Don't let Yadda's personal note distract you gand.

polite_gandalf wrote on Jan 31^st, 2014 at 11:39am:


OK gand, this is a request I will not allow you to ignore.
Please provide evidence to support your accusation.

polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 7^th, 2014 at 6:57am:


Nor are you ashamed of Muhammad's imperialistic aggression, mass murder of innocent young Jewish farm boys, their dads and grandpas - who never struck a blow - the rape of their little sisters, moms and grandmothers, and theft of the fruit of their labor of generations.

However Jesus did not even try to defend Himself. He knew He was to serve as the sacrificial Lamb of God.
http://www.islamandthetruth.com/the_lamb_slain.htm

To carry the weight of the sins of the world, just as prophesied in Isaiah so many hundreds of years in advance:
http://www.islamandthetruth.com/isaiah_53.htm

Isaiah 53:5 But he [was] wounded for our transgressions, [he was] bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace [was] upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.   6 All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.   7 He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth.   8 He was taken from prison and from judgment: and who shall declare his generation? for he was cut off out of the land of the living: for the transgression of my people was he stricken.

He even forgave those who crucified Him.
http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Luk&c=23&v=34&t=KJV#s=996034

You see gand, Muhammad was the exact opposite of Jesus. That is why you are trying to tear the sinless Messiah down to the level Muhammad's carnal reprobate nature.
http://www.falseprophetmuhammad.com/jesus_or_muhammad.htm

polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 7^th, 2014 at 6:57am:


I even warned you about filthy lying Islamic dissimulators like Ahmed Deedat and Yusuf Estes. It is pervasive throughout the Islamic community, because Muhammadans follow the father of lies.
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1390996044

Unless you give me reason to believe otherwise I'll continue to presume you are one of their Bible-ignorant unwitting victims, rather than a witting perpetrator of such lies.
So didn't you ever read the passage and try thinking for yourself?

polite_gandalf wrote on Jan 31^st, 2014 at 11:39am:


So what kind of "(violent) defense of the new religion" do you suppose they would have been out to wage, against the Roman army that was coming to get Jesus, when Jesus considered 2 swords to be enough?

polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 7^th, 2014 at 11:10am:


I realize that facing the sinless Messiah as compared to Muhammad's reprobate behavior is difficult for antichrists. But to continue to make such a ridiculous suggestion about your prooftexted verses, expresses such abject ignorance to the Gospel and its prophets and witnesses, as to be absolutely appalling. Let alone your insisting on continuing in self-imposed abject ignorance to the very verses you quoted.

Why don't you start by simply answering the question I posed at the bottom of the post instead of wasting more of our time?

True Colours wrote on Feb 7^th, 2014 at 9:12pm:


The scriptures contain more than one verse. Seems you've been fooled by Islam's dissimulating liars, like Ahmed Deedat and Yusuf Estes, that take advantage of their Bible-ignorant adoring minions.
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1390996044

Let's check out a few more verses:

1 John 2:22  Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ?

He is antichrist, that denieth

the Father and

the Son.

23

Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father:

[(but) he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also].

1John 4:14 And we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son [to be] the Saviour of the world. 15 Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God.

2John 1:9 Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.

1John 5:12 He that hath the Son hath life; [and] he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.
                           
1John 5:10 He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not

God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son.

Hebrews 10:29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
                     
2Peter 2:1 But there were false prophets also among the people,

even as there shall be false teachers among you

, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.
http://www.falseprophetmuhammad.com/

John 3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and

he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

I hope that helped. There are of course hundreds of verses in the New Testament that reveal the Son of God:
http://www.islamandthetruth.com/jesus_the_son_of_god.htm
And His Father:
http://www.islamandthetruth.com/god_the_father.htm

Yet those that follow the false prophet Muhammad alone, through his STAND-ALONE heavily abrogated 23 year 7th century record, must reject the 1600 year record of Yahweh to mankind as revealed through all of His prophets and witnesses, whose people have followed Him through two covenants for 3500 years.

True Colours wrote on Feb 7^th, 2014 at 9:45pm:


That would be the name of the Arabian pagan's moon god "Allah":
http://www.falseprophetmuhammad.com/the_name_allah.htm

The name on the head of THE false prophet Muhammad's Islamic kingdom "beast".
http://www.beholdthebeast.com/leopard_bear_lion_beast.htm

True Colours wrote on Feb 7^th, 2014 at 9:45pm:


But as the verses I quoted from scripture clearly indicate, Muhammad was an antichrist liar that denied the Lord that bought him.
http://www.falseprophetmuhammad.com/

So why would you believe the fable in his 23 year 7th century record about a one eyed boogieman, any more than you should believe his ridiculous story about riding on a flying donkey-mule from Mecca, to Jerusalem, up to the "paradise" of his overactive imagination, and back to Mecca by morning?
http://www.brotherpete.com/mohammeds_night_journey.htm

Try reading the verses in my prior post again. Your choice, your fate.

Why use the big gaps between text? So you can rush the thread to the next page so you won't have to continue to face those scriptures?

Pete Waldo wrote on Feb 7^th, 2014 at 7:13am:


Obviously not (and by the way, Jesus was arrested by the jewish temple guards - not the Romans). Jesus was meant to be arrested, it was God's plan, so there's obviously no sense in resisting that.

