Australian Politics Forum - Who will win/won debate

matty Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 11055 East Sydney Gender:	Re: Who will win/won debate Reply #90 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 8:41pm Andrei.Hicks wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 8:28pm: longweekend58 wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 8:18pm: suddenly all the laborites have gone.... I guess they realise they lost the debate... finally. Well that's wrong because they didn't. How so? Laurie Oakes and David Speers beg to differ.
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Maqqa

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Re: Who will win/won debate
Reply #91 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 8:45pm

No one expected Abbott to win - they expect Rudd clearly dominate Abbott

They expect a victory tonight would re-invigorate their campaign

When that didn't eventuate - the lefties are left milling around wondering what happened

From Abbott's point of view - he knows he can keep up with Rudd in the personality stakes.

From Rudd's point of view - he might have realised he's not all that. If not the next debate will be see Abbott edge ahead even further

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philperth2010 Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20542 Perth Gender:	Re: Who will win/won debate Reply #92 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 8:47pm I thought Rudd just won a very boring debate but failed to make the impression he was hoping for.....I would like to see the debate about the parties varying policies and how they will affect the nations future.....Without policies there is nothing to debate IMO!!!
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buzzanddidj

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Re: Who will win/won debate
Reply #93 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 8:47pm

Aussie wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 7:32pm:

I noticed when same sex marriage was discussed by Rudd there was a 70% dislike, and yet last years Galaxy Poll on the issue showed there was 65% popular support for the concept.

Cheesy

(I was watching 7, and surfed between that and the ABC.)

Did anyone notice how the CH9 "worm" went on THIS one ?

( ... I'm guessing the opposite ?)

... and given the 9 and 7 "worms" were at EXTREME opposites - at any given moment - I'll stick my neck out and say
BOTH studio audiences were "stacked"

Nine = ALP

Seven = LibNats

( ... is there ANOTHER explanation ?)

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Kat

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Re: Who will win/won debate
Reply #94 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 8:51pm

buzzanddidj wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 8:47pm:

Aussie wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 7:32pm:

I noticed when same sex marriage was discussed by Rudd there was a 70% dislike, and yet last years Galaxy Poll on the issue showed there was 65% popular support for the concept.

Cheesy

(I was watching 7, and surfed between that and the ABC.)

Did anyone notice how the CH9 "worm" went on THIS one ?

( ... I'm guessing the opposite ?)

... and given the 9 and 7 "worms" were at EXTREME opposites - at any given moment - I'll stick my neck out and say
BOTH studio audiences were "stacked"

Nine = ALP

Seven = LibNats

( ... is there ANOTHER explanation ?)

Yes.

Longie brought it to my attention, and I checked.

Almost the exact opposite reaction to that of 7.

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corporate_whitey Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 8896 Archivist	Re: Who will win/won debate Reply #95 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 8:57pm which liberal democrat clone did you think won the dictatorships meaningless debate?
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Sprintcyclist

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Re: Who will win/won debate
Reply #96 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 9:03pm

Armchair_Politician wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 8:26pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 8:08pm:

Aussie wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 8:05pm:

Armchair_Politician wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 7:54pm:

Not only did Rudd not answer the questions put to him in the debate tonight, he was caught out blatantly lying - most notably about the fictional plans of the Coalition to increase the GST despite numerous iron-clad assurances by Abbott that the GST will not and cannot change due to the fact that at least two current state governments are Labor and changes to the GST would require their approval (as well as the approval of all other states/territories).

Rudd also said when calling the election that it was about trust. He's struck out on that front already and tonight tried to say the election is about the economy. Well, he won't win on that point either. Not a single surplus since he won office from Howard in 2007 and the surplus Costello built up has turned into a debt fast approaching $300bn after Labor twice raised the debt ceiling.

Rudd also interjected numerous times despite David Spears practically telling him to shut up. He was not behaving like a statesman tonight - he was behaving like a man desperate to retain his inflated sense of importance and to be able to continue to serve his ego. Rudd clearly lost the debate tonight.

I get what you say, but it seems you did not notice the difference between what Rudd said and what Abbott said. Rudd was a definite , "NO," and stated that it was not even part of any intended review, while Abbott said "NO," but refused to state that it would not be part of a review....thus not ruling it out. He leant hard on the requirement that it could only change if all States agree, but he did not acknowledge that that is not a CONSTITUTIONAL requirement.......is is merely legislative, and Governments can change legislation at a whim.

