Australian Politics Forum - The duplicitous, AND DECEITFUL, moslem community w

Yadda Gold Member Offline Posts: 21884 A cat with a view	Re: The duplicitous, AND DECEITFUL, moslem community w Reply #30 - May 16^th, 2013 at 10:51am baron, I acknowledge that you are an atheist.
Back to top	"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead." Luke 16:31 IP Logged

polite_gandalf

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 20027
Canberra
Gender: male

Re: The duplicitous, AND DECEITFUL, moslem community w
Reply #31 - May 16^th, 2013 at 11:16am

Baronvonrort wrote on May 16^th, 2013 at 9:25am:

Here is a thread with muslims saying the children of Israel are jews which might explain why you have ignored my question on why muslims always leave "the children of Israel out" when quoting 5/32, perhaps the thread title is accurate.

The children of Israel were jews. So what does that actually mean?

Jew: from the latin 'Iudaeus"- which simply means "Judean". Therefore a "jew" is someone (actually or ancestrally) from the land of Judea.

Congratulations Baron, you've discovered that muslims believe that the children of Israel came from the land of Judea. Quite a revelation there Tongue

So who were the "jewish" chilren of Israel in islamic tradition? The God fearing people who received the very first revelations through Abraham, Isaac, Jacob... and eventually Moses - who is arguably the second greatest prophet in islamic tradition.

So its quite clear that the children of Israel were bone fide "muslims" - according to islamic tradition (but obviously not jewish tradition).

Is any of this contradicted by what Abu said in the thread you linked? No.

Baronvonrort wrote on May 16^th, 2013 at 9:25am:

As for your nonsense on who was the first muslim does the Quran say Mohammad was the first muslim?

Does this change the fact that the quran referred to Jacob and his children specifically as muslims? No. Why the seeming contradiction? Probably because there were no "muslims" (in the sense of those people of the book who followed the 'true' revelation of Moses and Jesus - as defined by islamic tradition) - left during the time the quran was revealed. Mohammad was the first muslim from amongst his people

Back to top

A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

IP Logged

Yadda

Gold Member

Offline

Posts: 21884
A cat with a view

Re: The duplicitous, AND DECEITFUL, moslem community w
Reply #32 - May 16^th, 2013 at 12:17pm

polite_gandalf wrote on May 16^th, 2013 at 11:16am:

Baronvonrort wrote on May 16^th, 2013 at 9:25am:

Here is a thread with muslims saying the children of Israel are jews which might explain why you have ignored my question on why muslims always leave "the children of Israel out" when quoting 5/32, perhaps the thread title is accurate.

The children of Israel were jews.

So what does that actually mean?

gandalf,

Your premise is incorrect.

The children of Israel were Hebrews.

Hebrews = = those who cross over

Cross over what ?

The explanation is spiritual, gandalf.

gandalf,

Why do you hate Jews ?

[Silly me. Of course. They are not moslems!]

Back to top

"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

IP Logged

polite_gandalf

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 20027
Canberra
Gender: male

Re: The duplicitous, AND DECEITFUL, moslem community w
Reply #33 - May 16^th, 2013 at 12:31pm

Yadda wrote on May 16^th, 2013 at 12:17pm:

gandalf,

Your premise is incorrect.

The children of Israel were Hebrews

Baron brought up the term 'jew' not me.

Baron said "muslims [say] the children of Israel are jews" - as if that was disproving something I said.

The children of Israel were "jews" in the sense that they were from the land of Judea. They were of course *ALSO* hebrews - in whatever sense you want - linguistically or spiritually.

Back to top

A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

IP Logged

Baronvonrort

Gold Member

Online

Australian Politics

Posts: 18740
Gender: male

Re: The duplicitous, AND DECEITFUL, moslem community w
Reply #34 - May 16^th, 2013 at 6:42pm

polite_gandalf wrote on May 16^th, 2013 at 12:31pm:

Baron said "muslims [say] the children of Israel are jews" - as if that was disproving something I said.

When children of Israel are mentioned in the Quran they are talking about the yahud (jews), you still have not answered why muslims leave out we decreed upon the children of israel when quoting 5/32.

Back to top

Leftists and the Ayatollahs have a lot in common when it comes to criticism of Islam, they don't tolerate it.

