
Reply #399 - Jun 8th, 2013 at 11:51pm  
Ah, but Y, how would you know?

Mind you, you can find Muslims who believe this. They do exist.

The rest of the world - more than a quarter of the global population - don’t believe it at all.

And if they did, you’d be dead.

How do I know? Read the Koran on welcoming strangers. I.e, read the FULL Koran.

If you read Leviticus, you’d think God’s chosen people were complete bastards. And who knows?

Maybe they were.
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Re: Evidence mainstream islam facilitates radicalism?
Reply #400 - Jun 9th, 2013 at 12:06am  
Karnal wrote on Jun 8th, 2013 at 11:50pm:
Ah, but Y, how would you know?

Mind you, you can find Muslims who believe this. They do exist.

The rest of the world - more than a quarter of the global population - don’t believe it at all.

And if they did, you’d be dead.

How do I know? Read the Koran on welcoming strangers. I.e, read the FULL Koran.

If you read Leviticus, you’d think God’s chosen people were complete bastards. And who knows?

Maybe they were.





Point me to those verses, K.

You can't.

Because there are none.

There are no verses in the Koran, encouraging hospitality or friendship towards people who are identified as 'disbelievers' or non-moslems.

Prove me wrong.
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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31
 
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Re: Evidence mainstream islam facilitates radicalism?
Reply #401 - Jun 9th, 2013 at 11:38am  
If I do, Y, will you renounce your knucklehead ways?
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Re: Evidence mainstream islam facilitates radicalism?
Reply #402 - Jun 9th, 2013 at 11:41am  
Yadda wrote on Jun 9th, 2013 at 12:06am:
Point me to those verses, K.

You can't.

Because there are none.

There are no verses in the Koran, encouraging hospitality or friendship towards people who are identified as 'disbelievers' or non-moslems.

Prove me wrong.


quran 60:8-9
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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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Re: Evidence mainstream islam facilitates radicalism?
Reply #403 - Jun 9th, 2013 at 12:13pm  
"Be kind to parents, and the near kinsman, and to orphans, and to the needy, and to the neighbour who is of kin, and to the neighbour who is a stranger, and to the companion at your side, and to the traveller, and to (slaves) that your right hands own. Surely God loves not the proud and boastful such as are niggardly, and bid other men to be niggardly, and themselves conceal the bounty God has given them." Koran. 4.36-37.

I’m not sure why they felt the need to list every type of person you should help, but there you have it. There are other verses too. Charity, and helping strangers - of any cloth - is one of the Four Pillars of Islam. "Every person’s every joint must perform charity every day the sun comes up". Forty Hadith of an- Nawawi 26.

Understand the purpose of this, Y. Charity brings humility - what Islam terms submission to God. Helping others reduces the ego - "and themselves conceal the bounty God has given them." All those rules and laws are aimed at this purpose: becoming humble and submitting to God.

If you just read abstracted quotes on Jihadwatch, you miss their purpose. If your entire purpose in reading them is to preach hatred, you won’t understand. You’ll just create more ignorance.

Is this what you WANT to do?
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Soren
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Re: Evidence mainstream islam facilitates radicalism?
Reply #404 - Jun 9th, 2013 at 12:19pm  
Charity and hospitality towards other Muslims, not towards the kuffar. The Koran is not about universal brotherhood but only about Muslim Brotherhood.
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