Forum

 
  Back to OzPolitic.com   Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register
  Forum Home Album HelpSearch Recent Rules LoginRegister  
 

Pages: 1 2 3 
Send Topic Print
Will Liberal Preference Decision Hurt Greens. (Read 1617 times)
imcrookonit
Ex Member
*



Will Liberal Preference Decision Hurt Greens.
Aug 15th, 2013 at 9:10am
 
Will the Liberals' preference decision hurt the Greens? Don't count on it

Date
    August 14, 2013


Will the Liberals' decision to give preferences to Labor put an end to the Greens' chances of winning seats at this election? Don't count on it.      Smiley

Don't be surprised if Adam Bandt, their only lower house MP, retains his seat of Melbourne. Don't be surprised if they return to the Senate with as many senators as they have now, and possibly more.      Smiley

For if Liberal voters direct preferences as they did in the 2010 state election – the last time the Liberals told their supporters to put Labor ahead of the Greens – Bandt could hold his seat if he can win a swing of just 4.2 per cent from Labor.


And in the Senate, the Greens have won 14 Senate contests since they began, but only one through Coalition preferences – ironically, when former communist Lee Rhiannon won in NSW in 2010.

Why don't Coalition preferences have a bigger impact? Three reasons.

First, there are only two seats where they are likely to be distributed – Melbourne, and the inner Hobart seat of Denison, held by independent Andrew Wilkie.

In 2010 the Greens came close to taking Grayndler from Deputy Prime Minister Anthony Albanese, or Sydney from Health Minister Tanya Plibersek. But the rising Liberal vote in NSW is almost certain to consign the Greens to finish third in both seats this time. Liberal preferences will not be distributed.

Second, inner city voters are independent types. A study by the Victorian Electoral Commission of voting in four inner city and four country seats at the 2006 election found that fewer than 50 per cent of voters followed their party's how to vote card.

Inner city Liberals are even more individualistic. Most of them don't like head office telling them what to do; they make up their own minds. Moreover, one in five votes in Melbourne in 2010 was cast not at a polling booth, but in pre-poll, postal or absentee voting, where voters don't have how-to-vote cards to tell them what to do.

In 2006, only 39 per cent of inner city Liberal voters followed the party ticket in allocating preferences – including just 30 per cent in the state seat of Melbourne. That is why the Greens narrowly lost the seat: 26 per cent of Liberals ignored the party ticket and gave their preferences to Labor.

Even in 2010, when Bandt won the federal seat, 22 per cent of Liberal voters directed preferences to Labor. At the state election, Liberal head office switched sides and directed preferences to Labor. But 35 per cent of Liberal voters in the seats of Melbourne and Richmond ignored the direction, and gave their preferences to the Greens.

You have to assume a similar distribution this time. If so, Labor would win the seat, based on 2010 voting, but with a majority of just 6000 votes, or 4.2 per cent. It's still a marginal seat, and it's quite possible that, with no other Lower House seats it can realistically win, the Greens could focus their resources on Melbourne and make up that margin.

The Greens are more worried about the impact of Liberal preferences favouring Labor in the Senate. Traditionally, the six Senate seats contested in each state split three-all between left and right, so that Labor and the Greens fight out the left's final seat.

You would think that Liberal preferences would have a big impact in that contest. After all, 96 per cent of us vote for the party box in Senate contests, and only 4 per cent of us distribute our own Senate preferences.

Yet history shows Coalition preferences rarely make a difference. Of the 14 Senate seats the Greens have won since 1996, only one was decided by Liberal preferences.

In 2010, for example, the Greens won their Senate seats in Victoria and Tasmania on first preferences, and in Queensland, WA and SA at relatively early stages of the count, when the Coalition was still fighting for its final seat.

To win three seats in any state, the Coalition will need to win 43 per cent of the vote. If it wins 45 per cent, for example – and in a crowded Senate contest, that will be difficult – it would be able to distribute just 2 per cent of votes as preferences.

