Australian Politics Forum - If you get on a boat

Stratos

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 4725

Re: If you get on a boat
Reply #30 - Nov 30^th, 2013 at 6:28pm

progressiveslol wrote on Nov 30^th, 2013 at 6:18pm:

Do indonesia torture children.

No Australians do by sending them to detention centers despite the fact they have done nothing wrong.

Latest UNHCR reports into the conditions of the detention centers we send people to.

Naaru- http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-11-27/unhcr-report-on-nauru/5118588

"rat-infested, cramped and very hot"

"It's not appropriate for families and children to be transferred to Nauru or Papua New Guinea and the suggestions and proposals for transferring unaccompanied children for us is even more deeply concerning," the UNHCR's Richard Towle said.

"Unaccompanied children are already very vulnerable and to place them in situations of uncertainty and tough physical conditions... could be very damaging to their health and well-being.""

"People are being held in what we found to be mandatory, arbitrary detention settings," Mr Towle said."

"If not addressed very carefully, we could see a fairly rapid degradation of psycho-social and physical health if people don't have a fairly early determination of their fate and future."

Are you seriously OK with sending innocent children into a rat infested, cramped, hot tent where they are unaccompanied, while also undergoing conditions that could deteriorate their physical and mental health for an indefinite amount of time? Would this be acceptable situation to put ANY child on earth in?

progressiveslol wrote on Nov 30^th, 2013 at 6:18pm:

Do indonesia torture children.

Refugees are not recognised under Indonesian law, and are unavailable to either work or receive any form of government support.

Back to top

Pete Waldo wrote on Jan 15^th, 2014 at 11:24pm:

Thus killing those Canaanite babies while they were still innocent, was a particularly merciful act

IP Logged

progressiveslol

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 17029

Re: If you get on a boat
Reply #31 - Nov 30^th, 2013 at 6:30pm

Stratos wrote on Nov 30^th, 2013 at 6:28pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Nov 30^th, 2013 at 6:18pm:

Do indonesia torture children.

No Australians do by sending them to detention centers despite the fact they have done nothing wrong.

Latest UNHCR reports into the conditions of the detention centers we send people to.

Naaru- http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-11-27/unhcr-report-on-nauru/5118588

"rat-infested, cramped and very hot"

"It's not appropriate for families and children to be transferred to Nauru or Papua New Guinea and the suggestions and proposals for transferring unaccompanied children for us is even more deeply concerning," the UNHCR's Richard Towle said.

"Unaccompanied children are already very vulnerable and to place them in situations of uncertainty and tough physical conditions... could be very damaging to their health and well-being.""

"People are being held in what we found to be mandatory, arbitrary detention settings," Mr Towle said."

"If not addressed very carefully, we could see a fairly rapid degradation of psycho-social and physical health if people don't have a fairly early determination of their fate and future."

Are you seriously OK with sending innocent children into a rat infested, cramped, hot tent where they are unaccompanied, while also undergoing conditions that could deteriorate their physical and mental health for an indefinite amount of time? Would this be acceptable situation to put ANY child on earth in?

progressiveslol wrote on Nov 30^th, 2013 at 6:18pm:

Do indonesia torture children.

Refugees are not recognised under Indonesian law, and are unavailable to either work or receive any form of government support.

Oh, so you would like to see more numbers of children go to their death, than have to be in detention centres? Why would anyone want children to die?

Back to top

IP Logged

Stratos

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 4725

Re: If you get on a boat
Reply #32 - Nov 30^th, 2013 at 6:37pm

progressiveslol wrote on Nov 30^th, 2013 at 6:30pm:

Oh, so you would like to see more numbers of children go to their death, than have to be in detention centres? Why would anyone want children to die?

Nope, and if you bothered to read before, I said as much. There are lots of options as to how we can help asylum seekers travel safely.

I will ask you again:

Stratos wrote on Nov 30^th, 2013 at 6:28pm:

Are you seriously OK with sending innocent children into a rat infested, cramped, hot tent where they are unaccompanied, while also undergoing conditions that could deteriorate their physical and mental health for an indefinite amount of time? Would this be acceptable situation to put ANY child on earth in?

