Australian Politics Forum - The ALP Eyes Youth Dole Boot Camps

Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: The ALP Eyes Youth Dole Boot Camps
Reply #60 - Jul 28^th, 2013 at 1:25pm

cods wrote on Jul 28^th, 2013 at 12:13pm:

Kat wrote on Jul 28^th, 2013 at 9:10am:

cods wrote on Jul 28^th, 2013 at 9:04am:

Kat wrote on Jul 28^th, 2013 at 8:53am:

[quote author=Andrei.Hicks link=1374962909/14#14 date=1374965334]Taking money off working people without even bothering to try and find a job is a crime.

They need to stop giving them money and switch to food stamps and vouchers.

And you need a good dose of reality.[/quote]

why???..

if they spend it on smokes or grog...and then queue up at the soup kitchen...it looks good for the likes of crook and yourself..

give them another $50 a week $100 a fortnight and we know where most of that will go.

I have known unemployed in the past and not one of them lived on the streets they all lived in a nice comfy warm home.with food on the table...I dont really see why they should get more.

And there goes your credibility, right there. The first sentence is loaded with bias, ignorance and stereotyping. No real need to read further.

The point being that you have no idea where it might go, and no right to decide where it might go.

And if you 'don't really see why they should get more' then you must be blind.

ANY MORE THAN YOU HAVE THEY ARE ALL HARD DONE BY...

as for not knowing anything... in Canberra some wash wind=screens at the traffic lights thee are obviously unemployed rough looking and untidy.. ALL SMOKING....yes I always get mine cleaned..I do like to help..

DONT FORGET IF i DONT KNOW WHERE THE MONEY GOES NEITHER DO YOU OR CROOK...

FROM WHAT I HAVE SEEN.. AN AWFUL LOT ARE COVERED IN TATTOOS..OR HAVE BODY PIERCING .. all of which turns many off employing them..

and for your information I not judging all the same.... as I said before I have known some and I was talking from that experience.

If you arent judging then why the comment about the smoking?

They can spend their money on whatever they want.

BTW that windshield gang is like the mafia. Nobody new can just go there and start washing windshields.

SOB

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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: The ALP Eyes Youth Dole Boot Camps
Reply #61 - Jul 28^th, 2013 at 1:27pm

ian wrote on Jul 28^th, 2013 at 12:29pm:

for many unemployed its not about a comfortable lifestyle, its about avoiding work at all cost. Un employment breeds crime, so what we need to start doing is to stop handing ourt money for nothing. Work for the dole must happen, in all cases. We may be surprised how many people actually find productive work for themselves when faced with the fact they are going to have to work anyway. The indigenous unemployment rate is a disgrace at 16 percent. We have too many in this country sitting on their arses with their hands out, it has to stop.

Oh really? How would you know this? the lifestyle of not being able to afford rent you mean?

As for crime - well - you have a bunch of ppl in poverty and thats what happens.

SOB

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buzzanddidj

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Re: The ALP Eyes Youth Dole Boot Camps
Reply #62 - Jul 28^th, 2013 at 2:16pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jul 28^th, 2013 at 12:48pm:

You cannot compare the impact of WW2 on Australia compared to
how we suffered
through consistent bombing campaigns of 1940-44.
Whilst Australia like many suffered to so extent, it pales in comparison to Europe and Great Britain.

OBVIOUSLY, "life in the colonies" was ( ... is ?) a component of little interest to the insular British education curriculum -
"How We Won the War"

Australia bombed, strafed and shelled

A desperate air battle was fought over Darwin yesterday as the air war in Australia’s north flared to its greatest pitch of fury.
The Sun, 20 February 1942

On 19 February 1942 Japanese bombs fell on mainland Australia for the first time. The port and city of Darwin suffered two devastating attacks by over 188 Japanese aircraft that day.

Over the next twenty months northern Australia was to endure almost a hundred air raids, from Exmouth in the west to Townsville in the east. At the same time, Japanese submarines attacked merchant vessels off the coast of eastern Australia.

