Australian Politics Forum - There has been no warming since the year 1998

muso

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Re: There has been no warming since the year 1998
Reply #60 - Aug 10^th, 2013 at 9:54pm

Rider wrote on Aug 10^th, 2013 at 12:45pm:

Wheels fall of the global warming bullsh1t bus again.....when will the cultists work out they are being dudded??

Pretty good read this, I fully expect bunny and hash to see it as a shining example of warming......that is to be expected.

http://notrickszone.com/2013/08/09/major-danish-daily-warns-globe-may-be-on-path-to-little-ice-age-much-colder-winters-dramatic-consequences/

Major Danish Daily Warns: “Globe May Be On Path To Little Ice Age…Much Colder Winters…Dramatic Consequences”!

By P Gosselin on 9. August 2013

JP_1Another major European media outlet is asking: Where’s the global warming?

Image right: The August 7 edition of Denmark’s Jyllands-Posten, featured a major 2-page article on the globe’s 15-years of missing warming and the potential solar causes and implications.

Why are you talking about newspaper articles and blog entries?

I take it that you have no peer reviewed research to refer to, so you resort to desperation?
Quote:

Major Danish Daily Warns

Opinions - They are all different, everybody's got one, and they all stink.

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muso

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Re: There has been no warming since the year 1998
Reply #61 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 8:52am

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There has been no warming since the year 1998

Is this the false statement thread? All frogs are green.

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn14527-climate-myths-global-warming-stopped...

That's an explanation from New Scientist, but of course if you don't trust that thar book larnin', it's a wasted message because we all know that you can't trust book larnin'. They are all conspiring to steal all your money and your girlfriend or whatever, so just go down to the pub and ask a plumber.

Quote:

The August 7 print edition of the Danish Jyllands-Posten, the famous daily that published the “Muhammad caricatures“, features a full 2-page article bearing the headline:

They can do Mohammed caricatures, so they must be good. Wheels fall off! Wow.

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« Last Edit: Aug 11^th, 2013 at 9:07am by muso »

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#

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Re: There has been no warming since the year 1998
Reply #62 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 10:23am

Another mention of the obscure blogger http://www.skepticalscience.com/Video-Chuck-Kutscher-debunking-climate-skeptic-a...:
Quote:

I found that a blogger by the name of Pierre Gosselin posted rebuttals to my presentation. See Blogger Rebuttal

He indicates that he is an American with a B.S. in mechanical engineering, works in Germany and has an interest in meteorology. I honestly did not find his rebuttals helpful in improving my presentation. For example, there were the typical attack on Mann's work and a reference to urban heat island effects. Both have been thoroughly addressed in the peer-reviewed literature and yet continue to crop up on skeptic sites. Similarly, the fact that the sun is not the culprit has been proven in many peer-reviewed journal articles. There were also the personal attacks and name-calling: questioning how I ever got my Ph.D. (for the record, a portion of my dissertation work was published in the respected, peer-reviewed ASME Journal of Heat Transfer) and calling me an "armageddonist." I guess that's stronger than "alarmist." (He also called me "slippery." )

I will continue to point out to people that if you call attention to something that is genuinely alarming, then you're not an "alarmist." Further, my research work and most of my presentations focus on solutions, so while "doom and gloom" makes for a nice label, it's not representative of my position. I believe that a combination of renewable energy, nuclear power, and land use changes can help us avoid the worst effects of global warming, and I was a co-author of a peer-reviewed journal article (in Environmental Science and Technology) along with Jim Hansen and two others describing the various solutions. I only put together the rebuttal to skeptic arguments in response to a special request by our local state legislature representative.

So Gosselin has a BSc in mechanical engineering and an interest in meteorology. He pretends to know better than the vast majority of the best qualified: PhDs, supported by peer review.

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Ajax

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Re: There has been no warming since the year 1998
Reply #63 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 11:52am

For warming to occur temperatures should increase incrementally each year.

Unfortunately for the global warming religion temperatures have fallen since 1998 and have not risen above the 1998 value.

Now the global warming religion is scurrying around trying to defend its unequivocal warming statement.