I think there was a stark difference, and hence the room for speculation on what Abbott's real position is, given Hockey has said it is part of the equation and Bishop today on Bolt blurted out that they would increase taxation.

Abbott has repeatedly said there wil be no GST change and that any such things in the future will be taken to an election.

And this from the party that said unequivocally that there would be no carbon tax!

... and the party that has been promising a surplus but failing to deliver anything but record deficits almost from the dawn of time! Grin

And that's the end of any institutions economic credibility.
To forecast a deficit and get one is ok.
To repeatedly forecast surpluses but miss them is bad.
It ain't rocket science folks.

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Maqqa Gold Member Offline 14% - that low?! Posts: 16000	Re: Who will win/won debate Reply #97 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 9:03pm corporate_whitey wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 8:57pm: which liberal democrat clone did you think won the dictatorships meaningless debate? better than the sh1thead leader of the Greens sitting in the audience
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Re: Who will win/won debate
Reply #98 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 9:14pm

we watched channel 9 and turned it off 20 mins in.

Abbott still didn't give too much away.

Watching the worm, we were completely gob smacked, the worm controller's agreeing with Dudd's bullshyte salesman replies which didn't answer the questions.

Did anyone hear Dudd saying "as the weather gets worse it makes climate change worse". What the?

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matty Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 11055 East Sydney Gender:	Re: Who will win/won debate Reply #99 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 9:15pm Can those saying that Rudd won please give their reasons? I've said why I though that Abbott won.
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De-registered User Gold Member Offline Posts: 1029	Re: Who will win/won debate Reply #100 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 9:20pm Rudd won car salesman of the year! Abbott won most improved speaker of the week. They both lost on answering questions. Makes me think the next debate will be a waste of my time and electricity.
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Armchair_Politician Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 26415 Gender:	Re: Who will win/won debate Reply #101 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 9:21pm De-registered User wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 9:20pm: Rudd won car salesman of the year! Abbott won most improved speaker of the week. ... and in four weeks time the headline you can post will be, "Abbott our new PM following landslide win against Rudd!"
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Re: Who will win/won debate
Reply #102 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 9:22pm

Armchair_Politician wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 9:21pm:

De-registered User wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 9:20pm:

Rudd won car salesman of the year!

Abbott won most improved speaker of the week.

... and in four weeks time the headline you can post will be, "Abbott our new PM following landslide win against Rudd!"

I hope so.

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#

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Re: Who will win/won debate
Reply #103 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 9:36pm

matty wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 9:15pm:

Can those saying that Rudd won please give their reasons? I've said why I though that Abbott won.

Rudd managed to avoid negativity and sloganeering better that Abbott.

Abbott surprisingly failed to neutralise the GST rise thing. As far as I know it's BS, but Rudd made the point that there's no point reviewing anything if you're not going to change it. That sounded convincing and Abbott didn't counter.

Abbott lost on costing. Comprehensively.

Both came over as fakes. Rudd just seemed sightly less so.

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longweekend58

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Re: Who will win/won debate
Reply #104 - Aug 11^th, 2013 at 9:56pm

# wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 9:36pm:

matty wrote on Aug 11^th, 2013 at 9:15pm:

Can those saying that Rudd won please give their reasons? I've said why I though that Abbott won.

Rudd managed to avoid negativity and sloganeering better that Abbott.

Abbott surprisingly failed to neutralise the GST rise thing. As far as I know it's BS, but Rudd made the point that there's no point reviewing anything if you're not going to change it. That sounded convincing and Abbott didn't counter.

Abbott lost on costing. Comprehensively.

Both came over as fakes. Rudd just seemed sightly less so.

the GST is a desperate ploy that Rudd needs to drop. Apart from the fact that it isn't working, if he keeps up with he will start to look like a comprehensive liar. It has already been ruled out but unlike Labor who seem quite happy to make unequivocal promises and then break them, the GST WILL be part of a tax review for the parliament AFTER the next one.

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Poll
Question: Who will win/won tonight's debate
Tony Abbott was the clear winner 11 (57.9%) Kevin castrati rudd thanks to media bias 7 (36.8%) The cut on castratis face 1 (5.3%) Total votes: 19 « Created by: Merlin on: Aug 11^th, 2013 at 11:07am »