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Palestine - a nation with a prestigious history (Read 21783 times)
wally1
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Re: Palestine - a nation with a prestigious history
Reply #30 - Feb 23rd, 2014 at 8:07am
 
Still don't have any evidence that Moses story happened.
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polite_gandalf
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Re: Palestine - a nation with a prestigious history
Reply #31 - Feb 23rd, 2014 at 8:46am
 
well to be fair to moses, I don't think he posted it for its authenticity.
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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
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Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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freediver
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Re: Palestine - a nation with a prestigious history
Reply #32 - Feb 23rd, 2014 at 9:05am
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 22nd, 2014 at 11:10pm:
Karnal wrote on Feb 19th, 2014 at 9:38pm:
freediver wrote on Feb 19th, 2014 at 9:33pm:
I tried googling it. I can find the first half (verse 4380) on a few sites. But none of them have verse 4381, for some reason.


Better whack it in the Wiki, FD.

Exhibit 4381.


It certainly meets the stringent evidential criteria of the wiki - namely some schmuck on ozpolitic posted it - and its found nowhere else in the world.


Gandalf everything on the wiki is open for discussion. Remember, last time you tried, it turned out that you were wrong.
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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.
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polite_gandalf
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Re: Palestine - a nation with a prestigious history
Reply #33 - Feb 23rd, 2014 at 9:09am
 
freediver wrote on Feb 23rd, 2014 at 9:05am:
Remember, last time you tried, it turned out that you were wrong.



Ah yes - I remember - Islam permits rape because some nobody calling himself falah allegedly said so. How silly of me to question that.
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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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freediver
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Re: Palestine - a nation with a prestigious history
Reply #34 - Feb 23rd, 2014 at 9:14am
 
Muhammed had sex with his sex slaves. That why they call them sex slaves.

What is the proper Islamic punishment for raping your sex slave or spouse? Just for authenticity, please give and example of Muhammed or one of his early followers meting out such a punishment. If that is a bit difficult, given that rape was a way of life for Muhammed and his followers, you could try giving an example of Muhammed punishing someone for beating their wife or sex slave, or "going to far" with such a beating. We know from Islamic sources that Muhammed had plenty of opportunity to punish such behaviour, so that one should be a bit easier for you.
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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.
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Yadda
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Re: Palestine - a nation with a prestigious history
Reply #35 - Feb 23rd, 2014 at 9:44am
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 23rd, 2014 at 9:09am:
freediver wrote on Feb 23rd, 2014 at 9:05am:
Remember, last time you tried, it turned out that you were wrong.



Ah yes - I remember - Islam permits rape because some nobody calling himself falah allegedly said so. How silly of me to question that.





FD said...
Quote:

Muhammed had sex with his sex slaves. That why they call them sex slaves.




FD,

We all understand, that rape, is a criminal act.

But FD, if forced sex has been made 'lawful' [to Mohammed/moslems], it can hardly be described as 'rape', now can it ?        Tongue

You must remember FD, it is rape, that is a criminal act.

And that, is not what moslem men do.

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31
 
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Yadda
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Re: Palestine - a nation with a prestigious history
Reply #36 - Feb 23rd, 2014 at 9:53am
 
Yadda wrote on Feb 23rd, 2014 at 9:44am:

We all understand, that rape, is a criminal act.

But FD, if forced sex has been made 'lawful' [to Mohammed/moslems], it can hardly be described as 'rape', now can it ?        Tongue





Raping your 'maids' [i.e. female slaves] is 'lawful' in ISLAM.



Quote:

Kuwait: "Female political activist" calls for legalizing sex slavery.....


The activist, Salwa Al-Mutairi, suggested apparently seriously in a video broadcast online that she had been informed by some clerics that affluent Muslim men who fear being seduced or tempted into immoral behavior by the beauty of their female servants, or even of those servants 'casting spells' on them, would be better to purchase women from an 'enslaved maid' agency for sexual purposes.

This is not religiously forbidden," she added, indicating that Caliph Haroun Al-Rashid (766-809 AD) was married to one woman but possessed 200 concubines.


http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1307539638/0#0
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2011/06/raymond-ibrahim-kuwaiti-female-activist-advoca...



