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underage marriage in Sydney (Read 114556 times)
polite_gandalf
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Re: underage marriage in Sydney
Reply #375 - Feb 27th, 2014 at 8:08am
 
Yadda wrote on Feb 27th, 2014 at 7:56am:
Why is it, that wherever moslems live in the world [within non-ISLAMIC jurisdictions], a substantial number of moslems ENGAGE IN LAWLESSNESS AND ACTIVELY FLOUT LOCAL LAWS, AND ENGAGE IN LAWLESS BEHAVIOUR ?


gandalf,

Is it because moslems are ignorant, about local laws ?

Or is it because moslems, themselves, have intentionally, and deceitfully, and disrespectfully, decided to flout local laws, AND ENGAGE IN LAWLESS BEHAVIOUR ?


Probably a combination of both I'm guessing Y.

Question for you: what have studies in the west demonstrated about muslim criminals and their connections to local islamic religious institutions:

answer: overwhelmingly, the pattern has been the more associated a muslim individual is with their local mosque/community, the less likely they are to be involved in criminal activity.

I feel its pertinent to point this out.
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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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Yadda
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Re: underage marriage in Sydney
Reply #376 - Feb 27th, 2014 at 8:30am
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 27th, 2014 at 8:08am:
Yadda wrote on Feb 27th, 2014 at 7:56am:
Why is it, that wherever moslems live in the world [within non-ISLAMIC jurisdictions], a substantial number of moslems ENGAGE IN LAWLESSNESS AND ACTIVELY FLOUT LOCAL LAWS, AND ENGAGE IN LAWLESS BEHAVIOUR ?


gandalf,

Is it because moslems are ignorant, about local laws ?

Or is it because moslems, themselves, have intentionally, and deceitfully, and disrespectfully, decided to flout local laws, AND ENGAGE IN LAWLESS BEHAVIOUR ?


Probably a combination of both I'm guessing Y.

Question for you: what have studies in the west demonstrated about muslim criminals and their connections to local islamic religious institutions:

answer: overwhelmingly, the pattern has been the more associated a muslim individual is with their local mosque/community, the less likely they are to be involved in criminal activity.

I feel its pertinent to point this out.





What a cop-out!

i.e.
When moslems are criminals, its got nothing to do with ISLAM, and the moslem community.

Moslem LAWLESSNESS, and the prevalence of LAWLESSNESS and LAWBREAKING among local moslems, has nothing to do with nothing.

"We moslems, are a virtuous people, don't you know!"



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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31
 
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polite_gandalf
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Re: underage marriage in Sydney
Reply #377 - Feb 27th, 2014 at 9:02am
 
Yadda wrote on Feb 27th, 2014 at 8:30am:
When moslems are criminals, its got nothing to do with ISLAM, and the moslem community.


The verifiable fact I just pointed out to you strongly indicates this - yes.
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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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Yadda
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Re: underage marriage in Sydney
Reply #378 - Feb 27th, 2014 at 9:05am
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 27th, 2014 at 8:08am:
Yadda wrote on Feb 27th, 2014 at 7:56am:
Why is it, that wherever moslems live in the world [within non-ISLAMIC jurisdictions], a substantial number of moslems ENGAGE IN LAWLESSNESS AND ACTIVELY FLOUT LOCAL LAWS, AND ENGAGE IN LAWLESS BEHAVIOUR ?


gandalf,

Is it because moslems are ignorant, about local laws ?

Or is it because moslems, themselves, have intentionally, and deceitfully, and disrespectfully, decided to flout local laws, AND ENGAGE IN LAWLESS BEHAVIOUR ?


Probably a combination of both I'm guessing Y.

Question for you: what have studies in the west demonstrated about muslim criminals and their connections to local islamic religious institutions:

answer: overwhelmingly, the pattern has been the more associated a muslim individual is with their local mosque/community, the less likely they are to be involved in criminal activity.

I feel its pertinent to point this out.




gandalf,

All criminality, undermines the structure and institutions of a society.


gandalf,

It can be argued, that in their own criminality, local moslems criminals are participating in an intentional and organised local ISLAMIC Jihad, to destroy [the functioning] local infidel society.

And so, it can be argued, that the local moslems criminals DO HAVE THE FULL [BUT DENIED, AND UNDECLARED] SANCTION OF THE LOCAL MOSLEM COMMUNITY.

Because those moslems [the moslems criminals who are disrupting the local infidel society], are participating in the holy ISLAMIC Jihad, to destroy [the functioning of] infidel society.

