Australian Politics Forum - How gullible are some people?

Prime Minister for Canyons

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 26906
Canberra
Gender: male

Re: How gullible are some people?
Reply #405 - Apr 9^th, 2014 at 11:21am

aquascoot wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 8:55am:

John Smith wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 8:34am:

Soren wrote on Apr 8^th, 2014 at 11:02pm:

John Smith wrote on Apr 8^th, 2014 at 10:51pm:

just don't try to tell me there is plenty of evidence out there .. there clearly isn't or you would have put it up 27 pages ago

What do you want proven?

And what would you accept as evidence for whatever it is that you want proven?

playing dumb now? I want proof that the two are the same & I'll accept any real proof.

Until you see the holes in his hands, you will not believe,

Thomas Wink

Actually if I do see the holes in the hands, I still won't believe. Tests show you can't put holes in the hands to crucify someone, their body weight will rip the nails through the gaps on their fingers. In order to really crucify you have to nail them between their radius and ulna bone so they can hold the weight

Back to top

In a time of universal deceit — telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

No evidence whatsoever it can be attributed to George Orwell or Eric Arthur Blair (in fact the same guy)

IP Logged

John Smith

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 74452
Gender: male

Re: How gullible are some people?
Reply #406 - Apr 9^th, 2014 at 11:22am

Prime Minister for Canyons wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 11:21am:

aquascoot wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 8:55am:

John Smith wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 8:34am:

Soren wrote on Apr 8^th, 2014 at 11:02pm:

John Smith wrote on Apr 8^th, 2014 at 10:51pm:

just don't try to tell me there is plenty of evidence out there .. there clearly isn't or you would have put it up 27 pages ago

What do you want proven?

And what would you accept as evidence for whatever it is that you want proven?

playing dumb now? I want proof that the two are the same & I'll accept any real proof.

Until you see the holes in his hands, you will not believe,

Thomas Wink

Actually if I do see the holes in the hands, I still won't believe. Tests show you can't put holes in the hands to crucify someone, their body weight will rip the nails through the gaps on their fingers. In order to really crucify you have to nail them between their radius and ulna bone so they can hold the weight

but you are talking about the son of god .... physics and reality don't apply.

Back to top

Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

IP Logged

Prime Minister for Canyons

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 26906
Canberra
Gender: male

Re: How gullible are some people?
Reply #407 - Apr 9^th, 2014 at 11:26am

John Smith wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 11:22am:

Prime Minister for Canyons wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 11:21am:

aquascoot wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 8:55am:

John Smith wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 8:34am:

Soren wrote on Apr 8^th, 2014 at 11:02pm:

John Smith wrote on Apr 8^th, 2014 at 10:51pm:

just don't try to tell me there is plenty of evidence out there .. there clearly isn't or you would have put it up 27 pages ago

What do you want proven?

And what would you accept as evidence for whatever it is that you want proven?

playing dumb now? I want proof that the two are the same & I'll accept any real proof.

Until you see the holes in his hands, you will not believe,

Thomas Wink

Actually if I do see the holes in the hands, I still won't believe. Tests show you can't put holes in the hands to crucify someone, their body weight will rip the nails through the gaps on their fingers. In order to really crucify you have to nail them between their radius and ulna bone so they can hold the weight

but you are talking about the son of god .... physics and reality don't apply.

For some yes, for me they do.

Back to top

In a time of universal deceit — telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

No evidence whatsoever it can be attributed to George Orwell or Eric Arthur Blair (in fact the same guy)

IP Logged

John Smith

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 74452
Gender: male

Re: How gullible are some people?
Reply #408 - Apr 9^th, 2014 at 11:33am

Prime Minister for Canyons wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 11:26am:

John Smith wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 11:22am:

Prime Minister for Canyons wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 11:21am:

aquascoot wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 8:55am:

John Smith wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 8:34am:

Soren wrote on Apr 8^th, 2014 at 11:02pm:

John Smith wrote on Apr 8^th, 2014 at 10:51pm:

just don't try to tell me there is plenty of evidence out there .. there clearly isn't or you would have put it up 27 pages ago

What do you want proven?

And what would you accept as evidence for whatever it is that you want proven?

playing dumb now? I want proof that the two are the same & I'll accept any real proof.

Until you see the holes in his hands, you will not believe,

Thomas Wink

Actually if I do see the holes in the hands, I still won't believe. Tests show you can't put holes in the hands to crucify someone, their body weight will rip the nails through the gaps on their fingers. In order to really crucify you have to nail them between their radius and ulna bone so they can hold the weight

but you are talking about the son of god .... physics and reality don't apply.

For some yes, for me they do.