In the article above, a moslem woman confirms, that the keeping of captive [non-moslem] women [within Sharia jurisdictions] as sex slaves, is completely 'lawful' within ISLAM.



Also, raping those sex slaves [female captives] is halal [i.e. kosher].
see also, THIS DESCRIPTION OF LIFE IN A 'RIGHTLY GUIDED' ISLAMIC CALIPHATE...


Quote:
"Egyptian imam: "When I want a sex slave, I just go to the market and choose the woman I like and purchase her" "

http://www.jihadwatch.org/2011/06/egyptian-imam-when-i-want-a-sex-slave-i-just-g...





ISLAMIC LAW......

For a devout moslem, all things are permissible, if they are permitted by Sharia Law.


And a moslem man can lawfully have sex at any time, with female captives [sex slaves].




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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31
 
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polite_gandalf
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Re: Palestine - a nation with a prestigious history
Reply #37 - Feb 23rd, 2014 at 9:59am
 
freediver wrote on Feb 23rd, 2014 at 9:14am:
Muhammed had sex with his sex slaves.


No he didn't. Muhammad had sex with no one he wasn't married to.

Now stand by as Baron swoops in and "proves" me wrong with a quote from islamqa

freediver wrote on Feb 23rd, 2014 at 9:14am:
What is the proper Islamic punishment for raping your sex slave or spouse?


Not sure FD - what is the "proper islamic punishment" for drinking alcohol or charging riba? Since they also don't have any specified punishment. Does it mean islam permits those as well? Must be.
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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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Stratos
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Re: Palestine - a nation with a prestigious history
Reply #38 - Feb 23rd, 2014 at 10:07am
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 23rd, 2014 at 9:59am:
No he didn't. Muhammad had sex with no one he wasn't married to.


I think the question being asked is, did he marry (and have sex with) anyone that was forced into doing so.
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Pete Waldo wrote on Jan 15th, 2014 at 11:24pm:
Thus killing those Canaanite babies while they were still innocent, was a particularly merciful act
 
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Yadda
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Re: Palestine - a nation with a prestigious history
Reply #39 - Feb 23rd, 2014 at 10:13am
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 23rd, 2014 at 9:59am:
freediver wrote on Feb 23rd, 2014 at 9:14am:
Muhammed had sex with his sex slaves.


No he didn't.

Muhammad had sex with no one he wasn't married to.




Quote:

"We went out with Allah's Messenger"
= = Mohammed was in the company of these men.

"on the expedition to the Bi'l-Mustaliq and took captive some excellent Arab women"
= = it was some form of raiding party, where they, 'took captive some excellent Arab women'.

"and we desired them"
= = hmmmm, i wonder what that means?

"for we were suffering from the absence of our wives"
= = ah, in the absence they wives, they desired these women for sex, to satisfy their sexual lust.

"(but at the same time) we also desired ransom for them."
= = in their minds, they sought to sexually 'use' these captive Arab women, and then let their menfolk redeem them.

"So we decided to have sexual intercourse with them"
= = yep, Allah's finest, sought to sexually 'use' these 'excellent' captive Arab women.



Those [above] extracts from the Hadith are cited, with references, here;

Bikeway rapist gets 25 years in jail
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1251431040/8#8



gandalf,

n.b.
"for we were suffering from the absence of our wives"


So those women that Mohammed and his companions took as captives, and had sex with, were not their wives.


gandalf,

Isn't that fornication, and sex outside of marriage ?

And what is the punishment, in ISLAMIC law, for adultery ?


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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31
 
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Yadda
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Re: Palestine - a nation with a prestigious history
Reply #40 - Feb 23rd, 2014 at 11:11am
 
Yadda wrote on Feb 18th, 2014 at 12:08am:

Palestine - a nation with a prestigious history
       Tongue


Could you answer some basic questions about the country of Palestine ? :


