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$19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls (Read 9627 times)
perceptions_now
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Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls
Reply #15 - Jul 27th, 2013 at 12:43pm
 
cods wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 7:59am:
perceptions_now wrote on Jul 26th, 2013 at 11:27pm:
No sh!t Sherlock!

Pity is, that you, the Liberals & Labor, NONE OF YOU HAVE AY IDEA OF THE CAUSE, LET ALONE WHAT YOU SHOULD HAVE DONE OVER THE LAST 40-50 YEARS, NOR WHAT YOU SHOULD DO OVER THE NEXT 40-50 YEARS!!!   





hey perc?.... has your life worked out exactly as you planned it 40/50 years ago?????..

I am not sure how anyone plans for "earthquakes".that may or may not happen in their lives.. but you must have done.


Unlike most natural earthquakes, where we mere mortals remain unaware of the quake, until they actually happen or at least very close to the event, this particular Global Economic earthquake has had indicators for about 40-50 years.

Certainly "those in the know", those with access to all the relevant Demographic, Energy Supply/Pricing & Climate factors have either known or should have known quite some time ago.

They ("those in the know OR thought they did") thought -
1) Like Longy, it had not happened before, so it never would!
2) "Something", like the cavalry riding to the rescue, would come along to save this from becoming a reality?
3) Then there were those who deliberately turned the other way, preferring short term rewards for themselves and a select few, at great cost to the long term future of the bulk of the Local & Global  Public!

Whatever our view/s on what worked in the past & there were appropriate times for both Keynesian & Austrian Economic fixes, the reality of the current Global GFC is that neither Keynesian & Austrian Economic fixes will work, as they did previously and nor will the current "money printing" of the likes of Japan & the USA!

In my judgement, the standard Liberal across the board AUS-terity cuts (Austrian fix), which would have worked on most occasions over the last 200 years or so, is now the worst o all options, BUT neither will the Labor Keynesian approach work, although it would stretch the final demise out for a little longer, until Debt finally overwhelms the system.

This time we really will need to change the whole system and everyone will either contribute their fair share or they will all share in a greater amount of Economic pain!

There are now, no easy options, 40-50 years of inappropriate activity by those on both the Left & Right o Politics & those at the top of the tree, have ensured that only difficult options now remain!

Good luck!

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perceptions_now
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Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls
Reply #16 - Jul 27th, 2013 at 12:47pm
 
perceptions_now wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 12:43pm:
cods wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 7:59am:
perceptions_now wrote on Jul 26th, 2013 at 11:27pm:
No sh!t Sherlock!

Pity is, that you, the Liberals & Labor, NONE OF YOU HAVE AY IDEA OF THE CAUSE, LET ALONE WHAT YOU SHOULD HAVE DONE OVER THE LAST 40-50 YEARS, NOR WHAT YOU SHOULD DO OVER THE NEXT 40-50 YEARS!!!   





hey perc?.... has your life worked out exactly as you planned it 40/50 years ago?????..

I am not sure how anyone plans for "earthquakes".that may or may not happen in their lives.. but you must have done.


Unlike most natural earthquakes, where we mere mortals remain unaware of the quake, until they actually happen or at least very close to the event, this particular Global Economic earthquake has had indicators for about 40-50 years.

Certainly "those in the know", those with access to all the relevant Demographic, Energy Supply/Pricing & Climate factors have either known or should have known quite some time ago.

They ("those in the know OR thought they did") thought -
1) Like Longy, it had not happened before, so it never would!
2) "Something", like the cavalry riding to the rescue, would come along to save this from becoming a reality?
3) Then there were those who deliberately turned the other way, preferring short term rewards for themselves and a select few, at great cost to the long term future of the bulk of the Local & Global  Public!

Whatever our view/s on what worked in the past & there were appropriate times for both Keynesian & Austrian Economic fixes, the reality of the current Global GFC is that neither Keynesian & Austrian Economic fixes will work, as they did previously and nor will the current "money printing" of the likes of Japan & the USA!

In my judgement, the standard Liberal across the board AUS-terity cuts (Austrian fix), which would have worked on most occasions over the last 200 years or so, is now the worst o all options, BUT neither will the Labor Keynesian approach work, although it would stretch the final demise out for a little longer, until Debt finally overwhelms the system.

This time we really will need to change the whole system and everyone will either contribute their fair share or they will all share in a greater amount of Economic pain!

