Australian Politics Forum - The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd (pt 2)

Bobby.

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd (pt 2)
Reply #210 - Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:13am

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 10:46am:

ian wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 9:49am:

Luke Fowler wrote on Jul 8^th, 2013 at 11:12pm:

It is impossible to have no doubt at all. The only thing you cannot doubt is an a priori truth.

I would not find a defendant guilty if I had reasonable doubt under the current system.

I would not find the defendant guilty at all if the death penalty was on the table because you can never be free of all doubt.

How can you send an individual to their death if there is any doubt whatsoever in their guilt?

Longweekend's twin brother example is highly unlikely but logically possible nonetheless, therefore there is doubt.

Until you can erase that, life without parole is the only alternative.

Your comments seem to be at odds there, counsel. And I in many cases, there is no doubt at all of guilt. As with Jill Meaghers killer, unless you are arguing there is doubt about Bayleys guilt, is that what you are doing? If so, what is your doubt based on. I suspect it would not be reasonable.

you have to be SOB's son. nobody could be as patently stupid as you without some genetic assistance. You seem to not understand some very, very basic principles of logic , never mind law. and perhaps worst of all, you cannot be taught or have anything explained to you.

Longloser,
there is NO DOUBT that Bayly did it.

He led the cops to the body.

You are such a fool.

Bayly should be hanged.

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Bobby. Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 104670 Melbourne Gender:	Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd (pt 2) Reply #211 - Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:14am bump
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Bobby. Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 104670 Melbourne Gender:	Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd (pt 2) Reply #212 - Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:14am bump again - page wouldn't flip
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greggerypeccary

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd (pt 2)
Reply #213 - Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:43am

Luke Fowler wrote on Jul 8^th, 2013 at 7:26pm:

Oh, and another thing, arguing against the death penalty does not in anyway mean that you support or excuse what a violent killer or rapist has done. Resorting to this kind of attack just shows weakness in your own argument.

That's exactly right.

Opponents of the death penalty despise these criminals and their horrendous crimes just as much as those advocating capital punishment. Nobody here is excusing the actions of criminals. Far from it.

However, the death penalty advocates seem to think that there are only two choices: capital punishment or freedom.

It's only once they manage to get past that ridiculous notion that they will be taken seriously.

Opposing premeditated state-sanctioned killing as a form of punishment is in no way condoning the action of criminals.

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Bobby.

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd (pt 2)
Reply #214 - Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:50am

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:43am:

Luke Fowler wrote on Jul 8^th, 2013 at 7:26pm:

Oh, and another thing, arguing against the death penalty does not in anyway mean that you support or excuse what a violent killer or rapist has done. Resorting to this kind of attack just shows weakness in your own argument.

That's exactly right.

Opponents of the death penalty despise these criminals and their horrendous crimes just as much as those advocating capital punishment. Nobody here is excusing the actions of criminals. Far from it.

However, the death penalty advocates seem to think that there are only two choices: capital punishment or freedom.

It's only once they manage to get past that ridiculous notion that they will be taken seriously.

Opposing premeditated state-sanctioned killing as a form of punishment is in no way condoning the action of criminals.

There is NO DOUBT that Bayly did it.

He led the cops to the body.

Bayly should be hanged.

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greggerypeccary

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd (pt 2)
Reply #215 - Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:56am

Bobby. wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:50am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:43am:

Luke Fowler wrote on Jul 8^th, 2013 at 7:26pm:

Oh, and another thing, arguing against the death penalty does not in anyway mean that you support or excuse what a violent killer or rapist has done. Resorting to this kind of attack just shows weakness in your own argument.

That's exactly right.

Opponents of the death penalty despise these criminals and their horrendous crimes just as much as those advocating capital punishment. Nobody here is excusing the actions of criminals. Far from it.

However, the death penalty advocates seem to think that there are only two choices: capital punishment or freedom.

It's only once they manage to get past that ridiculous notion that they will be taken seriously.

Opposing premeditated state-sanctioned killing as a form of punishment is in no way condoning the action of criminals.

There is NO DOUBT that Bayly did it.

He led the cops to the body.

Bayly should be hanged.

I'm not talking about Bayley.

I'm talking about premeditated state-sanctioned killing used as a form of punishment.

Stay focused bobby. This debate isn't about individual cases.

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Bobby.

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd (pt 2)
Reply #216 - Jul 9^th, 2013 at 12:00pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:56am:

Bobby. wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:50am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:43am:

Luke Fowler wrote on Jul 8^th, 2013 at 7:26pm:

Oh, and another thing, arguing against the death penalty does not in anyway mean that you support or excuse what a violent killer or rapist has done. Resorting to this kind of attack just shows weakness in your own argument.

That's exactly right.