1. When was it founded and by whom?
2. What language did the Palestinians speak?
3. What writing [script] did they use?
4. What manuscripts did they leave?
5. What was their religion?
6. Where are their temples?
7. What monuments attest to their existence?
8. What were its borders?
9. What was the name of its capital?
10. What were its major cities?
11. What constituted the basis of its economy?
12. What was the name of the currency that they used?
13. What was its form of government?
14. What achievements have they accomplished?
15. What other peoples did Palestine interact with?
16. Where can one find any [historic] records, wherein the country of Palestine and its people are mentioned?
17. What archaeological sites can one name?
18. Where can one find the recorded history of these people?
19. Whom did they conquer?, or, were conquered by?
20. Was Palestine ever recognized by a country whose existence, at that time or now, leaves no room for interpretation [or doubt]?
21. What was the prevalent religion of the country of Palestine?
22. Can anyone name at least five Palestinian leaders before Arafat?
23. Finally, since there is no such recognised country today, what caused its demise and when did it occur?


Further, why did these proud 'Palestinians' between 1948 and 1967, passively, allow themselves to be occupied by the Jordanians in the 'West Bank', and by the Egyptians in Gaza?


Those Q's  [above] are taken from;

Part 142 - Palestine and Palestinians
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=04iGfi9No6M

...........
...........


i




crickets chirping..........

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31
 
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Karnal
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Re: Palestine - a nation with a prestigious history
Reply #41 - Feb 23rd, 2014 at 1:01pm
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 23rd, 2014 at 9:09am:
freediver wrote on Feb 23rd, 2014 at 9:05am:
Remember, last time you tried, it turned out that you were wrong.



Ah yes - I remember - Islam permits rape because some nobody calling himself falah allegedly said so. How silly of me to question that.


Exactly. It’s all in the Wiki.

I hear they’re using it in the Sharia courts these days.
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wally1
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Re: Palestine - a nation with a prestigious history
Reply #42 - Feb 23rd, 2014 at 1:15pm
 
Yadda wrote on Feb 23rd, 2014 at 10:13am:
polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 23rd, 2014 at 9:59am:
freediver wrote on Feb 23rd, 2014 at 9:14am:
Muhammed had sex with his sex slaves.


No he didn't.

Muhammad had sex with no one he wasn't married to.




Quote:

"We went out with Allah's Messenger"
= = Mohammed was in the company of these men.

"on the expedition to the Bi'l-Mustaliq and took captive some excellent Arab women"
= = it was some form of raiding party, where they, 'took captive some excellent Arab women'.

"and we desired them"
= = hmmmm, i wonder what that means?

"for we were suffering from the absence of our wives"
= = ah, in the absence they wives, they desired these women for sex, to satisfy their sexual lust.

"(but at the same time) we also desired ransom for them."
= = in their minds, they sought to sexually 'use' these captive Arab women, and then let their menfolk redeem them.

"So we decided to have sexual intercourse with them"
= = yep, Allah's finest, sought to sexually 'use' these 'excellent' captive Arab women.



Those [above] extracts from the Hadith are cited, with references, here;

Bikeway rapist gets 25 years in jail
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1251431040/8#8



gandalf,

n.b.
"for we were suffering from the absence of our wives"


So those women that Mohammed and his companions took as captives, and had sex with, were not their wives.


gandalf,

Isn't that fornication, and sex outside of marriage ?

And what is the punishment, in ISLAMIC law, for adultery ?




War booty.THats just tough luck to the losing side.

If the Arab tribes just left Mohamed alone and abided by there peace treaties then all would be fine.


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moses
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Re: Palestine - a nation with a prestigious history
Reply #43 - Feb 23rd, 2014 at 3:31pm
 
Aggressively invading your peaceful neighbours, then killing the men, taking the women and children as sex slaves, forcing those sex slaves into prostitution / rape, thieving the property of those the muslims invaded, is distinctly part and parcel of the evil tenets of islam

from the qur'an:
Quote:
Chapter (24) sūrat l-nūr (The Light)
And let those who cannot find a match keep chaste till Allah give them independence by His grace. And such of your slaves as seek a writing (of emancipation), write it for them if ye are aware of aught of good in them, and bestow upon them of the wealth of Allah which He hath bestowed upon you. Force not your slave-girls to whoredom that ye may seek enjoyment of the life of the world, if they would preserve their chastity. And if one force them, then after their compulsion, lo! Allah will be Forgiving, Merciful.