There are now, no easy options, 40-50 years of inappropriate activity by those on both the Left & Right o Politics & those at the top of the tree, have ensured that only difficult options now remain!

Good luck!



Oh & as I have said previously, PRODUCTIVITY must now become number 1.

But Productivity must come come in a measured & sensible way, not simply to the benefit of some & at the expense of others!
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corporate_whitey
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Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls
Reply #17 - Jul 27th, 2013 at 1:01pm
 
ALL PRODUCTIVITY AND ECONOMICS DECISIONS MUST BE MADE SUBJECT TO THE MORAL LAW AND DECENCY TEST... Cool
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World Wide Working Class Struggle
 
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John Smith
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Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls
Reply #18 - Jul 27th, 2013 at 1:10pm
 
cods wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 11:08am:
adelcrow wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 8:16am:
John Smith wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 8:12am:
so Abbott will have no problem debating the issue with Rudd then?

He can share his opinions and the benefit of his knowledge.



An economic genius like Tony Abbott shouldn't be afraid of debating a little nerd like Kevin O'Heaven..
Sssoooo..why is Abbott afraid of a debate on the economy?




why on earth would anyone want to debate a psycho.. the man couldnt lie straight in bed...

look at the crap ad he is doing...telling everyone we are heaps better off than everyone else...hahahah..

he forgets we haven t had any hardship like Europe..he forgets export tripled..he forgets we were basically untouched by the GFC..thanks to China.

its a riot...he doesnt mention the magnificent DEBT he has racked up for us...

and the mess of the BOAT PEOPLE... did he tell us how much he has promised PNG... of course not..why because he doesnt know.. its all been cobbled together...

no Tony stay away from him... he can lie and look straight in the camera whilst he does it.. a conman./. one of the best I grant you.

...
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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.
 
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buzzanddidj
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Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls
Reply #19 - Jul 27th, 2013 at 1:12pm
 
matty wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 12:09am:
People need to realise that only the Coalition can effectively manage economy. Which party was it that repayed the $96 billion of debt they inherited, and left their successors with a surplus of $22 billion, which would then only be wasted on failed schemes like the BER and home insulation disaster?




If you checked the FACTS - and spent a little less time ejaculating onto copies of "The Australian" - you would realise BOH were major components of the most successful GFC stimulus program applied anywhere in the WORLD


... and listen to your elder statesman, on DEBT



longweekend58 wrote on May 20th, 2013 at 9:03am:
buzzanddidj wrote on May 20th, 2013 at 8:54am:
longweekend58 wrote on May 19th, 2013 at 8:04pm:
We DO have high levels of debt.
In fact it is the largest in our history in dollar terms and very close to the largest in GDP terms. and what is worse is that only a mere 6 years ago we have NO DEBT at all.






Don't pretend to be STUPID
It doesn't BECOME you


Even John Howard is capable of coming clean with the TRUTH - occasionally - and giving
credit, where credit is DUE






Quote:
Former prime minister
John Howard gave the economy a big tick
before Treasurer Wayne Swan delivered his sixth budget on Tuesday night.


''And our debt to GDP ratio, the amount of money we owe, to the strength of our economy, is still a lot better than most other countries,'' he said.


He said
Australia's economy was better than the economies of Japan, the US and most European countries.


This is in stark contrast to his protege and Opposition Leader Tony Abbott's assessment of doom and gloom on Monday
.


http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/resilient-economy-in-better-shape-t...







Australia’s
GFC stimulus debt
is the second lowest in the OECD.
Gross debt stands at 28.9% of GDP.

This compares to Japan at 224%,
Greece at 193.2%,
Portugal at 133.1%,
Italy at 129.6%,
Ireland at 127.7%,
United States at 113%,
France at 108.2%,
UK at 110.4%,
Canada at 85.5%,
Spain at 100.2%
Germany at 86.2%.














you have a poor definition of 'good'.










MY definition ?

I just presented the FACTS





...




The BIG ticks of APPROVAL come from ...

Standard & Poor's
Moody's
Fitch's
The Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD)
EuroMoney (Finance Minister of the Year Honours)
The International Monetary Fund (IMF)
The Reserve Bank of Australia (RBA)
The Australian Bureau of Statistics ( ... by stealth)
The Butcher
The Baker
The Candlestick Maker

... and NOW - a few days back - the former member for Bennelong



The ONLY talking down of the ecomomy and the Federal Treasurer is coming from the Opposition, NEWS Ltd - and Sydney shock-jocks


I know who I trust



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Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.'


