Australian Politics Forum - Attack on Nairobi Mall

muso Gold Member Offline Posts: 13151 Gladstone, Queensland Gender:	Re: Attack on Nairobi Mall Reply #30 - Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 10:23pm A few of the Kenyan Muslims on Twitter are quoting The Qur'an 5:32 Quote: whoever kills an innocent soul in the land - it is as if he had slain mankind entirely. And whoever saves one - it is as if he had saved mankind entirely.
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Baronvonrort

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Re: Attack on Nairobi Mall
Reply #31 - Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 10:53pm

muso wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 10:23pm:

A few of the Kenyan Muslims on Twitter are quoting The Qur'an 5:32

Quote:

whoever kills an innocent soul in the land - it is as if he had slain mankind entirely. And whoever saves one - it is as if he had saved mankind entirely.

That verse does not apply to muslims,since when have muslims been called the children of israel?

Take note of the part they leave out when quoting this verse-
Quote:

Because of that,We decreed upon the children of Israel that whoever kills a soul.....
www.quran.com/5/32

We could look at other verses in the Quran that mention children of Israel-
www.quran.com/search?q=children+of+israel

The next verse 5/33 does apply to muslims-
www.quran.com/5/33

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Leftists and the Ayatollahs have a lot in common when it comes to criticism of Islam, they don't tolerate it.

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Yadda

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Re: Attack on Nairobi Mall
Reply #32 - Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 11:12pm

muso wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 10:23pm:

A few of the Kenyan Muslims on Twitter are quoting The Qur'an 5:32

Quote:

whoever kills an innocent soul in the land - it is as if he had slain mankind entirely. And whoever saves one - it is as if he had saved mankind entirely.

muso,

We know, how moslems will intentionally use a very particular form of words [sophistry] so as to deceive the 'audience' that the moslem is talking to - a form of words, allowing the moslem to portray himself [and ISLAM] as 'innocent', virtuous and sincere.

e.g.

A moslem community leader,

speaking in the UK, publicly, AND THEN PRIVATELY, regarding the London 7/7 bombing victims.

Quote:

"......In public interviews Bakri condemned the killing of all innocent civilians.

Later when he addressed his own followers he explained that he had in fact been referring only to Muslims as only they were innocent:

Yes I condemn killing any innocent people, but not any kuffar."

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2087-1724541,00.html

muso,

You are not dumb.

Q.
Why are you still taken in by these deceits ?

Dictionary,
sophistry = = the use of fallacious arguments, especially to deceive.

Liam Neeson 'considers converting to Islam'
Yadda wrote on Jan 29^th, 2012 at 12:11am:

Dictionary,
sophistry = = the use of fallacious arguments, especially to deceive.

SOPHISTRY EXAMPLE #1

Peace

Good moslems will tell non-moslems, that moslems want to see 'peace' cover the whole earth.

But a moslem, does not openly reveal [at the same time] that all good moslems define 'peace', as submission to Allah's will.
Dar al-Islam = = "house of peace" [is those places where Sharia has authority].
Dar al-Harb = = "house of war".

Google,
Dar al-Harb deception
i.e.
A moslem 'peace' = = mankind's SLAVERY, under ISLAMIST political rule.

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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True Colours

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Re: Attack on Nairobi Mall
Reply #33 - Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 11:15pm

muso wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 10:23pm:

A few of the Kenyan Muslims on Twitter are quoting The Qur'an 5:32

Quote:

whoever kills an innocent soul in the land - it is as if he had slain mankind entirely. And whoever saves one - it is as if he had saved mankind entirely.

So when the Kenyan Army invaded Somalia and raped and killed thousands of people, they have killed the world many times over.

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muso Gold Member Offline Posts: 13151 Gladstone, Queensland Gender:	Re: Attack on Nairobi Mall Reply #34 - Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 11:16pm Well I don't claim to be an expert in Islam by any means, but the quotation seems relevant to them.
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muso

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Re: Attack on Nairobi Mall
Reply #35 - Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 11:23pm

Yadda wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 11:12pm:

muso,

You are not dumb.

Q.
Why are you still taken in by these deceits ?

Yadda, you have no knowledge of Kenya. I worked there for 2 years and some of my employees were Muslim. In fact it was about 50:50. The group responsible for these attacks is a group of extremists in Somalia, led by an English woman and her boyfriend and most of them are foreign mercenary converts. Nobody supports them in Kenya, and they are losing the war in Somalia. This is the group that was responsible for the kidnappings.

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Yadda

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Re: Attack on Nairobi Mall
Reply #36 - Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 11:32pm

muso wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 11:23pm:

Yadda wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 11:12pm:

muso,

You are not dumb.

