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a guide to AGW for the layman (Read 2805 times)
Ajax
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a guide to AGW for the layman
Aug 29th, 2013 at 12:06pm
 
An excellent guide for the layman on antropogenic global warming.

Catastrophe denied
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1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery &  prison" Regas Feraeos
 
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muso
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Re: a guide to AGW for the layman
Reply #1 - Aug 29th, 2013 at 2:27pm
 
Is it my imagination, or is the second "PDO warm" warmer that the first?

I've seen a better guide, but at least it seems to demonstrate a warming trend.

Why do you always quote the Hadcrut 3 dataset? Is it because it's least representative of the polar regions where a great deal of warming has occurred.
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Ajax
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Re: a guide to AGW for the layman
Reply #2 - Aug 29th, 2013 at 6:09pm
 
muso wrote on Aug 29th, 2013 at 2:27pm:
Is it my imagination, or is the second "PDO warm" warmer that the first?

I've seen a better guide, but at least it seems to demonstrate a warming trend.

Why do you always quote the Hadcrut 3 dataset? Is it because it's least representative of the polar regions where a great deal of warming has occurred.


Is that all your worried about that it shows a warming trend.

As long as its shows a warming trend your not too fussed..??

Why does it bother you that I show the hadcrut 3, ok i'll attempt to get others.

Do you think it will kill my argument..??????
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1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery &  prison" Regas Feraeos
 
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muso
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Re: a guide to AGW for the layman
Reply #3 - Aug 30th, 2013 at 7:15am
 
What argument?
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#
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Re: a guide to AGW for the layman
Reply #4 - Aug 30th, 2013 at 8:29am
 
For those genuinely trying to understand the issues, this might help:

There's a lot more at: http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL92EE5DBE2987982F.

Ajax: pay particular attention to what he says about confirmation bias.
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Ajax
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Re: a guide to AGW for the layman
Reply #5 - Aug 30th, 2013 at 9:12am
 
# wrote on Aug 30th, 2013 at 8:29am:
For those genuinely trying to understand the issues, this might help:

There's a lot more at: http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL92EE5DBE2987982F.

Ajax: pay particular attention to what he says about confirmation bias.


AGW is a scam based on the a lie.

It started of as global cooling then it changed to global warming, then it changed to climate change then it changed to green energy, what will it morph into next...???

In a nut shell,


Quote:
IPCC & Computer Circulation models tell us,


1. The hot spot in the tropopause will create a runaway greenhouse effect.

2. Sea levels are rising uncontrollably

3. Glaciers & the Nth Pole are melting.

4. All manner of catastrophes will come from the Earth heating up a little, including more powerful cyclones, tornadoes, more mosquitos to spread disease, shell fish are doomed, all species are doomed etc etc.

5. CO2 is the sole reason why we have had warming in the last 100 years, mainly because of mans CO2 emssions.

It creates a hotspot in the tropopause which attracts more water & then more CO2 & then more water vapour etc etc  until it uncontrollably creates a runaway greenhouse effect and destroys us all.

6.  The science is settled.


Quote:
Real world observations tell us


1. This hot spot cannot be detected in the tropopause thousands of weather balloons and satellite data confirm this.

2. Sea levels are rising but at a rate of about 2mm/year, which is nothing to be alarmed about, since we are coming out of a mini ice age its only natural that the Earth would heat up.

3. Glaciers & the arctic have been melting for the last 260 years that didn't just start melting from 1950 when mans CO2 emissions started to increase.

4. All part of the Earth's natural weather cycle, climate change is real its been happening since the Earth formed into a molten lava or rock and climate change will continue to the earth is no more.

Today at the present time we have some of the coolest temperatures the Earth has ever had and we have some of the lowest amounts of CO2 in our atmosphere, only one other time has CO2 concentrations in our atmosphere been so low.

5. CO2 concentrations follows temperature by a lag of about 800 years, temperature doesn't follow CO2 concentrations.

There is absolutely no correlation between CO2 and temperature, just look at the values from our history.

CO2 cannot cause a runaway greenhouse effect, otherwise it would have already done so when there was 20 times more CO2 in our atmosphere.

6.  We have scientists who get payed to find global warming and we have scientists who just study global warming without any remuneration.

There are just as many prominent scientists opposing AGW as there are preaching it, of course  the AGW religion will not acknowledge them or even debate them.

They prefer character assassination and calling for these independent scientists to be considered terrorist.

Seriously when you think about climate gate, the IPCC which is a political body with junk science most of it being based on computer circulation models instead of real world observations.

If indeed it was such a real threat then why place the fate of all humanity into the hands of wall street and the stock exchange.

