Australian Politics Forum - Abbott's Solution to Climate Change

FriYAY

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Re: Abbott's Solution to Climate Change
Reply #30 - Aug 30^th, 2013 at 12:12pm

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Aug 29^th, 2013 at 4:38pm:

FriYAY wrote on Aug 29^th, 2013 at 10:34am:

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Aug 28^th, 2013 at 7:46pm:

Did I hear right? Abbott's solution in the debate to tackle climate change is to set up a 15,000 strong "Green Army" to work on weekends to pick up litter and clear rubbish from creeks and rivers so we can "restore the natural beauty of this great country of ours" (or words to that effect). Is he serious? That's what Australia's contribution will be to addressing this world disaster that is climate change. A clean up Australia day? .

Considering Australia could cease all emissions tomorrow and it wouldn’t make I iota of difference to world wide emissions – what to you suggest should/can be done?

First, it is simply not correct to say that if Australia "ceased all emissions tomorrow it wouldn’t make I iota [sic] of difference to world wide emissions"

Prove it - prove it is not correct.... Roll Eyes

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longweekend58

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Re: Abbott's Solution to Climate Change
Reply #31 - Aug 30^th, 2013 at 12:13pm

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Aug 29^th, 2013 at 8:13pm:

Perceptions_now. It would really help if you could be clearer about what your trying to say. Just take a moment to organise your thoughts and then and only then commit to paper. I'm just saying.

Prozac_now is always like this. same message, same opaqueness and illogical thinking.

He is not known as pinhead for nothing.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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FriYAY

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Re: Abbott's Solution to Climate Change
Reply #32 - Aug 30^th, 2013 at 12:14pm

perceptions_now wrote on Aug 29^th, 2013 at 5:35pm:

FriYAY wrote on Aug 29^th, 2013 at 10:34am:

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Aug 28^th, 2013 at 7:46pm:

Did I hear right? Abbott's solution in the debate to tackle climate change is to set up a 15,000 strong "Green Army" to work on weekends to pick up litter and clear rubbish from creeks and rivers so we can "restore the natural beauty of this great country of ours" (or words to that effect). Is he serious? That's what Australia's contribution will be to addressing this world disaster that is climate change. A clean up Australia day? .

Considering Australia could cease all emissions tomorrow and it wouldn’t make I iota of difference to world wide emissions – what to you suggest should/can be done?

Well, it is POSSIBLE that OZ could cease all emissions tomorrow? But, on a scale of
1 - Being, we absolutely will cease tomorrow &
1 Trillion (or 1,000,000,000,000) - Being, we absolutely won't cease tomorrow

Then, I would suggest that our likely chances of ceasing tomorrow would probably rate around 999,999,999,999.

I would also suggest that it is incorrect to say that OZ ceasing all emissions won't make 1 iota of difference, BUT I would certainly say that, ON OUR OWN, AUSTRALIA WOULDN'T/WON'T STOP CLIMATE CHANGE or have any substantial effect!

Finally, I would suggest, the real question that needs to be asked is -
IF AUSTRALIA & THE REST OF THE WORLD DOESN'T ACT ON CLIMATE CHANGE, DON'T ACT SOON & DON'T THROW EVERYTHING AT THE PROBLEM, THEN WHAT WILL BE THE LIKELY EFFECTS, IN OUR LATER YEARS & ON FOLLOWING GENERATIONS?

Regrettably, I have an idea of what the likelihood is of Local & Global action & what will flow from that & the answer is not one which you & many others want to hear!

Nice highlights.

But my assertion is still correct.

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Dnarever Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 59253 Here Gender:	Re: Abbott's Solution to Climate Change Reply #33 - Aug 30^th, 2013 at 12:14pm Abbott's Solution to Climate Change Abbotts only problem with climate change is political in nature, the number of votes gained by pretending to do something.
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FriYAY

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Re: Abbott's Solution to Climate Change
Reply #34 - Aug 30^th, 2013 at 12:15pm

freediver wrote on Aug 29^th, 2013 at 8:40pm:

FriYAY wrote on Aug 29^th, 2013 at 10:34am:

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Aug 28^th, 2013 at 7:46pm:

Did I hear right? Abbott's solution in the debate to tackle climate change is to set up a 15,000 strong "Green Army" to work on weekends to pick up litter and clear rubbish from creeks and rivers so we can "restore the natural beauty of this great country of ours" (or words to that effect). Is he serious? That's what Australia's contribution will be to addressing this world disaster that is climate change. A clean up Australia day? .