Back to top

Pete Waldo wrote on Jan 15^th, 2014 at 11:24pm:

Thus killing those Canaanite babies while they were still innocent, was a particularly merciful act

IP Logged

progressiveslol

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 17029

Re: If you get on a boat
Reply #33 - Nov 30^th, 2013 at 7:05pm

Stratos wrote on Nov 30^th, 2013 at 6:37pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Nov 30^th, 2013 at 6:30pm:

Oh, so you would like to see more numbers of children go to their death, than have to be in detention centres? Why would anyone want children to die?

Nope, and if you bothered to read before, I said as much. There are lots of options as to how we can help asylum seekers travel safely.

I will ask you again:

Stratos wrote on Nov 30^th, 2013 at 6:28pm:

Are you seriously OK with sending innocent children into a rat infested, cramped, hot tent where they are unaccompanied, while also undergoing conditions that could deteriorate their physical and mental health for an indefinite amount of time? Would this be acceptable situation to put ANY child on earth in?

Are they dead yet? Seriously, you know my point by now. Me, they are alive, you, you want them to be dead or have the chance of it.

Back to top

IP Logged

Stratos Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 4725	Re: If you get on a boat Reply #34 - Nov 30^th, 2013 at 7:08pm So you ARE ok with the indefinite detention and torture of innocent people. Geez.....
Back to top	Pete Waldo wrote on Jan 15^th, 2014 at 11:24pm: Thus killing those Canaanite babies while they were still innocent, was a particularly merciful act IP Logged

progressiveslol Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 17029	Re: If you get on a boat Reply #35 - Nov 30^th, 2013 at 7:09pm Stratos wrote on Nov 30^th, 2013 at 7:08pm: So you ARE ok with the indefinite detention and torture of innocent people. Geez..... Do Indonesia torture children. Is that why they left the (so called) safe haven? Links.....
Back to top	IP Logged

Stratos

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 4725

Re: If you get on a boat
Reply #36 - Nov 30^th, 2013 at 7:38pm

Refugees have no rights in Indonesia Progressiveslol, which is why they travel to Australia by boat. They cannot work, and receive no government assistance. They have no livelihood and no possible future there.

http://www.unhcr.org/pages/49e488116.html will show you some of the problems in the area.

http://theconversation.com/asylum-seekers-in-indonesia-why-do-they-get-on-boats-... has some info too

"Officially, asylum seekers and refugees are not allowed to work nor do they have access to social support from the Indonesian government. Some receive assistance from UNHCR (through its implementing partner, Church World Service), the International Organization for Migration (pursuant to an arrangement with Australia), or local charities, but others have to fend for themselves."

Back to top

Pete Waldo wrote on Jan 15^th, 2014 at 11:24pm:

Thus killing those Canaanite babies while they were still innocent, was a particularly merciful act

IP Logged

Karnal

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 96597

Re: If you get on a boat
Reply #37 - Nov 30^th, 2013 at 8:20pm

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Nov 30^th, 2013 at 11:43am:

John S wrote on Nov 29^th, 2013 at 10:38pm:

This clip shows Scott Morrison addressing detainees on Nauru just over a week ago. It was taken from local Nauruan TV. There’s not much I can say except the man is scum and the thought of him being a Minister in the government that runs this country is sickening.

http://cafewhispers.wordpress.com/2013/11/29/you-will-not-be-getting-what-you-go...

Thanks for bringing this to our attention.
It's brilliant. Finally some balls shown on the issue.
My respect for Morrison just went up.

Absolute nonsense. It shows him pandering to a bunch of illegals, giving them more time than the decent white Australians he refuses to answer questions to.

Scott Morrison is no better than an appeasing, spineless apologist.

Pathetic, leftards, just pathetic.

Back to top

IP Logged

Peter Freedman Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 5275 Wellington Gender:	Re: If you get on a boat Reply #38 - Dec 1^st, 2013 at 12:40am Karnal wrote on Nov 30^th, 2013 at 12:00am: What’s he doing appearing on foreign TV? These people are the enemy. Fancy sucking up to the Nauruans. He should tell them all to go jump. Well, at least he gave an interview to someone. Back home the media can't find him.
Back to top	God grant me the patience to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can and, above all, the wisdom to tell the difference. IP Logged

longweekend58

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 45675
Gender: male

Re: If you get on a boat
Reply #39 - Dec 1^st, 2013 at 7:42am

Stratos wrote on Nov 30^th, 2013 at 6:28pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Nov 30^th, 2013 at 6:18pm:

Do indonesia torture children.