Opponents of the death penalty despise these criminals and their horrendous crimes just as much as those advocating capital punishment. Nobody here is excusing the actions of criminals. Far from it.

However, the death penalty advocates seem to think that there are only two choices: capital punishment or freedom.

It's only once they manage to get past that ridiculous notion that they will be taken seriously.

Opposing premeditated state-sanctioned killing as a form of punishment is in no way condoning the action of criminals.

There is NO DOUBT that Bayly did it.

He led the cops to the body.

Bayly should be hanged.

I'm not talking about Bayley.

I'm talking about premeditated state-sanctioned killing used as a form of punishment.

Stay focused bobby. This debate isn't about individual cases.

But every hanging is an individual decision.
When there is no doubt then they should be hanged.

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longweekend58

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd (pt 2)
Reply #217 - Jul 9^th, 2013 at 12:02pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:56am:

Bobby. wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:50am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:43am:

Luke Fowler wrote on Jul 8^th, 2013 at 7:26pm:

Oh, and another thing, arguing against the death penalty does not in anyway mean that you support or excuse what a violent killer or rapist has done. Resorting to this kind of attack just shows weakness in your own argument.

That's exactly right.

Opponents of the death penalty despise these criminals and their horrendous crimes just as much as those advocating capital punishment. Nobody here is excusing the actions of criminals. Far from it.

However, the death penalty advocates seem to think that there are only two choices: capital punishment or freedom.

It's only once they manage to get past that ridiculous notion that they will be taken seriously.

Opposing premeditated state-sanctioned killing as a form of punishment is in no way condoning the action of criminals.

There is NO DOUBT that Bayly did it.

He led the cops to the body.

Bayly should be hanged.

I'm not talking about Bayley.

I'm talking about premeditated state-sanctioned killing used as a form of punishment.

Stay focused bobby. This debate isn't about individual cases.

booby gets very easily distracted and moves to examples rather than principles. I assume that he doesn't understand the concept of 'principle'.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd (pt 2)
Reply #218 - Jul 9^th, 2013 at 12:03pm

Bobby. wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 12:00pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:56am:

Bobby. wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:50am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:43am:

Luke Fowler wrote on Jul 8^th, 2013 at 7:26pm:

Oh, and another thing, arguing against the death penalty does not in anyway mean that you support or excuse what a violent killer or rapist has done. Resorting to this kind of attack just shows weakness in your own argument.

That's exactly right.

Opponents of the death penalty despise these criminals and their horrendous crimes just as much as those advocating capital punishment. Nobody here is excusing the actions of criminals. Far from it.

However, the death penalty advocates seem to think that there are only two choices: capital punishment or freedom.

It's only once they manage to get past that ridiculous notion that they will be taken seriously.

Opposing premeditated state-sanctioned killing as a form of punishment is in no way condoning the action of criminals.

There is NO DOUBT that Bayly did it.

He led the cops to the body.

Bayly should be hanged.

I'm not talking about Bayley.

I'm talking about premeditated state-sanctioned killing used as a form of punishment.

Stay focused bobby. This debate isn't about individual cases.

But every hanging is an individual decision.
When there is no doubt then they should be hanged.

no such thing. 9 of the 18 that have been released from death row in the USA actually confessed despite being innocent. this concept you have of 'no doubt' is simplistic.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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Bobby.

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd (pt 2)
Reply #219 - Jul 9^th, 2013 at 12:06pm

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 12:02pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:56am:

Bobby. wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:50am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:43am:

Luke Fowler wrote on Jul 8^th, 2013 at 7:26pm:

Oh, and another thing, arguing against the death penalty does not in anyway mean that you support or excuse what a violent killer or rapist has done. Resorting to this kind of attack just shows weakness in your own argument.

That's exactly right.

Opponents of the death penalty despise these criminals and their horrendous crimes just as much as those advocating capital punishment. Nobody here is excusing the actions of criminals. Far from it.

However, the death penalty advocates seem to think that there are only two choices: capital punishment or freedom.

It's only once they manage to get past that ridiculous notion that they will be taken seriously.

Opposing premeditated state-sanctioned killing as a form of punishment is in no way condoning the action of criminals.

There is NO DOUBT that Bayly did it.

He led the cops to the body.

Bayly should be hanged.

I'm not talking about Bayley.

I'm talking about premeditated state-sanctioned killing used as a form of punishment.

Stay focused bobby. This debate isn't about individual cases.

booby gets very easily distracted and moves to examples rather than principles. I assume that he doesn't understand the concept of 'principle'.

Longweekend,

The principle is that of there is no doubt e.g. Bayly case -
where he led the cops to the body -
then they should be hanged.

If there is any doubt as in e.g. Chamberlain -
then they should be locked up waiting for an appeal.

