Australian Politics Forum - The Trial of David Suzuki

Doctor Jolly Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 3808	Re: The Trial of David Suzuki Reply #15 - Nov 20^th, 2013 at 2:35pm The 'hiatis' is only in atmospheric temperatures. There has been no hiatis in ocean temperatures. So the planet as a whole has continue to warm in line with co2 emissions.
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lee

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Re: The Trial of David Suzuki
Reply #16 - Nov 20^th, 2013 at 3:06pm

Are you using all the results back to 1950 which are few and far between in the early years or just the Argo buoys from about 2000?

How big are the error bars for the early years because of the paucity of data? The Argo array was only completed in 2007.

A study published in International Journal of Geosciences in 2011, by Knox and Douglass, titled "Recent Energy Balance of Earth"

Quote

"ABSTRACT
A recently published estimate of Earth’s global warming trend is 0.63 ± 0.28 W/m2, as calculated from ocean heat content anomaly data spanning 1993-2008. This value is not representative of the recent (2003-2008) warming/cooling rate because of a “flattening” that occurred around 2001-2002. Using only 2003-2008 data from Argo floats, we find by four different algorithms that the recent trend ranges from –0.010 to –0.161 W/m2 with a typical error bar of ±0.2 W/m2. These results fail to support the existence of a frequently-cited large positive computed radiative imbalance."

Trenberth's heat is still missing.

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lee Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 18027 Gender:	Re: The Trial of David Suzuki Reply #17 - Nov 20^th, 2013 at 3:11pm BTW, did you notice "frequently-cited large positive computed radiative imbalance."?
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muso Gold Member Offline Posts: 13151 Gladstone, Queensland Gender:	Re: The Trial of David Suzuki Reply #18 - Nov 20^th, 2013 at 5:50pm Lee - we've already addressed this on another thread. You might have to search for it.
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muso Gold Member Offline Posts: 13151 Gladstone, Queensland Gender:	Re: The Trial of David Suzuki Reply #19 - Nov 20^th, 2013 at 5:54pm lee wrote on Nov 20^th, 2013 at 2:24pm: Of course it is meaningless- CO2 is a lagging indicator. It's an equilibrium. CO2 varies diurnally and seasonally. It's a nonsense to talk about lagging and leading over the preindustrial period. Let me clarify - you are talking about the pre-industrial period are you not?
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lee Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 18027 Gender:	Re: The Trial of David Suzuki Reply #20 - Nov 20^th, 2013 at 5:54pm I was merely responding to Doctor Jolly and his no hiatus scenario for ocean warming.
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Re: The Trial of David Suzuki
Reply #21 - Nov 20^th, 2013 at 5:59pm

As I said earlier, the signal for increased radiative forcing resulting from increasing CO2 concentration, is very clear and non controversial. It has been measured from satellite data.

I realise that you have no technical skills in this area and that you're basically cutting and pasting from sites like WUWT and Joanne Nova.

I am interrupting your "script " in an effort to make you think for yourself.

Before you do that, why don't you do some basic reading on how the Greenhouse Effect actually works?

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muso

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Re: The Trial of David Suzuki
Reply #22 - Nov 20^th, 2013 at 6:05pm

lee wrote on Nov 20^th, 2013 at 5:54pm:

I was merely responding to Doctor Jolly and his no hiatus scenario for ocean warming.

Until you answer my question, I'll take that as meaning that you have no idea which period you are referring to, and that you are simply parroting what you have read elsewhere. You might have to phone a friend or something.

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lee Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 18027 Gender:	Re: The Trial of David Suzuki Reply #23 - Nov 20^th, 2013 at 6:22pm Yep, that's why I read scientific articles as listed above.
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muso

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Re: The Trial of David Suzuki
Reply #24 - Nov 20^th, 2013 at 6:56pm

The problem is that you didn't just happen to find it. You read about it on a blog first.

You either read this article or one that parotted it. The reason I know this is that we've already been through this with another poster.

http://joannenova.com.au/2011/12/the-travesty-of-the-missing-heat-deep-ocean-or-...

The other giveaway is that the conclusion that there is missing heat doesn't actually come from that paper itself.

So about that that little furphy that you actually read scientific papers like that one? C'mon - you don't have the technical knowledge to understand that paper.

Embarrassed yet?

lee wrote on Nov 20^th, 2013 at 6:22pm:

Yep, that's why I read scientific articles as listed above.

tut tut

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« Last Edit: Nov 20^th, 2013 at 7:03pm by muso »

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lee Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 18027 Gender:	Re: The Trial of David Suzuki Reply #25 - Nov 20^th, 2013 at 7:50pm The missing heat is Trenberth's claim- not mine. It was in a comment below the attrib- making it mine alone. You really need to lighten up. I've previously said I use WUWT and then go to the article. I see no shame in it. How do you get your updates on climate happenings?
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muso

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Re: The Trial of David Suzuki
Reply #26 - Nov 20^th, 2013 at 8:13pm

lee wrote on Nov 20^th, 2013 at 7:50pm:

The missing heat is Trenberth's claim- not mine. It was in a comment below the attrib- making it mine alone.

You really need to lighten up. I've previously said I use WUWT and then go to the article. I see no shame in it. How do you get your updates on climate happenings?

It wasn't Kevin Trenberth's claim.

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muso Gold Member Offline Posts: 13151 Gladstone, Queensland Gender:	Re: The Trial of David Suzuki Reply #27 - Nov 20^th, 2013 at 8:19pm lee wrote on Nov 20^th, 2013 at 7:50pm: How do you get your updates on climate happenings? I subscribe to Scientific Journals.
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lee

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Re: The Trial of David Suzuki
Reply #28 - Nov 20^th, 2013 at 9:38pm

'The main energy reservoir is the ocean, which sequesters energy as heat.' - Part of opening paragraph, Science 16 April 2010
'Tracking Earth's Energy Kevin E. Trenberth and John T. Fasullo'
sciencemag .org / content/328/5976/316.summary

'This gives rise to the concept of “missing energy” (Trenberth and Fasullo 2010). ' - Energy and Climate - Dr Kevin E Trenberth
at rmets .org /weather-and-climate/climate/energy-and-climate-dr-kevin-e-trenberth

Pretty much says it all.

As a pensioner I can't afford scientific journals. And the Library has about 100 books.

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« Last Edit: Nov 20^th, 2013 at 9:45pm by lee »

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Re: The Trial of David Suzuki
Reply #29 - Nov 21^st, 2013 at 1:15pm

lee wrote on Nov 20^th, 2013 at 9:38pm:

...
As a pensioner I can't afford scientific journals. And the Library has about 100 books.

As an amateur, you evidently don't understand what you read. That's the problem with research in ignorance. The results of our "research" invariably support our beliefs.

It's only human. Much of science is devoted to mitigating that human failing. That's why we have peer review.

That's why the denyosphere had to construct its own system of reviews. Their studies never made the grade in the established system. What they do is not science; it's confirmation of beliefs.

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