Australian Politics Forum - 100 days without illegals

Bread and Butter

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Re: 100 days without illegals
Reply #165 - Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:56pm

rabbitoh08 wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:43pm:

Bread and Butter wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:38pm:

rabbitoh08 wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:33pm:

Bread and Butter wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:30pm:

Aussie wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:25pm:

Bread and Butter wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:20pm:

Aussie wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:14pm:

Bread and Butter wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:07pm:

So still no numbers about how many we should let in?

hmm?

Even the Parties cannot agree on that number, so how do you expect Members here to offer a sensible response other than ~ whatever number reflects that we are pulling our weight internationally.

As I thought. This has nothing whatsoever to do with boat people or refugees or anything like it. It is an Abbott policy therefore you are duty bound by your mindless allegiances to oppose it.

You have no numbers because you have no plan. You have no numbers because you have not thought this out in any real way.

I actually support increasing our refugee numbers. I however oppose boat people. I have an implicit mistrust of people who come illegally and without ID and wonder exactly whey you do not. We already have one confirmed example of a terrorist arriving this way so why are you so intent on more?

Increase the numbers of refuges to 30,000pa. Send planes to pick them up. But have ID and background checks first.

You can actually be compassionate and not stupid at the same time you know.

Abbott's Operation Sovereign Borders 'Policy' is illegal, and go read my Posts of the past about that, because I'm not about to go over it all again just for you.

Yeas, I agree. Plane/safe boat them in, and plane/safe boat the false claimants out. That (planes) is PUP Policy, by the way.

'Plane them out' to where? as pointed out before there is no where that will take them which of course is the entire purpose behind people smuggling knowing that once they are here there is nowhere else to go.

We are still waiting for you to explain why you felt the need to tell a lie.

Who has ever demanded "we let them in, all of them, all the time."

Are you saying we should stop the boats or not. Please answer.

You have been caught telling a lie.

Who has ever demanded "we let them in, all of them, all the time."

Explain yourself or apologise for telling lies to the forum.

And once again, do you think all boar people should be able to come here? if you say YES then my statement is true about you. If you say NO then why aren't you supporting that position?

Yes, it is a trick question because either way you lose. Which is why you will take the easy way out and refuse to answer - just like everyone else has done here.

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Bread and Butter

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Re: 100 days without illegals
Reply #166 - Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:56pm

John Smith wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:44pm:

Bread and Butter wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:40pm:

It is in fact exactly what I said which was that you really don't care at all if terrorists come by boat

using that logic, you simply don't care how many terrorist come and how many they kill, as long as they come by plane ....

Please don't embarrass yourself any further by an appeal to 'logic' since you very clearly have no understanding of the concept if that sentence is any example.

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John Smith

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Re: 100 days without illegals
Reply #167 - Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:57pm

NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:49pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:45pm:

NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:44pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:37pm:

NorthOfNorth wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:36pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:22pm:

B&B contiually goes on about the lack of a number as if it means something, and yet continues to ignore the number i gave him, twice ... are you worried your arguments won't stand up B&B?

I think if this went on long enough and straw became a scarce commodity, I think we'd find that the true argument is just rebirthed "Yellow-Perilism".

maybe you should change that to islamic-perilism

Yes, maybe... Although weren't those Sri Lankan 'boat people' Hindus?

do you think B&B and his ilk know the difference? ..

I'm not sure it would matter... They are arriving on a boat from Asia, that's the heart of the hysteria right there.

exactly

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I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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rabbitoh08

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Re: 100 days without illegals
Reply #168 - Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:59pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:48pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:44pm:

Bread and Butter wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:40pm:

It is in fact exactly what I said which was that you really don't care at all if terrorists come by boat

using that logic, you simply don't care how many terrorist come and how many they kill, as long as they come by plane ....

Yep.

A plane ticket, along with a passport and visa, makes it all OK.

Can you believe the "logic" of these irrational bigots? Roll Eyes

I don't think it is unreasonable to expect someone fleeing from persecution to make sure they remember to make the effort fill out the necessary paperwork to apply for an Australian visa is it? I mean - it is not hard. All they need to do is get a police certificate from the country they are fleeing to attest that they are people of good character. Surely the government which is persecuting the asylum seekers wouldn't be so mean as to maybe not give them that certificate? Would they? That just wouldn't be cricket, would it.

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John Smith

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Re: 100 days without illegals
Reply #169 - Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:59pm

Bread and Butter wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:56pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:44pm:

Bread and Butter wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:40pm:

It is in fact exactly what I said which was that you really don't care at all if terrorists come by boat

using that logic, you simply don't care how many terrorist come and how many they kill, as long as they come by plane ....

