Australian Politics Forum - Again voicing the concerns of the Silent Majority

polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20027 Canberra Gender:	Re: Again voicing the concerns of the Silent Majority Reply #15 - Apr 14^th, 2014 at 8:00am freediver wrote on Apr 13^th, 2014 at 7:28pm: How would you prefer me to spin it? Preferably by what muslims actually say. I wandered over to the general discussion board last week and saw the worst anti-semitic bigotry I've seen on this board. And not a muslim in sight.
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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 49089 At my desk.	Re: Again voicing the concerns of the Silent Majority Reply #16 - Apr 14^th, 2014 at 8:48am How about plotting? Is that familiar enough also? Muhammed slaughtered Jews for being plotting, traitorous Jews, not because they were scheming Jews. They were also treacherous. Happy now? I wouldn't want to sound like a bigot.
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Dnarever Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 58640 Here Gender:	Re: Again voicing the concerns of the Silent Majority Reply #17 - Apr 14^th, 2014 at 8:49am Posting Pickering ???? Ho Ho Ho. Now to find todays copy of Bolt or Akerman's dribble.
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Lord Herbert Gold Member Offline Posts: 34441 Gender:	Re: Again voicing the concerns of the Silent Majority Reply #18 - Apr 14^th, 2014 at 9:20am Dnarever wrote on Apr 14^th, 2014 at 8:49am: Posting Pickering ???? Ho Ho Ho. Now to find todays copy of Bolt or Akerman's dribble. Would you like to cite an example of their drivel?
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Yadda

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Re: Again voicing the concerns of the Silent Majority
Reply #19 - Apr 14^th, 2014 at 9:21am

polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 11^th, 2014 at 11:07am:

freediver wrote on Apr 9^th, 2014 at 8:19pm:

Muslims have an excuse for every single one of them. Just ask. Most of them start with "but they deserved it for being scheming Jews..."

Interesting, that in my nearly 2 years here you're the only person I've ever seen using that phrase.

gandalf,

There are many, many, words in the English language, that can be used to speak in a derogatory way, with derogatory intent, in describing the Jewish people.

So you see gandalf, it not so much the particular words which are being used that are important, but it is the intent that is being conveyed, with the particular words which are used, that is far more important.

e.g.
What intent would you attribute to the intent and virtue of ISLAM, if you heard these words that describe ISLAM ?....

Quote:

Rejecting Terror
Thursday, 11 April 2013

Muslims everywhere consider all acts of terrorism that aims to murder and maim innocent human beings utterly reprehensible and abhorrent.

There is no theological basis whatsoever for such acts in our faith.

The very meaning of the word 'Islam' is peace.

[ISLAM] rejects terror and promotes peace and harmony.

http://www.mcb.org.uk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=2307:mcbnewst...
http://www.mcb.org.uk/article_detail.php?article=announcement-656

Surely such phrases like these [coming from British 'mainstream' moslems]....

"Muslims everywhere consider all acts of terrorism.....abhorrent."

and,
"ISLAM is peace"

and,
"[ISLAM] rejects terror and promotes peace and harmony."

...would appear to present ISLAM as as though it was a virtuous, and violence free philosophy.

But every thinking person would know, that such a self portrayal [of ISLAM and moslem intent towards those who are not moslems], by moslems, is an utter deceit.

+++

FROM ISLAMIC law....

"Ibn 'Abbas reported that the Prophet said: "The bare essence of Islam and the basics of the religion are three [acts], upon which Islam has been established. Whoever leaves one of them becomes an unbeliever and his blood may legally be spilled. [The acts are:] Testifying that there is no God except Allah, the obligatory prayers, and the fast of Ramadan."...."
fiqhussunnah/#3.110

n.b.
"Whoever......becomes an unbeliever.....his blood may legally be spilled."

FROM THE SUNNA OF MOHAMMED

"...If somebody (a Muslim) discards his religion, kill him."

hadithsunnah/bukhari/ #004.052.260

FROM THE KORAN

"Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued. "
Koran 9.29

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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Yadda

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Re: Again voicing the concerns of the Silent Majority
Reply #20 - Apr 14^th, 2014 at 9:34am

polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 14^th, 2014 at 8:00am:

freediver wrote on Apr 13^th, 2014 at 7:28pm:

How would you prefer me to spin it?

Preferably by what muslims actually say.

But as has been pointed out in this forum, time and time again, that we [those of us who are not moslems] can never tell, if "what muslims actually say"
, actually reflects moslem intentions.

