Australian Politics Forum - The Gender Gap

Grappler Truth Teller Feller

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Re: The Gender Gap
Reply #45 - Mar 28^th, 2014 at 11:28pm

The_Barnacle wrote on Mar 28^th, 2014 at 2:57pm:

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Mar 28^th, 2014 at 11:22am:

Yes, indeed - but the question has very much become "to what extent is a FAMILY unit entitled to jobs in a diminishing job market".

Now a family unit is anything from a single person living alone all the way up to the nuclear family (brought to you courtesy of Monty Burns) - so our question becomes - why is it that SOME family units are entitled to 2-3-4 bites at the cherry while others have no entitlement to any?

I feel like I am in a time warp back to the 1950s
Not only have knights been reintroduced but now grappler wants women to have to resign from their jobs as soon as they get married.
Roll Eyes

And where precisely did I say women should resign? I merely advocated the rationalisation of the FAMILY unit as being the holder of work at a certain level so as to enable other family units equal opportunity.

On that last - you now see the absolute lie that 'equal employment opportunity' for specified 'accredited victim status' groups is - it means that those thus 'equalised' can earn - in a FAMILY unit - for more than other FAMILY units - and are in fact given preference to do so.

If anything every created social and economic divide sin this country - that was it.

IF it so happens that women should be the ones to be withdrawn from jobs so as to approach genuine equal employment opportunity - then so be it - but at no time did I say this was mandatory.

Kindly do not allocate to me statements I did not make.

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Grappler Truth Teller Feller Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 83784 Proud pre-1850's NO Voter Gender:	Re: The Gender Gap Reply #46 - Mar 28^th, 2014 at 11:30pm For those of you who seek to call me a 'misogynist' - I've just signed this.... http://www.amnesty.org.au/action/action/34223/?&utm_source=int2014&utm_medium=em... Maybe some of you need to look at real issues for a change instead of propaganda.
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Grappler Truth Teller Feller

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Re: The Gender Gap
Reply #47 - Mar 28^th, 2014 at 11:39pm

Frances wrote on Mar 28^th, 2014 at 3:35pm:

Lord Herbert wrote on Mar 28^th, 2014 at 2:41pm:

GA wrote on Mar 28^th, 2014 at 10:48am:

Women are just as much entitled to an occupation as are men.

If they're single ~ Yes.

And if they're married, with their husband working, then certainly not if there are young married couples with neither of them being able to find work.

So I did the right thing in January by quitting my job?

If you worked for the government - certainly. You were betraying your honour in doing so due to their inability to see further than personal monetary advancement.

In terms of your personal situation - from what you have said - perhaps so. In doing so you offered an opportunity to someone else to do the job you had - however - that job will almost certainly go to someone else who has no NEED for it - but rather a WANT for it.

That's the way it works now.

On the other hand - in the desperate dog eat dog scrabble for anything at all generated by piss poor government policies in the hands of socio-fascist scientists and their ilk - coupled with the innate fascist leanings of people handed 'power' - and the inevitable ongoing decline in real standards of living and value of money etc that will result.....

...You May Well Have Been Better to Remain At Dog Eat Dog Level and Keep Your Job.

You may need it to survive.

THAT is a clear indication of how desperate these insane policies have made the whole situation.

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Frances

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Re: The Gender Gap
Reply #48 - Mar 29^th, 2014 at 6:41am

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Mar 28^th, 2014 at 11:39pm:

If you worked for the government - certainly.

I was in a middle management job in the NSW Public Service. With a staff freeze and reduction in numbers, all they did was move a few people further up the line to fill the vacancy and the others created by staff movements. As far as I am aware, they didn't fill the resultant vacancy further down the foodchain.....

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Mar 28^th, 2014 at 11:39pm:

On the other hand - in the desperate dog eat dog scrabble for anything at all generated by piss poor government policies in the hands of socio-fascist scientists and their ilk - coupled with the innate fascist leanings of people handed 'power' - and the inevitable ongoing decline in real standards of living and value of money etc that will result.....

...You May Well Have Been Better to Remain At Dog Eat Dog Level and Keep Your Job.

You may need it to survive.

With a new house and no mortgage, we don't really need two incomes. W'ere going out this weekend. If I was still working we would be staying home to do housework and gardening.

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Sure God created man before woman. But then you always make a rough draft before the final masterpiece.

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Lord Herbert

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Re: The Gender Gap
Reply #49 - Mar 29^th, 2014 at 6:56am

Speaking of being shunted up the food chain ~ a couple of years ago the NSW government forcibly retrenched a whole rats-nest of several hundred who had somehow risen to the top in various occupations to do with public transport.

It was like dropping a smoke-bomb into a subterranean sewer beneath the city, and then watching as hordes of rats came squeaking and scrambling out of various vents and gratings in a desperate panic.

