Australian Politics Forum - Marriage equality only for homosexuals

____ Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 33410 Australia Gender:	Re: Marriage equality only for homosexuals Reply #15 - May 23^rd, 2013 at 9:10am BlOoDy RiPpEr wrote on May 23^rd, 2013 at 9:07am: Next on the list is public toilets, Men who dress like women will want equal rights to female toilets. They will cry discrimination. news to me that toilets have reproductive organs. guess you spend more time around them so you should know.
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BlOoDy RiPpEr

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Re: Marriage equality only for homosexuals
Reply #16 - May 23^rd, 2013 at 9:26am

____ wrote on May 23^rd, 2013 at 9:10am:

BlOoDy RiPpEr wrote on May 23^rd, 2013 at 9:07am:

Next on the list is public toilets, Men who dress like women will want equal rights to female toilets. They will cry discrimination.

news to me that toilets have reproductive organs. guess you spend more time around them so you should know.

wtf are you on about greeny?

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greggerypeccary Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 139800 Gender:	Re: Marriage equality only for homosexuals Reply #17 - May 23^rd, 2013 at 10:45am BlOoDy RiPpEr wrote on May 23^rd, 2013 at 9:07am: Next on the list is public toilets, Men who dress like women will want equal rights to female toilets. They will cry discrimination. Dear me. This sounds serious. Just as well there are already unisex toilets in countries all around the world.
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Swagman

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Re: Marriage equality only for homosexuals
Reply #18 - May 23^rd, 2013 at 10:56am

Makka wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 8:11pm:

FriYAY wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 8:01pm:

Makka wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 7:56pm:

FriYAY wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 7:52pm:

Makka wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 7:50pm:

Has anyone heard social apologists pushing for marriage equality for any other group or is equality only worthy if you are a homosexual?

What other groups?

Any group that wants marriage equality

For example.....?

(1) Between family immediate members

(2) Between 1 man and many women

(3) Between 1 woman and many men

.....don't forget 'Rover' Grin

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Makka Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 803 Gender:	Re: Marriage equality only for homosexuals Reply #19 - May 23^rd, 2013 at 8:17pm Fit of Absent Mindeness wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 8:16pm: If these groups want marriage equality then they should lobby for it. So marriage equality is only available to those who lobby for it?
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Makka

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Re: Marriage equality only for homosexuals
Reply #20 - May 23^rd, 2013 at 8:21pm

Quantum wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 9:08pm:

"Marriage equality" and "discrimination" are words chucked around by many who want Same Sex Marriage as a way of avoiding actual debate. Too many use these as a form of guilt tripping and attacking the opposition to SSM.

True marriage equality can not expand to include one group and ignore all others. SSM may broaden the inclusion zone of marriage, but it still maintains barriers and excludes many other forms or relationships. It is certainly not true "marriage equality".

Same deal with discrimination. The word is thrown around as an insult towards any who would argue against SSM. But most who want SSM still want to discriminate. They don't want marriage for all but simply want to include same sex into marriage. This means they want to move the line to include same sex and then draw a new line to exclude all others. If any and all discrimination is bad then the same sex marriage supporters who use such arguments are simply hypocrites. They basically say that discrimination against them is wrong, but it is ok to discriminate against all others.

The reality is that no one who claims to want "marriage equality" and to remove "discrimination" in marriage actually want to have true equality and no discrimination. Instead they just want to have slightly less discrimination that what we currently have. Now that itself is fine, but you can not accuse people of discrimination just because they have a slightly more traditional line in the sand than you do.

If someone wants to argue for SSM then fine... argue for it. Stop chucking easy words like "equality" and "discrimination" around and then say; 'but it is still ok to exclude these people.'

hear hear

I remember those who support the climate change movement using "climate denier" as a way to avoid and stifle debate as well

The technique of avoiding or stifling debate is called "demonising"

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philperth2010

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Re: Marriage equality only for homosexuals
Reply #21 - May 23^rd, 2013 at 11:32pm

Makka wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 7:50pm:

Has anyone heard social apologists pushing for marriage equality for any other group or is equality only worthy if you are a homosexual?

You mean like mixed race marriages.....Or are you implying some people are not worthy of equal rights???