And therefore their actions [the moslems criminals] are helping 'the moslems' [i.e. the ummah], in their quest to destroy the infidels, in the aim of the moslem ummah, and to replace [an undermined, destroyed] infidel society with a Sharia based, ISLAMIC society.


'Moslems criminals', and intentional moslem criminality [which it could be argued, is being actually surreptitiously encouraged by the local moslem community] = = is in effect, an organised act of sedition against the local state.





+++


According to ISLAMIC doctrine, there is only one moslem jurisdiction/community.

Dictionary;
umma = = the whole community of Muslims bound together by ties of religion.



"Muslims are one ummah (community)
to the exclusion of all men. Believers are friends of one another to the exclusion of all outsiders."
Ishaq:231




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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31
 
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Stratos
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Re: underage marriage in Sydney
Reply #379 - Feb 27th, 2014 at 9:12am
 
Yadda wrote on Feb 27th, 2014 at 9:05am:
All criminality, undermines the structure and institutions of a society.


Jesus did things that were a crime in the society he lived in....
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Pete Waldo wrote on Jan 15th, 2014 at 11:24pm:
Thus killing those Canaanite babies while they were still innocent, was a particularly merciful act
 
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Yadda
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Re: underage marriage in Sydney
Reply #380 - Feb 27th, 2014 at 9:27am
 
Stratos wrote on Feb 27th, 2014 at 9:12am:
Yadda wrote on Feb 27th, 2014 at 9:05am:
All criminality, undermines the structure and institutions of a society.


Jesus did things that were a crime in the society he lived in....





Stratos,

Yes, go on.

Develop your argument that Jesus was an individual that promoted LAWLESSNESS [in the society in which he lived].

Oh do.            Tongue

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31
 
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polite_gandalf
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Re: underage marriage in Sydney
Reply #381 - Feb 27th, 2014 at 9:39am
 
Yadda wrote on Feb 27th, 2014 at 9:05am:
It can be argued, that in their own criminality, local moslems criminals are participating in an intentional and organised local ISLAMIC Jihad, to destroy [the functioning] local infidel society.


Hmmm lets see Y - local "muslim" drug dealing bikie gangs are:

a) common criminals after the usual common criminal things like money and power

or...

b) part of an organised islamic jihad to destroy local infidel society.

I think I'll go with option a  Tongue
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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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Karnal
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Re: underage marriage in Sydney
Reply #382 - Feb 27th, 2014 at 10:03am
 
Soren wrote on Feb 27th, 2014 at 7:28am:
Was there a hindu/christian child marriage scandal in the west, defended on hindu/christian grounds? It eluded me. Please refer.


Was there ever a Muslim child marriage scandal in the West that was justified on cultural grounds? One?

There’s been a fair few Christian cults that have done exactly that. The Mormonss and the Children of God are just two. The younger a girl is married off, the better. It’s for her own safetly, and as we know, the prophets had young wives and multiple brides, so it must be alright.

In 1901, Australia had a minimum age of marriage as 12. "Underage" marriage was common here. If anyone accused Australians in 1901 as being paedophiles, they’d hear a barrage of justifications.

You’re returning to form again, old boy, but it was nice to see a moment of clarity where you discussed actual facts.

Such moments are becoming so rare these days. Alas, it’s not your fault. It’s the symptoms.

We all sympathize, dear boy.
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« Last Edit: Feb 27th, 2014 at 10:26am by Karnal »  
 
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Stratos
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Re: underage marriage in Sydney
Reply #383 - Feb 27th, 2014 at 10:21am
 
Yadda wrote on Feb 27th, 2014 at 9:27am:
Develop your argument that Jesus was an individual that promoted LAWLESSNESS [in the society in which he lived].


This wasn't my point.  my point was that when you say things like this:

Yadda wrote on Feb 27th, 2014 at 9:05am:
All criminality, undermines the structure and institutions of a society.


You are saying it like it is necessarily a bad thing, when your own saviour did the very actions you are riling against.

Jesus disregarded many laws of his society, and definitely his actions lead to udnermine the structure and insitutions of a society (the pharisees)

I don't think it was a bad thing, as many of the laws he was breaking (i.e. healing someone on the sabbath) were pretty dumb to begin with.
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Pete Waldo wrote on Jan 15th, 2014 at 11:24pm:
Thus killing those Canaanite babies while they were still innocent, was a particularly merciful act
 
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Soren
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Re: underage marriage in Sydney
Reply #384 - Feb 27th, 2014 at 9:26pm
 
Karnal wrote on Feb 27th, 2014 at 10:03am:
Soren wrote on Feb 27th, 2014 at 7:28am:
Was there a hindu/christian child marriage scandal in the west, defended on hindu/christian grounds? It eluded me. Please refer.


