Australian Politics Forum - Abbott trying to sabotage Gonski

Innocent bystander Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 4220 Gender:	Re: Abbott trying to sabotage Gonski Reply #15 - May 20^th, 2013 at 11:03am The education department in this country already employs two people for every one job, are they trying to make it three for one?
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Swagman

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Re: Abbott trying to sabotage Gonski
Reply #16 - May 20^th, 2013 at 11:50am

John Smith wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 10:40am:

oh Bullsh1t ..... if he can come up with the money for his paid parental leave, he can come up with money for Gonski, its about priorities. .... besdies, that has nothing to do with his blatant attempts to sabotage labor.... he doesn't need to worry about the budget, he's not the PM. Everything Abbott has done for the last 3 years has been about one thing and one thing only, the polls ... he has never put the country first .. this is another example of that. Once he wins office (if he wins) he can make whatever changes he likes until then , he should butt out of things that don't concern him

Just pull out the visa card Smithy that's what Labor does. Pity it's maxed out.... Sad

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Doctor Jolly Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 3808	Re: Abbott trying to sabotage Gonski Reply #17 - May 20^th, 2013 at 11:52am Innocent bystander wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 11:03am: The education department in this country already employs two people for every one job Thats a very sweeping statement with little to back it up.
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John Smith

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Re: Abbott trying to sabotage Gonski
Reply #18 - May 20^th, 2013 at 12:04pm

Swagman wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 11:50am:

John Smith wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 10:40am:

oh Bullsh1t ..... if he can come up with the money for his paid parental leave, he can come up with money for Gonski, its about priorities. .... besdies, that has nothing to do with his blatant attempts to sabotage labor.... he doesn't need to worry about the budget, he's not the PM. Everything Abbott has done for the last 3 years has been about one thing and one thing only, the polls ... he has never put the country first .. this is another example of that. Once he wins office (if he wins) he can make whatever changes he likes until then , he should butt out of things that don't concern him

Just pull out the visa card Smithy that's what Labor does. Pity it's maxed out.... Sad

the same visa card he wants to use for paid parental leave? seriously you want to keep repeating that excuse? Abbotts talks the talk, but his priorities are all wrong. I think the country would gain more with the gonski reforms then they we will ever gain with the paid paretnal leave.

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aquascoot

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Re: Abbott trying to sabotage Gonski
Reply #19 - May 20^th, 2013 at 12:19pm

longweekend58 wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 9:44am:

The Finnish system is one of the worlds best yet the govt puts less money per student than we do - around 40% less. money isn't the solution. Gonski will only bloat education departments. Finland has independently run and managed public schools. Principals hire and fire staff and manage their own budgets. the education dept there is very small and responsible mainly for the curriculum and paying the bills. and the results are spectacular. In effect, the entire Finnish public education system is run like the private system here.

Who'd have thunk small private businesses could outperform a massive bloated public service run bureaucracy ? Cheesy

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John Smith

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Re: Abbott trying to sabotage Gonski
Reply #20 - May 20^th, 2013 at 12:28pm

aquascoot wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 12:19pm:

longweekend58 wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 9:44am:

The Finnish system is one of the worlds best yet the govt puts less money per student than we do - around 40% less. money isn't the solution. Gonski will only bloat education departments. Finland has independently run and managed public schools. Principals hire and fire staff and manage their own budgets. the education dept there is very small and responsible mainly for the curriculum and paying the bills. and the results are spectacular. In effect, the entire Finnish public education system is run like the private system here.

Who'd have thunk small private businesses could outperform a massive bloated public service run bureaucracy ? Cheesy

I thought the Finns didn't have private schools ... what small businesses are you referring to?

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longweekend58

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Re: Abbott trying to sabotage Gonski
Reply #21 - May 20^th, 2013 at 1:25pm

Doctor Jolly wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 11:52am:

Innocent bystander wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 11:03am:

The education department in this country already employs two people for every one job

Thats a very sweeping statement with little to back it up.

the govt department with the most employees being paid $300K (by far) is the education dept.

