Australian Politics Forum - The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...

Aussie

Gold Member

Online

OzPolitic

Posts: 38693
Gender: male

Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #30 - Jun 27^th, 2013 at 5:21pm

Lord Herbert wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 5:17pm:

Kat wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 4:42pm:

smack-all to do with God.

I don't support the DP. That's all I said,

Oh no. You said a lot more than that.

Your "always have and always will" was admitting to a closed mind.

It was an admission of you no longer being willing to exercise your intelligence or your intellect on the subject.

Seventh Day Adventists manifest the same stubbornness regarding refusal to permit blood transfusions for their dying offspring after car accidents.

"Never have and never will!" They chant proudly, in lockstep with biblical dogma.

Kat wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 4:42pm:

... and it's all that needs to be said.

But this thread isn't a poll, is it? We're not looking for 'Yes' and 'No' polling here.

Debate, discussion, and the exchange of ideas and opinions is expected from anyone posting in this thread.

Nah, Herbert, the subject has been done to death here, and if you were not trolling you would have found one of the existing threads, and added your OP there. All you are doing is having another 'look at me' wank.

Cheers.

Back to top

IP Logged

Lord Herbert

Gold Member

Offline

Posts: 34441
Gender: male

Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #31 - Jun 27^th, 2013 at 5:22pm

Dsmithy70 wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 4:58pm:

Did he catch the man in the act? If so, then I would assume most parents would do the same & good on them, I know I would.

Or did he just "THINK" it was him?

That is the core issue surrounding the death penalty.

There is no release with a "Sorry" at the end of it if new evidence comes to light.

Shït happens. Society does its best, but nothing is guaranteed.

Back to top

IP Logged

Lord Herbert

Gold Member

Offline

Posts: 34441
Gender: male

Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #32 - Jun 27^th, 2013 at 5:30pm

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 5:21pm:

...

200 people set free from death row by Project INnocence in only 13 years indicates that justice has a funny way of getting it wrong and the DP makes correcting those mistakes impossible.

The Devil is in the detail.

State governors in the US often release prisoners from death row as part of their platform promises in their re-election campaigns.

But I agree that if 'Reasonable doubt' can be proved - then okay, release them from death row. But bear in mind that a high percentage of these death row inmates had former convictions a mile long of rape and theft and drug dealing.

They are no saints.

Back to top

IP Logged

greggerypeccary

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 137433
Gender: male

Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #33 - Jun 27^th, 2013 at 5:52pm

Lord Herbert wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 5:30pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 5:21pm:

...

200 people set free from death row by Project INnocence in only 13 years indicates that justice has a funny way of getting it wrong and the DP makes correcting those mistakes impossible.

The Devil is in the detail.

State governors in the US often release prisoners from death row as part of their platform promises in their re-election campaigns.

But I agree that if 'Reasonable doubt' can be proved - then okay, release them from death row. But bear in mind that a high percentage of these death row inmates had former convictions a mile long of rape and theft and drug dealing.

They are no saints.

I've never seen anyone claim that people on death row are saints.

Back to top

IP Logged

greggerypeccary Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 137433 Gender:	Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd... Reply #34 - Jun 27^th, 2013 at 5:53pm Lord Herbert wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 5:22pm: ... Society does its best ... Not always. A society that uses premeditated state-sanctioned killing as a form of punishment is in no way doing its best. Not even close.
Back to top	IP Logged

Kat

Gold Member

Offline

Socialism IS the answer.

Posts: 17709
Everywhere and no-where
Gender: female

Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #35 - Jun 27^th, 2013 at 6:06pm

Lord Herbert wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 5:17pm:

Kat wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 4:42pm:

smack-all to do with God.

I don't support the DP. That's all I said,

Oh no. You said a lot more than that.

No, sorry. Apart from stating that I don't have to justify my choice here or anywhere else, and will not do so.

Your "always have and always will" was admitting to a closed mind.

No. I made a decision, and there's been nothing to make me change that decision. Nothing even closely akin to being 'closed-minded', quite the contrary.

It was an admission of you no longer being willing to exercise your intelligence or your intellect on the subject.

When there's a valid reason to review my choice, I will. That's no-where near 'closed-minded' either.

Seventh Day Adventists manifest the same stubbornness regarding refusal to permit blood transfusions for their dying offspring after car accidents.

I oppose this too, don't throw religion at me.

"Never have and never will!" They chant proudly, in lockstep with biblical dogma.

See previous.

Kat wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 4:42pm:

... and it's all that needs to be said.

But this thread isn't a poll, is it? We're not looking for 'Yes' and 'No' polling here.

Not specified.

Debate, discussion, and the exchange of ideas and opinions is expected from anyone posting in this thread.

Well, you should have said so in the OP. I didn't realise there were these unwritten rules. And if I did, I wouldn't follow them.

Basically, you are attempting to belittle me simply because I made a decision you disagree with.

Back to top

IP Logged

longweekend58

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 45675
Gender: male

Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #36 - Jun 27^th, 2013 at 6:40pm

Lord Herbert wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 5:30pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 5:21pm:

...

