Australian Politics Forum - The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...

greggerypeccary

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #345 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:04pm

John Smith wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:03pm:

Socrates wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 8:56pm:

http://deathpenaltycurriculum.org/student/c/about/arguments/argument1a.htm

NOT IN RESPONSE TO FREEDMAN.

For the information of others.

I suppose it's too much to ask for longy to put up his imaginary evidence.

Evidence of what?

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Avram Horowitz

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #346 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:05pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:02pm:

Avram Horowitz wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 8:58pm:

We don't need slogans thank you but you understand we operate in a situation where we must carry out removals of people by the state.

Now the situation is different in Australia.
You need to follow courts etc which is the justice route and it is sensible to expect death sentences for nasty crimes.

Perfectly reasonable.

No, perfectly unreasonable.

That's why we don't have the death penalty in this country.

We are (mostly) civilised people.

You could learn an awful lot from us.

I could learn many things from Aussies.
I find them a fascinating and warm friendly people.

However my views on death penalty and necessary vengeance ?

No I can learn nothing from them.

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Peter Freedman Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 5275 Wellington Gender:	Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd... Reply #347 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:05pm Socrates wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 8:56pm: http://deathpenaltycurriculum.org/student/c/about/arguments/argument1a.htm NOT IN RESPONSE TO FREEDMAN. For the information of others. OK, FINE. I WON'T READ IT THEN.
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ian

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #348 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:05pm

John Smith wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:03pm:

Socrates wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 8:56pm:

http://deathpenaltycurriculum.org/student/c/about/arguments/argument1a.htm

NOT IN RESPONSE TO FREEDMAN.

For the information of others.

I suppose it's too much to ask for longy to put up his imaginary evidence.

I doubt Longy will be back in this thread, in fact he might not even return to this forum at all.

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greggerypeccary

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #349 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:06pm

Big Dave wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:04pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 8:53pm:

Big Dave wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 8:51pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 8:42pm:

Avram Horowitz wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 8:39pm:

If it prevents more deaths from deterrence this is a bonus.

It doesn't.

You were wrong.

Your bloodlust fueled vengeance is not only completely disgusting, it is also preventing you from thinking clearly or presenting anything that resembles a rational argument.

I wonder how you'd feel if your daughter was raped and murdered. I bet you'd change your tune.

I'd feel terrible.

I'd want the bastard who did it to die.

However, that doesn't give me the right to kill him and it doesn't give a civilised country the right to use premeditated state-sanctioned killing as a means of punishment.

Well I feel sorry for the family who now don't have a daughter while some piece of crap still has a life after doing 10 years.

Yes, so do I. Very much so.

However, feeling sorry for someone doesn't give a country the right to use premeditated state-sanctioned killing as a form of punishment.

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John Smith

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #350 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:06pm

Peter Freedman wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:03pm:

John Smith wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 8:53pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 7:36pm:

John Smith wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 7:33pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 7:32pm:

John Smith wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 7:29pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 7:25pm:

John Smith wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 7:22pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 7:20pm:

John Smith wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 7:16pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 7:11pm:

John Smith wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 7:04pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 6:59pm:

John Smith wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 6:55pm:

Peter Freedman wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 6:45pm:

ian wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 6:09pm:

Lets see someone defend this pedophiles right to live amongst humans.

It is a question of society's right to kill him. I believe we have no such right.

In the case referred to, a man aged 42 has been sentenced to 40 years. If he serves his full sentence he may never be released.

Every day of the rest of his life, he can think about what he did and why he is behind bars.

Isn't that a better punishment than putting him to death?

meanwhile every day for the next 80 yrs, this kid gets to re-live everything they did to him. Nope, I still think it would be better for all concerned if they killed the bloke ... at least then the kid would know there is one monster under his bed who is never coming back.

thats already true. again., all you want - all you DP-supporters ever want - is DEATH and BLOOD.

you cant even make a conherent cogent argument for the DP beyond bloodlust

that's exactly right, in these cases, I want blood .... I'll leave the arguments for you. By the way, I notice you avoided answering my question . If after he, or any other pedo, has served his sentence & moves in next door to your grandkids would you object?

its moot because he isnt getting out. And I dont have the problem of a guilty conscience of executing criminals who may not all be actually guilty. Thats a problem you refuse to address.

ahh, I notice now you keep your answer limited to him, whereas before you were worried about the innocent ... Ok, would you have been happy if Dennis Ferguson or any other pedo , upon his release from prison (and before dying), moved in next door to your grandkids?

As for the guilty conscience bullsh1t, I doubt it would bother me too much. As long as my intentions are honest, I accept that I cannot control everything and understand that mistakes are made and I am prepared to live with that.

ah the irony! YOU are prepared to 'live with it'. Pity the poor innocent bugger executed. As predicted, this is all about YOU and your bloodlust and has zero to do with justice of any kind.

of course it's about justice .... but you asked me to address my supposed guilty conscience ... now you want me to tell you about the victims conscience?

wow... you really dont understand arguments very well do you?

or you don't maybe understand how to present a question properly? ... you asked about my conscience and then complain that it is about me and not the victim ... you're not the sharpest tool in the shed are you? Not to worry, despite that, you still are a tool

well let me clarify it with the simple question that I can almost guarantee you wont answer directly.

What rate of error in executing the guilty are you prepared to accept and still support the death penalty?

as many as it takes. you want me to present a number? that's not how it works dopey ....

as long as the system does everything it can to try and keep the number to a minimum, that is all anyone can ask

so if 10 people a year are executed and 3 are innocent you are okay with that?

as long as everyone did everything their jobs properly, yes.

Ummm, John, isn't THIS about executing the innocent? Including, possibly your own son?

no, it's about executing the guilty. Don't try to make this about my son, stick to topic.

