Australian Politics Forum - The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...

greggerypeccary

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #195 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 2:14pm

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 1:38pm:

ian wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 12:08pm:

because holding signs up and having a protest march will defintiely stop the sociopathic predators amongst us and they will mend their ways. The utter and complete naivete of some people in our society is absolutley mind boggling.

who else can smell the hint of BLOODLUST?

Oh, there's more than a hint.

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Peter Freedman Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 5275 Wellington Gender:	Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd... Reply #196 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 2:26pm "It is better ten guilty men go free, than one innocent man suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
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ian

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #197 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 2:49pm

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 1:27pm:

ian wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:53am:

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:50am:

ian wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:48am:

Despite having a much higher rate of deaths and injuuries form firearms, the US has a much lower rate of violent crime overall than Australia. wonder how that can be.

http://www.nationmaster.com/compare/Australia/United-States/Crime
Crime stats: Australia vs United States
Australian Crime stats
American Crime stats
Assault victims 2.4% 1.2%
Ranked 4th. 100% more than United States Ranked 11th.

LOL this from a drongo who doesnt accept the word of the Singapore Law society but quotes this site which is well known for its error-filled bogus statistics. Higher crime rate in australia in USA?? only a retard like you could beleive that.

I only used that site for convenience, I know the stats on this because I have previously studied it. Use any source you like.

no actually the onus is on YOU to provide stats that show the crime rate in USA lower than australia. but remember, we want gold-plated statistics as per YOUR standard.

I didnt state the crime rate was lower, I stated the violent crime rate was lower. and I did not demand "gold plated " sources as you suggest, merely credible sources other than an opinion post. Not only that, neither you or the other numpty has yet to supply any statistics at all. So your demand is a strawman, I have supplied verifiable statistics, you have not. Now either show they are wrong or argue the point some other way, but Im not going to continue to play semantics.

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greggerypeccary

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #198 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 3:01pm

Bobby. wrote on Jun 28^th, 2013 at 8:00pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 28^th, 2013 at 7:58pm:

ian wrote on Jun 28^th, 2013 at 7:55pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 28^th, 2013 at 7:53pm:

ian wrote on Jun 28^th, 2013 at 7:51pm:

Peter Freedman wrote on Jun 28^th, 2013 at 7:45pm:

cv
Now you are becoming seriously silly, ian. No doubt many innocent people have been executed. We will never know.

The point is that the death penalty was dropped in Australia before the advent of modern forensic science and DNA testing And the doubts which have been laid at these decades old executions are being voiced becuse modern DNA testing is casting the doubt. These people would never be convicted and executed under our current system.

you have to be a teenager. no one else could be so naively confident that the modern forensic science can deliver error-free judgements.

I never claimed it did. Do you have some sort of comprehension problem?

it is derived using a process I call logic - you should try it. Let me sum it up for you:
You declare that there must be zero tolerance for error in executions.
You are in favour of the DP
ergo you must believe in a error-free judicial system

care to find the flaw in the above logical progression?

Longy,
Are you saying that Julian Knight, Martin Bryant & Adrian Bayley shouldn't have got the noose?

Nobody should get the noose.

Introducing specific names and cases to the debate is irrelevant.

Civilised societies do not use premeditated state-sanctioned killing as a form of punishment, no matter how horrendous the crime.

Nobody is excusing the actions of criminals: we're merely condemning the perpetuation of the vicious cycle of violence.

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ian

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #199 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 3:01pm

Peter Freedman wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 2:26pm:

"It is better ten guilty men go free, than one innocent man suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.

William blackstone obviously was never close to a victim who was anally and vaginally raped with a blunt instrument a number of times before being tortured slowly and finally dying horrendously. Civilised societies protect the innocent, not the predators.

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greggerypeccary

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #200 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 3:11pm

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 1:27pm:

ian wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:53am:

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:50am:

ian wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:48am:

Despite having a much higher rate of deaths and injuuries form firearms, the US has a much lower rate of violent crime overall than Australia. wonder how that can be.

http://www.nationmaster.com/compare/Australia/United-States/Crime
Crime stats: Australia vs United States
Australian Crime stats
American Crime stats
Assault victims 2.4% 1.2%
Ranked 4th. 100% more than United States Ranked 11th.

LOL this from a drongo who doesnt accept the word of the Singapore Law society but quotes this site which is well known for its error-filled bogus statistics. Higher crime rate in australia in USA?? only a retard like you could beleive that.

I only used that site for convenience, I know the stats on this because I have previously studied it. Use any source you like.

no actually the onus is on YOU to provide stats that show the crime rate in USA lower than australia. but remember, we want gold-plated statistics as per YOUR standard.

You'll never get him to understand that logic.

While you are 100% correct, the onus is indeed on ian, he will never admit to it. He doesn't actually understand why the person presenting the premise needs to provide the supporting evidence.

In ian's world everything he says is true and it's up to everyone else to provide evidence to the contrary.

Everything everyone else says, however, is merely "opinion" and no amount of evidence will convince him otherwise.

He really is quite a strange and rare individual.