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longweekend58
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Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls
Reply #20 - Jul 27th, 2013 at 2:48pm
 
cods wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 7:59am:
perceptions_now wrote on Jul 26th, 2013 at 11:27pm:
Maqqa wrote on Jul 26th, 2013 at 10:51pm:
http://au.news.yahoo.com/latest/a/-/latest/18164803/labor-razor-gang-faces-dilem...

The Federal Government is facing a budget dilemma,
with the ABC learning revenues are around $8 billion lower than the May budget predicted.

The Government's razor gang met this morning to debate whether to implement painful budget cuts before the election or delay the return to surplus, currently scheduled for 2016-17.

The budget is in a tough position with the mining tax underperforming and revenue from other taxes also lower than expected.

Treasurer Chris Bowen today said Australia was also facing "dramatic reductions" in its terms of trade, but reaffirmed the intention to return to surplus on schedule.

The Government has got decisions to make on any potential cuts, but insiders insist the easy cuts have all already been made.

One Labor source questioned whether the Government should cause budget pain for the public at a time when Labor is just starting to perform better in the polls.

The Government will release its fiscal update next week, and Treasury will release its own accounting, the pre-election fiscal outlook (PEFO), early in the election campaign.

Earlier Friday, Opposition treasury spokesman Joe Hockey questioned the motives for the release of the Government's fiscal update so close to the PEFO.

"Why is the Government releasing a comprehensive economic statement just a few days before the pre-election fiscal outlook? It is about trying to bully the Treasury into a fixed set of numbers," he said.

Mr Hockey questioned the independence of Treasury by saying the Coalition would not rely on its figures to frame its policy costings because they could not be trusted.

That was despite earlier in the year saying "the only numbers than we can rely on are the PEFO numbers released by the heads of department during the course of the election campaign".

Mr Hockey now says every time the Government publishes budget figures they are "dead-set wrong".

He says the Coalition will instead base its policy costings on figures from the Parliamentary Budget Office, state Coalition governments and independent advisers.

The Treasurer has rejected Mr Hockey's assertions about Treasury's independence.

"It is an insult not to me but to the Treasury and the Department of Finance, and I am sick and tired of the Opposition trashing the reputation of Australia's public servants," Mr Bowen said.

Opposition Leader Tony Abbott has backed his treasury spokesman.

"Joe was making the point that figures from this Government have never turned out to be true; never, never, never starting from their very first budget."


No sh!t Sherlock!

Pity is, that you, the Liberals & Labor, NONE OF YOU HAVE AY IDEA OF THE CAUSE, LET ALONE WHAT YOU SHOULD HAVE DONE OVER THE LAST 40-50 YEARS, NOR WHAT YOU SHOULD DO OVER THE NEXT 40-50 YEARS!!!   





hey perc?.... has your life worked out exactly as you planned it 40/50 years ago?????..

I am not sure how anyone plans for "earthquakes".that may or may not happen in their lives.. but you must have done.


you will also not that Prozac_now never comes up with any solutions - just criticism.  He hates debt and hates spending cuts.  he seems to want it both ways while blaming everyone for everything.

clearly his medication is not working,
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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
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longweekend58
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Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls
Reply #21 - Jul 27th, 2013 at 2:50pm
 
Dnarever wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 10:52am:
What do we thing that dropping revenue will do to projected targets ??

And what do we think the budget impact will be from Abbotts over $100 Billion of unfunded spending before considering his unfunded plan to build multiple cities in the far north is considered all occurring with a dwindling income base?


abbott abbott abbott

it's all you ever talk about and is the reason he will be the next PM - because labor is so stupid all they do is talk about

abbott abbott abbott....
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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
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perceptions_now
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Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls
Reply #22 - Jul 27th, 2013 at 3:28pm
 
longweekend58 wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 2:48pm:
cods wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 7:59am:
perceptions_now wrote on Jul 26th, 2013 at 11:27pm:
Maqqa wrote on Jul 26th, 2013 at 10:51pm:
http://au.news.yahoo.com/latest/a/-/latest/18164803/labor-razor-gang-faces-dilem...

The Federal Government is facing a budget dilemma,
with the ABC learning revenues are around $8 billion lower than the May budget predicted.