The question was: How the hell did all these people manage to find little niches for themselves as petty managers and assistants to assistants to assistants so gradually that no one in government noticed it until a serious audit was done to find out how to minimise costs.

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GA

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Re: The Gender Gap
Reply #50 - Mar 29^th, 2014 at 1:10pm

Frances wrote on Mar 28^th, 2014 at 3:35pm:

Lord Herbert wrote on Mar 28^th, 2014 at 2:41pm:

GA wrote on Mar 28^th, 2014 at 10:48am:

Women are just as much entitled to an occupation as are men.

If they're single ~ Yes.

And if they're married, with their husband working, then certainly not if there are young married couples with neither of them being able to find work.

So I did the right thing in January by quitting my job?

Don't let the chauvinists browbeat you into submission, Frances. We are all entitled to equal employment, so it should be a choice as to whether or not you work for an employer or at home. It's not for women to accept responsibility for the failure of government to provide (something that even a drover's dog could do) in this big empty resource rich country, an economy that employs all those choosing to seek paid employment.

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Grappler Truth Teller Feller

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Re: The Gender Gap
Reply #51 - Mar 29^th, 2014 at 5:53pm

GA wrote on Mar 29^th, 2014 at 1:10pm:

Don't let the chauvinists browbeat you into submission, Frances. We are all entitled to equal employment an equal chance at employment not to handouts, so it should be a choice as to whether or not you work for an employer or at home. It's not for women men and women to accept responsibility for the failure of government to provide (something that even a drover's dog could do) in this big empty resource rich country, an economy that employs all those choosing to seek paid employment.

You are slow but you are getting there, Grasshopper.

Keep trying - you will leap ahead in your life studies once you drop the ideological rants.

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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Grappler Truth Teller Feller

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Re: The Gender Gap
Reply #52 - Mar 29^th, 2014 at 5:56pm

Frances wrote on Mar 29^th, 2014 at 6:41am:

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Mar 28^th, 2014 at 11:39pm:

If you worked for the government - certainly.

I was in a middle management job in the NSW Public Service. With a staff freeze and reduction in numbers, all they did was move a few people further up the line to fill the vacancy and the others created by staff movements. As far as I am aware, they didn't fill the resultant vacancy further down the foodchain.....

So they replaced workers with some management style flunkey? Nothing new there.

Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Mar 28^th, 2014 at 11:39pm:

On the other hand - in the desperate dog eat dog scrabble for anything at all generated by piss poor government policies in the hands of socio-fascist scientists and their ilk - coupled with the innate fascist leanings of people handed 'power' - and the inevitable ongoing decline in real standards of living and value of money etc that will result.....

...You May Well Have Been Better to Remain At Dog Eat Dog Level and Keep Your Job.

You may need it to survive.

With a new house and no mortgage, we don't really need two incomes. W'ere going out this weekend. If I was still working we would be staying home to do housework and gardening.

As long as things don;t become too desperate overall. You should not be surprised at the number of home owners who have found that their incomes simply do not keep up with the costs of living including rates etc. You may have to revert to the worker drone lifestyle and go back to dog eat dog just to get by.

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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
― John Adams

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Winston Smith

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Re: The Gender Gap
Reply #53 - Mar 29^th, 2014 at 6:36pm

GA wrote on Mar 29^th, 2014 at 1:10pm:

Frances wrote on Mar 28^th, 2014 at 3:35pm:

Lord Herbert wrote on Mar 28^th, 2014 at 2:41pm:

GA wrote on Mar 28^th, 2014 at 10:48am:

Women are just as much entitled to an occupation as are men.

If they're single ~ Yes.

And if they're married, with their husband working, then certainly not if there are young married couples with neither of them being able to find work.

So I did the right thing in January by quitting my job?

Don't let the chauvinists browbeat you into submission, Frances. We are all entitled to equal employment, so it should be a choice as to whether or not you work for an employer or at home. It's not for women to accept responsibility for the failure of government to provide (something that even a drover's dog could do) in this big empty resource rich country, an economy that employs all those choosing to seek paid employment.

I tend to agree with this, there's no excuse for that bloated beurocracy called government not to fulfill this basic role. Australia has a relatively small population and an abundance of resources. There are no other reasons I can think of outside of corruption for this not to be the case. I think if we followed the money trail it would go back through insider networks as far back as you care to look.

I'm interested to know to what degree that has something to do with the relative nature of reality. I think of people and institutions rather like props in the overall drama. There are these various players that manifest throughout the information history we can examine. But just like we are perfectly placed in space and time to exist and observe, these faceless groups could be just a complex part of that illusion.