IP Logged

polite_gandalf

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 20027
Canberra
Gender: male

Re: The duplicitous, AND DECEITFUL, moslem community w
Reply #35 - May 17^th, 2013 at 4:36pm

Long story short Baron, if you believe that islam inherits the message of the children of Israel (which muslims do), then you also believe that what was good for the children of Israel is also good for muslims - and conversely what is bad for the children of Israel (ie transgressing from the message), is also bad for muslims.

5/32 was deemed applicable for the children of Israel - therefore it is a given that it is also applicable for muslims.

Back to top

A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

IP Logged

Baronvonrort

Gold Member

Online

Australian Politics

Posts: 18740
Gender: male

Re: The duplicitous, AND DECEITFUL, moslem community w
Reply #36 - May 17^th, 2013 at 4:56pm

polite_gandalf wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 4:36pm:

Long story short Baron, if you believe that islam inherits the message of the children of Israel (which muslims do), then you also believe that what was good for the children of Israel is also good for muslims - and conversely what is bad for the children of Israel (ie transgressing from the message), is also bad for muslims.

5/32 was deemed applicable for the children of Israel - therefore it is a given that it is also applicable for muslims.

If Islam inherited the message from the children of Israel they would not be following the Quran they would be following the jewish texts,Islam says their belief is corrupted and Islam is the only true religion.

If an Israeli kills a Palestinian then muslims go apeshit, if muslims are killing muslims like in Syria or Iraq today nothing much gets said, the reaction from muslims over jewish killing of 1 person shows 5/32 applies to the filthy yahud and not muslims.

The Muhammad al Durrah hoax show that a jew killing a muslim (they didnt it was a staged hoax) caused an intifada, there is no such outrage from muslims killing muslims in Iraq or Syria.
www.en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad_al-Durrah_incident

You still have not explained why muslims leave out we decreed upon the children of Israel when quoting 5/32.
www.quran.com/5/32

5/33 does apply to muslims
www.quran.com/5/33

Back to top

Leftists and the Ayatollahs have a lot in common when it comes to criticism of Islam, they don't tolerate it.

IP Logged

polite_gandalf

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 20027
Canberra
Gender: male

Re: The duplicitous, AND DECEITFUL, moslem community w
Reply #37 - May 17^th, 2013 at 6:08pm

Baronvonrort wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 4:56pm:

If Islam inherited the message from the children of Israel they would not be following the Quran they would be following the jewish texts,Islam says their belief is corrupted and Islam is the only true religion.

You've made a claim and refuted it yourself - all in the one sentence Grin

- albeit a very bad sentence gramatically.

Muslims don't believe the "true" revelation given to Abraham and Moses is the same version that jews follow today. It was, as you yourself point out, corrupted somewhere along the way.

Back to top

A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

IP Logged

Baronvonrort

Gold Member

Online

Australian Politics

Posts: 18740
Gender: male

Re: The duplicitous, AND DECEITFUL, moslem community w
Reply #38 - May 17^th, 2013 at 7:04pm

polite_gandalf wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 6:08pm:

Baronvonrort wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 4:56pm:

If Islam inherited the message from the children of Israel they would not be following the Quran they would be following the jewish texts,Islam says their belief is corrupted and Islam is the only true religion.

You've made a claim and refuted it yourself - all in the one sentence Grin

- albeit a very bad sentence gramatically.

Muslims don't believe the "true" revelation given to Abraham and Moses is the same version that jews follow today. It was, as you yourself point out, corrupted somewhere along the way.

It is muslims who claim the buy-bull and jewish texts have been corrupted.

Did you make a spelling mistake?

Back to top

Leftists and the Ayatollahs have a lot in common when it comes to criticism of Islam, they don't tolerate it.

IP Logged

polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20027 Canberra Gender:	Re: The duplicitous, AND DECEITFUL, moslem community w Reply #39 - May 17^th, 2013 at 7:14pm Baronvonrort wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 7:04pm: It is muslims who claim the buy-bull and jewish texts have been corrupted. yes, and...?
Back to top	A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said: Quote: Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms. IP Logged

Brian Ross Gold Member Offline Representative of me Posts: 42312	Re: The duplicitous, AND DECEITFUL, moslem community w Reply #40 - May 17^th, 2013 at 9:27pm I wonder, how many angels do the theological experts like Yadda, Soren, FreeDiver and the Baron believe can dance on the head of a pin?
Back to top	Someone said we could not judge a person's Aboriginality on their skin colour. Why isn't that applied in the matter of Pascoe? Tsk, tsk, tsk... IP Logged

Yadda

Gold Member

Offline

Posts: 21884
A cat with a view

Re: The duplicitous, AND DECEITFUL, moslem community w
Reply #41 - May 17^th, 2013 at 11:40pm

Brian Ross wrote on May 17^th, 2013 at 9:27pm:

I wonder, how many angels do the theological experts like Yadda, Soren, FreeDiver and the Baron believe can dance on the head of a pin?