Please don't embarrass yourself any further by an appeal to 'logic' since you very clearly have no understanding of the concept if that sentence is any example.

yes, run away ... If I were you I would be running too ... Grin

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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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John Smith

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Re: 100 days without illegals
Reply #170 - Mar 30^th, 2014 at 3:01pm

rabbitoh08 wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:59pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:48pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:44pm:

Bread and Butter wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:40pm:

It is in fact exactly what I said which was that you really don't care at all if terrorists come by boat

using that logic, you simply don't care how many terrorist come and how many they kill, as long as they come by plane ....

Yep.

A plane ticket, along with a passport and visa, makes it all OK.

Can you believe the "logic" of these irrational bigots? Roll Eyes

I don't think it is unreasonable to expect someone fleeing from persecution to make sure they remember to make the effort fill out the necessary paperwork to apply for an Australian visa is it? I mean - it is not hard. All they need to do is get a police certificate from the country they are fleeing to attest that they are people of good character. Surely the government which is persecuting the asylum seekers wouldn't be so mean as to maybe not give them that certificate? Would they? That just wouldn't be cricket, would it.

and they would never send the same police department to hand deliver the report to the claimant, along with a .38 calibre bullet?

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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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Bread and Butter

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Re: 100 days without illegals
Reply #171 - Mar 30^th, 2014 at 3:01pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:48pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:44pm:

Bread and Butter wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:40pm:

It is in fact exactly what I said which was that you really don't care at all if terrorists come by boat

using that logic, you simply don't care how many terrorist come and how many they kill, as long as they come by plane ....

Yep.

A plane ticket, along with a passport and visa, makes it all OK.

Can you believe the "logic" of these irrational bigots? Roll Eyes

LOL so now that the consistency of your argument is exposed out come the ad hominem attack 'irrational bigots'.

You people are so utterly predictable. First the use of hair-splitting pedantry, then the absolute denial of the right to an alternative opinion nevermind the idea that that opinion might have validity. And finally, the abusive invective.

Predictable to the core.

But fortunately, the Australian voters spoke and Abbott answered the call and boat people are being stopped. At the end of the day the right of the people to decide whatever they wish to decide is sovereign.

You lose. Democracy wins. Always a good outcome!

In the words of Rajesh Kuthrapolli - 'Later losers!'
Grin

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greggerypeccary

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Re: 100 days without illegals
Reply #172 - Mar 30^th, 2014 at 3:03pm

Bread and Butter wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:42pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:38pm:

Bread and Butter wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:37pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:31pm:

Aussie wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:28pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:22pm:

Bread and Butter wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:20pm:

I actually support increasing our refugee numbers. I however oppose boat people. I have an implicit mistrust of people who come illegally and without ID and wonder exactly whey you do not.

The majority of boat people are granted genuine refugee status.

Why do you choose to ignore this fact?

Excellent point. Mr B & B is prejudiced.

Perhaps he missed one of my previous posts:

"A report by the Lowy Institute says boat people are more likely to be recognised as refugees than asylum seekers who arrive by air. It says: "Arguably Australia is worrying about the wrong asylum seekers. Whereas the majority of those arriving by boat are refugees, the majority of those arriving by air are not".

http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/2011/06/17/factbox-numbers-behind-asylum-deba...

Maybe he'll read it this time.

But the difference is those coming my plane have visas and ID. that is an exceedingly big difference. and we gave them permission to arrive - another big difference. I don't see why our right to sovereignty is so ignored by you regardless of reason. You cant arrive in anyone else's country without permission either.

"A report by the Lowy Institute says boat people are more likely to be recognised as refugees than asylum seekers who arrive by air. It says: "Arguably Australia is worrying about the wrong asylum seekers. Whereas the majority of those arriving by boat are refugees, the majority of those arriving by air are not".

What part of that don't you understand?

Seriously? Roll Eyes

What part of 'understand' do you think must necessarily impute 'agreement'? It was an OPINION article and one with which I disagree.

You claim to be good with words, but it is also apparent you don't quite understand any thoughts and opinions different to your own.

Tables 21 to 24:

http://www.immi.gov.au/media/publications/statistics/asylum/_files/asylum-stats-...

Official Government statistics. Not opinion.

The majority of boat people are granted genuine refugee status.

Capiche?

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John Smith

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Re: 100 days without illegals
Reply #173 - Mar 30^th, 2014 at 3:07pm

Bread and Butter wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 3:01pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:48pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:44pm:

Bread and Butter wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:40pm:

It is in fact exactly what I said which was that you really don't care at all if terrorists come by boat

using that logic, you simply don't care how many terrorist come and how many they kill, as long as they come by plane ....

Yep.

A plane ticket, along with a passport and visa, makes it all OK.

Can you believe the "logic" of these irrational bigots? Roll Eyes

LOL so now that the consistency of your argument is exposed out come the ad hominem attack 'irrational bigots'.