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longweekend58

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Re: Abbott trying to sabotage Gonski
Reply #22 - May 20^th, 2013 at 1:26pm

John Smith wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 12:28pm:

aquascoot wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 12:19pm:

longweekend58 wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 9:44am:

The Finnish system is one of the worlds best yet the govt puts less money per student than we do - around 40% less. money isn't the solution. Gonski will only bloat education departments. Finland has independently run and managed public schools. Principals hire and fire staff and manage their own budgets. the education dept there is very small and responsible mainly for the curriculum and paying the bills. and the results are spectacular. In effect, the entire Finnish public education system is run like the private system here.

Who'd have thunk small private businesses could outperform a massive bloated public service run bureaucracy ? Cheesy

I thought the Finns didn't have private schools ... what small businesses are you referring to?

they run all public schools as private schools, using the same methods and practices as private schools. That was the point.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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Doctor Jolly

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Re: Abbott trying to sabotage Gonski
Reply #23 - May 20^th, 2013 at 3:55pm

longweekend58 wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 1:25pm:

Doctor Jolly wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 11:52am:

Innocent bystander wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 11:03am:

The education department in this country already employs two people for every one job

Thats a very sweeping statement with little to back it up.

the govt department with the most employees being paid $300K (by far) is the education dept.

Oh, I thought he meant two teachers in every classroom.

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longweekend58

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Re: Abbott trying to sabotage Gonski
Reply #24 - May 20^th, 2013 at 5:36pm

There are a few public schools trialling 'independence' where the principal is actually allowed to run the school. they can select or remove teachers and manage their own funding. Watch in the future how this model gets replicated and over 10-20 years education department nationwide get scaled back to the bone. Then schools will have more money, more teachers, better outcomes and will cost us less than currently!

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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chicken_lipsforme Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 7090 Townsville NQ Gender:	Re: Abbott trying to sabotage Gonski Reply #25 - May 20^th, 2013 at 7:10pm Why worry about Abbott? If Labor actually were to implement the Gonski report they would stuff it up anyway.
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Mnemonic

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Re: Abbott trying to sabotage Gonski
Reply #26 - May 20^th, 2013 at 7:24pm

longweekend58 wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 1:26pm:

they run all public schools as private schools, using the same methods and practices as private schools. That was the point.

I'm not particularly fussed as long as so-called "private school" graduates don't get to be patronising and condescending to "public school" graduates. If everyone is under the same system, that's fine with me because in this case there is no "public" or "private." If they're going to mix traits associated with both public (government-funded, free tuition) and private schools (independent administration) in a universal education system, I don't care if part of it works like a "private" system.

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Mnemonic

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Re: Abbott trying to sabotage Gonski
Reply #27 - May 20^th, 2013 at 7:25pm

longweekend58 wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 5:36pm:

There are a few public schools trialling 'independence' where the principal is actually allowed to run the school. they can select or remove teachers and manage their own funding. Watch in the future how this model gets replicated and over 10-20 years education department nationwide get scaled back to the bone. Then schools will have more money, more teachers, better outcomes and will cost us less than currently!

As long as it doesn't lead to class-ism, I'm all for it.

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philperth2010 Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 20313 Perth Gender:	Re: Abbott trying to sabotage Gonski Reply #28 - May 20^th, 2013 at 8:49pm Abbott thinks education funding is ok the way it is??? http://www.theage.com.au/opinion/politics/how-privilege-rules-over-school-fundin...
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John Smith

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Re: Abbott trying to sabotage Gonski
Reply #29 - May 20^th, 2013 at 9:05pm

longweekend58 wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 1:26pm:

John Smith wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 12:28pm:

aquascoot wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 12:19pm:

longweekend58 wrote on May 20^th, 2013 at 9:44am:

The Finnish system is one of the worlds best yet the govt puts less money per student than we do - around 40% less. money isn't the solution. Gonski will only bloat education departments. Finland has independently run and managed public schools. Principals hire and fire staff and manage their own budgets. the education dept there is very small and responsible mainly for the curriculum and paying the bills. and the results are spectacular. In effect, the entire Finnish public education system is run like the private system here.

Who'd have thunk small private businesses could outperform a massive bloated public service run bureaucracy ? Cheesy

I thought the Finns didn't have private schools ... what small businesses are you referring to?

they run all public schools as private schools, using the same methods and practices as private schools. That was the point.

so they are all public schools that are run differently to our system .... they are still public schools no matter how they are run. So again, what small business is outperforming anything?

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Our esteemed leader:
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