Australian Politics Forum - Global warming science is fraudulant.....???

Ajax

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Global warming science is fraudulant.....???
Sep 27^th, 2013 at 1:18pm

Even the alarmist scientists are telling us that they've been selling us snake oil when it comes to global warming....??

So are governments still going to tax us on the air we breath so wall street can make a profit.......?????

Quote:

World's Top Climate Scientists Admit "Computers" Got Global Warming Wrong

If Climate Gate didn't silence the great global warming cult, then perhaps this will.

Climate scientists themselves now admit their calculations on global warming were WRONG, though they divert blame to glitchy computer models.

The reality is that all mainstream climate science to date has been fraudulent, and the fact that organizations like NASA and the CRU continually refuse to release the source data for their experiments to the public proves that they have been at least partially if not fully aware of the fraud.

Man-made climate change has been used as an excuse to fashion draconian environmental regulations that if implemented, will essentially tax the very air we breath, and set into motion the fantastical lie of "carbon pollution", which regards the very act of human existence as a threat to the stability of the Earth's biosphere.

It's an elitist's wet dream. Thankfully, the Liberty Movement and legitimate researchers have exposed the scam, making the enforcement of carbon controls on a wide scale almost impossible.

http://alt-market.com/articles/1718-worlds-top-climate-scientists-admit-qcompute...

Dailey Mail UK
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2420783/Worlds-climate-scientists-confes...

The Telegraph
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/environment/climatechange/10310712/Top-climate-...

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« Last Edit: Sep 27^th, 2013 at 1:42pm by Ajax »

1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery & prison" Regas Feraeos

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muso Gold Member Offline Posts: 13151 Gladstone, Queensland Gender:	Re: Global warming science is fraudulant.....??? Reply #1 - Sep 27^th, 2013 at 5:42pm Sounds a bit like that piece that the Australian retracted the other week. The British rags don't seem to be under the same obligation to print the truth.
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Chimp_Logic

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Re: Global warming science is fraudulant.....???
Reply #2 - Sep 27^th, 2013 at 5:59pm

Ajax

You have a problem with a new tax? Well that's something you can take up with your local sitting member of parliament.

I bet you wouldn't squeal when the Libs increase the GST in the next election.

In any case, what has your political distaste for a carbon tax got to do with the simple science that underpins AGW?

Sounds like you think the scientific data itself is part of some global conspiracy to impose controls and taxes upon your delusional sense of freedom.

In this particular forum YOU have a lot to answer for my friend!

You will be hunted down in here with the simple spear of truth.

Your chances of survival are limited from the arsenal of spin that I have seen you weave thus far in here.

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Life_goes_on Gold Member Offline Posts: 4772 400kms south of Yobsville, Qld Gender:	Re: Global warming science is fraudulant.....??? Reply #3 - Sep 27^th, 2013 at 6:03pm muso wrote on Sep 27^th, 2013 at 5:42pm: Sounds a bit like that piece that the Australian retracted the other week. The British rags don't seem to be under the same obligation to print the truth. Just read it. It seems to be exactly the same article where they later printed a retraction.
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BatteriesNotIncluded Gold Member Offline MediocrityNET: because people died for this! Posts: 26966	Re: Global warming science is fraudulant.....??? Reply #4 - Sep 28^th, 2013 at 1:24am one of the links was dated 27th september though so?????????????????????
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Ajax

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Re: Global warming science is fraudulant.....???
Reply #5 - Sep 30^th, 2013 at 10:16am

Chimp_Logic wrote on Sep 27^th, 2013 at 5:59pm:

Ajax

You have a problem with a new tax? Well that's something you can take up with your local sitting member of parliament.

I bet you wouldn't squeal when the Libs increase the GST in the next election.

In any case, what has your political distaste for a carbon tax got to do with the simple science that underpins AGW?

Sounds like you think the scientific data itself is part of some global conspiracy to impose controls and taxes upon your delusional sense of freedom.

In this particular forum YOU have a lot to answer for my friend!

You will be hunted down in here with the simple spear of truth.

Your chances of survival are limited from the arsenal of spin that I have seen you weave thus far in here.

Hey chimp

From what I have gathered on here is that you favour the carbon tax ETS because you think its going to clean pollution.

Just exactly which pollution are you hoping the carbon tax ETS is going to clean....????