Bankers are writing the laws of how carbon credits will be traded and this market is up and running its expected to be a $2 trillion dollar per annum market.

The United nations and the IPCC stand to make a lot of money from the various carbon taxes and ETS schemes around the world because of their junk science and policies.

You don't have to be a rocket scientist to know that Anthropogenic Global Warming is the biggest scam ever presented to humanity.
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« Last Edit: Aug 30th, 2013 at 9:23am by Ajax »  

1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery &  prison" Regas Feraeos
 
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#
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Re: a guide to AGW for the layman
Reply #6 - Aug 30th, 2013 at 9:17am
 
Ajax wrote on Aug 30th, 2013 at 9:12am:
...
AGW is a scam based on the a lie.
...
[followed by a bunch of unsubstantiated quotes]

And your (substantiated) qualifications for that assertion are??
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Ajax
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Re: a guide to AGW for the layman
Reply #7 - Aug 30th, 2013 at 9:20am
 
# wrote on Aug 30th, 2013 at 9:17am:
Ajax wrote on Aug 30th, 2013 at 9:12am:
...
AGW is a scam based on the a lie.
...
[followed by a bunch of unsubstantiated quotes]

And your (substantiated) qualifications for that assertion are??


Like i keep telling you...!!!

You don't have to be rocket scientist to understand AGW.

More people should research both sides of the argument.

I'm all for it.


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1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery &  prison" Regas Feraeos
 
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#
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Re: a guide to AGW for the layman
Reply #8 - Aug 30th, 2013 at 9:33am
 
Ajax wrote on Aug 30th, 2013 at 9:20am:
# wrote on Aug 30th, 2013 at 9:17am:
Ajax wrote on Aug 30th, 2013 at 9:12am:
...
AGW is a scam based on the a lie.
...
[followed by a bunch of unsubstantiated quotes]

And your (substantiated) qualifications for that assertion are??

...
You don't have to be rocket scientist to understand AGW.
...

No qualifications then.

My first recollection of the global warming debate is from the 1950s - a black and white TV show. I became really interested in the 1970s.

A Confucian aphorism translates roughly:
The more a wise man learns;
The more he comes to appreciate;
How much he does not know.

That presupposes two things; learning and wisdom.

I've learned enough to realise that I don't know enough. Any reasonably adept mind will recognise the complexity of climate science. Any reasonably healthy ego will accept that understanding such complexity takes more ability than most of us have and more time & effort than most of us have to spare.

Accepting that I can't credibly judge the science, I came to judging the scientists. By all credible reports, there's substantial agreement among the best qualified scientists. I don't pretend to know better.
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« Last Edit: Aug 30th, 2013 at 9:58am by # »  
 
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#
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Re: a guide to AGW for the layman
Reply #9 - Aug 30th, 2013 at 9:57am
 
# wrote on Aug 30th, 2013 at 9:33am:
...
My first recollection of the global warming debate is from the 1950s - a black and white TV show. ...

This is in colour, but it's something like what I remember seeing in the '50s. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qvc5N7XCPPs Note the date.

Al Gore didn't invent the inconvenient truth.
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Ajax
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Re: a guide to AGW for the layman
Reply #10 - Aug 30th, 2013 at 10:15am
 
# wrote on Aug 30th, 2013 at 9:33am:
No qualifications then.

My first recollection of the global warming debate is from the 1950s - a black and white TV show. I became really interested in the 1970s.

A Confucian aphorism translates roughly:
The more a wise man learns;
The more he comes to appreciate;
How much he does not know.

That presupposes two things; learning and wisdom.

I've learned enough to realise that I don't know enough. Any reasonably adept mind will recognise the complexity of climate science. Any reasonably healthy ego will accept that understanding such complexity takes more ability than most of us have and more time & effort than most of us have to spare.

Accepting that I can't credibly judge the science, I came to judging the scientists. By all credible reports, there's substantial agreement among the best qualified scientists. I don't pretend to know better.


Did i ever say that i was some kind of expert on AGW..??

I'm just a layman trying to make sense of it all.....!

There is one thing i do know though and that is...

All scientific hypothesis are there to be torn down if its possible.

Now that's what science is all about.

There you go boys here's my hypothesis, hung out line dogs balls, dissect it take it apart find what you can about it.

That's science...today we still have people trying to prove Newton and Einstein wrong...the science is there to be taken apart.

The AGW religion are so possessive of their science changing it or updating it every five years or so.

How can the science be settled if it gets revised every five years, this means its a work in progress there is nothing settled about it.

And yet we are being taxed on the air we breath because of science that is still incomplete.

The other thing is why do the alarmists arc up and act as though the deniers are terrorists or madman looking after their own interests.