Past experience suggests they are more likely to end up with a smaller party of the right than with either Labor or the Greens.

The senators we elect on September 7 will replace those elected in 2007, when the Greens won only three seats – in WA, SA and Tasmania. The Greens are polling about the same as in 2007, but Labor's vote is down. Don't be surprised if the Greens win more seats this time, with or without Liberal preferences.      Smiley

Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/federal-politics/federal-election-2013/will-the-liberals-preference-decision-hurt-the-greens-dont-count-on-it-20130814-2rwdp.html#ixzz2bzHtOzTh
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
longweekend58
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 45675
Gender: male
Re: Will Liberal Preference Decision Hurt Greens.
Reply #1 - Aug 15th, 2013 at 9:26am
 
Firstly, it is the Age nespapter which trumpets Labor most of the time.  Secondly, it is a pretty desperate bit of 'analysis' that avoids quite a number of political and statistical realities.

Adam Bandt won his seat last time on Liberal preferences. Without them, he would have lost.  His current primary polling is around 40%.  He is highly unlikely to get any labor preferences and even if he does get 20% of liberal preferences that still only bumps him to around 45% while Labor leap-frogs him to 50+ and a seat in parliament. That is not an optimistic view but rather a very rational one. And it assumes the Green vote hold firm whereas the Green vote has been slipping nationwide and strongly expected to do so even more by polling day.

the complexities of the senate race seem to elude the author as well.  in SA the Green vote is below the 2007 level that elected our local nut-job Green.  She is considered unlikely to win by pretty much every analyst.  the labor vote has collapsed in SA a large amount since 2007 so those much-needed preferences are in short supply.  Similarly in WA, the tide has turned strongly against Labor and the Greens and keeping a senator there will be difficult.

The Age loves to support labor (so what is this I hear from laborites about media bias???) and while it might like to imagine that liberal preferences are meaningless, it is also true that the decision to put Greens last in the Vic state election is credited with giving Libs a surprise win.

So much for having no effect!

The real clue that this writing was an exercise in fanciful imagination was the belief that the Greens would win MORE seats and senators.
Back to top
 

AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
IP Logged
 
____
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 33410
Australia
Gender: male
Re: Will Liberal Preference Decision Hurt Greens.
Reply #2 - Aug 15th, 2013 at 9:38am
 
Will Rusted On Liberals really vote in a Labor Representatives across the country and maybe help elect a majority Labor government !!!

Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
BlOoDy RiPpEr
Gold Member
*****
Offline


aussie-patriot.com

Posts: 2475
Sydney
Gender: male
Re: Will Liberal Preference Decision Hurt Greens.
Reply #3 - Aug 15th, 2013 at 9:57am
 
Well most of the people I know who vote Liberal would rather Labor candidates win over Greens, Its really a no brainer.
Back to top
 

host of the aussie-patriot.com site
WWW  
IP Logged
 
____
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 33410
Australia
Gender: male
Re: Will Liberal Preference Decision Hurt Greens.
Reply #4 - Aug 15th, 2013 at 10:02am
 
BlOoDy RiPpEr wrote on Aug 15th, 2013 at 9:57am:
Well most of the people I know who vote Liberal would rather Labor candidates win over Greens, Its really a no brainer.



I don't doubt it yet I would say the majority of rusted on Liberals would prefer to see Labor fighting on two fronts so strengthening Liberals chances in marginal seats.

All Abbott is doing is freeing up Labor cash and time so to win marginal seats off the coalition and so winning minority government.

Rusted on Liberals can oppose this easy street approach Abbott is giving Labor MPs.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Swagman
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Beware of cheap imitations......

Posts: 15095
Illawarra NSW
Gender: male
Re: Will Liberal Preference Decision Hurt Greens.
Reply #5 - Aug 15th, 2013 at 10:24am
 
____ wrote on Aug 15th, 2013 at 9:38am:
Will Rusted On Liberals really vote in a Labor Representatives across the country and maybe help elect a majority Labor government !!!