And surely, gandalf, moslem intentions, are far more important [in the real world], rather than what moslems say to us ?

"ISLAM is peace."

IMAGE.....

wtc-9-11.jpg

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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polite_gandalf

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Re: Again voicing the concerns of the Silent Majority
Reply #21 - Apr 14^th, 2014 at 11:01am

freediver wrote on Apr 14^th, 2014 at 8:48am:

How about plotting? Is that familiar enough also? Muhammed slaughtered Jews for being plotting, traitorous Jews, not because they were scheming Jews. They were also treacherous.

Happy now? I wouldn't want to sound like a bigot.

You do sound like a bigot - because you are a blatant distorter.

Muhammad executed traitors and schemers. Full stop. No one except you is phrasing it as traitorous and scheming jews.

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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Yadda

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Re: Again voicing the concerns of the Silent Majority
Reply #22 - Apr 14^th, 2014 at 11:35am

polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 14^th, 2014 at 11:01am:

freediver wrote on Apr 14^th, 2014 at 8:48am:

How about plotting? Is that familiar enough also? Muhammed slaughtered Jews for being plotting, traitorous Jews, not because they were scheming Jews. They were also treacherous.

Happy now? I wouldn't want to sound like a bigot.

You do sound like a bigot - because you are a blatant distorter.

Muhammad executed traitors and schemers. Full stop. No one except you is phrasing it as traitorous and scheming jews.

gandalf,

According to your own Koran, 'Allah is the best of schemers.'

"And they (the disbelievers) schemed, and Allah schemed (against them): and Allah is the best of schemers."
Koran 3.54

So isn't being a 'schemer' a virtuous quality ?

I ask, because being a 'schemer', is a quality that is attributed to Allah ?

And the word 'schemer' also 'translates' to, deceiver, imo.

gandalf,

QUESTION;
Do 'schemers' and 'traitors' and those who break their covenants belong together ?

+++

In the Bible, the God of Israel is attributed thus;

Job 12:16
With [God] is strength and wisdom: the deceived and the deceiver are his.

The God of Israel, a schemer ?

Isaiah 43:8
Bring forth the blind people that have eyes, and the deaf that have ears.
9 Let all the nations be gathered together, and let the people be assembled: who among them can declare this, and shew us former things? let them bring forth their witnesses, that they may be justified: or let them hear, and say, It is truth.
10 Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.
11 I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour.
12 I have declared, and have saved, and I have shewed, when there was no strange god among you: therefore ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, that I am God.
13 Yea, before the day was I am he; and there is none that can deliver out of my hand: I will work, and who shall let it?

Isaiah 45:17
But Israel shall be saved in the LORD with an everlasting salvation: ye shall not be ashamed nor confounded world without end.
18 For thus saith the LORD that created the heavens; God himself that formed the earth and made it; he hath established it, he created it not in vain, he formed it to be inhabited: I am the LORD; and there is none else.
19 I have not spoken in secret, in a dark place of the earth: I said not unto the seed of Jacob, Seek ye me in vain: I the LORD speak righteousness, I declare things that are right.
20 Assemble yourselves and come; draw near together, ye that are escaped of the nations: they have no knowledge that set up the wood of their graven image, and pray unto a god that cannot save.
21 Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me.
22 Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20027 Canberra Gender:	Re: Again voicing the concerns of the Silent Majority Reply #23 - Apr 14^th, 2014 at 1:04pm Stirring words Y. .... that is, at least I assume they are. I'm sure I would come to that conclusion if I could actually be bothered reading them.
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Karnal

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Re: Again voicing the concerns of the Silent Majority
Reply #24 - Apr 14^th, 2014 at 1:12pm

Lord Herbert wrote on Apr 14^th, 2014 at 9:20am:

Dnarever wrote on Apr 14^th, 2014 at 8:49am:

Posting Pickering ????

Ho Ho Ho.

Now to find todays copy of Bolt or Akerman's dribble.

Would you like to cite an example of their drivel?

Sure. Here's an oldie but a goodie on Piers from the usual suspects on Media Watch:

Quote:

Piers' Plagiarism :: 10/02/2003

Here’s Piers in December giving Carmen Lawrence a pasting.

Making a martyr for a lost cause
In resigning from Labor's shadow cabinet, the postergirl for the tunnel-visioned Left has attempted to portray herself as a martyr...
Sunday Telegraph, 8 December 2002

To highlight Carmen's failings, Piers quoted from a senior member of Al-Qaeda, Abu Amain Al-Hilali, who believed that terrorists are justified in killing Westerners.