If their science is sound all they have to do is give to the rest of the scientific community like feeding the chickens in a hen house.

The science itself will shut the doubters up once and for all.

Science is there for everyone to share and hopefully make this world a better place.

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1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery &  prison" Regas Feraeos
 
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Re: a guide to AGW for the layman
Reply #11 - Aug 30th, 2013 at 10:25am
 
Ajax wrote on Aug 30th, 2013 at 10:15am:
# wrote on Aug 30th, 2013 at 9:33am:
No qualifications then.

My first recollection of the global warming debate is from the 1950s - a black and white TV show. I became really interested in the 1970s.

A Confucian aphorism translates roughly:
The more a wise man learns;
The more he comes to appreciate;
How much he does not know.

That presupposes two things; learning and wisdom.

I've learned enough to realise that I don't know enough. Any reasonably adept mind will recognise the complexity of climate science. Any reasonably healthy ego will accept that understanding such complexity takes more ability than most of us have and more time & effort than most of us have to spare.

Accepting that I can't credibly judge the science, I came to judging the scientists. By all credible reports, there's substantial agreement among the best qualified scientists. I don't pretend to know better.


Did i ever say that i was some kind of expert on AGW..??

I'm just a layman trying to make sense of it all.....!

With science of such complexity, is "a layman trying to make sense of it all" sensible? Over the past four decades, I've come to the conclusion that it's futile.
Ajax wrote on Aug 30th, 2013 at 10:15am:
There is one thing i do know though and that is...

All scientific hypothesis are there to be torn down if its possible.
...

Can those who attempt to do so in ignorance, do so without making fools of themselves?

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Ajax
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Re: a guide to AGW for the layman
Reply #12 - Aug 30th, 2013 at 10:55am
 
# wrote on Aug 30th, 2013 at 10:25am:
With science of such complexity, is "a layman trying to make sense of it all" sensible? Over the past four decades, I've come to the conclusion that it's futile.


We can all try to understand it to the best of our abilities.

That way we can differentiate the wheat from the chaff.

Quote:
Can those who attempt to do so in ignorance, do so without making fools of themselves?


I don't think the many prominent scientist trying to do so, are doing it in ignorance...??
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1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery &  prison" Regas Feraeos
 
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muso
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Re: a guide to AGW for the layman
Reply #13 - Aug 30th, 2013 at 11:01am
 
Ajax wrote on Aug 30th, 2013 at 9:20am:
Like i keep telling you...!!!

You don't have to be rocket scientist to understand AGW.

More people should research both sides of the argument.

I'm all for it.



Why don't you then?

Why do you keep repeating these lies about IPCC claims when they have repeated shown to be strawmen?

Quote:
IPCC & Computer Circulation models tell us,


1. The hot spot in the tropopause will create a runaway greenhouse effect. 


Nonsense

2. Sea levels are rising uncontrollably

uncontrollably?

3. Glaciers & the Nth Pole are melting.

4. All manner of catastrophes will come from the Earth heating up a little, including more powerful cyclones, tornadoes, more mosquitos to spread disease, shell fish are doomed, all species are doomed etc etc.


Nonsense. Is it the IPCC or the General Circulation model that says "All species are doomed?"  Grin


5. CO2 is the sole reason why we have had warming in the last 100 years, mainly because of mans CO2 emssions.


That statement is incorrect and the assertion is incorrect.


It creates a hotspot in the tropopause which attracts more water & then more CO2 & then more water vapour etc etc  until it uncontrollably creates a runaway greenhouse effect and destroys us all.

Utter nonsense.  Grin

6.  The science is settled.

IPCC & Circulation models say that? Nonsense.



You see you don't even know what you're arguing against, because you get your information from Anthony Watts and Joanne Nova.
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« Last Edit: Aug 30th, 2013 at 11:13am by muso »  

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Re: a guide to AGW for the layman
Reply #14 - Aug 30th, 2013 at 11:09am
 
Ajax wrote on Aug 30th, 2013 at 10:55am:
# wrote on Aug 30th, 2013 at 10:25am:
With science of such complexity, is "a layman trying to make sense of it all" sensible? Over the past four decades, I've come to the conclusion that it's futile.


We can all try to understand it to the best of our abilities.

That way we can differentiate the wheat from the chaff.

Quote:
Can those who attempt to do so in ignorance, do so without making fools of themselves?


I don't think the many prominent scientist trying to do so, are doing it in ignorance...??

Clearly, we define "many" differently. With equal clarity, you're no less ignorant than I.

Whether you're making a fool of yourself - if not worse - you'll need to judge for yourself. I don't doubt that the readers have already judged.
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