Considering Australia could cease all emissions tomorrow and it wouldn’t make I iota of difference to world wide emissions – what to you suggest should/can be done?

That is not true.

Yes it is, prove me wrong.

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FriYAY

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Re: Abbott's Solution to Climate Change
Reply #35 - Aug 30^th, 2013 at 12:19pm

Kat wrote on Aug 29^th, 2013 at 9:01pm:

FriYAY wrote on Aug 29^th, 2013 at 10:53am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Aug 29^th, 2013 at 9:44am:

True Blue... wrote on Aug 29^th, 2013 at 7:39am:

they are the ones who don't incessantly complain non stop about getting "their" money (welfare) and spending it on what ever they want...

So you think other people should decide what they spend their money on?

What's the rationale behind that?

To try and stop people spending “welfare” on illicit drugs for starters. Or do you think welfare should be used to break the law?

Welfare recipients should be helped to restrict their spending on alcohol, cigarettes and tattoos as well.

And gambling.

And facial piercings.

We should also help fat welfare recipients.

None of these are necessities; they are selfish indulgences for people receiving welfare, usually to the detriment of families.

They can (and should) spend it on whatever they wish.

It's not, nor should it be, up to you, me or the Govt.

If they spend it on something 'illegal', or neglect their kids, that's the Law's business, just as it is if you or I do so.

Again, it's not yours.

Or mine.

Of course they shouldn't spend welfare breaking the law!

Of course it is up to the government.

So you'd rather see kids being abused and mistreated, just so some arsehole can spend their welfare on drugs and alcohol - fantastic.

Sad

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rabbitoh07

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Re: Abbott's Solution to Climate Change
Reply #36 - Aug 30^th, 2013 at 12:44pm

FriYAY wrote on Aug 30^th, 2013 at 12:15pm:

freediver wrote on Aug 29^th, 2013 at 8:40pm:

FriYAY wrote on Aug 29^th, 2013 at 10:34am:

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Aug 28^th, 2013 at 7:46pm:

Did I hear right? Abbott's solution in the debate to tackle climate change is to set up a 15,000 strong "Green Army" to work on weekends to pick up litter and clear rubbish from creeks and rivers so we can "restore the natural beauty of this great country of ours" (or words to that effect). Is he serious? That's what Australia's contribution will be to addressing this world disaster that is climate change. A clean up Australia day? .

Considering Australia could cease all emissions tomorrow and it wouldn’t make I iota of difference to world wide emissions – what to you suggest should/can be done?

That is not true.

Yes it is, prove me wrong.

Australia emits 1.45% of total world emissions
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_carbon_dioxide_emissions
If Australia could cease all emissions tomorrow and it would make 1.45%a of difference to world wide emissions.

1.45% > 1 iota

You are proven wrong.

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longweekend58

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Re: Abbott's Solution to Climate Change
Reply #37 - Aug 30^th, 2013 at 1:05pm

rabbitoh07 wrote on Aug 30^th, 2013 at 12:44pm:

FriYAY wrote on Aug 30^th, 2013 at 12:15pm:

freediver wrote on Aug 29^th, 2013 at 8:40pm:

FriYAY wrote on Aug 29^th, 2013 at 10:34am:

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Aug 28^th, 2013 at 7:46pm:

Did I hear right? Abbott's solution in the debate to tackle climate change is to set up a 15,000 strong "Green Army" to work on weekends to pick up litter and clear rubbish from creeks and rivers so we can "restore the natural beauty of this great country of ours" (or words to that effect). Is he serious? That's what Australia's contribution will be to addressing this world disaster that is climate change. A clean up Australia day? .

Considering Australia could cease all emissions tomorrow and it wouldn’t make I iota of difference to world wide emissions – what to you suggest should/can be done?

That is not true.

Yes it is, prove me wrong.

Australia emits 1.45% of total world emissions
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_carbon_dioxide_emissions
If Australia could cease all emissions tomorrow and it would make 1.45%a of difference to world wide emissions.

1.45% > 1 iota

You are proven wrong.

