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NBN progress? (Read 126308 times)
John Smith
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Re: NBN progress?
Reply #120 - Nov 18th, 2013 at 10:56am
 
# wrote on Nov 18th, 2013 at 10:18am:
Looks like FttH would have been faster, in both senses. Might be cheaper too, given the reported state of Telstra's copper.

Coalition's FttN network unlikely to start rolling out before 2015

Supratim Adhikari 15 Nov, 11:01 AM

The Coalition government’s planned Fibre to the Node (FttN) network is unlikely to start rolling out before 2015, potentially delaying its timetable of providing download speeds of between 25 and 100 megabits per second by the end of 2016 and 50 to 100 megabits per second by 2019.

The proposed FttN network will require the installation of approximately 50,000 to 60,000 nodes and a source told Technology Spectator that at best NBN Co could get 200 nodes rolled out a week.

With the rollout at scale expected to start around early 2015, it could take NBN Co six years to roll the FttN network out at 200 nodes a week 

It is understood that the 200 nodes a week figure was flagged by senior British Telecom executive Mike Galvin, who recently spent some time in Australia to advise NBN Co’s senior management and Communications Minister Malcolm Turnbull.

NBN Co is currently conducting FttN trials (in lab) and field trials for Fibre to the Basement (FttB) services and the nodes won’t commence until next year.

Commencement of the actual rollout is dependent on a number of factors – the selection of the equipment (kit) vendor, the all-important Telstra renegotiation and the ACCC’s approval.


When the libs were saying it will be quicker and cheaper, what were they comparing it to? the second coming?  Grin Grin Grin
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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.
 
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Fit of Absent Mindeness
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Re: NBN progress?
Reply #121 - Nov 18th, 2013 at 2:23pm
 
Quicker? (for who?)

Cheaper? (for who?)

Another non-core promise.
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Re: NBN progress?
Reply #122 - Nov 19th, 2013 at 7:31am
 
Godwin Grech started a job on Turnbull. It looks like this Coalition turkey will finish it. Which was, no doubt, Tony Abbott's intent.

NBN deadlines missed, can Turnbull make industry play nice?


Summary
: Having already missed the first significant deadline of his ministry and by all accounts set to blow way past a more significant one, Malcolm Turnbull's NBN turnaround effort is already looking iffy. He's prevailing upon the telecoms industry for "patience" and "collaboration", but will they listen?


By David Braue for Full Duplex | November 18, 2013 -- 03:06 GMT (14:06 AEST)

...
Turnbull certainly has the NBN's helm, but the storm is only just beginning. Screenshot by David Braue / ZDNet

Malcolm Turnbull's communications ministry quietly missed its first major, self-imposed deadline on Sunday, which marked 60 days of the Abbott government and therefore the latest date on which the current NBN review should have been delivered.

That deadline was never going to be met – nor was Turnbull's earlier commitment to November 11. Neither, for that matter, will Tony Abbott be able to honour the promise he made, on the launch of the Coalition's official NBN election policy, that he would deliver a revised NBN Corporate Plan by his 100th day in office (around Christmastime); now, Turnbull says that is due in mid-2014.

Those aren't the only deadlines being missed: as Turnbull made clear in his CommsDay Rebooting the NBN speech, neither will his promise – part of official Coalition policy and repeated over and over again during an election campaign built on discrediting the previous government's NBN project – to give every Australian premise “a download data rate of between 25 and 100 megabits per second by late 2016.”

Sorry, folks. It's just not going to happen. So much for "sooner".

Obviously, we now learn, the Coalition was just kidding with all those straight-faced election promises. Its NBN review, apparently due in early December, has blown out its timeframe by nearly 40 percent and the revision of its NBN Corporate Plan is already six months behind schedule.

This, from a government that made a hobby of bludgeoning Labor whenever it managed to delay the NBN by weeks or months.

Stepping aside from pedantry, however, one thing is clear: now that Turnbull is in the captain's chair and becoming aware of the true challenge of actually building the NBN – rather than just hobbling it with one acid-filled speech after another – things are very, very different from what was promised in the election.

Now the growing consensus is that the FttN rollout won't begin until 2015 and will probably run until 2021 – the date when Labor had initially planned to have its fibre-to-the-premise (FttP) network in service. For those keeping score, that's a six-year rollout – three times longer than Turnbull promised before the election.