Do you understand now?

cheers
Bobby

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greggerypeccary

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd (pt 2)
Reply #220 - Jul 9^th, 2013 at 12:07pm

Bobby. wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 12:00pm:

But every hanging is an individual decision.
When there is no doubt then they should be hanged.

Principles bobby, not examples.

Premeditated state-sanctioned killing, as a form of punishment, has no place in a civilised society.

Most of us are better than that.

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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd (pt 2)
Reply #221 - Jul 9^th, 2013 at 12:10pm

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 12:03pm:

Bobby. wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 12:00pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:56am:

Bobby. wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:50am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:43am:

Luke Fowler wrote on Jul 8^th, 2013 at 7:26pm:

Oh, and another thing, arguing against the death penalty does not in anyway mean that you support or excuse what a violent killer or rapist has done. Resorting to this kind of attack just shows weakness in your own argument.

That's exactly right.

Opponents of the death penalty despise these criminals and their horrendous crimes just as much as those advocating capital punishment. Nobody here is excusing the actions of criminals. Far from it.

However, the death penalty advocates seem to think that there are only two choices: capital punishment or freedom.

It's only once they manage to get past that ridiculous notion that they will be taken seriously.

Opposing premeditated state-sanctioned killing as a form of punishment is in no way condoning the action of criminals.

There is NO DOUBT that Bayly did it.

He led the cops to the body.

Bayly should be hanged.

I'm not talking about Bayley.

I'm talking about premeditated state-sanctioned killing used as a form of punishment.

Stay focused bobby. This debate isn't about individual cases.

But every hanging is an individual decision.
When there is no doubt then they should be hanged.

no such thing. 9 of the 18 that have been released from death row in the USA actually confessed despite being innocent. this concept you have of 'no doubt' is simplistic.

Do you trust our courts to know when theres no doubt though? They would have hung lindy chamberlain.

SOB

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Moron!

- edited by some unethical admin - you think its funny? - its a slippery slope

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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd (pt 2)
Reply #222 - Jul 9^th, 2013 at 12:11pm

Bobby. wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 12:06pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 12:02pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:56am:

Bobby. wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:50am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:43am:

Luke Fowler wrote on Jul 8^th, 2013 at 7:26pm:

Oh, and another thing, arguing against the death penalty does not in anyway mean that you support or excuse what a violent killer or rapist has done. Resorting to this kind of attack just shows weakness in your own argument.

That's exactly right.

Opponents of the death penalty despise these criminals and their horrendous crimes just as much as those advocating capital punishment. Nobody here is excusing the actions of criminals. Far from it.

However, the death penalty advocates seem to think that there are only two choices: capital punishment or freedom.

It's only once they manage to get past that ridiculous notion that they will be taken seriously.

Opposing premeditated state-sanctioned killing as a form of punishment is in no way condoning the action of criminals.

There is NO DOUBT that Bayly did it.

He led the cops to the body.

Bayly should be hanged.

I'm not talking about Bayley.

I'm talking about premeditated state-sanctioned killing used as a form of punishment.

Stay focused bobby. This debate isn't about individual cases.

booby gets very easily distracted and moves to examples rather than principles. I assume that he doesn't understand the concept of 'principle'.

Longweekend,

The principle is that of there is no doubt e.g. Bayly case -
where he led the cops to the body -
then they should be hanged.

If there is any doubt as in e.g. Chamberlain -
then they should be locked up waiting for an appeal.

Do you understand now?

cheers
Bobby

But our courts cant be trusted with those decisions. They would have hung lindy.

SOB

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Whaaaaaah!
I'm a
Moron!

- edited by some unethical admin - you think its funny? - its a slippery slope

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BigOl64

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd (pt 2)
Reply #223 - Jul 9^th, 2013 at 12:11pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:56am:

I'm not talking about Bayley.

I'm talking about premeditated state-sanctioned killing used as a form of punishment.

Stay focused bobby. This debate isn't about individual cases.

It is always easier to stay on your high horse if your aren't weighed down by the names of victims.

The DP is very much about individual case and perpetrators, otherwise it is too easy to ignore the crimes deserving of proper punishment.

Longy loves to use dodgy studies that support his argument and you like to ignore the very reason to execute certain criminals.

Make your stance very easy to defend when you have nothing of any substance to discuss other than repeating 'Killing is bad ..... Mmmkay'.

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BigOl64

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Re: The Death Penalty is still drawin' a crowd (pt 2)
Reply #224 - Jul 9^th, 2013 at 12:18pm

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 12:10pm:

Do you trust our courts to know when theres no doubt though? They would have hung lindy chamberlain.

SOB

No they would not, didn't even come close to meeting the requirements of a capital case, also she was exonerated through the normal appeals process, so I have no idea where you come to that belief.

Also meat is hung, humans are hanged.

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