Australian Politics Forum - There's no money but lefties want to spend & spend

Swagman

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Re: There's no money but lefties want to spend & spend
Reply #75 - Jul 8^th, 2013 at 10:51am

perceptions_now wrote on Jul 8^th, 2013 at 12:10am:

That said, targeted change, to reduce expenses & primary consideration going to improving Productivity, is absolutely the correct thing, as this once in history combination of Economic drivers will continue to impact on us Locally & Globally, for decades to come.

WE NEED NEW APPROACHES/SOLUTIONS TO THESE PROBLEMS, WHICH ARE FAR FROM "NORMAL"!

I agree with most of this statement.

Productivity improvement should be top of the list.

Tax reform.

Reforming out of date IR policies.

Concentrating on providing (affordable) incentives to industries that Australia has a competitive advantage and not cripple them with taxes .

Reforming Govt services to make them more self sustainable.

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corporate_whitey

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Re: There's no money but lefties want to spend & spend
Reply #76 - Jul 8^th, 2013 at 10:58am

The state cannot afford to fornicate with the libertarian right any more and not expect to reap the consequences of giving in to organized crime and anarchy. The state is bound to uphold the rule of law which is the only basis of its existence. To cut taxes, cut labor rights, cut the size of Government voluntarily and to cut services is to fail social democracy and to fail the people.

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World Wide Working Class Struggle

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Swagman Gold Member Offline Beware of cheap imitations...... Posts: 15095 Illawarra NSW Gender:	Re: There's no money but lefties want to spend & spend Reply #77 - Jul 8^th, 2013 at 4:17pm corporate_whitey wrote on Jul 8^th, 2013 at 10:58am: The state cannot afford to fornicate with the libertarian right any more It cannot afford not to. The Libertarian Right is where the State likely gets the majority of its revenue from......
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perceptions_now

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Re: There's no money but lefties want to spend & spend
Reply #78 - Jul 8^th, 2013 at 4:18pm

Swagman wrote on Jul 8^th, 2013 at 10:51am:

perceptions_now wrote on Jul 8^th, 2013 at 12:10am:

That said, targeted change, to reduce expenses & primary consideration going to improving Productivity, is absolutely the correct thing, as this once in history combination of Economic drivers will continue to impact on us Locally & Globally, for decades to come.

WE NEED NEW APPROACHES/SOLUTIONS TO THESE PROBLEMS, WHICH ARE FAR FROM "NORMAL"!

I agree with most of this statement.

Productivity improvement should be top of the list.

Tax reform.

Reforming out of date IR policies.

Concentrating on providing (affordable) incentives to industries that Australia has a competitive advantage and not cripple them with taxes .

Reforming Govt services to make them more self sustainable.

Well, there certainly is a lot to do!

However, I would make reducing government from 3 branches to 2, as the first cab of the rank.

In doing so, I would completely get rid of Local Councils, by making those services fall under the relevant State Government minister for Local government.

That would remove one whole tier of graft & corruption, although there would still be plenty to go around.

And, it would reduce expenses, additional red tape & unnecessary variations in local regulations.

That said, there is also a heck of a lot about both Commonwealth & State governments that also need a lot of changing!

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perceptions_now

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Re: There's no money but lefties want to spend & spend
Reply #79 - Jul 8^th, 2013 at 11:16pm

perceptions_now wrote on Jul 8^th, 2013 at 12:10am:

perceptions_now wrote on Jul 6^th, 2013 at 3:02pm:

Maqqa wrote on Jul 6^th, 2013 at 2:23pm:

I note all the austerity talk from lefties as if it's a bad thing

Facts are Austerity simply means spending less because the previous government had wasted sooooo much money

"Normally", Austerity programs are simply part of the ups & downs of the "Normal" Economic cycle, which have been a "Normal" part of Economics, for much of the last 200 years or so, of the Modern Economic Era!