Q.
Why are you still taken in by these deceits ?

Yadda, you have no knowledge of Kenya. I worked there for 2 years and some of my employees were Muslim. In fact it was about 50:50. The group responsible for these attacks is a group of extremists in Somalia, led by an English woman and her boyfriend and most of them are foreign mercenary converts. Nobody supports them in Kenya, and they are losing the war in Somalia. This is the group that was responsible for the kidnappings.

muso,

We all believe what we want to believe.

But of course, in my case [my imaginary friend Wink

], i'm a childish, naive, idiot. Wink

A fool. [its ok, i bear it well]

muso,

I respect your right to believe, what you want to believe.

But what we believe, will also, always, determine how we choose [in this life].

Correct ?

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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Chimp_Logic Gold Member Offline πολιτικός Posts: 4826 Mawson Base Gender:	Re: Attack on Nairobi Mall Reply #37 - Sep 24^th, 2013 at 12:54am muso wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 11:16pm: Well I don't claim to be an expert in Islam by any means, but the quotation seems relevant to them. Civilian deaths in Iraq post the US illegal 2003 invasion is ~ 1.42 million.
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Yadda

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Re: Attack on Nairobi Mall
Reply #38 - Sep 24^th, 2013 at 1:21am

Chimp_Logic wrote on Sep 24^th, 2013 at 12:54am:

muso wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 11:16pm:

Well I don't claim to be an expert in Islam by any means, but the quotation seems relevant to them.

Civilian deaths in Iraq post the US illegal 2003 invasion is ~ 1.42 million.

Chimp,

Allah's law IS VERY CLEAR.

Moslems, must never knowingly kill another 'believer'.

"......If a man kills a believer intentionally, his recompense is Hell, to abide therein (For ever): And the wrath and the curse of Allah are upon him, and a dreadful penalty is prepared for him."
Koran 4.92-93

So those 1.42 million casualties must be infidels - well, almost all of them.

Because moslems are a peace loving community, and, a moslem would never kill another moslem.

Honest, they are all infidels!

So, its not a real prob.

Those infidels are all destined for hell fire anyway!

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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Soren

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Re: Attack on Nairobi Mall
Reply #39 - Sep 24^th, 2013 at 8:36am

muso wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 11:23pm:

Yadda wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 11:12pm:

muso,

You are not dumb.

Q.
Why are you still taken in by these deceits ?

Yadda, you have no knowledge of Kenya. I worked there for 2 years and some of my employees were Muslim. In fact it was about 50:50. The group responsible for these attacks is a group of extremists in Somalia, led by an English woman and her boyfriend and most of them are foreign mercenary converts. Nobody supports them in Kenya, and they are losing the war in Somalia. This is the group that was responsible for the kidnappings.

The main reason they have limited support is because they are the Puritan's of Islam. They have impeccable Islamic credentials, they act exactly as the Koran prescribes.They are against the kuffar as well as the Muslim backsliders and modernisers and other lax Muslims. They are literalist, black-letter Muslims.

They were separating out the non-Muslims by asking them to recite an Islamic prayer. Those who couldn't were shot. Why? To make sure no 'innocents' were killed.

Islamic correctness is very, very important to them. Saying that their interpretation is incorrect is laughably useless and often nothing but a smokescreen of excuses. They are motivated enough to act in accordance with their beliefs. They have arrived to their very practical conclusion of what Islam requires of them.

Same with the Lee Rigby atrocity, the Bombay massacre and all the other outrages of this kind. The terrorists spell it out very clearly how and why they are acting exactly as Islam requires. We should take them at their words. There is no reason not to.

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Soren

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Re: Attack on Nairobi Mall
Reply #40 - Sep 24^th, 2013 at 9:09am

Brian Ross wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2013 at 10:53pm:

Soren wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2013 at 10:35pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2013 at 2:48pm:

I heartily condemn this attack by Islamic extremists in Kenya.

Strutting as ever. Who doesn't condemn this attack? And who else feels the need to jump up and strut about condemning it?

You are a very fair-weather friend and defender of Muslims, aren't you?? The moment the start shooting non-whites, you are elbowing to the fore with your 'hearty' condemnation. Ra ra ra, look at moi, I am hearty.
They can't rely on you, can they?

Hows your Toxophilia going, Soren? Grin

How's your prayer to Allah going, Brain. Heartily? "Allah humma Innee As alooka 'ilman naa fee-ow wa Rizq-ow waa See-ow wa Shee-faa amm min Kooll-lee daa-een. &&" = O Allah, I ask You to grant me beneficial knowledge, abundant sustenance and cure from all diseases.
That's how you sign off on every post. Are you a Muslim or just a heartily preening poseur?

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Yadda

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Re: Attack on Nairobi Mall
Reply #41 - Sep 24^th, 2013 at 10:29am

Soren wrote on Sep 24^th, 2013 at 8:36am:

muso wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 11:23pm:

Yadda wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 11:12pm:

muso,

You are not dumb.

