Australian Politics Forum - Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal

mantra

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Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal
Reply #150 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 3:26pm

Karnal wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 2:46pm:

The government’s advice - from Immigration and the Huston panel was that the Pacific Solution implimented "in full" would not work anymore.

The advice Tony Burke has just received from his department is that the Malaysian "solution" would not work now either. The numbers of arrivals are now too high. The time for that policy - like the Pacific Solution - has now passed.

This is a sensible discussion on a complex problem. Repeating the same old policies and behaviours does not always work. STOP THE BOATS is a nice idea, but how?

The Pacific Solution is no solution at all, which we’ll all find out when the Libs get in.

What then? Vote Abbott back out in three years?

That doesn’t fix the problem either. This policy needs to be bipartisan and free of wedge politics to work.

And yes, in hindsight (although I thought differently at the time), it was a mistake to abandon the Pacific Solution.

That doesn’t mean it would work today.

Well said. It appears you also know that the Pacific Solution is no solution now, but you keep saying Abbott will stop the boats. He can't.

I agree with the rest of your post.

Grendel wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 2:32pm:

Well I'd say you are ignorant or a liar but I know that would just upset you and you'd run to the mods and annoy them... so I won't.

I wouldn't report you for something so tame, but it's funny how ninety percent of those who read your posts say the same to you and you say the same thing back to them. Most people are ignorant and liars - except you and according to you.

You have actually given the best spiel in Abbott's defence that I've seen yet by any right whinger - even if you did make it up. Funny how you still call yourself a left wing.

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De-registered User Gold Member Offline Posts: 1029	Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal Reply #151 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 3:39pm ian wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 2:29pm: I would vote for Abbot if he had an effective solution, but he doesnt, he is just a bobble head on a stick. Having said that, you can not possibly vote for Rudd either, under your effective solution statement.
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De-registered User Gold Member Offline Posts: 1029	Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal Reply #152 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 3:41pm ian wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 2:29pm: I would vote for Abbot if he had an effective solution, but he doesnt, he is just a bobble head on a stick. Having said that about Abbott, then you can not possibly vote for Rudd either then can you.
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Karnal

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Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal
Reply #153 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 3:41pm

Grendel wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 2:58pm:

Quote:

It wasn’t a failed policy, it was a policy that was never voted through parliament because the Libs opposed it.

Like I said FAILED policy.
If you don't think what Rudd implemented and what has been implemented since is not failed policy then you are having a lend of yourself and are in denial. Facts are facts karnal.

As for the one policy that never got off the ground you are obsessing about as opposed to what i was talking about... The libs are not in coalition with the ALP the greens were... blame them for not passing the legislation their partners wanted.

I do blame the Greens, but that’s not the lie that has been rebutted. This goes to the Libs’ negativity and obstruction solely for tactical political reasons.

The High Court ruled on offshore processing. We have a separation of powers - we can’t blame the courts.

But by asking me to do so, you conceed that the Libs are guilty of obstructing legislation aimed to prevent the one thing they have consistently campaigned on: STOP THE BOATS. If they wanted them stopped, they would have voted with the government, who took the policy from an independant panel.

This clearly shows the Libs guilty of saying one thing, and doing another. It shows politicking of the most Machiavellian imagination. Mr Abbott did not want the boats stopped because it might have resolved his central campaign platform: STOP THE BOATS. This highlight’s Mr Abbott’s fundamentally negative stance and willful obstructionism. It shows Mr Abbott to be no more than a cunning political hack, a tactician of dirty tricks campaigns, dirt files and back room plots - a job usually reserved for political staffers, and not the alternative leader of the country.

This rebuts lie 3. You now have 59 more lies to go.

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philperth2010

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Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal
Reply #154 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 3:43pm

Grendel wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 3:18pm:

Quote:

I have made my point.....The fact you fail to see Abbott has been negative is astounding really!!!

Roll Eyes

What point did you make Phil... ?

I have seen Abbott be negative and the Libs mindlessly so. But nowhere near as much or as badly as the ALP.

But what Rudd is inferring and saying is a lie. That is the topic here.

Labor even eat their own Phil.
have a nice day Grin

ps. phil what you fail to acknowledge is that constructive criticism has led to labor having to address policy and implementation failures. that is a positive, not a negative.
Hmmm i'm sure I said that before Phil. Roll Eyes

Quote:

‘‘But that is different to a daily diatribe of negative politics whose single objective is to cause the Australian people to feel that our national economy and our national security is on the verge of falling apart – if not now, then certainly by next Thursday afternoon.’’

The challenges the Australian economy faced were ‘‘entirely manageable’’, Mr Rudd said. But with the China resources boom coming off, Australia’s economic strategy must be one that ‘‘diversifies our economy’’ by creating more jobs in manufacturing, food production and service industries ‘‘rather than having all our eggs in just one basket’’.

Have a nice day yourself.....Rudd was correct!!!

Roll Eyes

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« Last Edit: Jul 14^th, 2013 at 2:39pm by philperth2010 »

If knowledge can create problems, it is not through ignorance that we can solve them.
Isaac Asimov (1920 - 1992)

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Lobo

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Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal
Reply #155 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 3:43pm

Grendel wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 12:22pm:

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 11:38am:

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 11:10am:

Grendel wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 11:01am:

Lie 5

He is the most conservative politician to become leader of the Liberal Party in its history.

really?
And how would Kevin the great measure this conservativeness...?
who has he measured it against?

this is just Labor propaganda
it infers that being a conservative is a bad thing. However crazy Kevin has forgotten that he once sold himself to the public as being a big conservative himself. Grin

Well I dont see where you have proven its a lie. Of course rudd is a conservative but abbott is way more conservative. Who do you think was a more conservative leader of the libs?