200 people set free from death row by Project INnocence in only 13 years indicates that justice has a funny way of getting it wrong and the DP makes correcting those mistakes impossible.

The Devil is in the detail.

State governors in the US often release prisoners from death row as part of their platform promises in their re-election campaigns.

But I agree that if 'Reasonable doubt' can be proved - then okay, release them from death row. But bear in mind that a high percentage of these death row inmates had former convictions a mile long of rape and theft and drug dealing.

They are no saints.

the werent released from Death Row dummy. They were released from prison by virtue of having their convictions overturned. Try adn keep up.

Back to top

AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

IP Logged

longweekend58

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 45675
Gender: male

Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #37 - Jun 27^th, 2013 at 6:42pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 5:52pm:

Lord Herbert wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 5:30pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 5:21pm:

...

200 people set free from death row by Project INnocence in only 13 years indicates that justice has a funny way of getting it wrong and the DP makes correcting those mistakes impossible.

The Devil is in the detail.

State governors in the US often release prisoners from death row as part of their platform promises in their re-election campaigns.

But I agree that if 'Reasonable doubt' can be proved - then okay, release them from death row. But bear in mind that a high percentage of these death row inmates had former convictions a mile long of rape and theft and drug dealing.

They are no saints.

I've never seen anyone claim that people on death row are saints.

actually a surprising number have no criminal record at all. Not that it should matter. Guilt should be proven not inferred or expected. No wonder you like the death penaly. You ahve an appalling concept of justice.

Back to top

AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

IP Logged

Peter Freedman

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 5275
Wellington
Gender: male

Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #38 - Jun 27^th, 2013 at 6:44pm

Lord Herbert wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 4:03pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 3:51pm:

My opinion has always been that premeditated state-sanctioned killing is not an acceptable form of punishment.

I accept your right to have this opinion. In the final washup it really doesn't matter what happens to these serial killers and serial rapists ~~ the damage has already been done.

But then again, I'm drawn to the fact that the surviving families of these murder and rape victims need to feel that society has a justice system that does not allow for leniency and compassion towards these perpetrators.

The only closure the immediate family of murder victims have is when the perpetrator dies. For as long as the serial killer and rapists are alive and enjoying the comforts and entertainments found in prisons, the family members of the deceased are in a limbo of unresolved grieving and bereavement.

What an extraordinary generalisation. How can you claim to know what is in the mind of every family member of every murder victim?

The justice system is not about vengeance or "closure" for the victim's family.

No nation that practises judicial murder is truly civilised.

Every time there is a particularly nasty killing, the "hang 'em high" mob crawl out of their holes to vent their blood lust.

Then they crawl back in till the next time.

Back to top

God grant me the patience to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can and, above all, the wisdom to tell the difference.

IP Logged

Bobby.

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 104641
Melbourne
Gender: male

Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #39 - Jun 27^th, 2013 at 7:28pm

Peter Freedman wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 6:44pm:

Lord Herbert wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 4:03pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 3:51pm:

My opinion has always been that premeditated state-sanctioned killing is not an acceptable form of punishment.

I accept your right to have this opinion. In the final washup it really doesn't matter what happens to these serial killers and serial rapists ~~ the damage has already been done.

But then again, I'm drawn to the fact that the surviving families of these murder and rape victims need to feel that society has a justice system that does not allow for leniency and compassion towards these perpetrators.

The only closure the immediate family of murder victims have is when the perpetrator dies. For as long as the serial killer and rapists are alive and enjoying the comforts and entertainments found in prisons, the family members of the deceased are in a limbo of unresolved grieving and bereavement.

What an extraordinary generalisation. How can you claim to know what is in the mind of every family member of every murder victim?

The justice system is not about vengeance or "closure" for the victim's family.

No nation that practises judicial murder is truly civilised.

Every time there is a particularly nasty killing, the "hang 'em high" mob crawl out of their holes to vent their blood lust.

Then they crawl back in till the next time.

What hang em high mob?

Back to top

IP Logged

brumbie

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 994
Gender: male

Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #40 - Jun 27^th, 2013 at 7:36pm

Lord Herbert wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 3:07pm:

A new thread because the Search facility on this board is crap.

The Death Penalty.

Texas despatched 500 since 1976.

I'm all for the death penalty, but only in certain cases.

It's utterly ridiculous that this woman had to sit on Death Row for 14 years before they applied the original sentence.

She was an addict at the time she committed the murder.

She's been clean for 14 years. She's definitely not the person she was.

I recently finished a book by John Grisham concerning the over zealous hangem high attitude of the Texans called The Confession:

http://www.jgrisham.com/the-confession/

The article you refer to brings it to life somewhat.

Back to top

IP Logged

greggerypeccary

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 137433
Gender: male

Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #41 - Jun 27^th, 2013 at 7:50pm

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 6:42pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 5:52pm:

Lord Herbert wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 5:30pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 5:21pm:

...

200 people set free from death row by Project INnocence in only 13 years indicates that justice has a funny way of getting it wrong and the DP makes correcting those mistakes impossible.

The Devil is in the detail.

State governors in the US often release prisoners from death row as part of their platform promises in their re-election campaigns.