The seas are not warming as the 3000 buoys who measure them forthightly are telling us.

The seas are not rising, as a 50mm(2") rise would be withinn the error margin.

There is no hot spot in the tropopause as weather ballons and satellite data are telling us.

The energy from the sun is waning this will be felt in the next few years as temperatures drop.

And that will be the nail in the coffin for Antropogenic Global Warming.

A lie that has been propogated by bankers and their corporations including big oil etc.

The bottom line for them is to tax the air we breathe and create a $2 trillion dollar market which will be more interested in increasing CO2 emissions.

When this happens all you fools and greenies that think trading carbon credits on the stock exchange will reduce real manmade pollution like chemicals being dumped into our waterways better take cover.

Today we have some of the coollest temperatures in our history we also have some of the lowest amounts of CO2 in our atmosphere EVER.

Wake up all you boys and girls that have been snared by the Antropogen Global Warming Religion and smell the CO2 FFS.

The death of the AGW religion is coming.

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1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery & prison" Regas Feraeos

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muso

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Re: There has been no warming since the year 1998
Reply #64 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 12:13pm

Ajax wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 11:52am:

For warming to occur temperatures should increase incrementally each year.

Strawman number 1. Utter rot. Nobody is saying that. There is short term natural variation due to solar cycles and the Southern Oscillation index etc. Of course it doesn't matter how many times denialists are told these things, they latch on to the same "temperatures must increase incrementally each year" fallacy.

Of course, as the CO2 concentration in the atmosphere increases, the forcing due to that CO2 must rise, and as we know, it's one of several forcings, including direct solar forcing itself.

The net effect is that the mean global temperature rises, but to consider it only over such a short period borders on ridiculous.

Water vapour is a positive feedback. As the temperature rises, on average, the water vapour concentration increases, which gives rise to higher global temperatures. The extent to which this leverage effect occurs is known as the climate sensititivity.

Past events, such as the regional phenomenon known as the "Medieval Warming Period" are indicators of climate sensitivity in the higher range.

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« Last Edit: Aug 11^th, 2013 at 12:24pm by muso »

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Ajax

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Re: There has been no warming since the year 1998
Reply #65 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 12:19pm

muso wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 12:13pm:

Ajax wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 11:52am:

For warming to occur temperatures should increase incrementally each year.

Strawman number 1. Utter rot. Nobody is saying that. There is short term natural variation due to solar cycles and the Southern Oscillation index etc. Of course it doesn't matter how many times denialists are told these things, they latch on to the same "temperatures must increase incrementally each year" fallacy.

You cant have it both ways champ.

If temperatures where increasing every year since 1998, you would just piont to them and say told you so.

What will you come up with in the next few years when temperatures keep falling.

Dont tell me you will say that global warming is in the background?????

The Earth's temperature rises and falls like a jaggered edge.

It cannot remain constant....???!!!!

Actually its impossible....!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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« Last Edit: Aug 11^th, 2013 at 12:45pm by Ajax »

1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery & prison" Regas Feraeos

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Ajax

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Re: There has been no warming since the year 1998
Reply #66 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 12:41pm

muso wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 12:13pm:

Strawman number 1. Utter rot. Nobody is saying that. There is short term natural variation due to solar cycles and the Southern Oscillation index etc. Of course it doesn't matter how many times denialists are told these things, they latch on to the same "temperatures must increase incrementally each year" fallacy.

The sun's activities and the temperature of the Earth correlate quite nicely thank you very much.

Co2 and temperature donot correlate, CO2 follows temperature by a lag of about 800 years.

Quote:

Of course, as the CO2 concentration in the atmosphere increases, the forcing due to that CO2 must rise, and as we know, it's one of several forcings, including direct solar forcing itself.

Sure thing pal, but you forget to tell everyone that 770 gigatonnes per annum are from the ecosystems and 30 gigatonnnes per annum are from manmade emissions.

Why is that......????

Why is this NEVER EVER mentioned by dear old AL or the IPCC or Hansen....?????