SOB

http://spotofborg.com/files/persecution5.jpg

Bump

SOB

http://spotofborg.com/files/persecution5.jpg

Pity we are up to 6 now Spotty...
So how do you measure conservatism?
Rudd runs the parliament church group... not Abbott, does that make him more conservative?
Menzies was a traditionalist and a monarchist in a fashion I think Abbott does not come close to.
Personally I think Crazy Kev is just a liar. Something no one here has been able to disprove so far.

BTW Spotty this site has a glitch that stops posts from coming up and being seen.
I suggest you relax and stop making false accusations.

First thing I have agreed with, so far.

Hoping this post will get me past P10.

Cheesy

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"What's in store for me in the direction I don't take?"-Jack Kerouac.

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Lobo Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 7407 Sydney Gender:	Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal Reply #156 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 3:44pm YAY!!
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Grendel

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Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal
Reply #157 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 5:46pm

Sigh... I'm pretty sure we passed lie 3 ages ago karnal.

Quote:

I do blame the Greens, but that’s not the lie that has been rebutted. This goes to the Libs’ negativity and obstruction solely for tactical political reasons.

I already have shown this to be untrue.

Quote:

The High Court ruled on offshore processing. We have a separation of powers - we can’t blame the courts.

So by your logic you just blame the Libs instead? I'm not going to repost what you said to back that up it is here in the topic already. As I already proved voting against a policy that is bad is not a negative. 5 for 1 swap karnal. To a nation not a signatory of the UN Convention a point labor made time and time again as the excuse when it refused to accept Nauru. Hypocrisy abounds. This also does nothing to back up Rudd's lie.

Quote:

But by asking me to do so, you conceed that the Libs are guilty of obstructing legislation aimed to prevent the one thing they have consistently campaigned on: STOP THE BOATS. If they wanted them stopped, they would have voted with the government, who took the policy from an independant panel.

I have no need to concede anything as yet. The malaysia policy was not formulated by an independent panel. Their ideas came later. BTW just because they formulate a policy doesn't make it a good one. Or one that needs to be supported.

Quote:

This clearly shows the Libs guilty of saying one thing, and doing another.

No it doesn't.

Quote:

It shows politicking of the most Machiavellian imagination.

No it doesn't.

Quote:

Mr Abbott did not want the boats stopped because it might have resolved his central campaign platform: STOP THE BOATS.

No that is just your biased conjecture and is out of character with the man, but in line with ALP propaganda. Clearly this issue of the boats has not been the sole major issue over the last 6 years. Clearly the Carbon Tax has been a higher order issue for most of this time. The NBN at another and various other minor issues from time to time.

Quote:

This highlight’s Mr Abbott’s fundamentally negative stance and willful obstructionism. It shows Mr Abbott to be no more than a cunning political hack, a tactician of dirty tricks campaigns, dirt files and back room plots - a job usually reserved for political staffers, and not the alternative leader of the country.

No it mainly highlights your political bias. Where are the facts. where is the proof. we have just your biased speculation.

Quote:

This rebuts lie 3.

Unsuccessfully.

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adelcrow Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20133 everywhere Gender:	Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal Reply #158 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 5:53pm
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Grendel

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Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal
Reply #159 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 6:01pm

So where were we oh yeah 7... no refutation.

Lie 8

And the truth is that it is a lazy substitute for the hard work that is needed to develop, argue and implement real policies that will change Australia for the better.
That is why Mr Abbott has so far publicly stated that he does not want to face the public scrutiny of an economic policy debate here at the National Press Club of Australia.

Right Kevvy back on the propaganda trail lying about the Coalitions lack of policy and labelling it lazy. calling Abbott a coward and turning it around to him not wanting to face the people.

No one out Machievellis, Crazy Kev.

Abbott has called for an election how is that avoiding the public? In an election there are scheduled leadership debates how is that avoiding Kev and the judgement of the people? Kev's method is... tell a lie often enough...

If the Coalition was so lazy and bereft of ideas and concerns why is it Kev has reacted to these and come up with a so-called but as yet un-detailed "plan" to remedy the situation?

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Grendel Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 28080 Gender:	Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal Reply #160 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 6:02pm adelcrow wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 5:53pm: http://www.independentaustralia.net/Wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/RupertA... let's face it adelcrow you are a CONSPIRANUT.
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sir prince duke alevine Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 23619 Gender:	Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal Reply #161 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 6:04pm No it doesn't karnal, no it doesn't. Patience karnal, patience.
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Grendel Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 28080 Gender:	Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal Reply #162 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 6:06pm got nothing as usual I see alevine.
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Grendel Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 28080 Gender:	Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal Reply #163 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 7:51pm One last chance I guess... just for you KRuddy. Where has Abbott ever stated; "I do not want to face the public scrutiny of an economic policy debate here at the National Press Club of Australia. " gee kev how're those hallucinations going?
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Aussie

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Re: Rudd's 61 lies by Grendal
Reply #164 - Jul 13^th, 2013 at 8:06pm

Grendel wrote on Jul 13^th, 2013 at 7:51pm:

One last chance I guess... just for you KRuddy.

Where has Abbott ever stated; "I do not want to face the public scrutiny of an economic policy debate here at the National Press Club of Australia. "

gee kev how're those hallucinations going? Cheesy

I think it was by way of 'inference.'

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