The Government's razor gang met this morning to debate whether to implement painful budget cuts before the election or delay the return to surplus, currently scheduled for 2016-17.

The budget is in a tough position with the mining tax underperforming and revenue from other taxes also lower than expected.

Treasurer Chris Bowen today said Australia was also facing "dramatic reductions" in its terms of trade, but reaffirmed the intention to return to surplus on schedule.

The Government has got decisions to make on any potential cuts, but insiders insist the easy cuts have all already been made.

One Labor source questioned whether the Government should cause budget pain for the public at a time when Labor is just starting to perform better in the polls.

The Government will release its fiscal update next week, and Treasury will release its own accounting, the pre-election fiscal outlook (PEFO), early in the election campaign.

Earlier Friday, Opposition treasury spokesman Joe Hockey questioned the motives for the release of the Government's fiscal update so close to the PEFO.

"Why is the Government releasing a comprehensive economic statement just a few days before the pre-election fiscal outlook? It is about trying to bully the Treasury into a fixed set of numbers," he said.

Mr Hockey questioned the independence of Treasury by saying the Coalition would not rely on its figures to frame its policy costings because they could not be trusted.

That was despite earlier in the year saying "the only numbers than we can rely on are the PEFO numbers released by the heads of department during the course of the election campaign".

Mr Hockey now says every time the Government publishes budget figures they are "dead-set wrong".

He says the Coalition will instead base its policy costings on figures from the Parliamentary Budget Office, state Coalition governments and independent advisers.

The Treasurer has rejected Mr Hockey's assertions about Treasury's independence.

"It is an insult not to me but to the Treasury and the Department of Finance, and I am sick and tired of the Opposition trashing the reputation of Australia's public servants," Mr Bowen said.

Opposition Leader Tony Abbott has backed his treasury spokesman.

"Joe was making the point that figures from this Government have never turned out to be true; never, never, never starting from their very first budget."


No sh!t Sherlock!

Pity is, that you, the Liberals & Labor, NONE OF YOU HAVE AY IDEA OF THE CAUSE, LET ALONE WHAT YOU SHOULD HAVE DONE OVER THE LAST 40-50 YEARS, NOR WHAT YOU SHOULD DO OVER THE NEXT 40-50 YEARS!!!   





hey perc?.... has your life worked out exactly as you planned it 40/50 years ago?????..

I am not sure how anyone plans for "earthquakes".that may or may not happen in their lives.. but you must have done.


you will also not that Prozac_now never comes up with any solutions - just criticism.  He hates debt and hates spending cuts.  he seems to want it both ways while blaming everyone for everything.

clearly his medication is not working,


You assume too much, as usual! A solution, for everything, there is NOT!

As usual, you statements do not reflect the truth! I have no problem with Debt, Spending Cuts or Economic Stimulation measures, in the appropriate circumstances, of which there have been many, over the years, BUT NONE OF THEM WILL WORK NOW, FOR THE SHORT TO MEDIUM TERM, as the entire system has been destabilised over the last 40-50 years!
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Maqqa
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Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls
Reply #23 - Jul 27th, 2013 at 3:31pm
 
It's interesting when bad things happen - perception will blame the LibLab

But perception offers no alternative party that will win the required 70+ seats to form government

When pressed further - it is clear perception is a Labor voter
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Bill 14% is not the alcohol content of that wine. It's your poll number
 
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Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls
Reply #24 - Jul 27th, 2013 at 3:48pm
 
John Smith wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 8:12am:
so Abbott will have no problem debating the issue with Rudd then?

He can share his opinions and the benefit of his knowledge.


I'm tipping that Abbott will find an excuse NOT to go 1 on 1 with Rudd in a debate on the economy, even after the election is called.

Smiley
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"What's in store for me in the direction I don't take?"-Jack Kerouac.
 
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longweekend58
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Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls
Reply #25 - Jul 27th, 2013 at 3:55pm
 
perceptions_now wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 3:28pm:
longweekend58 wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 2:48pm:
cods wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 7:59am:
perceptions_now wrote on Jul 26th, 2013 at 11:27pm:
Maqqa wrote on Jul 26th, 2013 at 10:51pm:
http://au.news.yahoo.com/latest/a/-/latest/18164803/labor-razor-gang-faces-dilem...

The Federal Government is facing a budget dilemma,
with the ABC learning revenues are around $8 billion lower than the May budget predicted.