Reactions to these attacks varied across Australia. For those close to the areas under attack, the damage was obvious and the response immediate.

The population in southern Australia was shielded from the detail of the attacks by distance and wartime censorship. Nevertheless, strict air raid precautions were implemented and the civilian population prepared to face the national emergency.

On the night of 31 May – 1 June 1942 three Japanese midget submarines attacked Sydney Harbour. They were launched from a group of five larger submarines waiting off the Heads. All three midget submarines were lost, with two of them destroyed before they could fire their torpedoes. The third fired at but missed the USS Chicago, sinking HMAS Kuttabul, a coverted ferry, and killing 21 sleeping sailors aboard. Reactions by Sydney residents varied; a few made plans to flee the city, but many came to watch the recovery of the submarines.

A week after the midget submarine attack on Sydney Harbour, two of the larger submarines returned to bombard Sydney and Newcastle with their deck guns. One shelled Newcastle for twenty minutes until driven off by fire from coastal artillery defences. Another submarine fired ten rounds into eastern Sydney.

http://www.awm.gov.au/exhibitions/underattack/bombed/

During all of this, as in WW1, the Australian Defence Forces were in Europe- acting as cannon fodder - fighting "Britain's War"

A gesture, never reciprocated

But no-one EVER suffers as much as the English ( ... or as LOUDLY, at least)

Perhaps a visit to the Australian War Memorial might bring a little more RESPECT to the forefront - from the pair of you ?

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Mnemonic

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Re: The ALP Eyes Youth Dole Boot Camps
Reply #63 - Jul 28^th, 2013 at 2:28pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jul 28^th, 2013 at 10:42am:

It is good to have a pool of available workers.

It isn't as good to have a pool of oxygen stealers who haven't worked a day in decades and spent my money on beer.

If people want to drink beer, that's their business. You have a wife and kids, you own a nice house and a fast car. The beer drinkers don't get that stuff, so I don't know why you're complaining. We don't live in a Third World country. Because our country is higher up on the economic hierarchy, we can afford to support beer drinkers, unlike countries in Africa. If we were suddenly thrown into the Dark Ages, that's when we would stop supporting beer drinkers.

Besides, it's not like you deserved all the money represented by your "gross income." A market driven system is not objective. They sell goods and services to the highest bidder. That means the person or company with the most money to offer seals the deal. If you have millions of dollars to spend, you have an advantage and probably a monopoly on the work force. In other words, the value of gross income is arbitrary, not objective and not proportional to the effort put in. You are not losing any more than you deserve to so-called "beer drinkers."

You don't really believe in the objectivity of the "invisible hand" do you? If not, why would you think you deserved all of your gross income and that something was being "stolen" from you?

cods wrote on Jul 28^th, 2013 at 12:18pm:

one of the things that always amazes me about this country is the fact they do HAVE IT REALLY GOOD.. when I left England they had 2 weeks holidays per annum..here it was 3/4 weeks..plus untold public holidays even Union days off..

and still it isnt enough..

It's about keeping up with the Joneses. When you see your friends with smart-phones, you'll want one too. Nobody wants to be left behind. When others are having a great life, everybody wants a great life. It's a competition. You're competing with your friends and family. People complain when they feel they're missing out. They feel cheated. That's the psychology of this phenomenon. People compare themselves to others.

If people didn't have an opinion of what they might be missing, whether it's the unemployed who are struggling to pay rent or those that have six-figure incomes, they wouldn't be complaining.

People should stop having an opinion on what they deserve and get on with what they're supposed to be doing.

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Mnemonic

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Re: The ALP Eyes Youth Dole Boot Camps
Reply #64 - Jul 28^th, 2013 at 2:30pm

cods wrote on Jul 28^th, 2013 at 12:20pm:

dont forget nails.. they dont pay taxes in Australia..or spend the $7000 in AUstralia.. that is whats harming this country.

