Australian Politics Forum - Mr Abbott Will The Penalty Rates Stay.

Swagman

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Re: Mr Abbott Will The Penalty Rates Stay.
Reply #15 - Jun 10^th, 2013 at 10:51am

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If you want people to work weekends, you pay your penalty rates. Sad

Yes if you can't get enough people to work for you on weekends you offer more pay (that's a market) but you don't just pay everyone 50% - $100% more across the board just because it's a weekend, that's inefficient, retards enterprise and adds to unemployment.

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Swagman

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Re: Mr Abbott Will The Penalty Rates Stay.
Reply #16 - Jun 10^th, 2013 at 10:54am

Dnarever wrote on Jun 10^th, 2013 at 10:42am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jun 10^th, 2013 at 10:37am:

It's common sense.

Why does everything have to boil down to Liberal or Labor?

I'm no Liberal and I'm no Labor.

But we live in a global economy, we need competitive advantage, we need fluid head count costs.

Penalty rates are outdated. They belong back in the dark days of the 1970s.

Penalty rates are a sensible way of applying an appropriate market rate to hours with intrinsically more value to both the employer and employee.

2pm simply does not have the same market value in dollar terms as 2 am.

Unless you have people lining up to do the work and willing to do it without penalty rates.

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imcrookonit Ex Member	Re: Mr Abbott Will The Penalty Rates Stay. Reply #17 - Jun 10^th, 2013 at 10:55am Yes we do need the penalty rates to work those hours. No penalty rates. Sorry no can work those hours.
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Kat Gold Member Offline Socialism IS the answer. Posts: 17709 Everywhere and no-where Gender:	Re: Mr Abbott Will The Penalty Rates Stay. Reply #18 - Jun 10^th, 2013 at 11:00am Swaggie's so opposed to the lowest-paid or the unemployed getting a fair rate of pay/'benefit' that he just HAS to be an employer. Can't think of any other reason for it.
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imcrookonit Ex Member	Re: Mr Abbott Will The Penalty Rates Stay. Reply #19 - Jun 10^th, 2013 at 11:04am I cant see the unions supporting no penalty rates. With or without an Abbott government.
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Dnarever

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Re: Mr Abbott Will The Penalty Rates Stay.
Reply #20 - Jun 10^th, 2013 at 11:08am

Swagman wrote on Jun 10^th, 2013 at 10:54am:

Dnarever wrote on Jun 10^th, 2013 at 10:42am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jun 10^th, 2013 at 10:37am:

It's common sense.

Why does everything have to boil down to Liberal or Labor?

I'm no Liberal and I'm no Labor.

But we live in a global economy, we need competitive advantage, we need fluid head count costs.

Penalty rates are outdated. They belong back in the dark days of the 1970s.

Penalty rates are a sensible way of applying an appropriate market rate to hours with intrinsically more value to both the employer and employee.

2pm simply does not have the same market value in dollar terms as 2 am.

Unless you have people lining up to do the work and willing to do it without penalty rates.

You won't have people lining up - the belief is that enough people will have no choice and desperate enough to be forced to accept it.

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Swagman

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Re: Mr Abbott Will The Penalty Rates Stay.
Reply #21 - Jun 10^th, 2013 at 11:11am

Kat wrote on Jun 10^th, 2013 at 11:00am:

Swaggie's so opposed to the lowest-paid or the unemployed getting
a fair rate of pay/'benefit' that he just HAS to be an employer.

Can't think of any other reason for it.

Nope, I wouldn't be one. There's too much against being one and that would apply to many, and what does that say?

Employment is (well should be) a market.

If a business makes a lot more money on weekends such as a pub or a club but can't attract enough employees to work during those hours then that business will pay more to attract them.

Common sense.

You tell me why pay 10 people double time when 10 people may be sitting around unemployed when 20 people could be employed? Sad

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imcrookonit Ex Member	Re: Mr Abbott Will The Penalty Rates Stay. Reply #22 - Jun 10^th, 2013 at 11:14am Then we will get the job done Monday to Friday.
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Swagman Gold Member Offline Beware of cheap imitations...... Posts: 15095 Illawarra NSW Gender:	Re: Mr Abbott Will The Penalty Rates Stay. Reply #23 - Jun 10^th, 2013 at 11:17am Quote: Then we will get the job done Monday to Friday. Exactly the mentality that has seen the death of the manufacturing industry in Australia.
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Dnarever

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Re: Mr Abbott Will The Penalty Rates Stay.
Reply #24 - Jun 10^th, 2013 at 12:05pm

Swagman wrote on Jun 10^th, 2013 at 11:11am:

Kat wrote on Jun 10^th, 2013 at 11:00am:

Swaggie's so opposed to the lowest-paid or the unemployed getting
a fair rate of pay/'benefit' that he just HAS to be an employer.

Can't think of any other reason for it.

Nope, I wouldn't be one. There's too much against being one and that would apply to many, and what does that say?

Employment is (well should be) a market.

If a business makes a lot more money on weekends such as a pub or a club but can't attract enough employees to work during those hours then that business will pay more to attract them.

Common sense.

You tell me why pay 10 people double time when 10 people may be sitting around unemployed when 20 people could be employed? Sad

You tell me why pay 10 people double time when 10 people may be sitting around unemployed when 20 people could be employed?

Because you only need 10 people, the additional money would go into your pocket - that is the idea driving this. More money in the employers pocket and Less in the employees.

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The Heartless Felon Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 2869 Gender:	Re: Mr Abbott Will The Penalty Rates Stay. Reply #25 - Jun 10^th, 2013 at 12:21pm Quote: Then we will get the job done Monday to Friday. And everything closes for the weekend?
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imcrookonit Ex Member	Re: Mr Abbott Will The Penalty Rates Stay. Reply #26 - Jun 10^th, 2013 at 12:25pm Well that's up to the employer.
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Swagman

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Re: Mr Abbott Will The Penalty Rates Stay.
Reply #27 - Jun 10^th, 2013 at 12:31pm

Dnarever wrote on Jun 10^th, 2013 at 12:05pm:

Because you only need 10 people, the additional money would go into your pocket - that is the idea driving this. More money in the employers pocket and Less in the employees

Depends on the business. In manufacturing working at night or weekends makes effall difference to productivity. Penalty rates just add to production costs without adding to production items making the industry less competitive.

Eventually the business closes due to losses and nobody has a job and nobody gets penalty rates. Great outcome hey... Roll Eyes

This is Labor's and Unions' legacy to Australia. No good throwing money at schools and disability schemes when you have no industries and no jobs.

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imcrookonit Ex Member	Re: Mr Abbott Will The Penalty Rates Stay. Reply #28 - Jun 10^th, 2013 at 12:40pm Depends on the business. In manufacturing working at night or weekends makes effall difference to productivity. Then we will get the job done Monday to Friday.
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