However, this is not a "Normal" Economic cycle, owing to the prolonged impacts of Demographics, Energy Shortages/Price increases & Climate Change!

Therefore the "Normal" across the board Austerity programs are (think Europe)/would be (think Australia, the USA & elsewhere) absolutely the wrong thing, at absolutely the wrong time! Indeed, many of the "Normal" Economic fixes applied via both the Austrian & Keynesian Economic schools of thought, which have previously been successfully used, will now prove to be largely ineffective

That said, targeted change, to reduce expenses & primary consideration going to improving Productivity, is absolutely the correct thing, as this once in history combination of Economic drivers will continue to impact on us Locally & Globally, for decades to come.

WE NEED NEW APPROACHES/SOLUTIONS TO THESE PROBLEMS, WHICH ARE FAR FROM "NORMAL"!

http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1372809408/16#16

No response Maqqa!

Because, you know what I'm saying is correct?

Or because, as usual, you simply have NFI what is actually driving Economics and nor do the Liberals or Labor!
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1373084587/73#73

How are you going Maqqa?

Still seeking clarification from the Party Bosses on how to SPIN an answer, when you really have NFI about Economics?

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Maqqa

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Re: There's no money but lefties want to spend & spend
Reply #80 - Jul 8^th, 2013 at 11:21pm

PN

Your posts in regards to this deserves no answer because you will demonise the LIBs for cuts but applaud the ALP for the very same cuts

So you are not interested in a discussion

Unless and until you admit there is a need for a cut because expenditure have skyrocketed under this Labor government - what is there to discuss

Your interest was never about economic or budgetary debate

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Bill 14% is not the alcohol content of that wine. It's your poll number

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perceptions_now

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Re: There's no money but lefties want to spend & spend
Reply #81 - Jul 8^th, 2013 at 11:41pm

Maqqa wrote on Jul 8^th, 2013 at 11:21pm:

PN

Your posts in regards to this deserves no answer because you will demonise the LIBs for cuts but applaud the ALP for the very same cuts

So you are not interested in a discussion

Unless and until you admit there is a need for a cut because expenditure have skyrocketed under this Labor government - what is there to discuss

Your interest was never about economic or budgetary debate

More of your standard rubbish, Maqqa!

As I have already said -
Therefore the "Normal" across the board Austerity programs are (think Europe)/would be (think Australia, the USA & elsewhere) absolutely the wrong thing, at absolutely the wrong time! Indeed, many of the "Normal" Economic fixes applied via both the Austrian & Keynesian Economic schools of thought, which have previously been successfully used, will now prove to be largely ineffective

That said, targeted change, to reduce expenses & primary consideration going to improving Productivity, is absolutely the correct thing, as this once in history combination of Economic drivers will continue to impact on us Locally & Globally, for decades to come.

WE NEED NEW APPROACHES/SOLUTIONS TO THESE PROBLEMS, WHICH ARE FAR FROM "NORMAL"!

And, that applied to both major parties.

The problem is, when the Libs win the forthcoming election, they will implement their standard fix (across the board Austerity) and it is simply the worst option, for a bad time!

You can go ahead and bury your head in the sand & pretend it will all go away? The problem is YOUR SOLUTION IS WRONG AT THIS TIME & IT WILL MAKE A BAD SITUATION WORSE!

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Dnarever

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Re: There's no money but lefties want to spend & spend
Reply #82 - Jul 8^th, 2013 at 11:57pm

Dale Ftard wrote on Jul 6^th, 2013 at 7:42pm:

If the ALP folds like a pack of cards you should take it up with them. Just naming it a "super profits" tax evokes Orwelliancommunist nightmare in the population of normal people.

It was a complete balls up from start to finish by Rudd, Swan and Gillard who between them know nothing of business and less about mining. These clowns should be nowhere near economic policy levers. They are outright dangerous.