Amen to that.... Grin

Back to top

Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

IP Logged

Soren Gold Member Offline Posts: 25654 Gender:	Re: How gullible are some people? Reply #409 - Apr 9^th, 2014 at 11:53am Unapologetic. http://vimeo.com/90454757 I recommend it highly. The importance of religious experience. Make a note of it. Also
Back to top	« Last Edit: Apr 9^th, 2014 at 12:02pm by Soren » IP Logged

Quantum

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 3373

Re: How gullible are some people?
Reply #410 - Apr 9^th, 2014 at 5:50pm

John Smith wrote on Apr 8^th, 2014 at 10:51pm:

Soren wrote on Apr 8^th, 2014 at 9:28pm:

SO the really extraordinary guy went completely unnoticed and the stupid Romans and others recorded instead the insignificant nobody who had little or no actual impact. Coz, like, every hugely embellished, invented mythical folk hero became the focus of a world-wide religion lasting millennia. We have dozens of them, don't we?

what extraordinary guy? some guy was crucified on a cross for breaking Roman law (thousands were) and just like many other where the death penalty was served, it was recorded... and someone else decided to write a story, either based on myths and fables floating around at that time or made up, and call the main character Jesus.

there is a 50yr gap between the two incidents. Prove that they are connected? It's a big ask is it?

So someone made up a story (When? I assume you are suggesting some time around 80AD?) about this bloke called Jesus who was crucified 50 years ago, and much later on we just happen to find a record about a Jesus being crucified when this story is set.

That's not a bad coincidence. Someone made up a religion about some bloke called Jesus who was crucified 50 years earlier, and there just happened to be a totally unremarkable and unconnected Jesus who was crucified by the Romans 50 years before this faker came up with his fairytale. I doubt all Roman records were openly available to the public or that copies were widely spread throughout the empire, but this story writer just happened to pick a name for his story of a nobody who was actually crucified in just the right time period.

He could have picked any name at any time, but this bloke picked an unknown person who we would later just happen to have evidence for this persons existence. I would have thought the unlikely chance of such a thing as being evidence of a connection.

Back to top

IP Logged

John Smith

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 74452
Gender: male

Re: How gullible are some people?
Reply #411 - Apr 9^th, 2014 at 7:27pm

Quantum wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 5:50pm:

John Smith wrote on Apr 8^th, 2014 at 10:51pm:

Soren wrote on Apr 8^th, 2014 at 9:28pm:

SO the really extraordinary guy went completely unnoticed and the stupid Romans and others recorded instead the insignificant nobody who had little or no actual impact. Coz, like, every hugely embellished, invented mythical folk hero became the focus of a world-wide religion lasting millennia. We have dozens of them, don't we?

what extraordinary guy? some guy was crucified on a cross for breaking Roman law (thousands were) and just like many other where the death penalty was served, it was recorded... and someone else decided to write a story, either based on myths and fables floating around at that time or made up, and call the main character Jesus.

there is a 50yr gap between the two incidents. Prove that they are connected? It's a big ask is it?

So someone made up a story (When? I assume you are suggesting some time around 80AD?) about this bloke called Jesus who was crucified 50 years ago, and much later on we just happen to find a record about a Jesus being crucified when this story is set.

That's not a bad coincidence. Someone made up a religion about some bloke called Jesus who was crucified 50 years earlier, and there just happened to be a totally unremarkable and unconnected Jesus who was crucified by the Romans 50 years before this faker came up with his fairytale. I doubt all Roman records were openly available to the public or that copies were widely spread throughout the empire, but this story writer just happened to pick a name for his story of a nobody who was actually crucified in just the right time period.

He could have picked any name at any time, but this bloke picked an unknown person who we would later just happen to have evidence for this persons existence. I would have thought the unlikely chance of such a thing as being evidence of a connection.

Listen, this all started because some moron said that 'His existence is beyond doubt.' ... that is plain wrong. His existance is not beyond doubt. The story could very well be true, but it could also be a work of fantasy, either way, you cannot prove it.

By the way, if it is made up, he chose a popular name and given that the name was popular, and hanging on the cross was the punishment of the day, the probability that someone with a popular name was crucified is high. Wink

Back to top

Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

IP Logged

Soren

Gold Member

Offline

Posts: 25654
Gender: male

Re: How gullible are some people?
Reply #412 - Apr 9^th, 2014 at 8:20pm

John Smith wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 7:27pm:

Listen, this all started because some nice person said that 'His existence is beyond doubt.' ... that is plain wrong. His existance is not beyond doubt. The story could very well be true, but it could also be a work of fantasy, either way, you cannot prove it.

Anything can be doubted (except your own doubting, ie thinking, and that only since 1637). So yours is as banal an argument as you can have.