I am not a theological expert.

I can read and write, and i know which way is up.

I don't call black, white.

And i don't call white, black.

+++

IMAGE....

A moslem advertising campaign [2007] in the UK, promoting British moslems as normal, integrated citizens, who reject extremism;
"PROUD TO BE A.....MOSLEM"

It just makes you proud, doesn't it!i

Moslems are misrepresenting ISLAM, to naive, and uninformed, non-moslem communities.

ISLAM IS NOT A PEACEFUL AND TOLERANT FAITH.

"The Koran is our constitution, the Prophet is our leader, jihad is our path and death in the name of Allah is our goal."

Declaration by Morsi - Recently elected ISLAMIST PRESIDENT of Egypt.

"....the death of those who are killed for the cause of God gives more impetus to the cause, which continues to thrive on their blood."

ISLAMIC scholar, Sayyid Qutb

"And fight with them until.....religion should be only for Allah,..."
Koran 2.193

"O ye who believe! Fight those of the disbelievers who are near to you, and let them find harshness in you, and know that Allah is with those who keep their duty (unto Him)."
Koran 9.123

"Allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs (in return) is the garden (of Paradise): they fight in His cause, and slay and are slain:...."
Koran 9.111

Back to top

"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

IP Logged

Brian Ross Gold Member Offline Representative of me Posts: 42312	Re: The duplicitous, AND DECEITFUL, moslem community w Reply #42 - May 18^th, 2013 at 2:04pm You're not a theological expect, Yadda? I am amazed. Afterall, you keep trying to appear like one. Me? I think an infinite number of Angels can dance on the head of a pin. How many do you think can?
Back to top	Someone said we could not judge a person's Aboriginality on their skin colour. Why isn't that applied in the matter of Pascoe? Tsk, tsk, tsk... IP Logged

Yadda

Gold Member

Offline

Posts: 21884
A cat with a view

Re: The duplicitous, AND DECEITFUL, moslem community w
Reply #43 - May 19^th, 2013 at 2:08am

Brian Ross wrote on May 18^th, 2013 at 2:04pm:

You're not a theological expect, Yadda?

I am amazed.

Afterall, you keep trying to appear like one.

Me? I think an infinite number of Angels can dance on the head of a pin.

How many do you think can? Roll Eyes

How many dozen lying demons can inhabit your heart Brian ?

Not believable ?

The United States of Tara, reflects a truth.

Do you sleep soundly, Brian ? Roll Eyes

Back to top

"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

IP Logged

Brian Ross

Gold Member

Offline

Representative of me

Posts: 42312

Re: The duplicitous, AND DECEITFUL, moslem community w
Reply #44 - May 20^th, 2013 at 12:48am

Yadda wrote on May 19^th, 2013 at 2:08am:

Brian Ross wrote on May 18^th, 2013 at 2:04pm:

You're not a theological expect, Yadda?

I am amazed.

Afterall, you keep trying to appear like one.

Me? I think an infinite number of Angels can dance on the head of a pin.

How many do you think can? Roll Eyes

How many dozen lying demons can inhabit your heart Brian ?

Not believable ?

The United States of Tara, reflects a truth.

Do you sleep soundly, Brian ? Roll Eyes

Amazing, no crayon, no weird formatting. I can read one of your posts, Yadda! Praise the great Flying Meatball! I'm experimenting with being a Pastafarian today. The colander on the head is a great look, don't you think? Grin

In answer to your questions.

1. None. My cosmology doesn't have demons in it.

2. No.

3. Only for those that believe in the possibility of split personality disorder. Me, I just think its Schizophrenia. Do you suffer from it?

4. Soundly, like a baby.

How about you? Are your dreams filled with cattle cars and ovens into which you're shovelling innocents with Green Crescents sewn on their clothing? Roll Eyes

Back to top

Someone said we could not judge a person's Aboriginality on their skin colour. Why isn't that applied in the matter of Pascoe? Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

IP Logged