The Government's razor gang met this morning to debate whether to implement painful budget cuts before the election or delay the return to surplus, currently scheduled for 2016-17.

The budget is in a tough position with the mining tax underperforming and revenue from other taxes also lower than expected.

Treasurer Chris Bowen today said Australia was also facing "dramatic reductions" in its terms of trade, but reaffirmed the intention to return to surplus on schedule.

The Government has got decisions to make on any potential cuts, but insiders insist the easy cuts have all already been made.

One Labor source questioned whether the Government should cause budget pain for the public at a time when Labor is just starting to perform better in the polls.

The Government will release its fiscal update next week, and Treasury will release its own accounting, the pre-election fiscal outlook (PEFO), early in the election campaign.

Earlier Friday, Opposition treasury spokesman Joe Hockey questioned the motives for the release of the Government's fiscal update so close to the PEFO.

"Why is the Government releasing a comprehensive economic statement just a few days before the pre-election fiscal outlook? It is about trying to bully the Treasury into a fixed set of numbers," he said.

Mr Hockey questioned the independence of Treasury by saying the Coalition would not rely on its figures to frame its policy costings because they could not be trusted.

That was despite earlier in the year saying "the only numbers than we can rely on are the PEFO numbers released by the heads of department during the course of the election campaign".

Mr Hockey now says every time the Government publishes budget figures they are "dead-set wrong".

He says the Coalition will instead base its policy costings on figures from the Parliamentary Budget Office, state Coalition governments and independent advisers.

The Treasurer has rejected Mr Hockey's assertions about Treasury's independence.

"It is an insult not to me but to the Treasury and the Department of Finance, and I am sick and tired of the Opposition trashing the reputation of Australia's public servants," Mr Bowen said.

Opposition Leader Tony Abbott has backed his treasury spokesman.

"Joe was making the point that figures from this Government have never turned out to be true; never, never, never starting from their very first budget."


No sh!t Sherlock!

Pity is, that you, the Liberals & Labor, NONE OF YOU HAVE AY IDEA OF THE CAUSE, LET ALONE WHAT YOU SHOULD HAVE DONE OVER THE LAST 40-50 YEARS, NOR WHAT YOU SHOULD DO OVER THE NEXT 40-50 YEARS!!!   





hey perc?.... has your life worked out exactly as you planned it 40/50 years ago?????..

I am not sure how anyone plans for "earthquakes".that may or may not happen in their lives.. but you must have done.


you will also not that Prozac_now never comes up with any solutions - just criticism.  He hates debt and hates spending cuts.  he seems to want it both ways while blaming everyone for everything.

clearly his medication is not working,


You assume too much, as usual! A solution, for everything, there is NOT!

As usual, you statements do not reflect the truth! I have no problem with Debt, Spending Cuts or Economic Stimulation measures, in the appropriate circumstances, of which there have been many, over the years, BUT NONE OF THEM WILL WORK NOW, FOR THE SHORT TO MEDIUM TERM, as the entire system has been destabilised over the last 40-50 years!


so in short, you are saying that you have no answers or solutions.  WHICH WAS EXACTLY WHAT I SAID, oh depressed one.
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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
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longweekend58
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Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls
Reply #26 - Jul 27th, 2013 at 3:56pm
 
Lobo wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 3:48pm:
John Smith wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 8:12am:
so Abbott will have no problem debating the issue with Rudd then?

He can share his opinions and the benefit of his knowledge.


I'm tipping that Abbott will find an excuse NOT to go 1 on 1 with Rudd in a debate on the economy, even after the election is called.

Smiley


im tipping that if abbott extends his current 4point lead to 6 or more then he can do what he wants and Rudd can simply cry and whine (and of course swear) about it all he likes.
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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
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Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls
Reply #27 - Jul 27th, 2013 at 4:11pm
 
You see there is this cycle, what happens is, the Liberals put the economy in a good position, everything rosy in the garden then Labor comes along and says this garden is sh.t!

They then convince the people that they will make the garden into a spectacular garden.

The people can only see the vision, so they vote Labor in.

Then within a couple of years the weeds have grown out of control, the roses in the garden are dying, being strangled to death by the vines.

Labor shrugs and says we just have to get more gardeners in, bring in more roses from overseas.