Will it clean up corporations dumping sealed chemicals into our rivers, estuaries & oceans....???

Will it clean up land fill pollution..............????

Will it clean up corporations dumping sealed chemical into deep oceans or putting them into the ground.....????

The answer is a big fat NO....................???

The only thing taxing us on the air we breath will do is create a $2 trillion dollar carbon credit derivatives market.

And once that's up and running, the people who are behind this scam will let the CO2 issue drift into the back ground, even though emissions will rise just as they are now.

The media wont report about global warming anymore and we will be left with a tax on the air we breath.

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1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery & prison" Regas Feraeos

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Chimp_Logic

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Re: Global warming science is fraudulant.....???
Reply #6 - Sep 30^th, 2013 at 10:34am

Ajax wrote on Sep 30^th, 2013 at 10:16am:

Chimp_Logic wrote on Sep 27^th, 2013 at 5:59pm:

Ajax

You have a problem with a new tax? Well that's something you can take up with your local sitting member of parliament.

I bet you wouldn't squeal when the Libs increase the GST in the next election.

In any case, what has your political distaste for a carbon tax got to do with the simple science that underpins AGW?

Sounds like you think the scientific data itself is part of some global conspiracy to impose controls and taxes upon your delusional sense of freedom.

In this particular forum YOU have a lot to answer for my friend!

You will be hunted down in here with the simple spear of truth.

Your chances of survival are limited from the arsenal of spin that I have seen you weave thus far in here.

Hey chimp

From what I have gathered on here is that you favour the carbon tax ETS because you think its going to clean pollution.

No, I am not in favour of it, because the so called FREE MARKET combined with a taxing disincentive is ineffectual and inherently corrupt.

Did the world place a tax on CFCs and introduce a CFC trading regime on the stock market to mitigate the effects of CFCs on the ozone layer?

There was an international agreement to regulate and then finally ban CFCs from the environment.

How is the ozone layer doing now Ajax? Have you checked? Do you care?

My initial approach would be the TOTAL BAN of subsidies and grants to the any industry that emits CO2 from the combustion of fossil fuels or engages in other Carbon emitting activities such as de-forestation etc.

It will free up 1.4 trillion dollars world wide EACH YEAR, that can be used for tackling other social and environmental problems facing the human population.

(that 1.4 trillion dollars incidentally does NOT include the cost of many wars which are OIL or energy related. I net you haven't seen a war that has been over a Hydro electric dam or solar resources.)

The question is, Mr Ajax, is WHY you prefer to gallop along business as usual? Who are you to do nothing, and condemn future generations to the scrap heap?

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« Last Edit: Sep 30^th, 2013 at 11:14am by Chimp_Logic »

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Ajax

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Re: Global warming science is fraudulant.....???
Reply #7 - Sep 30^th, 2013 at 10:51am

Chimp_Logic wrote on Sep 30^th, 2013 at 10:34am:

No, I am not in favour of it, because the so called FREE MARKET combined with a taxing disincentive is ineffectual and inherently corrupt.

Did the world place a tax on CFCs and introduce a CFC trading regime on the stock market to mitigate the effects of CFCs on the ozone layer?

There was an international agreement to regulate and then finally ban CFCs from the environment.

Hey I agree on this issue, my two cents is why not simply spend the money here in Australia at grass roots level.

Just by converting our boilers over to LNG we would reduce our CO2 emissions by 25%, if we also use the latest technology in capturing pollution form coal fired power stations such as

1. Electrostatic precipitators - soot
2. Fabric Filter bags -soot
3. Scrubbers - CO2

We would be one of the cleanest industrialized nations on Earth, sure it will cost billions but only ONCE.

It wont be financial slavery for ever, and along the way we could encourage clean energy technology.

Tell me why should ten percent of Australia's carbon tax revenue be given over to the United Nations Environmental program, WTF are the UN going to do for us apart from hand us hefty finds if we don't meet the 5% target by 2020.

Quote:

How is the ozone layer doing now Ajax? Have you checked? Do you care?

Go and ask those smacking poms who blew the hole in our ozone in the 1950's testing their nuclear weapons.

While you're there ask them to fix it since they caused it, and to clean up all their nuclear rubbish that still lingers in central Australia.

Quote:

My initial approach would be the TOTAL BAN of subsidies and grants to the any industry that emits CO2 from the combustion of fossil fuels or engages in other Carbon emitting activities such as de-forestation etc.