Was there ever a Muslim child marriage scandal in the West that was justified on cultural grounds? One?

There’s been a fair few Christian cults that have done exactly that. The Mormonss and the Children of God are just two. The younger a girl is married off, the better. It’s for her own safetly, and as we know, the prophets had young wives and multiple brides, so it must be alright.

In 1901, Australia had a minimum age of marriage as 12. "Underage" marriage was common here. If anyone accused Australians in 1901 as being paedophiles, they’d hear a barrage of justifications.

You’re returning to form again, old boy, but it was nice to see a moment of clarity where you discussed actual facts.

Such moments are becoming so rare these days. Alas, it’s not your fault. It’s the symptoms.

We all sympathize, dear boy.



Oh, so we are comparing Muslims in 2014 to Australians in 1901.


We can always count on you, PB, to advocate for AND champion the soft bigotry of low expectations.

"They are tinted and Muslims, so let's compare them to how we, non-tinted and non-Muslims, were a century ago because comparing them to us now will invariably mean they are below our standards."


Very sly and slimey of you, as usual. Have another pickled stool, you know - we all know - you are gagging for it.
Have two.







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Karnal
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Re: underage marriage in Sydney
Reply #385 - Feb 27th, 2014 at 9:34pm
 
And we can always count on you, dear Boy. You’re now excusing and appeasing Mormons and Christian child sex cults.

How utterly despicable of you, old chap. How sly and slimey.

personal attack removed
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« Last Edit: Feb 28th, 2014 at 9:45am by polite_gandalf »  
 
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Re: underage marriage in Sydney
Reply #386 - Feb 27th, 2014 at 9:36pm
 
Karnal wrote on Feb 27th, 2014 at 9:34pm:
And we can always count on you, dear Boy. You’re now excusing and appeasing Mormons and Christian child sex cults.

How utterly despicable of you, old chap. How sly and slimey.

As a dirty Hun, we can’t let you join the club. I know you’ll understand. Still, you’re a man after our own hearts.

Yes, old boy, you’re one of us.

bugger knows what you are trying to say.



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Karnal
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Re: underage marriage in Sydney
Reply #387 - Feb 27th, 2014 at 9:51pm
 
Soren wrote on Feb 27th, 2014 at 9:36pm:
Karnal wrote on Feb 27th, 2014 at 9:34pm:
And we can always count on you, dear Boy. You’re now excusing and appeasing Mormons and Christian child sex cults.

How utterly despicable of you, old chap. How sly and slimey.

As a dirty Hun, we can’t let you join the club. I know you’ll understand. Still, you’re a man after our own hearts.

Yes, old boy, you’re one of us.

bugger knows what you are trying to say.





You like to play the no-speaka-the-English game, don’t you dear.
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Re: underage marriage in Sydney
Reply #388 - Feb 27th, 2014 at 10:01pm
 
Shame of our child brides: Court hears how woman was raped and beaten as it’s revealed hundreds are forced into arranged and unregistered marriages across NSW


A 14-YEAR-OLD girl was forced into an Islamic marriage with a western Sydney drug gang member who raped and beat her and later physically abused their daughter.

Details of the now 25-year old victim’s ordeal surfaced in the Federal Circuit Court where the victim was fighting to have the man banned from seeing their daughter.

So appalling was the woman's life of abuse, which included claims that her father told her she could only leave her marriage “in a coffin”, that Judge Joseph Harman made an unprecedented public appeal in his judgment for authorities to act.

The story came to light after the Daily Telegraph reported the arrest of a man who had been living with a 12-year-old as his wife in Sydney.

The imam who married the pair, Riaz Tasawar, was yesterday arrested by police.
...
Eman Sharobeem from the Immigrant Women’s Health Service said hundreds of children as young as 11 were being sent overseas to be married after being “shopped” on Facebook. “It’s far more prevalent and well-known than people think,” she said.

Dr Sharobeem said not enough was being done to build awareness about underage marriage. “Regulation needs to be put in place within different religions,” she said. “If we are talking about Australian law, every marriage should be under Australian law,”
http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/nsw/shame-of-our-child-brides-court-hears-...

