Australian Politics Forum - Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal

Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal
Reply #120 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 11:38am

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 11:10am:

Grendel wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 11:01am:

Lie 5

He is the most conservative politician to become leader of the Liberal Party in its history.

really?
And how would Kevin the great measure this conservativeness...?
who has he measured it against?

this is just Labor propaganda
it infers that being a conservative is a bad thing. However crazy Kevin has forgotten that he once sold himself to the public as being a big conservative himself. Grin

Well I dont see where you have proven its a lie. Of course rudd is a conservative but abbott is way more conservative. Who do you think was a more conservative leader of the libs?

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Karnal Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 96862	Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal Reply #121 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 11:42am I’ve been agreeing with you, Grendel. Just remember one thing. Despite those 61 lies, the people will vote on only one thing: Only Mr Abbott will STOP THE BOATS.
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Grendel Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 28080 Gender:	Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal Reply #122 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 11:51am Personally karnal... I think STOP THE BOATS is a slogan worth aiming for. Don't you? I think most people understand what it actually means. Don't you? I don't necessarily agree with either party's policies on how to go about it. Obviously Labor's is a total failure. I'd think that is undeniable.
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Grendel

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Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal
Reply #123 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 12:18pm

OK nothing but nothing and ad hom
let's move on

Lie 6

He is particularly formidable in the art of negative politics.

Really? This is simply more propaganda from Crazy Kevin and the ALP. The same negative tactics that they use almost daily ad nauseam. From day one they saw Abbott as a liability and they painted him as Dr No. The same is echoed by their media mates.

To disagree with Labor doesn't mean you are being negative.

If one disagrees with a bad policy that is not "negative politics".

The negative politics I see, is the constant ad hom attacks and disingenuousness mostly coming from the ALP.

It is the non-answers to simple questions put to the government in question time. It is things like Gillard's misogyny rant, or Kevin's lying. These are negative politics. And it is the ALP not Abbott who are formidable in the art of it, especially when they employ people like McTernan and Hawker. To the ALP it is just spin... but in reality it is simply lies.

Abbott's criticism of the ALP and its policies is well founded most of the time, unlike the kill the messenger attacks on Abbott. They have been relentless from day one. Gillard called it a game.

Abbott has been blamed for every natural disaster and policy failure this government can think of. Now that is negative politics Kevvy.

The guy is a lifesaver, he's in the bushfire brigade, he does charitable works, he lives with aborigines on remote locations helping and teaching... how is any of that negative and how does someone who does such works suddenly become Mr Negative. Truth be known, he doesn't. What we have is spin and playing the man, repeat a lie often enough is the ALP mantra... so here we have Kevin repeating it yet again.

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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal
Reply #124 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 12:22pm

Grendel wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 12:18pm:

OK nothing but nothing and ad hom
let's move on

Lie 6

He is particularly formidable in the art of negative politics.

Really? This is simply more propaganda from Crazy Kevin and the ALP. The same negative tactics that they use almost daily ad nauseam. From day one they saw Abbott as a liability and they painted him as Dr No. The same is echoed by their media mates.

To disagree with Labor doesn't mean you are being negative.

If one disagrees with a bad policy that is not "negative politics".

The negative politics I see, is the constant ad hom attacks and disingenuousness mostly coming from the ALP.

It is the non-answers to simple questions put to the government in question time. It is things like Gillard's misogyny rant, or Kevin's lying. These are negative politics. And it is the ALP not Abbott who are formidable in the art of it, especially when they employ people like McTernan and Hawker. To the ALP it is just spin... but in reality it is simply lies.

Abbott's criticism of the ALP and its policies is well founded most of the time, unlike the kill the messenger attacks on Abbott. They have been relentless from day one. Gillard called it a game.

Abbott has been blamed for every natural disaster and policy failure this government can think of. Now that is negative politics Kevvy.

