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spineless apologetics (Read 354809 times)
Brian Ross
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Re: spineless apologetics
Reply #1440 - Jun 2nd, 2016 at 9:37pm
 
moses wrote on Jun 2nd, 2016 at 9:16pm:
Quote:
Tell me, what is your opinion about Christian Just War theory and how does it differ from Muslim Just War Theory?


What did Christ say about war, just or otherwise?

I know muhammad was a war monger, who preached that muslim prophets had to be mass murderers, that the highest grade of muslims are the ones who slay and are slain in the cause of allah.

Tell us what Christ said on the subject, that's probably good enough for most Christians


Thank you for admitting your ignorance, Moses.    Roll Eyes

You've just discarded 2.000+ years of Christian theology and philosophy.    Roll Eyes
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moses
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Re: spineless apologetics
Reply #1441 - Jun 2nd, 2016 at 9:54pm
 
You've run from the question of all muslims supporting violence.

You can not support your lies about the doctrine of Christ causes and motivates human rights atrocities.

You're now hiding from the fact that war monger muhammad preached murder and depravity as the higher path for muslims, while Christ preached that his followers should pursue a spiritual path as the true way.
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Karnal
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Re: spineless apologetics
Reply #1442 - Jun 2nd, 2016 at 10:41pm
 
But Moses. You ssid ptophet Yeheshua told us to hate and despise the Muselman, remember? It,'s all in the Bible - bsn thrm, kill them, nuke them, rant, rave and drum up as much hatred as you can. Daily.

It,'s our Christian duty, no?
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Brian Ross
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Re: spineless apologetics
Reply #1443 - Jun 2nd, 2016 at 11:53pm
 
moses wrote on Jun 2nd, 2016 at 9:54pm:
You've run from the question of all muslims supporting violence.


You have evidence to support that premise, Moses?  You have asked EVERY Muslim their opinion?

Really?   Roll Eyes

Quote:
You can not support your lies about the doctrine of Christ causes and motivates human rights atrocities.


I can point to 2.000+ years of Christian history which is resplendent to a great deal of death, destruction, raping and looting, all inspired by the Christian religion, Moses.

I wonder how you account for that?

Quote:
You're now hiding from the fact that war monger muhammad preached murder and depravity as the higher path for muslims, while Christ preached that his followers should pursue a spiritual path as the true way.


I'm hiding from nothing, Moses.  Unlike yourself.    Roll Eyes
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Yadda
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Re: spineless apologetics
Reply #1444 - Jun 3rd, 2016 at 1:31am
 
Brian Ross wrote on Jun 2nd, 2016 at 11:53pm:
moses wrote on Jun 2nd, 2016 at 9:54pm:

You've run from the question of all muslims supporting violence.



You have evidence to support that premise, Moses?  You have asked EVERY Muslim their opinion?

Really?   Roll Eyes




Brian Ross,

You appear to be proposing that,
1 /moslems are NON-violent [supposing that there is no evidence that they are],
and,
2/ that moslems know nothing about ISLAM.



Brian Ross,

What or who, is a moslem ?



A moslem is a follower of ISLAM.       < -------- dictionary definition.

And every moslem, is a follower of ISLAM.



And ISLAM encourages and makes lawful, [the hatred of, and moslem] violence against those who are Allah's enemies [whenever the moslem has an 'opportunity' to engage in jihad 'operations'].




.





THE PRINCIPLE PRECEPT OF ISLAM.....

VIOLENCE AGAINST THE ENEMIES OF ALLAH, SO AS TO BRING ALLAH's 'PEACE' TO ALL OF MANKIND.

A VIOLENCE WHICH EVERY MOSLEM IS OBLIGATED TO SUPPORT, OR TO ENGAGE IN.


----------- >


"....Lo! Allah is an enemy to those who reject Faith."
Koran 2.98


"....those who reject Allah have no protector."
Koran 47.008
v. 8-11


"O ye who believe! Take not my enemies and yours as friends (or protectors),- offering them (your) love,..."
Koran 60.1


"Thou wilt not find any people who believe in Allah and the Last Day, loving those who resist Allah and His Messenger, even though they were their fathers or their sons, or their brothers, or their kindred...."
Koran 58.22


"O ye who believe! Choose not your fathers nor your brethren for friends if they take pleasure in disbelief rather than faith. Whoso of you taketh them for friends, such are wrong-doers."
Koran 9.23


"Muhammad is the messenger of Allah. And those with him are hard against the disbelievers and merciful among themselves....."
Koran 48.29


"Fighting [against disbelievers] is prescribed for you, and [if] ye dislike it.....Allah knoweth, and ye know not."
Koran 2.216


"O ye who believe! Fight those of the disbelievers who are near to you, and let them find harshness in you, and know that Allah is with those who keep their duty (unto Him)."
Koran 9.123


"Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued. "
Koran 9.29


"Allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs (in return) is the garden (of Paradise): they fight in His cause, and slay and are slain:...."
Koran 9.111



.