It will free up 1.4 trillion dollars world wide EACH YEAR, that can be used for tackling other social and environmental problems facing the human population.

Hey i'm right with you on this one........!!!!!

Quote:

(that 1.4 trillion dollars incidentally does NOT include the cost of many wars which are OIL or energy related. I net you haven't seen a war that has been over a Hydro electric dam or solar resources.)

Again a agree....!!!!....no argument from me....!!!!

Quote:

The question is, Mr Ajax, is WHY you prefer to gallop along business as usual? Who are you to do nothing, and condemn future generations to the scrap heap?

Because the very same people that start wars for energy are the same that want to tax us all on the air we breath.

That's why...................!!!

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1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery & prison" Regas Feraeos

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muso Gold Member Offline Posts: 13151 Gladstone, Queensland Gender:	Re: Global warming science is fraudulant.....??? Reply #8 - Sep 30^th, 2013 at 10:58am Chimp, Where are you getting this 1.3 trillion dollar figure from? Ajax, You're a shocker, mate. You should be on Millionaire. You'd fit right in. I don't have time to address all your crazy proclamations right now.
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Chimp_Logic

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Re: Global warming science is fraudulant.....???
Reply #9 - Sep 30^th, 2013 at 11:23am

Ajax wrote on Sep 30^th, 2013 at 10:51am:

Chimp_Logic wrote on Sep 30^th, 2013 at 10:34am:

No, I am not in favour of it, because the so called FREE MARKET combined with a taxing disincentive is ineffectual and inherently corrupt.

Did the world place a tax on CFCs and introduce a CFC trading regime on the stock market to mitigate the effects of CFCs on the ozone layer?

There was an international agreement to regulate and then finally ban CFCs from the environment.

Hey I agree on this issue, my two cents is why not simply spend the money here in Australia at grass roots level.

Just by converting our boilers over to LNG we would reduce our CO2 emissions by 25%, if we also use the latest technology in capturing pollution form coal fired power stations such as

1. Electrostatic precipitators - soot
2. Fabric Filter bags -soot
3. Scrubbers - CO2

We would be one of the cleanest industrialized nations on Earth, sure it will cost billions but only ONCE.

It wont be financial slavery for ever, and along the way we could encourage clean energy technology.

Tell me why should ten percent of Australia's carbon tax revenue be given over to the United Nations Environmental program, WTF are the UN going to do for us apart from hand us hefty finds if we don't meet the 5% target by 2020.

Quote:

How is the ozone layer doing now Ajax? Have you checked? Do you care?

Go and ask those smacking poms who blew the hole in our ozone in the 1950's testing their nuclear weapons.

While you're there ask them to fix it since they caused it, and to clean up all their nuclear rubbish that still lingers in central Australia.

Quote:

My initial approach would be the TOTAL BAN of subsidies and grants to the any industry that emits CO2 from the combustion of fossil fuels or engages in other Carbon emitting activities such as de-forestation etc.

It will free up 1.4 trillion dollars world wide EACH YEAR, that can be used for tackling other social and environmental problems facing the human population.

Hey i'm right with you on this one........!!!!!

Quote:

(that 1.4 trillion dollars incidentally does NOT include the cost of many wars which are OIL or energy related. I net you haven't seen a war that has been over a Hydro electric dam or solar resources.)

Again a agree....!!!!....no argument from me....!!!!

Quote:

The question is, Mr Ajax, is WHY you prefer to gallop along business as usual? Who are you to do nothing, and condemn future generations to the scrap heap?

Because the very same people that start wars for energy are the same that want to tax us all on the air we breath.

That's why...................!!!

That may well be the case, but what does that have to do with the science of climate change and AGW?

Are you suggesting these very same war mongers are directing and corrupting the outcomes and publications of EVERY scientists working on AGW and climate change?

(on your CO2 scrubber solution, its clear you haven't done enough work on the feasibility, and scale of the scrubbers that would be needed to remove the CO2 from the stacks. SO2 scrubbers are used because of the low concentration of SO2 in the flue gases. The reason for this is to mitigate Acid Rain problems in the environment. I am sure that your know that precipitators and SO2 scrubbers are compulsory by law (in the West and most other nations). What do you suggest we do with the Carbonic acid produced in the scrubber liquor streams?)

