Australian Politics Forum - Muslims want to silence and intimidate you

polite_gandalf

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Re: Muslims want to silence and intimidate you
Reply #90 - Jun 2^nd, 2013 at 10:42pm

FFS Soren. How can I invite you to a sensible, civilized discussion without having you ridiculing and mocking me? Please help me Angry

The jew scenario seemed poignant given the history of persecution they have suffered - even to this day. But pick whatever group you like. How about Vietnamese - they were a target group a couple of decades ago:

a man in a restaurant picks out a Vietnamese couple and says "if not for these arseholes, our streets would be free of heroin". Would you consider that an unacceptable "freedom of speech"?

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20027 Canberra Gender:	Re: Muslims want to silence and intimidate you Reply #91 - Jun 2^nd, 2013 at 10:42pm bump
Back to top	A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said: Quote: Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms. IP Logged

Soren

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Re: Muslims want to silence and intimidate you
Reply #92 - Jun 2^nd, 2013 at 10:53pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2013 at 10:42pm:

FFS Soren. How can I invite you to a sensible, civilized discussion without having you ridiculing and mocking me? Please help me Angry

The jew scenario seemed poignant given the history of persecution they have suffered - even to this day.

Mostly by Muslim, in this day and age.

Your Jew scenario is about Muslims trying to diddle the jews out of the victimhood schtick.

In every discussion around the Muslim responsibility for the actions of Muslim, it is Muslims who introduce the jew scenario.
As if.
As if the Muslims were victims like the Jews. What a load of crap.

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polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20027 Canberra Gender:	Re: Muslims want to silence and intimidate you Reply #93 - Jun 2^nd, 2013 at 11:03pm So nothing to say about Australian law, and what speech freedoms should be restricted by law then? I apologise if I caused any offense with my jew scenario, I honestly didn't mean anything by it.
Back to top	A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said: Quote: Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms. IP Logged

Soren

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Re: Muslims want to silence and intimidate you
Reply #94 - Jun 2^nd, 2013 at 11:11pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2013 at 11:03pm:

So nothing to say about Australian law, and what speech freedoms should be restricted by law then?

I apologise if I caused any offense with my jew scenario, I honestly didn't mean anything by it.

Criticism of Islam is not restricted. Just as there is no restriction on the criticism of Christianity, the foundational religion of the country, or any other religion. So no restriction on Islam as there is nothing sacred about Islam.

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polite_gandalf

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Re: Muslims want to silence and intimidate you
Reply #95 - Jun 2^nd, 2013 at 11:19pm

Soren, thank for finally addressing the topic.

However this is not about criticising islam, or a religion per se.

If it was, then the scenario would be more like the man standing up and reciting sections of the Quran and sarcastically asking the rhetorical question "and islam is the religion of peace??" - and not directing the reading towards any muslims that may be in the same room.

No, this is about vilifying and intimidating two people minding their own business, picked out for no other reason that the attacker perceives them as representing an undesirable group of people. And here the Vietnamese analogy is useful - because its exactly the same sort of vilifying ("you are all terrorists" == "you are all drug dealers"). I am interested at least in what you think about the Vietnamese scenario - should be illegal or not?

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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Soren

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Re: Muslims want to silence and intimidate you
Reply #96 - Jun 2^nd, 2013 at 11:30pm

It is already illegal - defamation.

The rest of it, the Islamic religious vilification crap that you are introducing, is an attempt to extend the established defamation laws to 'defamation of religion', a new push by Muslims, starting from the UN and going all the way down to internet forums like this one.

But Islam itself defames all other religions, if the Koran is anything to go by. This is why I think you and all other Muslims pushing for the 'defamation of religion' wheeze are dishonest to a startlingly barefaced degree. The Vietnamese scenario is just a gauche attempt to cover your tracks.

When there is religious freedom in the 'Muslim lands', we can talk. Until then, you are hypocrites of the worst kind.

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Brian Ross

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Re: Muslims want to silence and intimidate you
Reply #97 - Jun 3^rd, 2013 at 5:41pm

Soren wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2013 at 11:30pm:

It is already illegal - defamation.

The rest of it, the Islamic religious vilification crap that you are introducing, is an attempt to extend the established defamation laws to 'defamation of religion', a new push by Muslims, starting from the UN and going all the way down to internet forums like this one.

But Islam itself defames all other religions, if the Koran is anything to go by. This is why I think you and all other Muslims pushing for the 'defamation of religion' wheeze are dishonest to a startlingly barefaced degree. The Vietnamese scenario is just a gauche attempt to cover your tracks.

When there is religious freedom in the 'Muslim lands', we can talk. Until then, you are hypocrites of the worst kind.

Question - Why is Christianity protected by blasphemy laws in the UK and no other religion is?

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Someone said we could not judge a person's Aboriginality on their skin colour. Why isn't that applied in the matter of Pascoe? Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

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Lionel Edriess

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Re: Muslims want to silence and intimidate you
Reply #98 - Jun 3^rd, 2013 at 6:07pm

Brian Ross wrote on Jun 3^rd, 2013 at 5:41pm:

Soren wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2013 at 11:30pm:

It is already illegal - defamation.

The rest of it, the Islamic religious vilification crap that you are introducing, is an attempt to extend the established defamation laws to 'defamation of religion', a new push by Muslims, starting from the UN and going all the way down to internet forums like this one.

But Islam itself defames all other religions, if the Koran is anything to go by. This is why I think you and all other Muslims pushing for the 'defamation of religion' wheeze are dishonest to a startlingly barefaced degree. The Vietnamese scenario is just a gauche attempt to cover your tracks.

When there is religious freedom in the 'Muslim lands', we can talk. Until then, you are hypocrites of the worst kind.