Quote:

'Whosoever dies without participating in an expedition (jihad) nor having the intention to do so, dies on a branch of hypocrisy,'


   - 'Aussie' EX-moslem, Mohamed Elomar, quoting holy ISLAMIC scripture.



Google;
"Allah's Messenger said" "Whosoever dies without participating"





Brian Ross,

Religious fighting, in Allah's cause, is obligatory for every moslem.

And every moslem knows that.


A moslem is a follower of ISLAM.       < -------- dictionary definition.

QUESTION;
If a moslem, is a follower of ISLAM, how could he not know that mainstream ISLAM promotes violence ?



Moslems intentionally misrepresent ISLAM to those [non-moslems] who are ignorant and naive, whenever they [the non-moslems] are too strong, for moslems to overwhelm or fight them.


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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31
 
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Karnal
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Re: spineless apologetics
Reply #1445 - Jun 3rd, 2016 at 3:18am
 
Kill them.
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freediver
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Re: spineless apologetics
Reply #1446 - Jun 3rd, 2016 at 6:43am
 
Brian Ross wrote on Jun 1st, 2016 at 10:33pm:
freediver wrote on Jun 1st, 2016 at 5:54pm:
Do you honestly think that the words and deeds of Jesus are not significantly different from those of Muhammed in terms of support for violence? Or are you just demonstrating you capacity for getting it wrong?


FD, perhaps you need to learn that Christianity, like Islam is far more than just the words of their founders?   Roll Eyes


True. Actions speak louder than words eh?

Do you honestly think that the words and deeds of Jesus are not significantly different from those of Muhammed in terms of support for violence? Or are you just demonstrating you capacity for getting it wrong?
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Brian Ross
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Re: spineless apologetics
Reply #1447 - Jun 3rd, 2016 at 3:26pm
 
freediver wrote on Jun 3rd, 2016 at 6:43am:
Brian Ross wrote on Jun 1st, 2016 at 10:33pm:
freediver wrote on Jun 1st, 2016 at 5:54pm:
Do you honestly think that the words and deeds of Jesus are not significantly different from those of Muhammed in terms of support for violence? Or are you just demonstrating you capacity for getting it wrong?


FD, perhaps you need to learn that Christianity, like Islam is far more than just the words of their founders?   Roll Eyes


True. Actions speak louder than words eh?

Do you honestly think that the words and deeds of Jesus are not significantly different from those of Muhammed in terms of support for violence? Or are you just demonstrating you capacity for getting it wrong?


As I am discussing more than just the words of Christ or Mohammed, FD, your comment is nonsensical.   Try again.    Roll Eyes
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moses
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Re: spineless apologetics
Reply #1448 - Jun 3rd, 2016 at 4:08pm
 
Brian ross wrote Reply #1443 - Yesterday at 11:53pm

Quote:
You have evidence to support that premise, Moses?  You have asked EVERY Muslim their opinion?

Really?


Overwhelming evidence actually.

All muslims fully support the cause and motivation of islamic violence (islam allah muhammad qur'an).

They unequivocally deem this cause and motivation as being immutably perfect and can never be changed.

If you fully support the cause and motivation of unspeakable atrocities, you also fully support the engendered atrocities.

Quote:
I can point to 2.000+ years of Christian history which is resplendent to a great deal of death, destruction, raping and looting, all inspired by the Christian religion, Moses.

I wonder how you account for that?


Easy, I can point you to the teachings of Christ, which warned that such falsification would arise.

Mathew 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

Mathew 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils?  and in thy name done many wonderful works?

Mathew 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

The above three verses fully explain that certain people will claim Christianity, but will be rejected by Christ as they are workers of iniquity.

Then we have:

Mathew 15:9  But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

Mark 7:7  Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

Explains that the commandments of men taught as the doctrine which resulted in many wrongdoings, was also rejected by Christ.