As a rusted on Coalition voter I always preference Labor before the Greens.

Lesser of two veevils  Cheesy
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
cods
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 88048
Re: Will Liberal Preference Decision Hurt Greens.
Reply #6 - Aug 15th, 2013 at 10:36am
 
I will be totally honest I am over those who only get in via preferences  who then think they are GOD and vote with which ever party suits them.. and not via the wishes of those that g\ave them their primary vote......looking at what we have had over the past 3 years... it isnt right...not in my book anyway..its madness to give someone who is a second choice at best all that POWER.

what can be done about that I dont know...

yes I do.. withing 12 months of a hung parliament.. we should go to the polls again..maybe that will keep them from looking after their own backs first..
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
cods
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 88048
Re: Will Liberal Preference Decision Hurt Greens.
Reply #7 - Aug 15th, 2013 at 10:41am
 
Swagman wrote on Aug 15th, 2013 at 10:24am:
____ wrote on Aug 15th, 2013 at 9:38am:
Will Rusted On Liberals really vote in a Labor Representatives across the country and maybe help elect a majority Labor government !!!



As a rusted on Coalition voter I always preference Labor before the Greens.

Lesser of two veevils  Cheesy




well lets be honest nothing wrong with rusted on or loyalty to a party....but I do think those that are should take their heads out of the sand once in a while and look at the big picture..

I am over the excuses..for bad management and the waste..there are no excuses... if you cant do the job.. bugger off...thats what I say.. and that goes for all sides..when someone does a sh!t job like swan he should never have been left to get this country into so much debt for 6 years....it was a farce.... and we all know it.. if he was in charge of say RioTinto he wouldnt have lasted 12 months..so why was he allowed to carry on like he was ab ove creating this enormous debt..???... he claimed he created 1.6million jobs.. but no one knows where or how...

we are over being told something and TRUSTING them with the truth..too many lies too many broken promises.. from everyone.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Andrei.Hicks
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 23818
Carlsbad, CA
Gender: male
Re: Will Liberal Preference Decision Hurt Greens.
Reply #8 - Aug 15th, 2013 at 10:44am
 
Yes absolutely it will.

When my wife and I went in to vote the last time in Higgins, we followed the How to Vote card from the Liberal candidate (Peter Costello) as did most others in the suburb.

If you multiply that by the amount of times, absolutely the Greens will be hurt by this decision.

It makes sense too - whilst I have voted Coalition in the past, I find an ALP Government ever more preferable than the Greens.

The Greens would raise my taxes hugely, remove all my benefits (at least Labor kept some), increase petrol tax hugely, bring in social policies not in keeping with my views (Labor has been more amiable to the middle ground)

The ALP is infinitely more friendly to my middle class demographic than the Greens will ever be.
Back to top
 

Anyone who lives within their means suffers from a lack of imagination - Oscar Wilde
 
IP Logged
 
buzzanddidj
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 14215
Eganstown, via Daylesford, VIC
Gender: male
Re: Will Liberal Preference Decision Hurt Greens.
Reply #9 - Aug 15th, 2013 at 11:40am
 
They're a pretty "feisty" lot in the electorate of Melbourne


( ... where else would you see a local councillor (Stephen Jolly) constantly re-elected under a blazing
Socialist Party
banner
- and home to Australia's first
Greens
council
-Yarra ?)




buzzanddidj wrote on Aug 8th, 2013 at 1:41pm:
It may not be preferences at ALL, that determines the outcome




Fears park to go for Melbourne link road

July 21, 2013


Angry inner Melbourne residents fear precious parkland will be turned into a freeway overpass as part of Melbourne's East West Link road project.


Ross Straw Field on the edge of Royal Park is home to a baseball club, soccer and cricket clubs, but will become an LA-style road flyover when the East West Link is built, the Greens say.

On Sunday about 150 local residents gathered at the field to protest against the road.

Protesters held up signs saying "No road tunnel" and "trains not tolls".

Speakers said the parkland was vital to sporting clubs and an important part of Melbourne's much loved Royal Park.