You people are so utterly predictable. First the use of hair-splitting pedantry, then the absolute denial of the right to an alternative opinion nevermind the idea that that opinion might have validity. And finally, the abusive invective.

Predictable to the core.

But fortunately, the Australian voters spoke and Abbott answered the call and boat people are being stopped. At the end of the day the right of the people to decide whatever they wish to decide is sovereign.

You lose. Democracy wins. Always a good outcome!

In the words of Rajesh Kuthrapolli - 'Later losers!'
Grin

you were the one trying to argue against boat people because a terrorist may enter, and then you accused Gregory is supporting terrorists and even supporting the imaginary bombing of a childcare centre simply because he doesn't have a panick attack at the mere mention of a boat person

now that your own arguments are used against you you get all uppity and high and mighty Grin

did you ever stop to think that if the argument is silly when used against you, it is equally as silly when you use it against others?

nooo, I bet that thought never once crossed your mind Cheesy

Like I said many times, comprehension is not your forte'

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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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greggerypeccary

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Re: 100 days without illegals
Reply #174 - Mar 30^th, 2014 at 3:08pm

Bread and Butter wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 3:01pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:48pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:44pm:

Bread and Butter wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:40pm:

It is in fact exactly what I said which was that you really don't care at all if terrorists come by boat

using that logic, you simply don't care how many terrorist come and how many they kill, as long as they come by plane ....

Yep.

A plane ticket, along with a passport and visa, makes it all OK.

Can you believe the "logic" of these irrational bigots? Roll Eyes

LOL so now that the consistency of your argument is exposed out come the ad hominem attack 'irrational bigots'.

You people are so utterly predictable. First the use of hair-splitting pedantry, then the absolute denial of the right to an alternative opinion nevermind the idea that that opinion might have validity. And finally, the abusive invective.

Predictable to the core.

But fortunately, the Australian voters spoke and Abbott answered the call and boat people are being stopped. At the end of the day the right of the people to decide whatever they wish to decide is sovereign.

You lose. Democracy wins. Always a good outcome!

In the words of Rajesh Kuthrapolli - 'Later losers!'
Grin

I'm dealing in facts here, not opinions.

Fact 1. You are an irrational bigot. Every post you've made has proved that beyond any reasonable doubt.

Fact 2. The majority of boat people are granted genuine refugee status. That's not opinion, it's recorded in official Government statistics:

http://www.immi.gov.au/media/publications/statistics/asylum/_files/asylum-stats-...

Fact 3. You have a very hard time dealing with facts.

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rabbitoh08

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Re: 100 days without illegals
Reply #175 - Mar 30^th, 2014 at 3:10pm

Bread and Butter wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:56pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:44pm:

Bread and Butter wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:40pm:

It is in fact exactly what I said which was that you really don't care at all if terrorists come by boat

using that logic, you simply don't care how many terrorist come and how many they kill, as long as they come by plane ....

Please don't embarrass yourself any further by an appeal to 'logic' since you very clearly have no understanding of the concept if that sentence is any example.

Ha ha ha!!! Thanks "Mr Logical".

Let's have a look at how "logical you are:

First - you get caught red-handed telling a lie.

You claimed that people who claim that we should "let them in, all of them, all the time."
You have not yet told us who claimed that.

You have been accused of telling a lie 3 times now, yet refuse to apologise for telling a lie, or explain why you felt the need to tell a lie.

All we get from you is your "logic"?!?!?:

Bread and Butter wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:56pm:

And once again, do you think all boar people should be able to come here? if you say YES then my statement is true about you. If you say NO then why aren't you supporting that position?

Pay attention liar.

It has already been explained to you:
People are demanding that asylums seekers be treated with respect and not abused or locked up indefinitely

They have committed no crime. They should have their claims assessed - and if they are not refugees - then deported. What is difficult about that? After all - it is our legal obligation.

NO ONE has ever claimed that we should "let them in, all of them, all the time."

What has been explained to you ad nauseum is that it not illegal to seek asylum - whether you arrive by plane or boat or hot air balloon. And it is Australia's legal obligation to process the claims of asylum seekers, and provide asylum in the case that they are genuine refugees.

Seriously - a liar like you would not know "logic" if it bit you on the arse.

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greggerypeccary

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Re: 100 days without illegals
Reply #176 - Mar 30^th, 2014 at 3:14pm

John Smith wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 3:07pm:

Bread and Butter wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 3:01pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:48pm:

John Smith wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:44pm:

Bread and Butter wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 2:40pm:

It is in fact exactly what I said which was that you really don't care at all if terrorists come by boat

using that logic, you simply don't care how many terrorist come and how many they kill, as long as they come by plane ....

Yep.

A plane ticket, along with a passport and visa, makes it all OK.

Can you believe the "logic" of these irrational bigots? Roll Eyes

LOL so now that the consistency of your argument is exposed out come the ad hominem attack 'irrational bigots'.