There were alternatives to CFCs when the ban was introduced in the 1990s. There are non fossil fuel alternatives as well that can provide electricity. Why can you only see Natural gas as an alternative fuel? THis is not a long term solution.

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muso

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Re: Global warming science is fraudulant.....???
Reply #10 - Sep 30^th, 2013 at 11:33am

Chimp_Logic wrote on Sep 30^th, 2013 at 11:23am:

(on your CO2 scrubber solution, its clear you haven't done enough work on the feasibility, and scale of the scrubbers that would be needed to remove the CO2 from the stacks. SO2 scrubbers are used because of the low concentration of SO2 in the flue gases. The reason for this is to mitigate Acid Rain problems in the environment. I am sure that your know that precipitators and SO2 scrubbers are compulsory by law (in the West and most other nations). What do you suggest we do with the Carbonic acid produced in the scrubber liquor streams?)

You don't know much about coal fired power stations. They have their own legislation in a lot of cases.

Most do not have SO2 scrubbers. ESP? Yes. Visible emissions are ...well visible. They cause most outrage.

They might have trialled SO2 scrubbing way back in the 90's (most used sulfur trioxide) as part of an obligation, but very few actually use them.

As for CO2 scrubbers, as usual Ajax is in Bonkers Banana land. Never mind "What would you do with the liquor?" What about what would you do about the CO2 you produce while manufacturing the liquor? With sodium hydroxide, it's electricity intensive. With Calcium hydroxide, you have to roast limestone in air to produce it, thus emitting even more CO2.

Quote:

There were alternatives to CFCs when the ban was introduced in the 1990s. There are non fossil fuel alternatives as well that can provide electricity. Why can you only see Natural gas as an alternative fuel? THis is not a long term solution.

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Chimp_Logic

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Re: Global warming science is fraudulant.....???
Reply #11 - Sep 30^th, 2013 at 11:35am

muso wrote on Sep 30^th, 2013 at 10:58am:

Chimp,

Where are you getting this 1.3 trillion dollar figure from?

Ajax, You're a shocker, mate. You should be on Millionaire. You'd fit right in. I don't have time to address all your crazy proclamations right now.

1.4 trillion

(estimates can vary, the IMF for example put the level of fossil fuel subsidies world wide at about 1.9 trillion dollars per annum. I use an estimate acceptable within the industry I consult in on occasions)

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Chimp_Logic

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Re: Global warming science is fraudulant.....???
Reply #12 - Sep 30^th, 2013 at 11:44am

muso wrote on Sep 30^th, 2013 at 11:33am:

Chimp_Logic wrote on Sep 30^th, 2013 at 11:23am:

(on your CO2 scrubber solution, its clear you haven't done enough work on the feasibility, and scale of the scrubbers that would be needed to remove the CO2 from the stacks. SO2 scrubbers are used because of the low concentration of SO2 in the flue gases. The reason for this is to mitigate Acid Rain problems in the environment. I am sure that your know that precipitators and SO2 scrubbers are compulsory by law (in the West and most other nations). What do you suggest we do with the Carbonic acid produced in the scrubber liquor streams?)

Visible emissions are ...well visible. They cause most outrage.

you will find that the visible emissions associated with coal fired power stations is massive amounts of steam coming out of the cooling towers which dominate the skyline around the plants.

You rarely see dark smoke coming from the flue gas stacks if the bag houses are working ok etc

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muso Gold Member Offline Posts: 13151 Gladstone, Queensland Gender:	Re: Global warming science is fraudulant.....??? Reply #13 - Sep 30^th, 2013 at 11:44am Chimp, Have you looked at the NPI Web site? http://www.npi.gov.au/npidata/action/load/emission-by-substance-result/criteria/... That's for NSW. Substitute your own state if you like. If SO2 scrubbing is compulsory by law, why were 230,000 tonnes emitted by Electricity generation in 2011-12?
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muso

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Re: Global warming science is fraudulant.....???
Reply #14 - Sep 30^th, 2013 at 11:46am

Chimp_Logic wrote on Sep 30^th, 2013 at 11:44am:

you will find that the visible emissions associated with coal fired power stations is massive amounts of steam coming out of the cooling towers which dominate the skyline around the plants.

You rarely see dark smoke coming from the flue gas stacks if the bag houses are working ok etc

Correct. SO2 is different though. I worked for a coal fired power station for about a year, so I know the ins and outs.

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