But alas the garden or what was once a garden becomes an over ridden desolate place,

Until...one day the Liberals come along once more and say we can manage then garden, eliminate the weeds, put things to rights,

Then the people hungry and disillusioned finally put them back into power,

Then the diligent gardeners return to restore order out of chaos. Smiley Smiley Smiley Smiley Smiley Smiley

And that is the story of Labor and the garden.
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Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls
Reply #28 - Jul 27th, 2013 at 4:19pm
 
matty wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 12:09am:
People need to realise that only the Coalition can effectively manage economy. Which party was it that repayed the $96 billion of debt they inherited, and left their successors with a surplus of $22 billion, which would then only be wasted on failed schemes like the BER and home insulation disaster?

You mean the party that repayed the $96 billion of debt they inherited - $40billion of which was debt John Howard racked up as Treasurer.

The Party that then went on to be the most wasteful this country has ever seen:

Australia's most needlessly wasteful spending took place under the John Howard-led Coalition government rather than under the Whitlam, Rudd or Gillard Labor governments, an international study has found...

The International Monetary Fund examined 200 years of government financial records across 55 leading economies.
It identifies only two periods of Australian "fiscal profligacy" in recent years, both during John Howard's term in office - in 2003 at the start of the mining boom and during his final years in office between 2005 and 2007.


http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/hey-big-spender-howard-the...

The Party that pissed the profits of the mining boom up against the wall with illegal wars, middle-class welfare and baby bonuses - but failed to provide necessary services and infrastructure.  No NBN.  No NDIS.  No carbon pricing.  Nothing.  Just waste.


You think this is better than the Party that left Australia with one of the lowest levels of debt in the developed world after the greatest global economic downturn since the Great Depression. 

ANd BTW:  what exactly was wrong with the BEF and the home insulation programmes?  Both were very successful.  Have you been believing what Alan Jones tells you again!!
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Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls
Reply #29 - Jul 27th, 2013 at 4:21pm
 
Maqqa wrote on Jul 26th, 2013 at 10:51pm:
http://au.news.yahoo.com/latest/a/-/latest/18164803/labor-razor-gang-faces-dilem...

The Federal Government is facing a budget dilemma, with the ABC learning revenues are around $8 billion lower than the May budget predicted.

The Government's razor gang met this morning to debate whether to implement painful budget cuts before the election or delay the return to surplus, currently scheduled for 2016-17.

The budget is in a tough position with the mining tax underperforming and revenue from other taxes also lower than expected.

Treasurer Chris Bowen today said Australia was also facing "dramatic reductions" in its terms of trade, but reaffirmed the intention to return to surplus on schedule.

The Government has got decisions to make on any potential cuts, but insiders insist the easy cuts have all already been made.

One Labor source questioned whether the Government should cause budget pain for the public at a time when Labor is just starting to perform better in the polls.

The Government will release its fiscal update next week, and Treasury will release its own accounting, the pre-election fiscal outlook (PEFO), early in the election campaign.

Earlier Friday, Opposition treasury spokesman Joe Hockey questioned the motives for the release of the Government's fiscal update so close to the PEFO.

"Why is the Government releasing a comprehensive economic statement just a few days before the pre-election fiscal outlook? It is about trying to bully the Treasury into a fixed set of numbers," he said.

Mr Hockey questioned the independence of Treasury by saying the Coalition would not rely on its figures to frame its policy costings because they could not be trusted.

That was despite earlier in the year saying "the only numbers than we can rely on are the PEFO numbers released by the heads of department during the course of the election campaign".

Mr Hockey now says every time the Government publishes budget figures they are "dead-set wrong".

He says the Coalition will instead base its policy costings on figures from the Parliamentary Budget Office, state Coalition governments and independent advisers.

The Treasurer has rejected Mr Hockey's assertions about Treasury's independence.

"It is an insult not to me but to the Treasury and the Department of Finance, and I am sick and tired of the Opposition trashing the reputation of Australia's public servants," Mr Bowen said.

Opposition Leader Tony Abbott has backed his treasury spokesman.

"Joe was making the point that figures from this Government have never turned out to be true; never, never, never starting from their very first budget."


Hocey could just treat treasury like Peter Costello did.  he listened to them but didn't swallow what they said as necessarily reliable of accurate. Swan however, believed everything they said and has produced 6 budgets in a row that missed their projections by a mile.  It wasn't just the deficits they produced, it was the way in which every single element of the budgets failed massively.
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