No Australians do by sending them to detention centers despite the fact they have done nothing wrong.

Latest UNHCR reports into the conditions of the detention centers we send people to.

Naaru- http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-11-27/unhcr-report-on-nauru/5118588

"rat-infested, cramped and very hot"

"It's not appropriate for families and children to be transferred to Nauru or Papua New Guinea and the suggestions and proposals for transferring unaccompanied children for us is even more deeply concerning," the UNHCR's Richard Towle said.

"Unaccompanied children are already very vulnerable and to place them in situations of uncertainty and tough physical conditions... could be very damaging to their health and well-being.""

"People are being held in what we found to be mandatory, arbitrary detention settings," Mr Towle said."

"If not addressed very carefully, we could see a fairly rapid degradation of psycho-social and physical health if people don't have a fairly early determination of their fate and future."

Are you seriously OK with sending innocent children into a rat infested, cramped, hot tent where they are unaccompanied, while also undergoing conditions that could deteriorate their physical and mental health for an indefinite amount of time? Would this be acceptable situation to put ANY child on earth in?

progressiveslol wrote on Nov 30^th, 2013 at 6:18pm:

Do indonesia torture children.

Refugees are not recognised under Indonesian law, and are unavailable to either work or receive any form of government support.

they are illegal aliens... which is a criminal offence. every other country on the planet has the same crime. you cannot just go to another country without ID and permission.

Back to top

AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

IP Logged

Stratos

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 4725

Re: If you get on a boat
Reply #40 - Dec 1^st, 2013 at 7:50am

longweekend58 wrote on Dec 1^st, 2013 at 7:42am:

they are illegal aliens... which is a criminal offence.

According to article 31 of the UN convention, anyone travelling to a country for the purposes of seeking asylum cannot be punished for anything that would under normal circumstances be illegal, such as engaging the services of a people smuggler, or arriving in the country without a visa or passport.

This still has nothing to do with the fact that Australian indefinitely imprisons children in rat infested, crowded camps anyway.

Even if you do think that they are committing a crime (and they aren't), then is this still suitable way to treat children?

You could do with the same question Progressives is refusing to answer Longy
Stratos wrote on Nov 30^th, 2013 at 6:28pm:

Are you seriously OK with sending innocent children into a rat infested, cramped, hot tent where they are unaccompanied, while also undergoing conditions that could deteriorate their physical and mental health for an indefinite amount of time? Would this be acceptable situation to put ANY child on earth in?

Back to top

Pete Waldo wrote on Jan 15^th, 2014 at 11:24pm:

Thus killing those Canaanite babies while they were still innocent, was a particularly merciful act

IP Logged

Big Dave

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 2164
Gender: male

Re: If you get on a boat
Reply #41 - Dec 1^st, 2013 at 8:19am

Stratos wrote on Dec 1^st, 2013 at 7:50am:

longweekend58 wrote on Dec 1^st, 2013 at 7:42am:

they are illegal aliens... which is a criminal offence.

According to article 31 of the UN convention, anyone travelling to a country for the purposes of seeking asylum cannot be punished for anything that would under normal circumstances be illegal, such as engaging the services of a people smuggler, or arriving in the country without a visa or passport.

This still has nothing to do with the fact that Australian indefinitely imprisons children in rat infested, crowded camps anyway.

Even if you do think that they are committing a crime (and they aren't), then is this still suitable way to treat children?

You could do with the same question Progressives is refusing to answer Longy
Stratos wrote on Nov 30^th, 2013 at 6:28pm:

Are you seriously OK with sending innocent children into a rat infested, cramped, hot tent where they are unaccompanied, while also undergoing conditions that could deteriorate their physical and mental health for an indefinite amount of time? Would this be acceptable situation to put ANY child on earth in?

Putting your children in a dangerous unseaworthy vessel should be a crime. I don't care how much I wanted to move to another country I could never do that. The skippers should be prosecuted for overloading etc. Ideally if a boat goes down and children die then parents should be prosecuted for manslaughter. Same as the skippers. To say there are no crimes associated with people smuggling is absurd. The reason why nothing happens is too many leftists are involved in it. Both in Australia and nationally.