Foreigners should be paying the same taxes we have, if not more. Just because you're not Australian, doesn't mean you should be exempt from our tax system. They should give them a tax file number immediately when they arrive here.

Foreign-owned companies should also be paying taxes, at least as much as locally owned ones -- if not more. You don't work, live or operate here for nothing. Angry

It may drive investment and capital away, but at least we'll own everything. We'll be self-sufficient.

................ and get rid of free trade, please. Angry

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Mnemonic

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Re: The ALP Eyes Youth Dole Boot Camps
Reply #65 - Jul 28^th, 2013 at 2:41pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jul 28^th, 2013 at 12:48pm:

Don't be such an ignorant fool Buzz.

You cannot compare the impact of WW2 on Australia compared to how we suffered through consistent bombing campaigns of 1940-44.
Whilst Australia like many suffered to so extent, it pales in comparison to Europe and Great Britain.

Yet, Great Britain has been able to maintain at least two aircraft carriers, meddle in world politics and maintain its military and political influence for decades.

Australia never wasted its energy on empire. Britain is just a tired old man who is still flexing his muscles, preparing and bracing himself to pick another fight. World powers exhaust themselves, trying to hold onto the status of alpha male.

I don't think the argument that European and Britain sustained heavy bombing is really relevant after seventy years. Just look at Japan and Germany. They were heavily bombed, but they rebuilt and have two of the world's biggest economies. They are both among the top 10.

BTW, what exactly do you mean by "we?" Aren't you Australian? You use "we" when talking about Americans and "we" when talking about the British. It's as if you don't even think of yourself as Australian and you have a problem with Australians putting beetroot in their burgers and sandwiches (like you said in one of the other threads). It's not like it's coriander or cilantro.

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longweekend58

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Re: The ALP Eyes Youth Dole Boot Camps
Reply #66 - Jul 28^th, 2013 at 3:13pm

Kat wrote on Jul 28^th, 2013 at 8:29am:

Quote:

The Brahminy Foundation's Wilderness Camp, 200 kilometres from Darwin, is for some of society's most troubled and unemployable youths.

Sounds like a POW camp, or Deep-South 'road-gang'-style incarceration to me.

Is this the first step towards locking our unemployed up for being unemployed?

If so, God help this country, because I surely will not.

so why do you want to vote labor then?? no matter how much you hate abbott, these kinds of Rudd policies are far right of the liberals. If you are to be true to your convictions them you MUST vote Liberal.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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perceptions_now Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 11694 Perth WA Gender:	Re: The ALP Eyes Youth Dole Boot Camps Reply #67 - Jul 28^th, 2013 at 3:14pm How about compulsory National Service for everyone over 18 years old, but not employed? We could put the conscripts to work, turning back the boats and all of our problems could be solved?
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longweekend58

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Re: The ALP Eyes Youth Dole Boot Camps
Reply #68 - Jul 28^th, 2013 at 3:17pm

cods wrote on Jul 28^th, 2013 at 8:42am:

Ex Dame Pansi wrote on Jul 28^th, 2013 at 8:34am:

cods wrote on Jul 28^th, 2013 at 8:26am:

[quote author=pansi1951 link=1374962909/1#1 date=1374963510]
The ALP and the Coalition need a boot camp for themselves, they're both out of control.

Punish the youth, they're all lazy.....nothing to do with the fact that there is NO work.

Little boot camps to con the youngsters into signing for the big boot camp.

shhhhh pansi someone from the left tells us this govt has created 4 million jobs..

well THEY believe it?.

can you see any govt making this generation DO ANYTHING?...hilarious.

You do realise the previous generation said the same thing about your generation cods.

I wouldn't speak too ill of them because it is these same people who will be changing your diapers in the future. You wouldn't want them to leave you messy for too long, would you?

Is it the government wrecking manufacturing or the "lazy" kids?.....you can't have it both ways.

This generation is not lazy, they work damn hard, when they get the opportunity.