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Grappler Truth Teller Feller Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 83784 Proud pre-1850's NO Voter Gender:	Re: The Gender Gap Reply #54 - Mar 29^th, 2014 at 8:44pm
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Frances Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 3577 In a Castle in the Hills Gender:	Re: The Gender Gap Reply #55 - Mar 31^st, 2014 at 8:36am GA wrote on Mar 29^th, 2014 at 1:10pm: Don't let the chauvinists browbeat you into submission, Frances. What makes you think I was "browbeaten into submission"?
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GA

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Re: The Gender Gap
Reply #56 - Mar 31^st, 2014 at 9:58am

Frances wrote on Mar 31^st, 2014 at 8:36am:

GA wrote on Mar 29^th, 2014 at 1:10pm:

Don't let the chauvinists browbeat you into submission, Frances.

What makes you think I was "browbeaten into submission"?

You had submitted something that looked like it needed an approval. But it might be that I've got it wrong, and it was maybe only sarcasm on your part.

The point is that there should be no sacrifices being made by 'anyone' that compensate for poor government.

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GA

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Re: The Gender Gap
Reply #57 - Mar 31^st, 2014 at 10:38am

... wrote on Mar 28^th, 2014 at 10:14am:

GA wrote on Mar 28^th, 2014 at 9:58am:

... wrote on Mar 25^th, 2014 at 7:17pm:

GA wrote on Mar 25^th, 2014 at 2:19pm:

Winston Smith wrote on Mar 25^th, 2014 at 1:58pm:

Upon reflection, I realise the reason I'm so hard on you Grappler, is because I respect you and feel frustrated that you let yourself down.

Grappler and the other chauvinists are the best 'friends' feminism has ever had. And that's because mistake #1 is for a male to attack women in 'any' way. Ignoring the fact that women (or females in general) are not to blame for any of societies problems anyhow. For example, single parents (mostly women) are the 'victims' not the 'victorious' members of society. But they are the 'collateral' damage in a war that's being waged between our chromosomes. The target being "males" regardless of their age, or for that matter their state of development (male embryos will also be targeted).

Oh I dunno....I'd say they're to blame for about half.

http://0.tqn.com/d/taoism/1/0/0/-/-/-/yinYang.gif

XX and XY can't be divided equally in half. The division can only be XXX - Y. And the 'divisiveness' that's behind our present heading will ensure this happens.

Well if you want to put it like that, they're to blame for 3/4. Personally I think thats' a bit harsh, but it leaves only one option - ban women.

XX is a representation of humanity, so women it can be argued are 'completely' human. So we can't be blaming them, besides men too are bearers of the X chromosome along with the Y. So what can we do if an 'imbalance' is the problem, well we could make the male vote worth more than the female one, but even then this has it limits (and problems). Or we could do what American political commentator Anne Coulter has sarcastically (but not seriously of course) suggested: "If we took away women's right to vote, we'd never have to worry about another Democrat president" (As a way of countering 'our' left bias).

http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Ann_Coulter

Now (as a theist) I'm obliged to accept that there is no real imbalance, the God doesn't make mistakes kind of thing. What instead is happening I believe is that the normal balance, the natural 'symmetry' that exists, has been upset. Logic is being left out, and that's because what sells in the media is 'emotion' more than does rationality. So the actual 'blame' factor all come back to thinking people like us instead, who fail to act to rectify the problem.

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Grappler Truth Teller Feller

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Re: The Gender Gap
Reply #58 - Mar 31^st, 2014 at 11:23am

GA wrote on Mar 31^st, 2014 at 9:58am:

Frances wrote on Mar 31^st, 2014 at 8:36am:

GA wrote on Mar 29^th, 2014 at 1:10pm:

Don't let the chauvinists browbeat you into submission, Frances.

What makes you think I was "browbeaten into submission"?

You had submitted something that looked like it needed an approval. But it might be that I've got it wrong, and it was maybe only sarcasm on your part.

The point is that there should be no sacrifices being made by 'anyone' that compensate for poor government.

Now you're talking - 'anyone'!! And unfortunately in the current gender debate that encompasses a very wide range of people in a very wide range of ways. Precisely why women who are elected should NOT be pursuing their version of 'women's rights' to the exclusion of all else.

In plain English - one woman's meat is another man's poison and vice versa, and you cannot rob Peter to pay Paula. There is thus NO avenue for government intervention on the grand scale to enforce some kind of ideological 'equality', by literally beating up on one 'side' to hand to the other.

Utter rubbish and the stuff of civil war.

Nobody is seeking to 'browbeat' Frances - she is a personal favourite and I, for one, seek only to enlighten her to the fundamental realities of 'gender wars' and their dire cost to humanity.

Oh - BTW, Frances - the Frances character in my story, The Case Of The Eternal Virgin, is NOT based on you - that was a serendipitous non-connection.

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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Frances Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 3577 In a Castle in the Hills Gender:	Re: The Gender Gap Reply #59 - Mar 31^st, 2014 at 1:38pm Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Mar 31^st, 2014 at 11:23am: BTW, Frances - the Frances character in my story, The Case Of The Eternal Virgin, is NOT based on you Couldn't be. I'm not a virgin
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