I believe the point is that with global emissions rising by several percent each year the value of our 1.45% drop would be eliminated in a matter of months at best. since 'not one iota' is a literary term and not a mathematical one, his point was quite valid.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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Swagman Gold Member Offline Beware of cheap imitations...... Posts: 15095 Illawarra NSW Gender:	Re: Abbott's Solution to Climate Change Reply #38 - Aug 30^th, 2013 at 1:39pm In the system of Greek numerals iota has a value of 10. 1.45 is therefore not 1 iota...
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perceptions_now

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Re: Abbott's Solution to Climate Change
Reply #39 - Aug 30^th, 2013 at 2:53pm

FriYAY wrote on Aug 30^th, 2013 at 12:14pm:

perceptions_now wrote on Aug 29^th, 2013 at 5:35pm:

FriYAY wrote on Aug 29^th, 2013 at 10:34am:

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Aug 28^th, 2013 at 7:46pm:

Did I hear right? Abbott's solution in the debate to tackle climate change is to set up a 15,000 strong "Green Army" to work on weekends to pick up litter and clear rubbish from creeks and rivers so we can "restore the natural beauty of this great country of ours" (or words to that effect). Is he serious? That's what Australia's contribution will be to addressing this world disaster that is climate change. A clean up Australia day? .

Considering Australia could cease all emissions tomorrow and it wouldn’t make I iota of difference to world wide emissions – what to you suggest should/can be done?

Well, it is POSSIBLE that OZ could cease all emissions tomorrow? But, on a scale of
1 - Being, we absolutely will cease tomorrow &
1 Trillion (or 1,000,000,000,000) - Being, we absolutely won't cease tomorrow

Then, I would suggest that our likely chances of ceasing tomorrow would probably rate around 999,999,999,999.

I would also suggest that it is incorrect to say that OZ ceasing all emissions won't make 1 iota of difference, BUT I would certainly say that, ON OUR OWN, AUSTRALIA WOULDN'T/WON'T STOP CLIMATE CHANGE or have any substantial effect!

Finally, I would suggest, the real question that needs to be asked is -
IF AUSTRALIA & THE REST OF THE WORLD DOESN'T ACT ON CLIMATE CHANGE, DON'T ACT SOON & DON'T THROW EVERYTHING AT THE PROBLEM, THEN WHAT WILL BE THE LIKELY EFFECTS, IN OUR LATER YEARS & ON FOLLOWING GENERATIONS?

Regrettably, I have an idea of what the likelihood is of Local & Global action & what will flow from that & the answer is not one which you & many others want to hear!

Nice highlights.

But my assertion is still correct.

Why, thank you!

That said, which assertion is correct?
1) That Australia could cease all emissions tomorrow?
Well, yes it could, BUT it is EXTREMELY UNLIKELY!

In fact, it is so unlikely that for "all intents & purposes", YOUR ASSERTION IS NOT CORRECT!

2) If OZ did cease all emissions tomorrow, it wouldn’t make I iota of difference to world wide emissions?

WHILST THAT STATEMENT MAY BE TECHNICALLY INCORRECT, it would make no substantive difference, in an overall, Global context, as I have previously agreed.

However, whether your assertions are correct or incorrect, is not really answering the big questions.
I would suggest, the real question that needs to be asked is -
IF AUSTRALIA & THE REST OF THE WORLD DOESN'T ACT ON CLIMATE CHANGE, DON'T ACT SOON & DON'T THROW EVERYTHING AT THE PROBLEM, THEN WHAT WILL BE THE LIKELY EFFECTS, IN OUR LATER YEARS & ON FOLLOWING GENERATIONS?

Regrettably, I have an idea of what the likelihood is of Local & Global action & what will flow from that & the answer is not one which you & many others want to hear!

The truth is that in our later years & in future generations, WE WILL ALL PAY DEARLY, IF CONCERTED ACTIONS ARE NOT TAKEN IMMEDIATELY & GLOBALLY!

And, I would suggest, the answer to that conundrum is that Global action/s, will come far too late, if they come at all!

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ImSpartacus2

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Re: Abbott's Solution to Climate Change
Reply #40 - Aug 30^th, 2013 at 4:14pm

FriYAY,

Sorry to say but you (and longweekend) clearly have a problem with logic (what longweekend, delayed by a few months is not a difference???), as rabbitoh07 has so amply shown and so yes "you are proven wrong". Secondly, as a matter of logic it was you who made the absurd assertion and so it is for you to prove not for me to disprove (God exists, now prove he doesn't - dumb argument - logic 101). So go on get started!!!