Why dont they mention that in our past we had 20 times the CO2 we have today.....they act as though CO2 levels have NEVER been higher.

Again why is that.........???????

Quote:

The net effect is that the mean global temperature rises, but to consider it only over such a short period borders on ridiculous.

Well then how can they tax the air we breath just because we happened to be on a peak temperature curve.

Quote:

Water vapour is a positive feedback. As the temperature rises, on average, the water vapour concentration increases, which gives rise to higher global temperatures. The extent to which this leverage effect occurs is known as the climate sensititivity.

Yes and the computer simulated models tell us that there is a hot spot in the tropopause because of the water vapor and extra manmade CO2 that has accumulated there.

But weather baloons and satellites say there is no hotspot.

Case closed...................................!

Quote:

Past events, such as the regional phenomenon known as the "Medieval Warming Period" are indicators of climate sensitivity in the higher range.

You mean what happened during the medieval warm period isn't what just happened now but on a bigger time scale.

For the last few decades our sun was very active and temperatures increased now the sun is entering a quite phase and temperatures will fall.

This is what we've had recently, and on that information the carbon tax ETS all over the world should be scrapped.

Quote:

1. 30-years of global cooling from 1880 to 1910
2. 30-years of global warming from 1910 to 1940
3. 30-years of global cooling from 1940 to 1970
4. 30-years of global warming from 1970 to 2000

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1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery & prison" Regas Feraeos

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muso

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Re: There has been no warming since the year 1998
Reply #67 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 12:58pm

Ajax wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 12:41pm:

Sure thing pal, but you forget to tell everyone that 770 gigatonnes per annum are from the ecosystems and 30 gigatonnnes per annum are from manmade emissions.

Are you saying that a net 770 Gigatonnes is entering the atmosphere from the ecosystems plus a net 30 gigatonnes from fossil fuel burning etc ?

Let me just check what you're saying......

Because, by my calculation, that's roughly 800 gigatonnes entering the atmosphere every year. In the last 10 years, the CO2 inventory must have increased by 8000 gigatonnes.

So if the total atmospheric inventory is only 2600 gigatonnes, why hasn't the CO2 concentration gone up by a factor of three?

Shorely shome mishtake.

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# Gold Member Offline A fool is certain: an ignorant fool, absolutely so Posts: 2603	Re: There has been no warming since the year 1998 Reply #68 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 1:13pm Ajax wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 11:52am: For warming to occur ... Has it ever occurred to you that the only person you're fooling with your belief that you know what you're talking about is yourself?
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Bobby.

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Re: There has been no warming since the year 1998
Reply #69 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 1:18pm

muso wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 12:13pm:

Ajax wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 11:52am:

For warming to occur temperatures should increase incrementally each year.

Strawman number 1. Utter rot. Nobody is saying that. There is short term natural variation due to solar cycles and the Southern Oscillation index etc. Of course it doesn't matter how many times denialists are told these things, they latch on to the same "temperatures must increase incrementally each year" fallacy.

Of course, as the CO2 concentration in the atmosphere increases, the forcing due to that CO2 must rise, and as we know, it's one of several forcings, including direct solar forcing itself.

The net effect is that the mean global temperature rises, but to consider it only over such a short period borders on ridiculous.

Water vapour is a positive feedback. As the temperature rises, on average, the water vapour concentration increases, which gives rise to higher global temperatures. The extent to which this leverage effect occurs is known as the climate sensititivity.

Past events, such as the regional phenomenon known as the "Medieval Warming Period" are indicators of climate sensitivity in the higher range.

Muso,
I thought water vapour was negative feedback?
Water vapour creates clouds which are white & reflect sunlight.

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Ajax

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Re: There has been no warming since the year 1998
Reply #70 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 1:19pm

muso wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 12:58pm:

Are you saying that a net 770 Gigatonnes is entering the atmosphere from the ecosystems plus a net 30 gigatonnes from fossil fuel burning etc ?

Exactly what i'm saying.........

Le Quote:

t me just check what you're saying......