Just naming it a "super profits" tax evokes Orwelliancommunist nightmare

I would have thought that the fact that it only applies to companies making super profits and only on the super part of the profit would qualify.

i.e. a 30% tax on profit over $75 Million minus deductions + minus state royalties+ minus a projects allowance of 25%

effective tax rate of 22.5% on profit over $75M after deductions and royalties.

A profit of over $75M is considered a super profit.

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Dnarever

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Re: There's no money but lefties want to spend & spend
Reply #83 - Jul 8^th, 2013 at 11:58pm

Maqqa wrote on Jul 8^th, 2013 at 11:21pm:

PN

Your posts in regards to this deserves no answer because you will demonise the LIBs for cuts but applaud the ALP for the very same cuts

So you are not interested in a discussion

Unless and until you admit there is a need for a cut because expenditure have skyrocketed under this Labor government - what is there to discuss

Your interest was never about economic or budgetary debate

The Libs won't cut middle class welfare they will increase it. The very same cuts between the two groups are uncommon.

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Dale Ftard

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Re: There's no money but lefties want to spend & spend
Reply #84 - Jul 9^th, 2013 at 1:10am

Dnarever wrote on Jul 8^th, 2013 at 11:57pm:

Dale Ftard wrote on Jul 6^th, 2013 at 7:42pm:

If the ALP folds like a pack of cards you should take it up with them. Just naming it a "super profits" tax evokes Orwelliancommunist nightmare in the population of normal people.

It was a complete balls up from start to finish by Rudd, Swan and Gillard who between them know nothing of business and less about mining. These clowns should be nowhere near economic policy levers. They are outright dangerous.

Just naming it a "super profits" tax evokes Orwelliancommunist nightmare

I would have thought that the fact that it only applies to companies making super profits and only on the super part of the profit would qualify.

i.e. a 30% tax on profit over $75 Million minus deductions + minus state royalties+ minus a projects allowance of 25%

effective tax rate of 22.5% on profit over $75M after deductions and royalties.

A profit of over $75M is considered a super profit.

An example from back in 2010 except it hasn't taken into account that the ALP squibbed on the company tax rate reduction to 28%.
Revenue = $100 and
Expenses = $50
Your profit = $50
You can then subtract depreciation, with the allowance - set at 6 per cent.
So if RSPT allowance = $3
You are left with $50 - $3 = $47
The $47 is taxed at 40 per cent (the super tax).
So $47 x 0.4 = $18.80 and you are left with $ 28.20
The $28.20 is taxed again at 28 per cent (the company tax).
So $28.20 x 0.28 = $7.90 and you are left with $20.30.
That adds up to about a total tax of about 57 per cent.

Put that into millions or billions and you can see already investment would be threatened bu the greedy ALP. $100M or $100Bn revenue is nothing if the company and investors have spent years and $$$ in exploration and development an the greedy ALP want to tax them twice and think that a "super profit" is 6%??? WTF??

How would you like it if the govt turned around and decided that every dollar you earned was a "super profit" and were going to take 0.80c and leave you with 0.20c?

It's completely retarded.

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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: There's no money but lefties want to spend & spend
Reply #85 - Jul 9^th, 2013 at 5:44am

Swagman wrote on Jul 8^th, 2013 at 4:17pm:

corporate_whitey wrote on Jul 8^th, 2013 at 10:58am:

The state cannot afford to fornicate with the libertarian right any more

It cannot afford not to.

The Libertarian Right is where the State likely gets the majority of its revenue from......

Well if they hurry up with this NBN they will have a proper income again

SOB

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- edited by some unethical admin - you think its funny? - its a slippery slope

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bambu Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 1084 Gender:	Re: There's no money but lefties want to spend & spend Reply #86 - Jul 9^th, 2013 at 6:01am By the time the "You must have our system or none" Labor govt NBN is completed, 'everyone' will be mobile, with wireless devices. Phones, 'iPads', mini-'iPads', laptops, mini laptops...etc.
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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: There's no money but lefties want to spend & spend
Reply #87 - Jul 9^th, 2013 at 6:40am

bambu wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 6:01am:

By the time the "You must have our system or none" Labor govt NBN is completed, 'everyone' will be mobile, with wireless devices.
Phones, 'iPads', mini-'iPads', laptops, mini laptops...etc.