It's the economy.........

onai you are probably of a different generation to me.. but believe me.. we all had jobs.. good and bad.. no such thing as dole in my day. we were never called lazy cant get out of bed..

this generation is lazy pansi.. I remember someone suggesting the get on a BUS to go to work.. shock waves went through the place.

they do not work hard pansi.. they have far too many machines to do what MY GENERATION DID BY HAND AND BACK..

sorry matey...but that is a fact..men dont dig roads today machines do..

its the same with accounting.. its done my machine..

I would not go down a mine if you paid me too...and I admire those that do...but even that is becoming a thing of the past its all opencut now...

look around pansi things have changed an awful lot.

honest to god stop finding excuses for everything.

thats nonsense cods. The idea that 'the good old days' had full employment is as silly as it is provably wrong. In fact, for most of the last 15 years we have had historically LOWER unemployment than most of the last century. You seem to forget the 10%+ unemployment of the 70s and 80s, to 30%+unemployment of the 30s that was only ended by the major employer called WW2. The 'good old days' never existed. even the 1950s very low unemployment was a farce as it was only achieved by denying married women the right to work.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: The ALP Eyes Youth Dole Boot Camps
Reply #69 - Jul 28^th, 2013 at 3:18pm

Kat wrote on Jul 28^th, 2013 at 9:05am:

Business needs to take responsibility too.

Their policy of cutting jobs, wages and conditions, to protect CEO
bonuses and dividends to parasi...oops, shareholders is a major
cause of the unemployment problem.

As is their refusal to provide on-the-job training for employees.

cutting wages??? DOES NOT HAPPEN or do you forget that wages are controlled by law?

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: The ALP Eyes Youth Dole Boot Camps
Reply #70 - Jul 28^th, 2013 at 3:20pm

Kat wrote on Jul 28^th, 2013 at 9:10am:

cods wrote on Jul 28^th, 2013 at 9:04am:

Kat wrote on Jul 28^th, 2013 at 8:53am:

[quote author=Andrei.Hicks link=1374962909/14#14 date=1374965334]Taking money off working people without even bothering to try and find a job is a crime.

They need to stop giving them money and switch to food stamps and vouchers.

And you need a good dose of reality.[/quote]

why???..

if they spend it on smokes or grog...and then queue up at the soup kitchen...it looks good for the likes of crook and yourself..

give them another $50 a week $100 a fortnight and we know where most of that will go.

I have known unemployed in the past and not one of them lived on the streets they all lived in a nice comfy warm home.with food on the table...I dont really see why they should get more.

And there goes your credibility, right there. The first sentence is loaded with bias, ignorance and stereotyping. No real need to read further.

The point being that you have no idea where it might go, and no right to decide where it might go.

And if you 'don't really see why they should get more' then you must be blind.

why should the govt not have some right to dictate where at least part of the money goes?? the dole is not a RIGHT. it is a privilege given by a country that can afford it and one that I strongly support. That doesn't mean that there is no mutual obligation involved in this transaction. the dole is given to support the basics of life while getting work and no more.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: The ALP Eyes Youth Dole Boot Camps
Reply #71 - Jul 28^th, 2013 at 3:35pm

Mnemonic wrote on Jul 28^th, 2013 at 2:30pm:

cods wrote on Jul 28^th, 2013 at 12:20pm:

dont forget nails.. they dont pay taxes in Australia..or spend the $7000 in AUstralia.. that is whats harming this country.

Foreigners should be paying the same taxes we have, if not more. Just because you're not Australian, doesn't mean you should be exempt from our tax system. They should give them a tax file number immediately when they arrive here.

Foreign-owned companies should also be paying taxes, at least as much as locally owned ones -- if not more. You don't work, live or operate here for nothing. Angry

It may drive investment and capital away, but at least we'll own everything. We'll be self-sufficient.