'Making a martyr for a lost cause'
The citizens of the democratic western countries take full part in the decisions taken by their governments. The residents of those countries are not classified as 'civilians' as they were classified during previous wars in history.
Sunday Telegraph, 8 December 2002

See Piers Akerman's article »

Piers' wasn't only quoting Al-Halili. Everything he said about him and his views was taken from an Israel Defence Force press release.

'Making a martyr for a lost cause'
Abu Aiman Al- Hilali, a senior member of the Al- Qaida terror organization, marked the US, Britain, France, Italy, Canada, Germany and Australia as enemies of the organization. He also justified terror attacks perpetrated by Al- Qaeda "Jihad warriors" in the US, Tunisia, Pakistan, Yemen, Bali, Moscow and other places.
Sunday Telegraph, 8 December 2002

Read IDF Press Release »

Akerman dropped almost every word of that Israeli press release straight into his article without thanks or acknowledgement and it’s not an isolated case.

You want one from Bolt? It's hard to know where to start.

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Karnal

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Re: Again voicing the concerns of the Silent Majority
Reply #25 - Apr 14^th, 2014 at 1:20pm

Yadda wrote on Apr 14^th, 2014 at 9:34am:

polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 14^th, 2014 at 8:00am:

freediver wrote on Apr 13^th, 2014 at 7:28pm:

How would you prefer me to spin it?

Preferably by what muslims actually say.

But as has been pointed out in this forum, time and time again, that we [those of us who are not moslems] can never tell, if "what muslims actually say"
, actually reflects moslem intentions.

And surely, gandalf, moslem intentions, are far more important [in the real world], rather than what moslems say to us ?

"ISLAM is peace."

IMAGE.....
http://oedipuslex.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/wtc-9-11.jpg
wtc-9-11.jpg

That's right, Y. Here's what a Karmic Christian had to say in Oklahoma.

Google:

Come unto me, all ye that labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

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OKLAHOMA-CITY-BOMBING-ANNIVERSARY-large570.jpg (75 KB | 50 )

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freediver

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At my desk.

Re: Again voicing the concerns of the Silent Majority
Reply #26 - Apr 14^th, 2014 at 1:23pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 14^th, 2014 at 11:01am:

freediver wrote on Apr 14^th, 2014 at 8:48am:

How about plotting? Is that familiar enough also? Muhammed slaughtered Jews for being plotting, traitorous Jews, not because they were scheming Jews. They were also treacherous.

Happy now? I wouldn't want to sound like a bigot.

You do sound like a bigot - because you are a blatant distorter.

Muhammad executed traitors and schemers. Full stop. No one except you is phrasing it as traitorous and scheming jews.

Yes, 800 of them in one day. Because they were schemers. Not because they were Jews.

Thanks for the clarification Gandalf. I have added it to the wiki for future reference.

http://www.ozpolitic.com/wiki/index.php?title=Islamic_lexicon

Now don't say I never update it.

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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polite_gandalf

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Re: Again voicing the concerns of the Silent Majority
Reply #27 - Apr 14^th, 2014 at 2:51pm

I really don't know what your hang up on this is FD. The Qurayza were executed because they were traitors, not because they were jews. You are the only one trying to put an anti-semitic frame around this by putting words into my mouth. Presumably because I refuse to condemn this act because they were jews.

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20027 Canberra Gender:	Re: Again voicing the concerns of the Silent Majority Reply #28 - Apr 14^th, 2014 at 2:55pm By the way FD, plotting, traitorous and treacherous jews are unacceptable as well. Please update the wiki again. And let it be known these are your terms, and your terms alone. I encourage you to provide a footnote to this very post.
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polite_gandalf

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Re: Again voicing the concerns of the Silent Majority
Reply #29 - Apr 14^th, 2014 at 3:04pm

oh and while I'm at it, the burqa is not the traditional scarf. That is called the hijab. Your description of the niqab is actually the burqa. The niqab is just a cloth that covers the whole face except for the eyes - the burqa is the one piece head to foot covering with a mesh over the eyes.

Also a note on spelling: both 'burqa' and 'niqab' are spelled with the arabic "qaaf" (ق) - which is the equivalent to the english Q. So it is not correct to spell one with a k and one with a q - they should both be the same, and preferably with a q.

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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