I hate to say I told you so but... oh, wait, who am I kidding? I love to say it. Scratch that.

Consider, though: given that so much of that plan still remains up in the air, even 2021 could be an optimistic half-guess. Any progress depends, for example, on the Coalition government's renegotiations with Telstra – for which Turnbull amusingly called for quick conclusion “in a spirit of collaboration and partnership”.

Because, you know, Telstra is just dying to gift-wrap its copper network for Turnbull. Perhaps David Thodey will wrap up the network with a nice figgy pudding and deliver it to Turnbull's doorstep for Christmas?

I'm sorry, but being sued during major contract negotiations doesn't exactly suggest that Telstra is feeling that spirit too. Indeed, there is still a very large question mark around whether an economically deterministic Coalition can offer enough money to get a disaffected industry to even complete its obligations around the current rollout. The way things are looking, anybody wanting to put a bit of extra cash in their pockets for Christmas might consider starting an NBN-contractor dead pool.

[continued ...]
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Re: NBN progress?
Reply #123 - Nov 19th, 2013 at 7:32am
 
[... continued]

Quote:
    As we hunker down to wait for yet another broadband plan to come to fruition, it's worth remembering that many of the obstacles Labor encountered came not only from its own over-ambitious agenda, but from the uncertainty that Turnbull himself sowed and reaped over three years in virulent opposition.

Turnbull has begged “patience” from the industry as he seeks to sort out the remnants of Labor's rollout, and he continues to blame the disarray on Labor's own mistakes. This is hardly surprising.

And yet, as we hunker down to wait for yet another broadband plan to come to fruition, it's worth remembering that many of the obstacles Labor encountered came not only from its own over-ambitious agenda, but from the uncertainty that Turnbull himself sowed and reaped over three years in virulent opposition.

Had he supported Labor's FttP ambition but pushed instead for tighter oversight of the processes by which it was being rolled out – instead of simply arguing for a totally different policy – would the industry have fallen in line faster, knowing that FttP was inevitable?

It's not a question we can answer for sure, but it's certainly one to consider as Turnbull swaddles himself in the blindly optimistic capitalism that marked the Howard government's poorly-executed privatisation of Telstra.

Even now, Turnbull speaks in misty-eyed terms about a private sector given government subsidies “to support deployment in less economic, typically rural and remote, areas for the project and business execution risk to be carried by those best able to manage it.”

This is a worry, because – as we have seen – for better or worse, the private sector in Australia is simply not interested in managing that risk, or taking it on at all. Construction firms were, we must remember, contracted to deliver specific outcomes around the NBN based on their own estimations of the cost of the work – and, by all accounts, struggled to deliver outcomes that meet their own expectations.

Whether or not those expectations were driven by unrealistic government demands, as Turnbull will allege, or by fierce competition for what was perceived as A-grade project work, as Stephen Conroy will likely contend, the fact remains that Turnbull now faces a serious problem in mustering the manpower to deliver on his own vision.

Some have pointed to recent investments by the likes of TPG – which bought 4G spectrum earlier this year, is investing in undersea capacity via the $350m Hawaiki project and wants to build fibre to around 500,000 capital-city apartments – as a sign that the private sector has been revitalised with Coalition's election.

And yet I seriously doubt TPG, or any other company building its own infrastructure, is going to freely allow access to that infrastructure. Turnbull's NBN Co could deliver such an outcome were it to buy the infrastructure when it's built – but that's not really the plan, now, is it?

Quote:
    Turnbull still has not outlined how he will deliver the open-access wholesale network that everybody agrees is necessary – while getting the private sector to build enough infrastructure that the government can shed the risk that he believes it should never have taken on in the first place.

Despite assimilating TransACT's fibre network and all his rhetoric about capitalising on existing HFC networks, Turnbull still has not outlined how he will deliver the open-access wholesale network that everybody agrees is necessary – while getting the private sector to build enough infrastructure that the government can shed the risk that he believes it should never have taken on in the first place.

But who will carry that risk? Modern business cases simply don't allow you to fund infrastructure that will facilitate the creation of new competitors that will eat your lunch. Foxtel hasn't allowed competitors onto its HFC network, Optus didn't do it either. Optus has reined in its mobile virtual network operator (MVNO) business in an attempt to stop price erosion in the crucial mobile market.