................ and get rid of free trade, please. Angry

in general, if you work her you DO pay tax here. also, if your company operates here you generally pay tax here. There are exceptions of course but it is generally true.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: The ALP Eyes Youth Dole Boot Camps
Reply #72 - Jul 28^th, 2013 at 3:52pm

buzzanddidj wrote on Jul 28^th, 2013 at 2:16pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Jul 28^th, 2013 at 12:48pm:

You cannot compare the impact of WW2 on Australia compared to
how we suffered
through consistent bombing campaigns of 1940-44.
Whilst Australia like many suffered to so extent, it pales in comparison to Europe and Great Britain.

OBVIOUSLY, "life in the colonies" was ( ... is ?) a component of little interest to the insular British education curriculum -
"How We Won the War"

Australia bombed, strafed and shelled

http://www.awm.gov.au/exhibitions/underattack/images/maps/attacks.gif

A desperate air battle was fought over Darwin yesterday as the air war in Australia’s north flared to its greatest pitch of fury.
The Sun, 20 February 1942

On 19 February 1942 Japanese bombs fell on mainland Australia for the first time. The port and city of Darwin suffered two devastating attacks by over 188 Japanese aircraft that day.

Over the next twenty months northern Australia was to endure almost a hundred air raids, from Exmouth in the west to Townsville in the east. At the same time, Japanese submarines attacked merchant vessels off the coast of eastern Australia.

Reactions to these attacks varied across Australia. For those close to the areas under attack, the damage was obvious and the response immediate.

The population in southern Australia was shielded from the detail of the attacks by distance and wartime censorship. Nevertheless, strict air raid precautions were implemented and the civilian population prepared to face the national emergency.

On the night of 31 May – 1 June 1942 three Japanese midget submarines attacked Sydney Harbour. They were launched from a group of five larger submarines waiting off the Heads. All three midget submarines were lost, with two of them destroyed before they could fire their torpedoes. The third fired at but missed the USS Chicago, sinking HMAS Kuttabul, a coverted ferry, and killing 21 sleeping sailors aboard. Reactions by Sydney residents varied; a few made plans to flee the city, but many came to watch the recovery of the submarines.

A week after the midget submarine attack on Sydney Harbour, two of the larger submarines returned to bombard Sydney and Newcastle with their deck guns. One shelled Newcastle for twenty minutes until driven off by fire from coastal artillery defences. Another submarine fired ten rounds into eastern Sydney.

http://www.awm.gov.au/exhibitions/underattack/bombed/

During all of this, as in WW1, the Australian Defence Forces were in Europe- acting as cannon fodder - fighting "Britain's War"

A gesture, never reciprocated

But no-one EVER suffers as much as the English ( ... or as LOUDLY, at least)

Perhaps a visit to the Australian War Memorial might bring a little more RESPECT to the forefront - from the pair of you ?

now you just sound like a fool. To even suggest that Australia suffered anything like the English in WW2 is just stupid... SOB-level stupidity.

We hardly got off scot free but we had ONE attack on the mainland.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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True Blue...

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Re: The ALP Eyes Youth Dole Boot Camps
Reply #73 - Jul 28^th, 2013 at 4:22pm

cods wrote on Jul 28^th, 2013 at 9:07am:

Quote:

Well for one, stop sacking public servants.

what a joke... so they sit there shuffling paper and thats ok...if you knew how many are on STRESS LEAVE .. some almost permanently...

how many go homes sick at least once a week...

you wouldnt be so smug.

you obviously dont understand who pays public servants

cods.... some people on here are on jungle juice or live in fairy land... maybe they are mentally challenged..

just ask Greece and Italy etc what broke their countries....

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Sprintcyclist Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 40774 Gender:	Re: The ALP Eyes Youth Dole Boot Camps Reply #74 - Jul 28^th, 2013 at 4:37pm chicken_lipsforme wrote on Jul 28^th, 2013 at 8:20am: Rudd will have them goosestepping around in their little black uniforms in no time. This is choice. Not creating any new jobs, just showing a tough face. rudd has failed at every jump. It was fuel watch, grocery watch, now youth watch.
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