The guy is a lifesaver, he's in the bushfire brigade, he does charitable works, he lives with aborigines on remote locations helping and teaching... how is any of that negative and how does someone who does such works suddenly become Mr Negative. Truth be known, he doesn't. What we have is spin and playing the man, repeat a lie often enough is the ALP mantra... so here we have Kevin repeating it yet again.

So obviously you cant answer my question or back up your assertion he is lying since you ignored it again.

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Grendel

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Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal
Reply #125 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 12:22pm

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 11:38am:

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 11:10am:

Grendel wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 11:01am:

Lie 5

He is the most conservative politician to become leader of the Liberal Party in its history.

really?
And how would Kevin the great measure this conservativeness...?
who has he measured it against?

this is just Labor propaganda
it infers that being a conservative is a bad thing. However crazy Kevin has forgotten that he once sold himself to the public as being a big conservative himself. Grin

Well I dont see where you have proven its a lie. Of course rudd is a conservative but abbott is way more conservative. Who do you think was a more conservative leader of the libs?

SOB

http://spotofborg.com/files/persecution5.jpg

Bump

SOB

http://spotofborg.com/files/persecution5.jpg

Pity we are up to 6 now Spotty...
So how do you measure conservatism?
Rudd runs the parliament church group... not Abbott, does that make him more conservative?
Menzies was a traditionalist and a monarchist in a fashion I think Abbott does not come close to.
Personally I think Crazy Kev is just a liar. Something no one here has been able to disprove so far.

BTW Spotty this site has a glitch that stops posts from coming up and being seen.
I suggest you relax and stop making false accusations.

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Karnal

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Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal
Reply #126 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 12:28pm

Grendel wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 11:51am:

Personally karnal... I think STOP THE BOATS is a slogan worth aiming for. Don't you?

I think most people understand what it actually means. Don't you?

I don't necessarily agree with either party's policies on how to go about it. Obviously Labor's is a total failure. I'd think that is undeniable.

The Libs and Greens opposed all Labor attempts to STOP THE BOATS.

In Abbott’s case, he did so solely to keep the boats coming - that, I think, is undeniable.

The policies on refugees have always been bipartisan. Only since Howard has this issue been used to create a political wedge. In this case, Abbott has done this with people’s lives.

With this record, how can Abbott really be trusted to create a workable, regional solution? So far, he has only played politics.

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mantra

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Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal
Reply #127 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 12:29pm

Grendel wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 12:18pm:

Lie 6

He is particularly formidable in the art of negative politics.

How is that a lie? Abbott is only good at being an attack dog. Most of the time you don't have a clue what his attack is about - only that he revs up the haters and regressives.

He has nothing positive to say about the future of this country. His political stance is always negative.

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philperth2010

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Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal
Reply #128 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 12:31pm

Grendel wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 12:18pm:

OK nothing but nothing and ad hom
let's move on

Lie 6

He is particularly formidable in the art of negative politics.

Really? This is simply more propaganda from Crazy Kevin and the ALP. The same negative tactics that they use almost daily ad nauseam. From day one they saw Abbott as a liability and they painted him as Dr No. The same is echoed by their media mates.

To disagree with Labor doesn't mean you are being negative.

If one disagrees with a bad policy that is not "negative politics".

The negative politics I see, is the constant ad hom attacks and disingenuousness mostly coming from the ALP.

It is the non-answers to simple questions put to the government in question time. It is things like Gillard's misogyny rant, or Kevin's lying. These are negative politics. And it is the ALP not Abbott who are formidable in the art of it, especially when they employ people like McTernan and Hawker. To the ALP it is just spin... but in reality it is simply lies.

Abbott's criticism of the ALP and its policies is well founded most of the time, unlike the kill the messenger attacks on Abbott. They have been relentless from day one. Gillard called it a game.

Abbott has been blamed for every natural disaster and policy failure this government can think of. Now that is negative politics Kevvy.