Member for Melbourne Adam Bandt said the parkland would potentially become a rats nest of on and off ramps.


"We are going to lose huge chunks of Royal Park. This baseball diamond where we are at the moment is going to go and it's going to become LA-style flyovers going right past people's houses," he told reporters.

Mr Bandt said people who where due to move into an apartment complex across the road from the park in the next few months will now have a flyover 50m from their windows.

"We are going to make sure that this area of inner Melbourne remains the green lungs of the city and that there are parklands where all the people that live here can bring their kids to play," he said.

http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/2013/07/21/14/13/fears-park-to-go-for-melb-l...




Tony Abbott has promised funding

Kevin Rudd has declined


The proposed EastWest project runs right through the centre of the electorate ( ... including on and off ramps)

A compulsory acquisition order will be made on several hundred homes and businesses - but details are being kept under wraps till after the Federal Election, by
Premier Napthine


It was THIS ...


Quote:
Urban jazz hits a sour note

June 15 2002

The ink on the publicity puff for Fitzroy's latest building proposal was hardly dry when the grass-roots movement against it began to stir. In an early Victorian cottage in a narrow street in the heart of Fitzroy, Geoff Barbour's phone was ringing. What happened next is something of a parable of the times, illustrating the political momentum and power that communities can generate when they perceive a threat in their back yard.

Angry residents told Barbour they had heard that the proposal involved an eight-storey, futuristic-looking castle with 126 apartments. They had heard the designer had described the proposed complex as "urban jazz". More strangely, the development was called something like "nkya".

As president of the Fitzroy Residents Association, Barbour was one of the first contacts for locals concerned that their quiet neighbourhood was about to be transformed into what they feared would be "visual cacophony".

Residents soon discovered that a planning application had been lodged with the City of Yarra for a $70 million development that was very edgy in design, very large and included shops, licensed premises, office space and car parks - all in a heritage overlay area.

Within 48 hours, more than 100 locals from near the site bound by Napier, Kerr, Argyle and Young Streets had held a public meeting and formed a working party. People with experience in town planning, design, law, websites and writing stepped forward to develop the weapons of urban conflict.

(Architect) Ivan Rijavec says that while the nyka issue was being portrayed as a battle by the local media, he had contacted the opponents and suggested getting together to discuss the project. "Unfortunately the system that is in place is one that automatically ambles towards that sort of . . . adversarial, confronting situation."


He has received some "pretty interesting e-mails" and the website address at the site, urbanjazz.com.au, had at one stage been
mysteriously blanked out
and replaced with urbanjoke.com.


( ... a small part of my contribution - on a step-ladder - at 1 am)




More ...

http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2002/06/14/1023864346813.html



... that STARTED the surge of Greens support in the electorate of Melbourne













I doubt they'll take too kindly to Tony Abbott doing all he can to see this very active in the local community representative is not returned




Back to top
 

'I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians.
Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.'


- Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi
 
IP Logged
 
Andrei.Hicks
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 23818
Carlsbad, CA
Gender: male
Re: Will Liberal Preference Decision Hurt Greens.
Reply #10 - Aug 15th, 2013 at 11:48am
 
Inner Melbourne is home to society's peripherals.

Tree huggers, homosexuals, high Asian population.

Not exactly what you'd label 2 cars, 2 children everyday Australia.


Who knows how these oddballs vote??
Back to top
 

Anyone who lives within their means suffers from a lack of imagination - Oscar Wilde
 
IP Logged
 
longweekend58
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 45675
Gender: male
Re: Will Liberal Preference Decision Hurt Greens.
Reply #11 - Aug 15th, 2013 at 12:55pm
 
____ wrote on Aug 15th, 2013 at 9:38am:
Will Rusted On Liberals really vote in a Labor Representatives across the country and maybe help elect a majority Labor government !!!