Huh

Never try to reason the prejudice out of a man. It was not reasoned into him, and cannot be reasoned out.
Sydney Smith (1771 - 1845)

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philperth2010

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Re: Marriage equality only for homosexuals
Reply #22 - May 23^rd, 2013 at 11:50pm

Quantum wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 9:08pm:

"Marriage equality" and "discrimination" are words chucked around by many who want Same Sex Marriage as a way of avoiding actual debate. Too many use these as a form of guilt tripping and attacking the opposition to SSM.

True marriage equality can not expand to include one group and ignore all others. SSM may broaden the inclusion zone of marriage, but it still maintains barriers and excludes many other forms or relationships. It is certainly not true "marriage equality".

Same deal with discrimination. The word is thrown around as an insult towards any who would argue against SSM. But most who want SSM still want to discriminate. They don't want marriage for all but simply want to include same sex into marriage. This means they want to move the line to include same sex and then draw a new line to exclude all others. If any and all discrimination is bad then the same sex marriage supporters who use such arguments are simply hypocrites. They basically say that discrimination against them is wrong, but it is ok to discriminate against all others.

The reality is that no one who claims to want "marriage equality" and to remove "discrimination" in marriage actually want to have true equality and no discrimination. Instead they just want to have slightly less discrimination that what we currently have. Now that itself is fine, but you can not accuse people of discrimination just because they have a slightly more traditional line in the sand than you do.

If someone wants to argue for SSM then fine... argue for it. Stop chucking easy words like "equality" and "discrimination" around and then say; 'but it is still ok to exclude these people.'

OK I will bite.....Why should gay people not be allowed to marry each other???

Huh

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Mnemonic

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Re: Marriage equality only for homosexuals
Reply #23 - May 24^th, 2013 at 12:30am

Peter Freedman wrote on May 23^rd, 2013 at 5:08am:

Just a dumb thread. Still, it gave Quantum a chance to indulge in semantics, so I guess it isn't all bad.

Personally, I believe giraffes should be allowed to marry hippos and will not cease to lobby for this until successful.

Actually I think Quantum made a good point. I never thought of it that way.

philperth2010 wrote on May 23^rd, 2013 at 11:50pm:

OK I will bite.....Why should gay people not be allowed to marry each other???

Huh

I don't see it as a problem. Let's just be ready for more debates about the limits of marriage.

In advance, let me say I think polygamy should be legal.

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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: Marriage equality only for homosexuals
Reply #24 - May 24^th, 2013 at 4:27am

Makka wrote on May 23^rd, 2013 at 8:21pm:

Quantum wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 9:08pm:

"Marriage equality" and "discrimination" are words chucked around by many who want Same Sex Marriage as a way of avoiding actual debate. Too many use these as a form of guilt tripping and attacking the opposition to SSM.

True marriage equality can not expand to include one group and ignore all others. SSM may broaden the inclusion zone of marriage, but it still maintains barriers and excludes many other forms or relationships. It is certainly not true "marriage equality".

Same deal with discrimination. The word is thrown around as an insult towards any who would argue against SSM. But most who want SSM still want to discriminate. They don't want marriage for all but simply want to include same sex into marriage. This means they want to move the line to include same sex and then draw a new line to exclude all others. If any and all discrimination is bad then the same sex marriage supporters who use such arguments are simply hypocrites. They basically say that discrimination against them is wrong, but it is ok to discriminate against all others.

The reality is that no one who claims to want "marriage equality" and to remove "discrimination" in marriage actually want to have true equality and no discrimination. Instead they just want to have slightly less discrimination that what we currently have. Now that itself is fine, but you can not accuse people of discrimination just because they have a slightly more traditional line in the sand than you do.

If someone wants to argue for SSM then fine... argue for it. Stop chucking easy words like "equality" and "discrimination" around and then say; 'but it is still ok to exclude these people.'

hear hear

I remember those who support the climate change movement using "climate denier" as a way to avoid and stifle debate as well

The technique of avoiding or stifling debate is called "demonising"

Nope. Perhaps you should look it up.