Your grinning attempts to cover up and slime the obvious is thoroughly disgusting and contemptible, PB. Just f vck disgusting.


personal attack removed
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« Last Edit: Feb 28th, 2014 at 9:46am by polite_gandalf »  
 
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Karnal
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Re: underage marriage in Sydney
Reply #389 - Feb 28th, 2014 at 9:21am
 
Soren wrote on Feb 27th, 2014 at 10:01pm:
Your grinning attempts to cover up and slime the obvious is thoroughly disgusting and contemptible, PB. Just f vck disgusting. You are a despicable propagandist and willful idiot.




Thoroughly despicable, old chap. Like this:

Quote:
I cried so much during my wedding my dress was soaked: Horrifying ordeal of Warren Jeffs' child bride 'forced to marry her cousin'
Elissa's mother held her hand during underage marriage ceremony
Parents so brainwashed they were 'unable to protect' their children

By Kerry Mcqueeney
CREATED: 09:27 GMT, 22 September 2011

A woman who was forced into marriage at the age of 14 while under the control of paedophile Mormon polygamist Warren Jeffs's cult has recounted her harrowing ordeal.The woman, Elissa Wall, revealed how her own mother resorted to holding her daughter's hand at the altar in a bid to calm her down as she was forced to marry her 19-year-old cousin, whom she despised.
In a CNN interview, which is to be aired tonight, Elissa describes how she cried so much during the ceremony that her wedding dress was soaked with her own tears.
Traumatic: Elissa recalls the harrowing experience of being forced to marry a 19-year-old Warren Jeffs when she was only 14 on the Anderson Cooper CNN TV show
Family portrait: The picture shows dozens of Warren Jeffs's brides, lined up together as if they are posing for a school photograph

She told broadcaster Anderson Cooper: 'It was so devastating that even in the ceremony itself I'm crying to such a level that my wedding dress is soaked.
'They had my mother stand next to me and hold my hand just to get me to take my vows.'
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2040428/Warren-Jeffss-child-bride-I-crie...

Or this:

Quote:
Children of God – Children of Sorrow
Posted on April 18, 2013 by RobRobinson

The Children of God, now known as The Family International was one of the vilest of  all cults and certainly the worst of the Christian cults.  Often times called the sex cult, it was also, with reason, called the Church of Pedophilia. The Founder, David Berg, also known as “Moses David” or “Dad” and later “Grandpa”, combined hard core fundamentalist Christianity, with liberal sexual ethics along with his own, sick, sexual fantasies...

Some of Berg’s most alarming teachings appeared to condone pedophilia and incest. Mo Letters from the 1970s discuss a babysitter who masturbated and fellated Berg when he was only three years old. Berg asserted her actions did not do him “any harm.” In 1973, he wrote, “Incest, or certain forms of sex with certain specified close relatives was not made illegal until the Mosaic Law 2600 years after Creation.” He also wrote, “Marriages of brothers and sisters, mothers and sons and even fathers and daughters were very common in ancient times and were not even considered incestuous, much less illegal.”
http://worldcultwatch.org/children/

You've highlighted Dr Sharobeem's "different religions" quote. I presume you mean this as an ironic reference to Islam, but as the above shows, this is not an issue confined to Islam. David Moses, leader of the Children of God cult, used the example of Judeo-Christian prophets to justify incest and sex with children.

Your Daily Tele article, however, reports census figures on underage defacto marriages, a number in the South Coast/Wollongong area, and many in rural and regional areas, including Young. I doubt very much these are Islamic "marriages". They are, quite simply, girls living in consentual relationships with boys or men. Why else would they self-report their relationship status to a census?

I can't disagree with the prevelence of this. I see this constantly in my work with families: underage girls hooking up with older boys or men and moving away from their parents to live with their boyfriends as defactos. We're talking about all cultures and religions here. Most of the girls I've worked with have been Anglos.

Sure it's a problem. It's a problem as old as Romeo and Juliet. The thing is though, if it's consensual, there is nothing the police or child protection system can do without the girl testifying to abuse. They rarely do.

From experience, you will find a few examples in the courts of underage defacto marriages, where the underage girl has testified - usually following domestic violence and psychological abuse. These cases are not confined to Muslims - far from it. But cases like this are few and far between. If they weren't, the Tele would be reporting them instead of census data.

As you can see, old boy, it's hardly an issue confined to Islam, but we know you won't discuss this.

You'll pretend not to notice.

Cunning, no?
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« Last Edit: Feb 28th, 2014 at 10:44am by Karnal »  
 
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