if you had half a brain you would know that liberal preferences are only distributed in seats they already CANT WIN.  So the libs are in effect choosing labor over greens in seats that will not be theirs anyhow.  Given that Greens support Labor to form govt 100% of the time, it makes zero difference to the Libs one way or the other.
Back to top
 

AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
IP Logged
 
PZ547
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 9282
Gender: male
Re: Will Liberal Preference Decision Hurt Greens.
Reply #12 - Aug 15th, 2013 at 1:37pm
 
.
Libs and Labor and their overseas owners know the Aussie public has had a gutful of both fake parties


They know Mr. and Ms. Australia are seriously considering ditching Labor and Libs


There's FEAR in those overseas controllers of this country


They FEAR the alternative parties, the most known and dangerous being the Greens


You've seen all this before.  Go on, wake up your memory

You saw both parties gang up on virtually ALL viable female politicians

You saw both parties gang up on Pauline

Now they're both ganging up on the Greens


Any sane individual would vote for a party with ethics and genuine concern for voters and this country

There are several good alternative parties, but the whore media is burying them to stop you hearing about or considering them

The Greens are a danger, so it's been decided to kill the Greens.  Simple as that


That way, you'll be stuck with the two fake prostitute parties who're owned by offshore thugs


Fight back.  Don't buy Abbott's bullshit.  It was all scripted for him by his overseas owners in any case

And if Rudd makes the same pronouncement, ignore him too.  Because he has the same overseas owners as Abbott


This nation is not going to improve until we get some decent alternative political options

and that won't happen if we allow up and comers to be killed off by the two bullies

Labour and Libs are the political version of Woolies and Coles

Time to support the independents

It will work for you in the long term because it will make the two big fake parties work harder for YOU

Back to top
 

All my comments, posts & opinions are to be regarded as satire & humour
 
IP Logged
 
longweekend58
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 45675
Gender: male
Re: Will Liberal Preference Decision Hurt Greens.
Reply #13 - Aug 15th, 2013 at 4:47pm
 
PZ547 wrote on Aug 15th, 2013 at 1:37pm:
.
Libs and Labor and their overseas owners know the Aussie public has had a gutful of both fake parties


They know Mr. and Ms. Australia are seriously considering ditching Labor and Libs


There's FEAR in those overseas controllers of this country


They FEAR the alternative parties, the most known and dangerous being the Greens


You've seen all this before.  Go on, wake up your memory

You saw both parties gang up on virtually ALL viable female politicians

You saw both parties gang up on Pauline

Now they're both ganging up on the Greens


Any sane individual would vote for a party with ethics and genuine concern for voters and this country

There are several good alternative parties, but the whore media is burying them to stop you hearing about or considering them

The Greens are a danger, so it's been decided to kill the Greens.  Simple as that


That way, you'll be stuck with the two fake prostitute parties who're owned by offshore thugs


Fight back.  Don't buy Abbott's bullshit.  It was all scripted for him by his overseas owners in any case

And if Rudd makes the same pronouncement, ignore him too.  Because he has the same overseas owners as Abbott


This nation is not going to improve until we get some decent alternative political options

and that won't happen if we allow up and comers to be killed off by the two bullies

Labour and Libs are the political version of Woolies and Coles

Time to support the independents

It will work for you in the long term because it will make the two big fake parties work harder for YOU



what a load of crap.  its like saying labor and libs are 'ganging up' on family first because they don't get their second preferences.

drongo
Back to top
 

AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
IP Logged
 
buzzanddidj
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 14215
Eganstown, via Daylesford, VIC
Gender: male
Re: Will Liberal Preference Decision Hurt Greens.
Reply #14 - Aug 15th, 2013 at 5:14pm
 
Andrei.Hicks wrote on Aug 15th, 2013 at 11:48am:
Inner Melbourne is home to society's peripherals.

Environmentalists, homosexuals, high Asian population.


Who knows how these oddballs vote??


( ... not that I carry any prejudice)




Greens - quite OFTEN




Back to top
 

'I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians.
Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.'


- Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi
 
IP Logged
 
Pages: 1 2 3 
Send Topic Print