Everywhere you turn, Australia's private sector is showing exactly why Turnbull's business idealism is completely misplaced – and why residents in rural areas of Australia, who everyone agrees need broadband sooner than anybody else, have been left holding the bag once again.

Turnbull has appealed to the telecommunications sector for “commitment and flexibility, patience and hard work” as the industry's new captain works to turn the ocean liner that is Labor's NBN plan towards the Port of Broadband Mediocrity. But as Turnbull's nascent ministry misses deadline after deadline, and staggers from one broken promise to another, it's worth wondering not only when but if this boat will ever reach shore.

[continued ...]
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Re: NBN progress?
Reply #124 - Nov 19th, 2013 at 7:37am
 
[... continued]

What do you think? Is Turnbull just doing the best he can given the situation? Or is he reaping the effects of the dissent he sowed in Opposition? Will the private sector be as nice to Turnbull as he wants to be to it? And: is this thing ever going to be built?
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Re: NBN progress?
Reply #125 - Nov 19th, 2013 at 9:26am
 
Woop bloody woop! NBN Co says LAB trials of VDSL with vectoring works: http://www.zdnet.com/nbn-vdsl-trials-a-success-nbn-co-cto-7000023290/

BIG smacking deal! (Turncoat will pretend it is in QT today, you bet!)

First—it is a lab test so perfect copper, short length of line, etc. (We knew this would perform to specs.)

Secondly—trying this over a length of actual Telstra copper result will be not so good to say the least and this is what we really need to know!

Thirdly—VDSL as part of FTTN is only any use to an incumbent telco sweating the last use out of copper and NBN Co does not own the copper!

Fourthly—VDSL/FTTN is obsolete, would need to be replaced within three years (i.e. one year after starting the rollout. Long term we need FTTH!


This: http://www.zdnet.com/au/copper-network-not-ageing-telstra-7000023286/
is just Telstra setting to charge Malcolm an arm and a leg for access to their crap copper. 20mbps ADSL2 actually giving 1-2mbps is the result of a crap, corroded network.


Turncoat has missed deadlines and will miss many more—he really doesn’t look very good: http://www.zdnet.com/nbn-deadlines-missed-can-turnbull-make-the-industry-play-ni...

I have not thought much of him since Rainmaker and Gretch but did think he could manage a Department. Guess I was wrong.
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« Last Edit: Nov 19th, 2013 at 9:47am by St George of the Garden »  

I want Muso as GMod. Bring back Muso!
WWW Friends of the National Broadband Network  
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Re: NBN progress?
Reply #126 - Nov 19th, 2013 at 1:01pm
 
This is a shambles - the roll out won't begin until 2015/2016, will take 7-8 years (won't be finished until 2022/2023) and won't give us world class speeds.

Either do it once and right with fibre or don't do it at all.

As for those lab trials - fibre has a world record of 126 pettabits over 500km - this is real world.

No other medium will rival this - even quantum networks will use fibre.

http://www.zdnet.com/nbn-deadlines-missed-can-turnbull-make-the-industry-play-nice-7000023284/

Malcolm Turnbull's communications ministry quietly missed its first major, self-imposed deadline on Sunday, which marked 60 days of the Abbott government and therefore the latest date on which the current NBN review should have been delivered.

Obviously, we now learn, the Coalition was just kidding with all those straight-faced election promises. Its NBN review, apparently due in early December, has blown out its timeframe by nearly 40 percent and the revision of its NBN Corporate Plan is already six months behind schedule.

Not cheaper, not sooner and not quicker.
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« Last Edit: Nov 19th, 2013 at 1:41pm by Fit of Absent Mindeness »  

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Update 22 November
Reply #127 - Nov 23rd, 2013 at 10:38am
 
10 days. That's all the time we have until NBN Co's review of our broadband future closes -- and Malcolm Turnbull could be sitting down to begin making decisions.

Worryingly, with the voices Malcolm Turnbull have been listening to so far, we could see our broadband future drastically scaled back. Those with money may get access while remote and disadvantaged areas may miss out; speeds capped; all the economic and social benefits of fast, reliable broadband cast aside.