But I agree that if 'Reasonable doubt' can be proved - then okay, release them from death row. But bear in mind that a high percentage of these death row inmates had former convictions a mile long of rape and theft and drug dealing.

They are no saints.

I've never seen anyone claim that people on death row are saints.

actually a surprising number have no criminal record at all. Not that it should matter. Guilt should be proven not inferred or expected. No wonder you like the death penaly. You ahve an appalling concept of justice.

You got the wrong person.

I am totally against the death penalty.

Back to top

IP Logged

brumbie

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 994
Gender: male

Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #42 - Jun 27^th, 2013 at 8:02pm

Peter Freedman wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 6:44pm:

Lord Herbert wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 4:03pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 3:51pm:

My opinion has always been that premeditated state-sanctioned killing is not an acceptable form of punishment.

I accept your right to have this opinion. In the final washup it really doesn't matter what happens to these serial killers and serial rapists ~~ the damage has already been done.

But then again, I'm drawn to the fact that the surviving families of these murder and rape victims need to feel that society has a justice system that does not allow for leniency and compassion towards these perpetrators.

The only closure the immediate family of murder victims have is when the perpetrator dies. For as long as the serial killer and rapists are alive and enjoying the comforts and entertainments found in prisons, the family members of the deceased are in a limbo of unresolved grieving and bereavement.

What an extraordinary generalisation. How can you claim to know what is in the mind of every family member of every murder victim?

The justice system is not about vengeance or "closure" for the victim's family.

No nation that practises judicial murder is truly civilised.

Every time there is a particularly nasty killing, the "hang 'em high" mob crawl out of their holes to vent their blood lust.

Then they crawl back in till the next time.

A bit like the Anti Gun Lobbyists after the latest school massacre in the Usa you mean?

Back to top

IP Logged

greggerypeccary

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 137433
Gender: male

Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #43 - Jun 27^th, 2013 at 8:06pm

brumbie wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 8:02pm:

Peter Freedman wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 6:44pm:

Lord Herbert wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 4:03pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 3:51pm:

My opinion has always been that premeditated state-sanctioned killing is not an acceptable form of punishment.

I accept your right to have this opinion. In the final washup it really doesn't matter what happens to these serial killers and serial rapists ~~ the damage has already been done.

But then again, I'm drawn to the fact that the surviving families of these murder and rape victims need to feel that society has a justice system that does not allow for leniency and compassion towards these perpetrators.

The only closure the immediate family of murder victims have is when the perpetrator dies. For as long as the serial killer and rapists are alive and enjoying the comforts and entertainments found in prisons, the family members of the deceased are in a limbo of unresolved grieving and bereavement.

What an extraordinary generalisation. How can you claim to know what is in the mind of every family member of every murder victim?

The justice system is not about vengeance or "closure" for the victim's family.

No nation that practises judicial murder is truly civilised.

Every time there is a particularly nasty killing, the "hang 'em high" mob crawl out of their holes to vent their blood lust.

Then they crawl back in till the next time.

A bit like the Anti Gun Lobbyists after the latest school massacre in the Usa you mean?

Absolutely nothing like the "Anti Gun Lobbyists after the latest school massacre in the Usa".

Anti-gun lobbyists want to see the killing stop.

The "hang 'em high" mob want to see the killing continue.

See if you can spot the difference.

Back to top

IP Logged

brumbie

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 994
Gender: male

Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #44 - Jun 27^th, 2013 at 8:12pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 8:06pm:

brumbie wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 8:02pm:

Peter Freedman wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 6:44pm:

Lord Herbert wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 4:03pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 27^th, 2013 at 3:51pm:

My opinion has always been that premeditated state-sanctioned killing is not an acceptable form of punishment.

I accept your right to have this opinion. In the final washup it really doesn't matter what happens to these serial killers and serial rapists ~~ the damage has already been done.

But then again, I'm drawn to the fact that the surviving families of these murder and rape victims need to feel that society has a justice system that does not allow for leniency and compassion towards these perpetrators.

The only closure the immediate family of murder victims have is when the perpetrator dies. For as long as the serial killer and rapists are alive and enjoying the comforts and entertainments found in prisons, the family members of the deceased are in a limbo of unresolved grieving and bereavement.

What an extraordinary generalisation. How can you claim to know what is in the mind of every family member of every murder victim?

The justice system is not about vengeance or "closure" for the victim's family.

No nation that practises judicial murder is truly civilised.

Every time there is a particularly nasty killing, the "hang 'em high" mob crawl out of their holes to vent their blood lust.

Then they crawl back in till the next time.

A bit like the Anti Gun Lobbyists after the latest school massacre in the Usa you mean?

Absolutely nothing like the "Anti Gun Lobbyists after the latest school massacre in the Usa".

Anti-gun lobbyists want to see the killing stop.

The "hang 'em high" mob want to see the killing continue.

See if you can spot the difference.

I did spot the difference...I was kinda wondering if you did

Back to top

IP Logged

Poll
Question: Do you support the death penalty?
yes 7 (50.0%) no 6 (42.9%) not sure 1 (7.1%) Total votes: 14 « Created by: Bobby. on: Jul 1^st, 2013 at 7:19pm »