So you are a liar when you make statements that the Doctrine of Christ causes and motivates human rights atrocities.

Quote:
I'm hiding from nothing, Moses.  Unlike yourself.


You're desperate to hide from the fact that muhammad was a war monger who preached that a muslim prophet had to be a mass murderer, while the highest grade of muslims are the ones who slay and are slain in the cause of allah.

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polite_gandalf
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Re: spineless apologetics
Reply #1449 - Jun 3rd, 2016 at 4:16pm
 
moses wrote on Jun 3rd, 2016 at 4:08pm:
Overwhelming evidence actually.

All muslims fully support the cause and motivation of islamic violence (islam allah muhammad qur'an).

They unequivocally deem this cause and motivation as being immutably perfect and can never be changed.


There you go Brian - moses's "overwhelming evidence" is the logic that all muslims follow moses's version of Islam - which is the violent and depraved version. Foolproof eh?

Of course muslims themselves don't get a say - it literally doesn't make any difference if I say that I, as a muslim, reject violence outside self defense. No, we're just a mindless collective, believing what Moses says we believe.
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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
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Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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moses
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Re: spineless apologetics
Reply #1450 - Jun 3rd, 2016 at 4:21pm
 
Do you reject the commands of allah, the teachings of muhammad, the verses in the qur'an which cause and motivate islamic atrocities, as being wrong evil and not valid in a 21st century civilised society Gandalf?
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polite_gandalf
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Re: spineless apologetics
Reply #1451 - Jun 3rd, 2016 at 4:24pm
 
And what are these "Commands of Allah" and "teachings of Muhammad" - oh thats right, rape, slaughter and generally be a dick.

See? Foolproof
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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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Karnal
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Re: spineless apologetics
Reply #1452 - Jun 3rd, 2016 at 4:26pm
 
moses wrote on Jun 3rd, 2016 at 4:21pm:
Do you reject the commands of allah, the teachings of muhammad, the verses in the qur'an which cause and motivate islamic atrocities, as being wrong evil and not valid in a 21st century civilised society Gandalf?


Say it, Muslim. Convert.

It’s Moses’ Christian duty to apply the branding iron, you see.
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Karnal
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Re: spineless apologetics
Reply #1453 - Jun 3rd, 2016 at 4:30pm
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Jun 3rd, 2016 at 4:24pm:
And what are these "Commands of Allah" and "teachings of Muhammad" -


Oh, the same as the Christian ones if you believe Moses.

Somehow, he’s interpreted a Bible passage about Jesus talking with the devil in the desert as hate them, kill them, nuke them.

If you don’t have mean instructions, you have to make them up, you see.
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Brian Ross
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Re: spineless apologetics
Reply #1454 - Jun 3rd, 2016 at 4:36pm
 
moses wrote on Jun 3rd, 2016 at 4:08pm:
Brian ross wrote Reply #1443 - Yesterday at 11:53pm

Quote:
You have evidence to support that premise, Moses?  You have asked EVERY Muslim their opinion?

Really?


Overwhelming evidence actually.

All muslims fully support the cause and motivation of islamic violence (islam allah muhammad qur'an).

They unequivocally deem this cause and motivation as being immutably perfect and can never be changed.

If you fully support the cause and motivation of unspeakable atrocities, you also fully support the engendered atrocities.


So, is this like how all Christians proclaim their belief in Christ and his teachings and his church(es)?

So, then, why were the teachings of Christ ignored for nearly 2,000+ years and you, a supposedly a Christian continue to ignore them in your hatred of everything that is non-Christian?  Mmmm?   Roll Eyes
Quote:
Quote:
I can point to 2.000+ years of Christian history which is resplendent to a great deal of death, destruction, raping and looting, all inspired by the Christian religion, Moses.

I wonder how you account for that?


Easy, I can point you to the teachings of Christ, which warned that such falsification would arise.
[/quote]

"Falsification"?   Yet, the Christian philosophers, theologians and Churchmen all claimed they spoke the true words of Christ when they were proclaiming their wars against the infidel, now didn't they?

Quote:
I
Quote:
I'm hiding from nothing, Moses.  Unlike yourself.


You're desperate to hide from the fact that muhammad was a war monger who preached that a muslim prophet had to be a mass murderer, while the highest grade of muslims are the ones who slay and are slain in the cause of allah.


Did he?  According to whom?  You?  But we have seen how you are working against the teachings of Christ, Moses so why should we believe what you preach?  Mmmm?    Roll Eyes
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