Q.
Why are you still taken in by these deceits ?

Yadda, you have no knowledge of Kenya. I worked there for 2 years and some of my employees were Muslim. In fact it was about 50:50. The group responsible for these attacks is a group of extremists in Somalia, led by an English woman and her boyfriend and most of them are foreign mercenary converts. Nobody supports them in Kenya, and they are losing the war in Somalia. This is the group that was responsible for the kidnappings.

The main reason they have limited support is because they are the Puritan's of Islam. They have impeccable Islamic credentials, they act exactly as the Koran prescribes.They are against the kuffar as well as the Muslim backsliders and modernisers and other lax Muslims. They are literalist, black-letter Muslims.

They were separating out the non-Muslims by asking them to recite an Islamic prayer. Those who couldn't were shot. Why? To make sure no 'innocents' were killed.

Islamic correctness is very, very important to them. Saying that their interpretation is incorrect is laughably useless and often nothing but a smokescreen of excuses. They are motivated enough to act in accordance with their beliefs. They have arrived to their very practical conclusion of what Islam requires of them.

Same with the Lee Rigby atrocity, the Bombay massacre and all the other outrages of this kind. The terrorists spell it out very clearly how and why they are acting exactly as Islam requires.

We should take them at their words. There is no reason not to.

Exactly so, imo.

Where persons declare themselves to be moslems, and wherever their declarations, align with the pronouncements that are found within their 'holy' ISLAMIC texts.....

ABSOLUTELY, 120%.

'We should take them at their words. There is no reason not to. '

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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muso

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Re: Attack on Nairobi Mall
Reply #42 - Sep 24^th, 2013 at 12:02pm

Soren wrote on Sep 24^th, 2013 at 8:36am:

muso wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 11:23pm:

Yadda wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2013 at 11:12pm:

muso,

You are not dumb.

Q.
Why are you still taken in by these deceits ?

Yadda, you have no knowledge of Kenya. I worked there for 2 years and some of my employees were Muslim. In fact it was about 50:50. The group responsible for these attacks is a group of extremists in Somalia, led by an English woman and her boyfriend and most of them are foreign mercenary converts. Nobody supports them in Kenya, and they are losing the war in Somalia. This is the group that was responsible for the kidnappings.

The main reason they have limited support is because they are the Puritan's of Islam. They have impeccable Islamic credentials, they act exactly as the Koran prescribes.They are against the kuffar as well as the Muslim backsliders and modernisers and other lax Muslims. They are literalist, black-letter Muslims.

They were separating out the non-Muslims by asking them to recite an Islamic prayer. Those who couldn't were shot. Why? To make sure no 'innocents' were killed.

Islamic correctness is very, very important to them. Saying that their interpretation is incorrect is laughably useless and often nothing but a smokescreen of excuses. They are motivated enough to act in accordance with their beliefs. They have arrived to their very practical conclusion of what Islam requires of them.

Same with the Lee Rigby atrocity, the Bombay massacre and all the other outrages of this kind. The terrorists spell it out very clearly how and why they are acting exactly as Islam requires. We should take them at their words. There is no reason not to.

They have no credibility with the vast majority of African Muslims in the same way as Fred Phelps and the Westboro Baptist Church have no credibility with any decent Christian. You could argue that Fred Phelps is just taking Christianity literally. Maybe we should take his word for it.

Yes, most African Muslims in Kenya don't take Islam literally. In Ramadan, you can find young Muslims in clubs drinking etc with the best of them. They intermarry, when the marry at all. Most can't afford it. Is it strictly in accordance with either Christianity of Islam? No.

The book doesn't make the religion - the people do. Kenyan people are among the most peaceful I have met anywhere.

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True Colours

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Re: Attack on Nairobi Mall
Reply #43 - Sep 24^th, 2013 at 1:28pm

The Shabab are just one of the many Islamist groups in Somalia. The people who carried out the attack on the Kenyan mall are just a small faction of shabab - probably best described as loosely aligned to Shabab. There are factions of the Shabab which are opposed to attacks on civilians. Probably support for this attack is not large even within the Shabab group itself.

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wally1

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Re: Attack on Nairobi Mall
Reply #44 - Sep 24^th, 2013 at 3:00pm

True Colours wrote on Sep 24^th, 2013 at 1:28pm:

The Shabab are just one of the many Islamist groups in Somalia. The people who carried out the attack on the Kenyan mall are just a small faction of shabab - probably best described as loosely aligned to Shabab. There are factions of the Shabab which are opposed to attacks on civilians. Probably support for this attack is not large even within the Shabab group itself.

These terrorist must be stupid.

Heard they were asking the hostages what the names of Prophet Mohammeds parents where.

According to Islamic scholars Prophet Mohamed parents where not muslims.

Just plain dumb.

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