Back to top

IP Logged

greggerypeccary

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 139542
Gender: male

Re: If you get on a boat
Reply #42 - Dec 1^st, 2013 at 8:21am

longweekend58 wrote on Dec 1^st, 2013 at 7:42am:

Stratos wrote on Nov 30^th, 2013 at 6:28pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Nov 30^th, 2013 at 6:18pm:

Do indonesia torture children.

No Australians do by sending them to detention centers despite the fact they have done nothing wrong.

Latest UNHCR reports into the conditions of the detention centers we send people to.

Naaru- http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-11-27/unhcr-report-on-nauru/5118588

"rat-infested, cramped and very hot"

"It's not appropriate for families and children to be transferred to Nauru or Papua New Guinea and the suggestions and proposals for transferring unaccompanied children for us is even more deeply concerning," the UNHCR's Richard Towle said.

"Unaccompanied children are already very vulnerable and to place them in situations of uncertainty and tough physical conditions... could be very damaging to their health and well-being.""

"People are being held in what we found to be mandatory, arbitrary detention settings," Mr Towle said."

"If not addressed very carefully, we could see a fairly rapid degradation of psycho-social and physical health if people don't have a fairly early determination of their fate and future."

Are you seriously OK with sending innocent children into a rat infested, cramped, hot tent where they are unaccompanied, while also undergoing conditions that could deteriorate their physical and mental health for an indefinite amount of time? Would this be acceptable situation to put ANY child on earth in?

progressiveslol wrote on Nov 30^th, 2013 at 6:18pm:

Do indonesia torture children.

Refugees are not recognised under Indonesian law, and are unavailable to either work or receive any form of government support.

they are illegal aliens... which is a criminal offence. every other country on the planet has the same crime. you cannot just go to another country without ID and permission.

Incorrect.

You need to read the UN Convention again.

Back to top

IP Logged

Stratos

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 4725

Re: If you get on a boat
Reply #43 - Dec 1^st, 2013 at 8:32am

Big Dave wrote on Dec 1^st, 2013 at 8:19am:

Putting your children in a dangerous unseaworthy vessel should be a crime. I don't care how much I wanted to move to another country I could never do that.

Remember, 90% of refugees are found to have a genuine claim to asylum, as in can demonstrate that they were fleeing a very real risk to their safety or freedom. A lot of these people have no other options.

Big Dave wrote on Dec 1^st, 2013 at 8:19am:

The skippers should be prosecuted for overloading etc

Agreed, but then again, the people running the show ARE actually committing a crime, unlike their passengers.
Big Dave wrote on Dec 1^st, 2013 at 8:19am:

Same as the skippers. To say there are no crimes associated with people smuggling is absurd

It is a crime to facilitate in people smuggling, but not if you are using their services to seek asylum. Go after the smugglers and organisers sure, leave the innocents out of it.

Back to top

Pete Waldo wrote on Jan 15^th, 2014 at 11:24pm:

Thus killing those Canaanite babies while they were still innocent, was a particularly merciful act

IP Logged

Big Dave

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 2164
Gender: male

Re: If you get on a boat
Reply #44 - Dec 1^st, 2013 at 8:36am

Stratos wrote on Dec 1^st, 2013 at 8:32am:

Big Dave wrote on Dec 1^st, 2013 at 8:19am:

Putting your children in a dangerous unseaworthy vessel should be a crime. I don't care how much I wanted to move to another country I could never do that.

Remember, 90% of refugees are found to have a genuine claim to asylum, as in can demonstrate that they were fleeing a very real risk to their safety or freedom. A lot of these people have no other options.

Big Dave wrote on Dec 1^st, 2013 at 8:19am:

The skippers should be prosecuted for overloading etc

Agreed, but then again, the people running the show ARE actually committing a crime, unlike their passengers.
Big Dave wrote on Dec 1^st, 2013 at 8:19am:

Same as the skippers. To say there are no crimes associated with people smuggling is absurd

It is a crime to facilitate in people smuggling, but not if you are using their services to seek asylum. Go after the smugglers and organisers sure, leave the innocents out of it.

So putting your children on a boat that could sink is not a child welfare issue? So in your eyes it's not a crime to drive a vessel of people out to sea knowing it's unsafe?

Back to top

IP Logged