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Socrates

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #201 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 3:27pm

CAPITAL PUNISHMENT FOR:

Murder of Law Enforcement Officers, including Corrections/Prison Officers
Premeditated murder
Murder of Children
Sexual assault and abuse of children

Now for all you smug twats (peccahead, skippy and Jackass) who are going to respond with explain, either read it again, or go back to school.

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An intellectual is a man who takes more words than necessary to tell more than he knows.

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greggerypeccary

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #202 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 3:29pm

Socrates wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 3:27pm:

CAPITAL PUNISHMENT FOR:

Murder of Law Enforcement Officers, including Corrections/Prison Officers
Premeditated murder
Murder of Children
Sexual assault and abuse of children

Civilised societies do not use premeditated state-sanctioned killing as a form of punishment, no matter how horrendous the crime.

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longweekend58

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #203 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 3:37pm

Peter Freedman wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 2:26pm:

"It is better ten guilty men go free, than one innocent man suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.

It is the principle we base our system on which is why the burden of proof is in the prosecution while in Singapore the burden of proof is on the defendant. You have to prove your innocence. It is a little more difficult to do and is why they have a high rate of miscarriages of justice.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #204 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 3:40pm

ian wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 3:01pm:

Peter Freedman wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 2:26pm:

"It is better ten guilty men go free, than one innocent man suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.

William blackstone obviously was never close to a victim who was anally and vaginally raped with a blunt instrument a number of times before being tortured slowly and finally dying horrendously. Civilised societies protect the innocent, not the predators.

yep, there's that bloodlust again! You might think differently if you were charged with murder and were innocent. You might take a great deal of comfort in the idea that the prosecution has to prove its case with no reasonable doubt. And again, ALL you are after is vengeance - not justice. Justice upholds the rights of all - including the accused.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #205 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 3:42pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 3:11pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 1:27pm:

ian wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:53am:

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:50am:

ian wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 11:48am:

Despite having a much higher rate of deaths and injuuries form firearms, the US has a much lower rate of violent crime overall than Australia. wonder how that can be.

http://www.nationmaster.com/compare/Australia/United-States/Crime
Crime stats: Australia vs United States
Australian Crime stats
American Crime stats
Assault victims 2.4% 1.2%
Ranked 4th. 100% more than United States Ranked 11th.

LOL this from a drongo who doesnt accept the word of the Singapore Law society but quotes this site which is well known for its error-filled bogus statistics. Higher crime rate in australia in USA?? only a retard like you could beleive that.

I only used that site for convenience, I know the stats on this because I have previously studied it. Use any source you like.

no actually the onus is on YOU to provide stats that show the crime rate in USA lower than australia. but remember, we want gold-plated statistics as per YOUR standard.

You'll never get him to understand that logic.

While you are 100% correct, the onus is indeed on ian, he will never admit to it. He doesn't actually understand why the person presenting the premise needs to provide the supporting evidence.

In ian's world everything he says is true and it's up to everyone else to provide evidence to the contrary.

Everything everyone else says, however, is merely "opinion" and no amount of evidence will convince him otherwise.

He really is quite a strange and rare individual.

if only it were true. Unfortunately, such fools are not rare at all. They demand a standard of evidence that is unattainable from others while quoting nothing more than opinion or sources that make wiki look unimpeachable and then wonder why we laugh at them.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #206 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 3:45pm

Socrates wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 3:27pm:

CAPITAL PUNISHMENT FOR:

Murder of Law Enforcement Officers, including Corrections/Prison Officers
Premeditated murder
Murder of Children
Sexual assault and abuse of children

Now for all you smug twats (peccahead, skippy and Jackass) who are going to respond with explain, either read it again, or go back to school.

question: why is the murder of a child a special category? Why does the 'heat of the moment' murder of a child rate higher than other such murders? And 'sexual aasault and abuse' is a very poor definition since it has a range of offence from the trivial to the monstrous. And that is why we dont have mandatory sentences - so judges can sentence on the basis of the facts of the case rather than the whims of politicians seeking to look tough on crime to get re-elected.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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Lord Herbert

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #207 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 3:45pm

Peter Freedman wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 2:26pm:

"It is better ten guilty men go free, than one innocent man suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.

Very true.

But then nobody reported what he said next...

"It is better eleven guilty men get the rope, than fear of convicting one innocent man sets them free" - English jurist William Blackstone.

Very wise man. Cool

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longweekend58

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #208 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 3:55pm

Lord Herbert wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 3:45pm:

Peter Freedman wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 2:26pm:

"It is better ten guilty men go free, than one innocent man suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.

Very true.

But then nobody reported what he said next...

"It is better eleven guilty men get the rope, than fear of convicting one innocent man sets them free" - English jurist William Blackstone.

Very wise man. Cool

not reported because he didnt say it.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58 Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 45675 Gender:	Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd... Reply #209 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 3:58pm Just for Ian who apparently beleives modern forensics can give ua a safe DP http://listverse.com/2013/04/09/10-innocent-people-sentenced-to-death/
Back to top	AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..." IP Logged

Poll
Question: Do you support the death penalty?
yes 7 (50.0%) no 6 (42.9%) not sure 1 (7.1%) Total votes: 14 « Created by: Bobby. on: Jul 1^st, 2013 at 7:19pm »