There was a thread about this somewhere. It wont happen because they want to gouge us. I had to use my mobile internet for a week or so and it cost 100s of dollars and there was a 3g limit on it.

SOB

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bambu

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Re: There's no money but lefties want to spend & spend
Reply #88 - Jul 9^th, 2013 at 7:16am

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 6:40am:

bambu wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 6:01am:

By the time the "You must have our system or none" Labor govt NBN is completed, 'everyone' will be mobile, with wireless devices.
Phones, 'iPads', mini-'iPads', laptops, mini laptops...etc.

That is now, but wait until everyone goes mobile, competition will bring the costs down.

The NBN for most people will likely be unaffordable.

There was a thread about this somewhere. It wont happen because they want to gouge us. I had to use my mobile internet for a week or so and it cost 100s of dollars and there was a 3g limit on it.

SOB

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Dnarever

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Re: There's no money but lefties want to spend & spend
Reply #89 - Jul 9^th, 2013 at 11:04am

Dale Ftard wrote on Jul 9^th, 2013 at 1:10am:

Dnarever wrote on Jul 8^th, 2013 at 11:57pm:

Dale Ftard wrote on Jul 6^th, 2013 at 7:42pm:

If the ALP folds like a pack of cards you should take it up with them. Just naming it a "super profits" tax evokes Orwelliancommunist nightmare in the population of normal people.

It was a complete balls up from start to finish by Rudd, Swan and Gillard who between them know nothing of business and less about mining. These clowns should be nowhere near economic policy levers. They are outright dangerous.

Just naming it a "super profits" tax evokes Orwelliancommunist nightmare

I would have thought that the fact that it only applies to companies making super profits and only on the super part of the profit would qualify.

i.e. a 30% tax on profit over $75 Million minus deductions + minus state royalties+ minus a projects allowance of 25%

effective tax rate of 22.5% on profit over $75M after deductions and royalties.

A profit of over $75M is considered a super profit.

An example from back in 2010 except it hasn't taken into account that the ALP squibbed on the company tax rate reduction to 28%.
Revenue = $100 and
Expenses = $50
Your profit = $50
You can then subtract depreciation, with the allowance - set at 6 per cent.
So if RSPT allowance = $3
You are left with $50 - $3 = $47
The $47 is taxed at 40 per cent (the super tax).
So $47 x 0.4 = $18.80 and you are left with $ 28.20
The $28.20 is taxed again at 28 per cent (the company tax).
So $28.20 x 0.28 = $7.90 and you are left with $20.30.
That adds up to about a total tax of about 57 per cent.

Put that into millions or billions and you can see already investment would be threatened bu the greedy ALP. $100M or $100Bn revenue is nothing if the company and investors have spent years and $$$ in exploration and development an the greedy ALP want to tax them twice and think that a "super profit" is 6%??? WTF??

How would you like it if the govt turned around and decided that every dollar you earned was a "super profit" and were going to take 0.80c and leave you with 0.20c?

It's completely retarded.

$100M or $100Bn revenue is nothing

Nothing to do with revenue - it is after everything profit over $75M

company and investors have spent years and $$$ in exploration and development

All with the benefit of huge government hand outs and tax breaks.

How would you like it if the govt turned around and decided that

every dollar

you earned was a "super profit"

No not every dollar, just the ones above $75 Million in profit after everything and then a bit more is deducted and the rate reduced.

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Poll
Question: Who wasted the most amount of money in government?
Howard on middle class welfare 1 (8.3%) Howard on handouts to the middle class 0 (0.0%) Howard trying to buy votes 0 (0.0%) All of the above 11 (91.7%) Total votes: 12 « Created by: skippy. on: Jul 6^th, 2013 at 6:08pm »