SOB

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philperth2010

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Re: Marriage equality only for homosexuals
Reply #25 - May 24^th, 2013 at 7:06am

Mnemonic wrote on May 24^th, 2013 at 12:30am:

Peter Freedman wrote on May 23^rd, 2013 at 5:08am:

Just a dumb thread. Still, it gave Quantum a chance to indulge in semantics, so I guess it isn't all bad.

Personally, I believe giraffes should be allowed to marry hippos and will not cease to lobby for this until successful.

Actually I think Quantum made a good point. I never thought of it that way.

philperth2010 wrote on May 23^rd, 2013 at 11:50pm:

OK I will bite.....Why should gay people not be allowed to marry each other???

Huh

I don't see it as a problem. Let's just be ready for more debates about the limits of marriage.

In advance, let me say I think polygamy should be legal.

As I am not a Conservative I accept the world must change so all people are given the same rights to freedom and the right of law.....Gay people are allowed to marry in many countries around the world without a call for people to be allowed to marry their pets or window dressings.....In some countries men already have the legal right to take many wives so that argument falls flat on its face.....Quantum has called for a reasoned debate on gay marriage so lets stick to that instead of raising bullshit possibilities that have nothing to do with the subject.....Every human being deserves the same rights regardless of their sexual orientation.....So why shouldn't gay people be allowed to marry???

Huh

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Re: Marriage equality only for homosexuals
Reply #26 - May 24^th, 2013 at 8:37am

philperth2010 wrote on May 23^rd, 2013 at 11:32pm:

Makka wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 7:50pm:

Has anyone heard social apologists pushing for marriage equality for any other group or is equality only worthy if you are a homosexual?

You mean like mixed race marriages.....Or are you implying some people are not worthy of equal rights???

Huh

Never try to reason the prejudice out of a man. It was not reasoned into him, and cannot be reasoned out.
Sydney Smith (1771 - 1845)

Was interracial marriage ever illegal in Australia?

No, you say? So what's the relevance bud?

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In the fullness of time...

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...

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Re: Marriage equality only for homosexuals
Reply #27 - May 24^th, 2013 at 8:42am

philperth2010 wrote on May 24^th, 2013 at 7:06am:

Every human being deserves the same rights regardless of their sexual orientation.....So why shouldn't gay people be allowed to marry???

Their rights don't differ.

Quote:

since 1 July 2009, same-sex couples receive the same level of recognition as de facto opposite-sex couples in federal legislation including tax, health, superannuation, and aged care.

Just like I don't have the right to redefine universal, traditional institutions, neither do they.

No issue here.

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In the fullness of time...

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philperth2010

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Re: Marriage equality only for homosexuals
Reply #28 - May 24^th, 2013 at 5:07pm

... wrote on May 24^th, 2013 at 8:37am:

philperth2010 wrote on May 23^rd, 2013 at 11:32pm:

Makka wrote on May 22^nd, 2013 at 7:50pm:

Has anyone heard social apologists pushing for marriage equality for any other group or is equality only worthy if you are a homosexual?

You mean like mixed race marriages.....Or are you implying some people are not worthy of equal rights???

Huh

Never try to reason the prejudice out of a man. It was not reasoned into him, and cannot be reasoned out.
Sydney Smith (1771 - 1845)

Was interracial marriage ever illegal in Australia?

No, you say? So what's the relevance bud?

Where does it state Australia in my post.....Another deflection when you have no substance to your argument!!!

Huh

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If knowledge can create problems, it is not through ignorance that we can solve them.
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philperth2010

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Re: Marriage equality only for homosexuals
Reply #29 - May 24^th, 2013 at 5:09pm

... wrote on May 24^th, 2013 at 8:42am:

philperth2010 wrote on May 24^th, 2013 at 7:06am:

Every human being deserves the same rights regardless of their sexual orientation.....So why shouldn't gay people be allowed to marry???

Their rights don't differ.

They are not allowed to get married...That right is not afforded to gay people!!!

Quote:

since 1 July 2009, same-sex couples receive the same level of recognition as de facto opposite-sex couples in federal legislation including tax, health, superannuation, and aged care.

Just like I don't have the right to redefine universal, traditional institutions, neither do they.

No issue here.

So when it happens as it will you will have to accept it.....No issue here!!!

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If knowledge can create problems, it is not through ignorance that we can solve them.
Isaac Asimov (1920 - 1992)

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