Or we could step up the fight. This Tuesday 26 November, people from right across the country are doing just that. They're organising and attending petition deliveries of our 270,000-strong petition to their local MPs -- it's a national day of action for the NBN.

Check out all the events planned for the national day of action -- and join other petition signers delivering the petition to your local MP.

So far, 40 events are organised across the country. They're in some of the most marginal seats in the country, to Turnbull's electorate and others are even hosting a delivery to NBN Co's HQ!

Some of the most powerful voices for Turnbull are that of his colleagues in parliament -- now imagine if they too start calling Turnbull demanding answers after realising thousands of their voters are hot on their heels asking what they're going to do, to save the NBN in their electorate. That's when our message starts reaching the ear of Malcolm Turnbull.

But for the plan to have the biggest impact, it needs you. Click here to check out a petition delivery happening near you -- enter your postcode, and find all the details.

Can't find an event in your electorate yet? Sign up to deliver the petition to your MP -- we'll support you in giving your community a voice in our fight for a better NBN.

Thanks so much for being with us in this final big push before the review closes. We've done a lot already together, and we know that we can have a huge impact if we show them that across the country we're together fighting for this, and that we're not going to give up.

Look forward to seeing you at one of the events!

Nick, Alex and the Save the NBN Campaign

P.S. Might be keen to organise an event but want to talk it through first? Drop us an email on savethenbnpetition@gmail.com!
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Re: NBN progress?
Reply #128 - Nov 23rd, 2013 at 4:19pm
 
blah blah blah....  here in SA we have less than 1000 connected to the NBN and no one connected on over 2 years.

what good is 'superior speed' it it will take 100 years to get it??

give me FTTN now.
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Re: NBN progress?
Reply #129 - Nov 24th, 2013 at 9:51am
 
longweekend58 wrote on Nov 23rd, 2013 at 4:19pm:
...
give me FTTN now.
Unfortunately, FTTN looks like taking as long to deliver as FTTH, if not longer. Do read the history before posting.
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Re: NBN progress?
Reply #130 - Nov 25th, 2013 at 10:48am
 
longweekend58 wrote on Nov 23rd, 2013 at 4:19pm:
blah blah blah....  here in SA we have less than 1000 connected to the NBN and no one connected on over 2 years.

what good is 'superior speed' it it will take 100 years to get it??

give me FTTN now.


FTTN won't be rolling out for another 2 years at least.

By the time this is finished, how far behind will we be compared with the rest of the world?
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Re: NBN progress?
Reply #131 - Nov 25th, 2013 at 12:50pm
 
Fit of Absent Mindeness wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 10:48am:
...
By the time this is finished, how far behind will we be compared with the rest of the world?

A while back, someone pointed out to me that the Overland Telegraph was completed in 1872. The telephone was patented in 1876. No doubt those responsible for the overland telegraph thought they knew what those wires would be used for. The telephone, which originally used telegraph wires, changed the game.

Something to ponder, for those who assume they know the uses of optical fibre.
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Re: NBN progress?
Reply #132 - Nov 25th, 2013 at 1:10pm
 
The Luddites are back in charge!!!!
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Re: NBN progress?
Reply #133 - Nov 25th, 2013 at 1:50pm
 
I can't post videos yet so youtube "Senator Ludlam asks questions to NBN"
It is a very good watch. It just goes to show how unorganized the FTTN really is. It's a shame, I admired Mr Turnbull, but I'm starting to think it's best that he considers leaving politics before his reputation begins to sink.  Undecided

Here's a quote from the Video
Ludlam "Will 100% of copper customers get maximum speed?"
Ziggy "No"
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Update 25 November
Reply #134 - Nov 25th, 2013 at 2:40pm
 
Wow, that response was incredible.

When we emailed you on Friday about the NBN national day of action there were 40 events lined up -- now there's 145 deliveries of the petition happening to MPs right across the country tomorrow. Amazing.

That means there's an event organised near you. Want to join other petition signers to help deliver our 260,000+ signatures to to your MP tomorrow?

Find all the details here.

I hope you can come along. It's likely to be just 30 minutes out of your day -- but the more people that show up, the louder our message will be heard in parliament (and the more media coverage we'll be able to get about our campaign to save the NBN)!

Thanks so much for your help. And look forward to seeing you out there tomorrow!

Nick, Alex and the Save the NBN campaign.
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