That the man Jesus of Nazareth existed is beyond doubt by anyone who has had even a cursory look at the evidence. That people can doubt things despite the evidence is not a compelling but a banal argument so don't trot it out.

That he was a son of god is a different issue and is obviously not an empirical question but a much, much bigger one. For example, if you could offer only empirical proofs of your love for your wife and children, they would rightly despise you as a cold sociopath.

They might even ask if you were for real.

Back to top

IP Logged

greggerypeccary Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 137142 Gender:	Re: How gullible are some people? Reply #413 - Apr 9^th, 2014 at 8:38pm Soren wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 8:20pm: That the man Jesus of Nazareth existed is beyond doubt by anyone who has had even a cursory look at the evidence. Incorrect. You have clearly demonstrated that you have absolutely no idea what "beyond doubt" means. I guess we'll just add it to the list.
Back to top	IP Logged

John Smith

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 74452
Gender: male

Re: How gullible are some people?
Reply #414 - Apr 9^th, 2014 at 8:46pm

Soren wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 8:20pm:

John Smith wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 7:27pm:

Listen, this all started because some nice person said that 'His existence is beyond doubt.' ... that is plain wrong. His existance is not beyond doubt. The story could very well be true, but it could also be a work of fantasy, either way, you cannot prove it.

Anything can be doubted (except your own doubting, ie thinking, and that only since 1637). So yours is as banal an argument as you can have.

That the man Jesus of Nazareth existed is beyond doubt by anyone who has had even a cursory look at the evidence. That people can doubt things despite the evidence is not a compelling but a banal argument so don't trot it out.

That he was a son of god is a different issue and is obviously not an empirical question but a much, much bigger one. For example, if you could offer only empirical proofs of your love for your wife and children, they would rightly despise you as a cold sociopath.

They might even ask if you were for real.

banal is claiming that his existence is beyond a doubt, whilst failing to prove it. You just repeat the same crap I've heard from every priest since I was 10 'the proof is there if you have faith'.. the proof is not there.... The very term beyond a doubt means that it is beyond a doubt. ... just look at the 3 words.

I don't give a f%ck what you believe, just don't claim his existence is beyond a doubt... it very clearly isn't.

Back to top

Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

IP Logged

greggerypeccary Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 137142 Gender:	Re: How gullible are some people? Reply #415 - Apr 9^th, 2014 at 8:48pm John Smith wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 8:46pm: I don't give a f%ck what you believe, just don't claim his existence is beyond a doubt... it very clearly isn't. Amen.
Back to top	IP Logged

NorthOfNorth

Gold Member

Offline

OzPolitic

Posts: 17258
Gender: male

Re: How gullible are some people?
Reply #416 - Apr 9^th, 2014 at 9:44pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 8:38pm:

Soren wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 8:20pm:

That the man Jesus of Nazareth existed is beyond doubt by anyone who has had even a cursory look at the evidence.

Incorrect.

You have clearly demonstrated that you have absolutely no idea what "beyond doubt" means.

I guess we'll just add it to the list.

Never mind Jesus... Nazareth did not exist in early 1st century... Probably a mistranslation of Nazarite.

Back to top

Conviction is the art of being certain

IP Logged

greggerypeccary

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 137142
Gender: male

Re: How gullible are some people?
Reply #417 - Apr 9^th, 2014 at 9:50pm

NorthOfNorth wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 9:44pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 8:38pm:

Soren wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 8:20pm:

That the man Jesus of Nazareth existed is beyond doubt by anyone who has had even a cursory look at the evidence.

Incorrect.

You have clearly demonstrated that you have absolutely no idea what "beyond doubt" means.

I guess we'll just add it to the list.

Never mind Jesus... Nazareth did not exist in early 1st century...

That's true.

Their first album only came out in 1971.

Back to top

IP Logged

Yadda

Gold Member

Offline

Posts: 21727
A cat with a view

Re: How gullible are some people?
Reply #418 - Apr 9^th, 2014 at 9:51pm

NorthOfNorth wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 9:44pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 8:38pm:

Soren wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 8:20pm:

That the man Jesus of Nazareth existed is beyond doubt by anyone who has had even a cursory look at the evidence.

Incorrect.

You have clearly demonstrated that you have absolutely no idea what "beyond doubt" means.

I guess we'll just add it to the list.

Never mind Jesus... Nazareth did not exist in early 1st century... Probably a mistranslation of Nazarite.

And, Conviction is the art of being certain. .......too.

Back to top

"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

IP Logged

Yadda Gold Member Offline Posts: 21727 A cat with a view	Re: How gullible are some people? Reply #419 - Apr 9^th, 2014 at 9:53pm .....and some people find that believing in anything to be a drudge.
Back to top	"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead." Luke 16:31 IP Logged