Look I understand the metaphorical interpretation of that verse, but the literal interpretation - that this sanctions violence in self defense is not exactly a fringe view amongst Christians. It also arguably contextualises Exodus 22:2-3 - "he who lives by the sword will die by the sword" (ie only use violence when absolutely necessary, and don't use it in excess). These are reasonable arguments that have already been made. Perhaps you should take more notice of your own theological debates.

A good brief analysis:
http://www.loveyourenemies.org/sword.html

polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 7^th, 2014 at 10:18pm:


The Jews lived at the pleasure of the Romans, under the Roman Empire (until they were slaughtered by the Romans in 70 AD and again in 132 AD). That's why they appealed to Pilate.

John 19:6 When the chief priests therefore and officers saw him, they cried out, saying, Crucify him, crucify him. Pilate saith unto them, Take ye him, and crucify him: for I find no fault in him. 7 The Jews answered him, We have a law, and by our law he ought to die, because he made himself the Son of God.

Jesus was executed for being the Son of God. Thus Muhammad's followers crucify Jesus all over again, day in and day out.
http://www.falseprophetmuhammad.com/islam_is_antichrist.htm
Regarding those that came there were indeed officers of the Jews but:

KJV John 18:12 Then the band and the captain and officers of the Jews took Jesus, and bound him,

band Strong's G4686 - speira
1. a military cohort
the tenth part of legion
about 600 men i.e. legionaries
if auxiliaries either 500 or 1000
a maniple, or the thirtieth part of a legion
2. any band, company, or detachment, of soldiers

captain - Strong's G5506 - chiliarchos
1. a chiliarch, the commander of a thousand soldiers
2. the commander of a Roman cohort (a military tribunal)
3. any military commander

polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 7^th, 2014 at 10:18pm:


That's right. It also refutes your accusation that the intent of the verses you prooftexted were toward a "(violent) defense of the new religion" of Christianity with only two swords. So until you present further evidence to support your accusation it will remain a false one. That's why I initially referred to it simply as an accusation, hoping you would eventually see your way clear, to label it appropriately yourself.

Were the disciples sent out to spread the Gospel with swords the way Muhammad's followers were? They didn't even have money, let alone a spare coat.

Mat 10:9 Provide neither gold, nor silver, nor brass in your purses, 10 Nor scrip for your journey, neither two coats, neither shoes, nor yet staves: for the workman is worthy of his meat.

Everywhere they went they were invited to meals and lodging. However they of course weren't unarmed, or without armor:

Eph 6:14 Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness; 15 And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace; 16 Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked. 17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:

How many of Jesus' followers died in a sword fight? Did Jesus' disciples die inadvertently while in the act of murdering others, the way Muhammad's followers did during their imperialistic aggression of the First Jihad, or were the Apostles and disciples of Jesus simply murdered in cold blood purely because of what they believed, just the way Christians continue to be murdered all around the world today by Muhammadans?
http://www.falseprophetmuhammad.com/muslim_persecution_of_christians.htm

The Bible tells us who the liars are:

"Who is the liar? It is whoever denies that Jesus is the Christ."
  - 1 John 2:22



Muslims: "Jesus is the Christ!"

Jews: "Jesus is not Christ"


So who are the enemies of Christ? Who will be the supporters of the Anti-Christ?


"And therefore did the Jews persecute Jesus..."
  - John 5:16

"Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him"
  -John 5:18

"Jesus walked in Galilee: for he would not walk in Jewry, because the Jews sought to kill him"
  - John 7:1


"no man spake openly of him for fear of the Jews."
  - John 7:13

"Then answered the Jews, and said unto him (Jesus), Say we not well that thou art a Samaritan, and hast a devil?"
  -John 8:48

"Then said the Jews unto him (Jesus), Now we know that thou hast a devil.
  -John 8:52

"They feared the Jews: for the Jews had agreed already, that if any man did confess that he (Jesus) was Christ, he should be put out of the synagogue."
- John 9:21

Joseph of Arimathaea, being a disciple of Jesus, but secretly for fear of the Jews
  - John 19:38

the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews
  - John 20:19

the Jews took counsel to kill him
  - Acts 9:23

when the Jews saw the multitudes, they were filled with envy
  - Acts 13:45

the unbelieving Jews stirred up the Gentiles, and made their minds evil affected against the brethren
  -Acts 14:2

But the Jews which believed not, moved with envy, took unto them certain lewd fellows of the baser sort, and gathered a company, and set all the city on an uproar, and assaulted the house of Jason
- Acts 17:5






"Then came the Jews round about him, and said unto him, How long dost thou make us to doubt? If thou be the Christ, tell us plainly. Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not...Then the Jews took up stones again to stone him."
  - John 10:24-32


"Jesus therefore walked no more openly among the Jews"
  - John 11:54

"Then the band and the captain and officers of the Jews took Jesus, and bound him"
  - John 18:12


"I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty (but thou art rich), and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not but the synagogue of Satan."
  - Revelations 2:9




Anas bin Malik reported that Prophet Muhammed (may peace be upon him) said: "The Anti-Christ would be followed by seventy thousand Jews..."
(Sahih Muslim - Book 041,Hadith Number 7034)