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True Colours
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freediver wrote on Feb 16 th, 2014 at 11:35am: I see this claim made by Muslims on a regular basis: freediver wrote on Feb 16 th, 2014 at 9:15am: True Colours wrote on Feb 15 th, 2014 at 10:40pm: freediver wrote on Feb 15 th, 2014 at 5:14pm: It was not "war compensation" because it happened before the war. The war was a response by the Meccans to Muhammed robbing their caravans. Muhammed had a long career as a highway robber before he moved up to rape and pillage. Before the incident you speak of, the pagans of Mecca killed, tortured, raped, stole property and promised to kill every Muslim in Medina. Perhaps you think that was some kind of state of peace, most people would not. freediver wrote on Feb 15 th, 2014 at 5:14pm: Muhammed stoned rapists, but was himself a rapist. He executed thieves, but was himself a thief. The difference being of course, that Muhammed permitted himself to rape and pillage. Big claims - for which you have no evidence. And why did they do this? I have seen evidence of Muhammed himself engaging in torture (to force a Jew to give up his Jew gold). But I have not seen evidence of Muslims being tortured. Last time I asked the closest I got was being spat on and bitten by a dog. The only evidence I have found is that Muhammed himself was the torturer: Kinana b. al-Rabi`, who had the custody of the treasure of B. al-Nadir, was brought to the apostle who asked him about it. He denied that he knew where it was. A Jew came (T. was brought) to the apostle and said that he had seen Kinana going round a certain ruin every morning early. When the apostle said to Kinana, "Do you know that if we find you have it I shall kill you?" he said Yes. The apostle gave orders that the ruin was to be excavated and some of the treasure was found. When he asked him about the rest he refused to produce it, so the apostle gave orders to al-Zubayr b. al-`Awwam, "Torture him until you extract what he has," so he kindled a fire with flint and steel on his chest until he was nearly dead. Then the apostle delivered him to Muhammad b. Maslama and he struck off his head, in revenge for his brother Mahmud. (Ibn Ishaq, Sirat Rasul Allah, translated as, The Life of Muhammad, (tr. A. Guillaume), Karachi: Oxford University Press, 1998, p. 515.)(That night, Muhammed and the man's widow fell madly in love and spent the night together in Muhammed's tent) In response to Muhammed's favourite child bride being accused of adultery: Ishaq:496 "Ask the slave girl; she will tell you the truth.' So the Apostle called Burayra to ask her. Ali got up and gave her a violent beating first, saying, 'Tell the Apostle the truth.'"
Sahih Muslim Book 016, Hadith Number 4131.
Anas reported: Eight men of the tribe of 'Ukl came to Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) and swore allegiance to him on Islam, but found the climate of that land uncongenial to their health and thus they became sick, and they made complaint of that to Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him), and he said: Why don't you go to (the fold) of our camels along with our shepherd, and make use of their milk and urine. They said: Yes. They set out and drank their (camels') milk and urine and regained their health. They killed the shepherd and drove away the camels. This (news) reached Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) and he sent them on their track and they were caught and brought to him (the Holy Prophet). He commanded about them, and (thus) their hands and feet were cut off and their eyes were gouged and then they were thrown in the sun, until they died.
This hadith has been narrated on the authority of Ibn al-Sabbah with a slight variation of words.
Quran 5:33
The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His Messenger, and strive with might and main for mischief through the land is: execution, or crucifixion, or the cutting off of hands and feet from opposite sides.
Ibn Ishaq/Hisham 436
“…they brought them along and questioned them while the apostle was standing praying… The people were dismayed at their report…and so they beat them. When they were beaten soundly..."
Abu Dawud 38:4474
Narrated AbdurRahman ibn Azhar:
I saw the Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) on the morning of the conquest of Mecca when I was a young boy. He was walking among the people, seeking the camp of Khalid ibn al-Walid. A man who had drunk wine was brought (before him) and he ordered them (to beat him). So they beat him with what they had in their hands. Some struck him with whips, some with sticks and some with sandals. The Apostle of Allah (peace_be_upon_him) threw some dust on his face.
When a man who had drunk wine was brought before AbuBakr, he asked them (i.e. the people) about the number of beatings which they gave him. They numbered it forty. So AbuBakr gave him forty lashes. I think that most of us would agree that there is a stark difference between a person being punished for a crime and being punished for their religious beliefs. The stories that you have posted are about criminals being punished and some of them are fabrications. Prophet Muhammed and his followers were tortured by pagans for being monotheists, not for being criminals - a subtle difference that perhaps you are unable to grasp.
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