The guy is a lifesaver, he's in the bushfire brigade, he does charitable works, he lives with aborigines on remote locations helping and teaching... how is any of that negative and how does someone who does such works suddenly become Mr Negative. Truth be known, he doesn't. What we have is spin and playing the man, repeat a lie often enough is the ALP mantra... so here we have Kevin repeating it yet again.

The attack adds from the Coalition support Rudd's claim about Abbott's negative politics......Nothing about policy from Mr Abbott only negative diatribe to talk down the economy and promote a fear of asylum seekers.....Mr Abbott's prediction the carbon tax would be wrecking ball through the economy was crap like most of his negative rhetoric!!!

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MOTR Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 6646	Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal Reply #129 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 12:41pm It would seem anyone who forms an opinion outside Grendel's perspective on all matters is a liar.
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John Smith

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Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal
Reply #130 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 12:43pm

Grendel wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 10:02am:

scope wrote on Jul 12^th, 2013 at 10:41pm:

John Smith wrote on Jul 12^th, 2013 at 9:49pm:

Grendel wrote on Jul 12^th, 2013 at 7:27pm:

(lie by inference)

I can't wait to get to 61, just think of the possibilities

Lie 61 (lie by ESP)

I,d just like to see 1 lie to start with , so far zilch, zip, nada

Well in order to "see" you'd need an open mind and then you can open your eyes... if that doesn't work... then getting an adult to explain things to you might help but them I'm thinking that might be beyond you. Cheesy

nope ... a lie is a lie ... an open or closed mind does not change that ... an open mind only aids you in your quest to re- invent the definition of a lie

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Grendel

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Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal
Reply #131 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 12:46pm

John Smith wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 12:43pm:

Grendel wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 10:02am:

scope wrote on Jul 12^th, 2013 at 10:41pm:

John Smith wrote on Jul 12^th, 2013 at 9:49pm:

Grendel wrote on Jul 12^th, 2013 at 7:27pm:

(lie by inference)

I can't wait to get to 61, just think of the possibilities

Lie 61 (lie by ESP)

I,d just like to see 1 lie to start with , so far zilch, zip, nada

Well in order to "see" you'd need an open mind and then you can open your eyes... if that doesn't work... then getting an adult to explain things to you might help but them I'm thinking that might be beyond you. Cheesy

nope ... a lie is a lie ... an open or closed mind does not change that ... an open mind only aids you in your quest to re- invent the definition of a lie

Yes John but even though you are correct that a lie is a lie.... some people's attitudes prevent them from acknowledging them.
A lie is an untruth.
A lie ignores the facts.

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Karnal

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Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal
Reply #132 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 12:49pm

Grendel wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 12:18pm:

OK nothing but nothing and ad hom
let's move on

Lie 6

He is particularly formidable in the art of negative politics.

Really? This is simply more propaganda from Crazy Kevin and the ALP. The same negative tactics that they use almost daily ad nauseam. From day one they saw Abbott as a liability and they painted him as Dr No. The same is echoed by their media mates.

To disagree with Labor doesn't mean you are being negative.

If one disagrees with a bad policy that is not "negative politics".

The negative politics I see, is the constant ad hom attacks and disingenuousness mostly coming from the ALP.

It is the non-answers to simple questions put to the government in question time. It is things like Gillard's misogyny rant, or Kevin's lying. These are negative politics. And it is the ALP not Abbott who are formidable in the art of it, especially when they employ people like McTernan and Hawker. To the ALP it is just spin... but in reality it is simply lies.

Abbott's criticism of the ALP and its policies is well founded most of the time, unlike the kill the messenger attacks on Abbott. They have been relentless from day one. Gillard called it a game.

Abbott has been blamed for every natural disaster and policy failure this government can think of. Now that is negative politics Kevvy.

The guy is a lifesaver, he's in the bushfire brigade, he does charitable works, he lives with aborigines on remote locations helping and teaching... how is any of that negative and how does someone who does such works suddenly become Mr Negative. Truth be known, he doesn't. What we have is spin and playing the man, repeat a lie often enough is the ALP mantra... so here we have Kevin repeating it yet again.