Question - Why is Christianity protected by blasphemy laws in the UK and no other religion is?

How so?

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Toughen up, Australia!

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Brian Ross

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Re: Muslims want to silence and intimidate you
Reply #99 - Jun 3^rd, 2013 at 6:13pm

Lionel Edriess wrote on Jun 3^rd, 2013 at 6:07pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Jun 3^rd, 2013 at 5:41pm:

Soren wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2013 at 11:30pm:

It is already illegal - defamation.

The rest of it, the Islamic religious vilification crap that you are introducing, is an attempt to extend the established defamation laws to 'defamation of religion', a new push by Muslims, starting from the UN and going all the way down to internet forums like this one.

But Islam itself defames all other religions, if the Koran is anything to go by. This is why I think you and all other Muslims pushing for the 'defamation of religion' wheeze are dishonest to a startlingly barefaced degree. The Vietnamese scenario is just a gauche attempt to cover your tracks.

When there is religious freedom in the 'Muslim lands', we can talk. Until then, you are hypocrites of the worst kind.

Question - Why is Christianity protected by blasphemy laws in the UK and no other religion is?

How so?

There are laws against Blasphemy in the UK still, Lionel. However, they only pertain to Christianity. Why?

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Someone said we could not judge a person's Aboriginality on their skin colour. Why isn't that applied in the matter of Pascoe? Tsk, tsk, tsk... Roll Eyes

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freediver

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Re: Muslims want to silence and intimidate you
Reply #100 - Jun 3^rd, 2013 at 8:15pm

Quote:

So you consider it "mistrustful" of a muslim to state that muslims carrying a placard calling for someone to be beheaded is an outrage and should be illegal?

No Gandalf, I do not trust people who want to whittle away our freedom but offer nothing but excuses when asked to suggest how far they would whittle. Lately is always seem to be Muslims doing the whittling.

Quote:

I am also baffled as to why you don't consider it a specific example of what freedoms should be restricted.

I do. The question I am asking is how far would you go. Do I need to repeat the question?

Quote:

Oh wait, I remember now, I've mentioned all three of them already.

No gandalf you gave no details at all last time. You merely regurgitated a pamphlet on hate speech and prefaced it with "in a restaurant".

Quote:

Of course, by pure coincidence, the person in my scenario might have found a muslim husband and wife who by chance were indeed plotting a terrorist attack.

Not all Muslims are terrorists Gandalf. You'll upset Brian. But good on you for being alert.

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No, this is about vilifying and intimidating two people minding their own business

Didn't you just say it was about vilifying all Muslims?

Quote:

Question - Why is Christianity protected by blasphemy laws in the UK and no other religion is?

It is not. Where do you think the Life of Brian was made? You have the same problem as Gandalf in interpreting statues.

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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Yadda

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Re: Muslims want to silence and intimidate you
Reply #101 - Jun 3^rd, 2013 at 8:31pm

freediver wrote on Jun 3^rd, 2013 at 8:15pm:

Quote:

Question - Why is Christianity protected by blasphemy laws in the UK and no other religion is?

It is not. Where do you think the Life of Brian was made? You have the same problem as Gandalf in interpreting statues.

A good example!

In contrast, somewhere in the world, someone satirises Mohammed/ISLAM in a film - and we see moslems on 'main street' Sydney, with placards calling for beheadings [....of persons who do not believe as moslems believe] !

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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Lionel Edriess

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Re: Muslims want to silence and intimidate you
Reply #102 - Jun 3^rd, 2013 at 8:37pm

Brian Ross wrote on Jun 3^rd, 2013 at 6:13pm:

Lionel Edriess wrote on Jun 3^rd, 2013 at 6:07pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Jun 3^rd, 2013 at 5:41pm:

Soren wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2013 at 11:30pm:

It is already illegal - defamation.

The rest of it, the Islamic religious vilification crap that you are introducing, is an attempt to extend the established defamation laws to 'defamation of religion', a new push by Muslims, starting from the UN and going all the way down to internet forums like this one.

But Islam itself defames all other religions, if the Koran is anything to go by. This is why I think you and all other Muslims pushing for the 'defamation of religion' wheeze are dishonest to a startlingly barefaced degree. The Vietnamese scenario is just a gauche attempt to cover your tracks.

When there is religious freedom in the 'Muslim lands', we can talk. Until then, you are hypocrites of the worst kind.

Question - Why is Christianity protected by blasphemy laws in the UK and no other religion is?

How so?

There are laws against Blasphemy in the UK still, Lionel. However, they only pertain to Christianity. Why?

What laws?

Didn't I make myself clear?

And why indeed?

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Toughen up, Australia!

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Soren Gold Member Offline Posts: 25654 Gender:	Re: Muslims want to silence and intimidate you Reply #103 - Jun 3^rd, 2013 at 8:46pm Brian Ross wrote on Jun 3^rd, 2013 at 6:13pm: There are laws against Blasphemy in the UK still, Lionel. However, they only pertain to Christianity. Why? Look at the English flag and take fvckn wild guess, Brain. Go on.
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Yadda

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Re: Muslims want to silence and intimidate you
Reply #104 - Jun 3^rd, 2013 at 8:51pm

Yadda wrote on Jun 3^rd, 2013 at 8:31pm:

freediver wrote on Jun 3^rd, 2013 at 8:15pm:

Quote:

Question - Why is Christianity protected by blasphemy laws in the UK and no other religion is?

It is not. Where do you think the Life of Brian was made? You have the same problem as Gandalf in interpreting statues.

A good example!

In contrast, somewhere in the world, someone satirises Mohammed/ISLAM in a film - and we see moslems on 'main street' Sydney, with placards calling for beheadings [....of persons who do not believe as moslems believe] !

And don't ever forget, 'Blessed are the cheese-makers.'

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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