You people are so utterly predictable. First the use of hair-splitting pedantry, then the absolute denial of the right to an alternative opinion nevermind the idea that that opinion might have validity. And finally, the abusive invective.

Predictable to the core.

But fortunately, the Australian voters spoke and Abbott answered the call and boat people are being stopped. At the end of the day the right of the people to decide whatever they wish to decide is sovereign.

You lose. Democracy wins. Always a good outcome!

In the words of Rajesh Kuthrapolli - 'Later losers!'
Grin

you were the one trying to argue against boat people because a terrorist may enter, and then you accused Gregory is supporting terrorists and even supporting the imaginary bombing of a childcare centre simply because he doesn't have a panick attack at the mere mention of a boat person

now that your own arguments are used against you you get all uppity and high and mighty Grin

did you ever stop to think that if the argument is silly when used against you, it is equally as silly when you use it against others?

nooo, I bet that thought never once crossed your mind Cheesy

Like I said many times, comprehension is not your forte'

Mr B&B, I believe this is yours:

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Bam Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 21905 Gender:	Re: 100 days without illegals Reply #177 - Mar 30^th, 2014 at 5:37pm Bread and Butter wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 12:35pm: I don't know how you can possibly equate the chance that someone might arrive on a false passport and the guaranteed certainly that 100% of boat arrivals are doing so. 95% of all statistics quoted without a source are made up on the spot.
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Bam

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Re: 100 days with Spin
Reply #178 - Mar 30^th, 2014 at 5:46pm

Grendel wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 1:09pm:

Bam wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 7:05am:

Armchair_Politician wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 6:47am:

____ wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 6:11am:

illegal migrants is just con spin for refugees. So my question remains unanswered. Will it be a broken promise when the next boat arrives?

The Coalition is simply calling them what they are. However, calling them irregular maritime arrivals (as Labor did) is absurd in the extreme. Makes it sound as if they use some legitimate, but unreliable, ferry service!!! Grin

The Coalition are making up crap that obscures the debate. What about illegal foreign workers on farms? Why aren't the Coalition doing anything about them? If the Coalition were consistent, they would be sending in the Department of Immigration on frequent raids on anyone caught once with illegal foreign workers to make sure they never do it again.

I have friends that work for the Dept of Immigration they go on raids on a daily basis... They put people in Villawood daily... perhaps they need more staff.

I think you may be right to suggest that the Department of Immigration needs more staff.

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Bam

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Re: 100 days without illegals
Reply #179 - Mar 30^th, 2014 at 6:16pm

Grendel wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 1:25pm:

Bam wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 7:47am:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 7:08am:

Bam wrote on Mar 30^th, 2014 at 7:06am:

They come here because they know they can get illegal work on our farms and in many other businesses, no questions asked.

So then they are NOT legitimate asylum seekers???

Some are, some are not. It's why we need to process them - to weed out the greedy from among the persecuted.

We do then the pc brigade and their lawyers overturn the initial assessment which are in most cases valid.

We shouldn't penalise them though; they are the victims, not the criminals.

Really, and the country shoppers, and people smugglers and their families and economic refugees etc, etc...

The real criminals are the people smugglers and Australian businesses that employ people who do not have the legal right to work in Australia.

Not the war criminals and the rest I previously mentioned?

Smashing the people smugglers' business model does nothing if we do not also pursue the crooked Australian businesses with equal vigour and harsh penalties.

Do you honestly think considering most illegals end up on long term welfare that business is actually a large contributor to the problem?

Can you stop your silly

color highlighting

? It's lazy and makes it harder to respond to your points. Use quote tags, it's what they are for.

Your remarks about lawyers overturning the assessment is hypothetical nonsense, unless you can prove that every one of the assessments has been overturned in this manner. Which you can't because it's false. I could also point out people who have been detained indefinitely after an adverse security assessment, but who have not been deported.

Yes, the asylum seekers, refugees, etc are victims. Victims of the people smugglers, taking their money, lying to them, and setting them adrift on leaky boats. I would rather save my ire for the people smugglers. I would rather bring people smugglers to justice than persecute their victims.

I said nothing about war criminals. For good reason, it is a silly argument. We also have war criminals arriving by plane with proper travel papers. Do we denigrate everyone arriving by plane?

Did I say businesses were a "large contributor to the problem"? No, I did not. Did I say that businesses illegally employed asylum seekers? No, I did not. Both are straw man arguments. But let me tell you something. When you've got the Weekly Times and the Herald Sun running articles this week on several farms in Victoria where illegal labour is employed, you know there's a problem because these papers do not generally denigrate businesses or farmers.

Also, your assertion that "most illegals end up on long term welfare" would be better for proof. (They are not "illegals" by the way, that's Orwellian Coalition nonsense.)

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