See my post above. Mr Abbott says he wants to turn boats back to Indonesia, but refused to vote in a policy that sent boat people to.Malaysia. Why? Because Malaysia isn’t a signatory to the refugee convention.

And neither is Indonesia.

Mr Abbott demanded Labor reopen Nauru and Manus Island, and it did. To comply, Nauru had to sign the refugee convention.

And it did. The legislation was drafted to overturn the High Court’s ruling on offshore processing. What happened?

Mr Abbott said no.

And this, in the aftermath of a boat sinking off Christmas Island, a tragedy that killed nearly two hundred people.

However, lets put all this aside and see what Mr Abbott proposes to do instead, shall we?

"A raft of measures", "proven to work", "deterants", "taking the sugar off the table", "breaking the people smuggler’s business model", "behavioural protocols,", and, when it is safe to do so, "turn back boats".

What exactly does all this mean?

Who knows? But one thing is clear: only Mr Abbott will

STOP THE BOATS.

How? That’s easy. He’ll just say no.

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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal
Reply #133 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 12:53pm

Grendel wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 12:22pm:

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 11:38am:

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 11:10am:

Grendel wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 11:01am:

Lie 5

He is the most conservative politician to become leader of the Liberal Party in its history.

really?
And how would Kevin the great measure this conservativeness...?
who has he measured it against?

this is just Labor propaganda
it infers that being a conservative is a bad thing. However crazy Kevin has forgotten that he once sold himself to the public as being a big conservative himself. Grin

Well I dont see where you have proven its a lie. Of course rudd is a conservative but abbott is way more conservative. Who do you think was a more conservative leader of the libs?

SOB

http://spotofborg.com/files/persecution5.jpg

Bump

SOB

http://spotofborg.com/files/persecution5.jpg

Pity we are up to 6 now Spotty...
So how do you measure conservatism?
Rudd runs the parliament church group... not Abbott, does that make him more conservative?
Menzies was a traditionalist and a monarchist in a fashion I think Abbott does not come close to.
Personally I think Crazy Kev is just a liar. Something no one here has been able to disprove so far.

BTW Spotty this site has a glitch that stops posts from coming up and being seen.
I suggest you relax and stop making false accusations.

What false accusations would those be? If you didnt see them when why did you see the ones after them? And how did you know what i was talking about?

You are the one that is saying rudd lied about abbott being the most conservative so who do you think was more conservative?

SOB

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Grendel

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Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal
Reply #134 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 12:54pm

Quote:

The attack adds from the Coalition support Rudd's claim about Abbott's negative politics......Nothing about policy from Mr Abbott only negative diatribe to talk down the economy and promote a fear of asylum seekers.....Mr Abbott's prediction the carbon tax would be wrecking ball through the economy was crap like most of his negative rhetoric!!!

Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

Sorry Phil but if you want to refute you must use FACTS not just ALP propaganda and spin.

Feel free to actually refute anything I have said.

No factual refutation is no refutation.

You see Phil, Kevin agrees with much of the stuff you call negative Abbott.

His ''national competitiveness agenda'' is designed to directly counter Mr Abbott's highly effective political critiques of Labor over cost-of-living pressures, the carbon tax, union militancy and broader economic management. Mr Rudd said his multi-pronged strategy involved unspecified action to address:

* electricity prices which were too high by global standards;
* rigidities that had crept into the labour market under the Fair Work Act and were inhibiting investment and jobs growth;
* the failure of Australian business to fully engage with and expand within Asia; and
* improvements in vocational education and training and infrastructure financing.

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/federal-election-2013/rudds-push-for-a-pa...

So since when is constructive criticism by Abbott negative when you would obviously be calling it negative. IF kevin addresses those concerns I'd be calling it positive. kevins certainly seems to think they needed addressing.

Feel free to try and refute. Roll Eyes

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