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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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ian

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #351 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:06pm

Avram Horowitz wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:05pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:02pm:

Avram Horowitz wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 8:58pm:

We don't need slogans thank you but you understand we operate in a situation where we must carry out removals of people by the state.

Now the situation is different in Australia.
You need to follow courts etc which is the justice route and it is sensible to expect death sentences for nasty crimes.

Perfectly reasonable.

No, perfectly unreasonable.

That's why we don't have the death penalty in this country.

We are (mostly) civilised people.

You could learn an awful lot from us.

I could learn many things from Aussies.
I find them a fascinating and warm friendly people.

However my views on death penalty and necessary vengeance ?

No I can learn nothing from them.

Avram, these are not the views of the majority of Australians, I can assure you. If a referendum was to be held tomorrow the result would be a reinstatement of the death penalty.

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greggerypeccary

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #352 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:07pm

Avram Horowitz wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:05pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:02pm:

Avram Horowitz wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 8:58pm:

We don't need slogans thank you but you understand we operate in a situation where we must carry out removals of people by the state.

Now the situation is different in Australia.
You need to follow courts etc which is the justice route and it is sensible to expect death sentences for nasty crimes.

Perfectly reasonable.

No, perfectly unreasonable.

That's why we don't have the death penalty in this country.

We are (mostly) civilised people.

You could learn an awful lot from us.

I could learn many things from Aussies.
I find them a fascinating and warm friendly people.

However my views on death penalty and necessary vengeance ?

No I can learn nothing from them.

Actually, you are right and I was wrong.

I seriously doubt that you could learn anything.

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John Smith

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #353 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:08pm

ian wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:06pm:

Avram Horowitz wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:05pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:02pm:

Avram Horowitz wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 8:58pm:

We don't need slogans thank you but you understand we operate in a situation where we must carry out removals of people by the state.

Now the situation is different in Australia.
You need to follow courts etc which is the justice route and it is sensible to expect death sentences for nasty crimes.

Perfectly reasonable.

No, perfectly unreasonable.

That's why we don't have the death penalty in this country.

We are (mostly) civilised people.

You could learn an awful lot from us.

I could learn many things from Aussies.
I find them a fascinating and warm friendly people.

However my views on death penalty and necessary vengeance ?

No I can learn nothing from them.

Avram, these are not the views of the majority of Australians, I can assure you. If a referendum was to be held tomorrow the result would be a reinstatement of the death penalty.

I think that would be true. It's a pity the ALP doesn't try to introduce it, they would almost be guaranteed a win in the election

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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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Avram Horowitz Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 3153 Australia Gender:	Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd... Reply #354 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:10pm My country performs targeted removals of murderers no matter where they run. This has support of 80% of our people. My friend I support this. Every act shall be avenged.
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greggerypeccary

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #355 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:10pm

John Smith wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:03pm:

Socrates wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 8:56pm:

http://deathpenaltycurriculum.org/student/c/about/arguments/argument1a.htm

NOT IN RESPONSE TO FREEDMAN.

For the information of others.

I suppose it's too much to ask for longy to put up his imaginary evidence.

Evidence of what?

What is it you want to see John?

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John Smith

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #356 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:11pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:04pm:

John Smith wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:03pm:

Socrates wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 8:56pm:

http://deathpenaltycurriculum.org/student/c/about/arguments/argument1a.htm

NOT IN RESPONSE TO FREEDMAN.

For the information of others.

I suppose it's too much to ask for longy to put up his imaginary evidence.

Evidence of what?

this was one of longy's comments earlier.

multiple researchers have concluded that the DP is at best no deterrent at all and in a disturbing number of states/countries has a correlation with a slight increase in violent crime.

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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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greggerypeccary Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 137545 Gender:	Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd... Reply #357 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:12pm Avram Horowitz wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:10pm: My country performs targeted removals of murderers no matter where they run. This has support of 80% of our people. I don't doubt that for a minute. Your country is a shithole full of crazy people.
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greggerypeccary

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd...
Reply #358 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:14pm

John Smith wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:11pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:04pm:

John Smith wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:03pm:

Socrates wrote on Jun 29^th, 2013 at 8:56pm:

http://deathpenaltycurriculum.org/student/c/about/arguments/argument1a.htm

NOT IN RESPONSE TO FREEDMAN.

For the information of others.

I suppose it's too much to ask for longy to put up his imaginary evidence.

Evidence of what?

this was one of longy's comments earlier.

multiple researchers have concluded that the DP is at best no deterrent at all and in a disturbing number of states/countries has a correlation with a slight increase in violent crime.

He was 100% correct.

"A report that examined the 74 studies into the the death penalty over a 51-year period found no evidence that executing offenders had a deterrent effect on crime."

"The October 2004 report for the NSW Bureau of Crime Statistics and Research, entitled The deterrent effect of capital punishment: A review of the research evidence, found no conclusive evidence that the death penalty had reduced crime."

"One clear message comes from reading the vast literature that exists on this topic, and that is, there is no consistent evidence that capital punishment deters crime ... "

"Some studies even found the opposite - a 'brutalisation effect' - that when the state sanctions violence, levels of violence increase."

http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/is-capital-punishment-a-deterrent/2005/12/01...

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Avram Horowitz Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 3153 Australia Gender:	Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd... Reply #359 - Jun 29^th, 2013 at 9:15pm We live with different threats to you. The principle of vengeance is the same all over the world.
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Poll
Question: Do you support the death penalty?
yes 7 (50.0%) no 6 (42.9%) not sure 1 (7.1%) Total votes: 14 « Created by: Bobby. on: Jul 1^st, 2013 at 7:19pm »