Because, by my calculation, that's roughly 800 gigatonnes entering the atmosphere every year. In the last 10 years, the CO2 inventory must have increased by 8000 gigatonnes.

Thats right your spot on, but you seemed to have forgotten about the sinks.

I know I know in the past the Earth's sinks have absorbed 7000ppm, every year the Earth's sinks can absorb the 770 gigatonnes the ecosystems throw up but they cannot absorb the 30 extra gigatonnes man throws up.

Thats malarkey..............!!!!!!!!!

Only the faithful believe that one.

Quote:

So if the total atmospheric inventory is only 2600 gigatonnes, why hasn't the CO2 concentration gone up by a factor of three?

Good question...............!!??

The hyposthises that man is responsible for the increase in CO2 is just that a hypothesis.

Where is the real proff????????

Quote:

Shorely shome mishtake.

Nope no mistake.

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Ajax

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Re: There has been no warming since the year 1998
Reply #71 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 1:25pm

# wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 1:13pm:

Ajax wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 11:52am:

For warming to occur ...

Has it ever occurred to you that the only person you're fooling with your belief that you know what you're talking about is yourself?

If the science was settled then we wouldn't have a leg to stand on .

Missing heat that cannot be explained.

No hot spot.

Oceans aren't warming.

And if they have risen by 50mm, thats withing the error margin making it negligible.

Putting your faith in computer simulated models Vs real world data, and both show different things...??

Doesn't it mean the hypothesis of AGW is WRONG.

Science is all about proving the hypothesis in the real world world isn't it?????

Ok boys i have to go and enjoy this manmade CO2 infested lovely afternoon, seeya on the flip side.

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1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery & prison" Regas Feraeos

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Re: There has been no warming since the year 1998
Reply #72 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 1:27pm

From http://notrickszone.com/about-pierre-gosselin/:
Quote:

I’m a US citizen, received an Associate Degree in Civil Engineering at Vermont Technical College and a Bachelor of Science in Mechanical Engineering at the University of Arizona in Tucson. Now I live in Europe and help my wife, the owner, run a small business ...

As a boy I had a strong interest in meteorology and even dreamed of becoming one for a time. I often read the weather charts ...

So Gosselin is the essentially unemployed holder of a BSc in mechanical engineering with an interest in meteorology, who pretends to know better than the vast majority of PhDs who work in the field of climate science and whose work has passed peer review. At least the fact that he's apparently unemployed explains why he has so much time for misinterpreting data and misrepresenting isolated fragments of information.

Ajax wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 12:41pm:

...
Case closed...................................!
...

By the way, Ajax, what are your qualifications? How come you have so much time for misinterpretation and misrepresentation?

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muso

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Re: There has been no warming since the year 1998
Reply #73 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 1:31pm

Ajax wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 1:19pm:

Thats right your spot on, but you seemed to have forgotten about the sinks.

I know I know in the past the Earth's sinks have absorbed 7000ppm, every year the Earth's sinks can absorb the 770 gigatonnes the ecosystems throw up but they cannot absorb the 30 extra gigatonnes man throws up.

Thats malarkey..............!!!!!!!!!

That can be measured, and it isn't malarkey.

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Ajax

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Re: There has been no warming since the year 1998
Reply #74 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 1:36pm

# wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 1:27pm:

By the way, Ajax, what are your qualifications? How come you have so much time for misinterpretation and misrepresentation?

Have some time couldn't resist this one.

Just because your educated it doesn't make you smart, you can teach a monkey to do anything cant you.

Look at you for example, your right behind this AGW religion, that is so politicized and backed by bankers you fail to see the bigger picture.

Sure if i ask you to do some calculus to prove something you might be up to it, this doesn't make you smart in life and society.

Do you honestly think that once the $2 trillion dollar carbon credit market kicks of, the people who are pushing for a tax on air now will be concerned with the amount of CO2 emissions.

If Al Gore's company starts trading carbon credits to the world do you think dear old Al will want to reduce CO2 emmsions.

Do you think the UN / IPCC will want to fore go 10% of the carbon tax ETS going to them????/

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2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery & prison" Regas Feraeos

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