But I tell you want. I'll let you off the hook since the main point I was making was that no matter how big or small our contribution to the Global Warming Problem has been (and I believe its very significant since, amongst other things, we have made a very comfortable living exporting coal for many decades) we should not expect the rest of the world to carry us now that the sh!t has hit the fan. I mean, really, that's what a bludger does, truth be told. They're there for the good times but look the other way when its time to pull together and fix our mess. But look, I don't want you to go away from this thinking "man, this whole problem is too big, we can't possibly fix it so lets just carry on business as usual until extinction comes". That's just lazy. The qualified scientists are telling us we still have time to significantly mitigate the extent of global warming, so that's what we should do right; rather then just lay down and die.

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ImSpartacus2 Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 6913	Re: Abbott's Solution to Climate Change Reply #41 - Aug 30^th, 2013 at 4:25pm Repeat Post, sorry
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salad in

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Re: Abbott's Solution to Climate Change
Reply #42 - Aug 30^th, 2013 at 5:10pm

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Aug 29^th, 2013 at 4:47pm:

Hey SI, that's OK, I didn't expect you to have the courage to honestly answer the question.

OK I'll answer your questions. No, I don't believe a man of average weight can walk on water. No, I don't believe a man can be born if his mother is a virgin. No, you can't feed a multitude of people with a handful of loaves of bread and a few fish.

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The ALP, the progressive party, the party of ideas, the workers' friend, is the only Australian political party to roast four young Australians in roof cavities. SHAME! SHAME! SHAME!

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rabbitoh07

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Re: Abbott's Solution to Climate Change
Reply #43 - Aug 30^th, 2013 at 5:24pm

salad in wrote on Aug 30^th, 2013 at 5:10pm:

[quote author=ImSpartacus2 link=1377683186/16#16 date=1377758864]

Hey SI, that's OK, I didn't expect you to have the courage to honestly answer the question.

salad in wrote on Aug 30^th, 2013 at 5:10pm:

OK I'll answer your questions. No, I don't believe a man of average weight can walk on water.

He could if he had extrordinarily large feet

salad in wrote on Aug 30^th, 2013 at 5:10pm:

No, I don't believe a man can be born if his mother is a virgin.

Have you not heard of IVF?

salad in wrote on Aug 30^th, 2013 at 5:10pm:

No, you can't feed a multitude of people with a handful of loaves of bread and a few fish.

You could if the fish were whale sharks

It appears that everything you believe is wrong.

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Dnarever

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Re: Abbott's Solution to Climate Change
Reply #44 - Aug 30^th, 2013 at 5:33pm

longweekend58 wrote on Aug 30^th, 2013 at 1:05pm:

rabbitoh07 wrote on Aug 30^th, 2013 at 12:44pm:

FriYAY wrote on Aug 30^th, 2013 at 12:15pm:

freediver wrote on Aug 29^th, 2013 at 8:40pm:

FriYAY wrote on Aug 29^th, 2013 at 10:34am:

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Aug 28^th, 2013 at 7:46pm:

Did I hear right? Abbott's solution in the debate to tackle climate change is to set up a 15,000 strong "Green Army" to work on weekends to pick up litter and clear rubbish from creeks and rivers so we can "restore the natural beauty of this great country of ours" (or words to that effect). Is he serious? That's what Australia's contribution will be to addressing this world disaster that is climate change. A clean up Australia day? .

Considering Australia could cease all emissions tomorrow and it wouldn’t make I iota of difference to world wide emissions – what to you suggest should/can be done?

That is not true.

Yes it is, prove me wrong.

Australia emits 1.45% of total world emissions
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_carbon_dioxide_emissions
If Australia could cease all emissions tomorrow and it would make 1.45%a of difference to world wide emissions.

1.45% > 1 iota

You are proven wrong.

I believe the point is that with global emissions rising by several percent each year the value of our 1.45% drop would be eliminated in a matter of months at best. since 'not one iota' is a literary term and not a mathematical one, his point was quite valid.

With about 200 countries in the world 1.5% constitutes about 3 X above our share of emissions.

Here is where your argument ultimately leads:

With 200 countries on average producing 0.5% of carbon emissions each the number is so small that everyone is irrelevant and nobody reducing emissions can fix the problem so we are better off to just keep exponentially increasing our output because nobody's individual input has an impact at all ????

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