This quiet clearly sanctions muslims forcing girls into prostitution / rape

Again the qur'an says:
Quote:
Al-Anfal 8:41:
And know that whatever of war-booty that you may gain, verily one-fifth (1/5th) of it is assigned to Allâh, and to the Messenger, and to the near relatives [of the Messenger (Muhammad SAW)], (and also) the orphans, Al-Masâkin (the poor) and the wayfarer, if you have believed in Allâh and in that which We sent down to Our slave (Muhammad SAW) on the Day of criterion (between right and wrong), the Day when the two forces met (the battle of Badr) - And Allâh is Able to do all things.

Al-Ahzab 33:27:
And He caused you to inherit their lands, and their houses, and their riches, and a land which you had not trodden (before). And Allâh is Able to do all things.


Both clearly state muslims are to invade the lands they have not trodden before. You can't get booty / conquered sex slaves / other people's property, if you stay at home peacefully, you have to be the aggressor and invade to collect your spoils of war.

muslims and their apologists are liars when they claim to be the defenders




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Yadda
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Re: Palestine - a nation with a prestigious history
Reply #44 - Feb 23rd, 2014 at 5:13pm
 
Karnal wrote on Feb 23rd, 2014 at 1:01pm:
polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 23rd, 2014 at 9:09am:
freediver wrote on Feb 23rd, 2014 at 9:05am:
Remember, last time you tried, it turned out that you were wrong.



Ah yes - I remember - Islam permits rape because some nobody calling himself falah allegedly said so. How silly of me to question that.


Exactly. It’s all in the Wiki.

I hear they’re using it in the Sharia courts these days.





K,

Go and tell it to the Beslan children, the dead Beslan children.

The dead Beslan school children hostages, who were raped and then had their throats slit by, ISLAMIC Jihad warriors.

It was lawful K, according to Sharia law.





And according to ISLAMIST logic,
the parents of Beslan, are responsible for the deaths of their own children.

As it was the parents of the Beslan children, that sent their own children into an area which was targeted for Jihadist 'operations'.


Quote:
There Can Be No End to Jihad'

Islamist Sheikh Omar Bakri Muhammad, in an exclusive interview, discusses the rationale for 9/11, the Christians he most respects, and the Jesus he defends.
posted 11/05/2007
....Any weapons are legitimate in jihad. Even animals may be used as "suicide bombers"! It is not restricted by target—even Muslims or children, if used by the enemy as human shields, can be killed.
....Killing women and children never was and never will be part of the jihad in Islam, whether that be the women or children of the Muslims or non-Muslims. So if Chechen mujahedeen killed women and children in Beslan, I would condemn it. The children of non-Muslims, such as those at Beslan, who die in such circumstances go to Paradise.
....Women and children [i.e. boys under 15] or Muslims are not legitimate targets—nor are any noncombatants [clergy, disabled, insane, elderly, etc.]. Not even Israeli children or women, unless they serve in the military, which most do, or live in properties taken from dispossessed Palestinians (Muslim or Christian), which virtually all do.
However, if children are killed, the fault lies with the adult occupiers who brought them into a battlefield situation.


.....quoting a 'peace loving' moslem cleric, explaining that it is the non-moslems who are always to blame, when non-moslem children [i.e. Jewish children in occupied 'Palestinian'] are killed in "Jihad operations" with moslems.

Google;
"There Can Be No End to Jihad"






AND THERE IS A DUPLICITY IN THE 'ARGUMENT', OF MOSLEM PROPAGANDA, WHEN THESE INCIDENTS OCCUR....

1/ Those who resist ISLAMISTS and who inadvertently kill innocents  = = "THEY, ARE MURDERERS OF INNOCENTS" - according to moslem propaganda.

2/ But if ISLAMISTS kill innocents  = = IT IS THE FAULT OF INFIDELS, BECAUSE THEY ARE BRINGING INNOCENTS INTO AN ENVIRONMENT OF CONFLICT [.....even when ISLAMISTS intentionally, or carelessly cause the deaths of those innocents]





Nice friends you have, K.

These are ISLAMISTS who you [and people like you], are defending, K, with your silence [with your lack of criticism].

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« Last Edit: Feb 23rd, 2014 at 5:31pm by Yadda »  

"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31
 
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