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the ever-convenient Muslim "war" excuse (Read 5202 times)
polite_gandalf
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Re: the ever-convenient Muslim "war" excuse
Reply #30 - Apr 22nd, 2014 at 10:18pm
 
freediver wrote on Apr 22nd, 2014 at 10:15pm:
There was no Islamic state at the time.


and...?
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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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Yadda
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Re: the ever-convenient Muslim "war" excuse
Reply #31 - Apr 23rd, 2014 at 9:37am
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 22nd, 2014 at 10:06pm:

I think any state - muslim or non-muslim - could justifiably reserve the right to execute their own citizens who conspired with a hostile aggressor to bring down the state.





Yeah, 'me too', gandalf.i
Moslems, 'in' Australia......

Quote:

"[a respected moslem community spokesman has] called on Australian Muslims to spurn secular democracy and Western notions of moderate Islam...
...[moslems in Australia were told] that democracy is "haram" (forbidden) for Muslims, whose political engagement should be be based purely on Islamic law.
"We must adhere to Islam and Islam alone,"
Mr Hanif [said]"



http://www.jihadwatch.org/2010/07/australia-members-of-hizb-ut-tahrir-say-countr...





IMAGE...
...
August 4, 2005      
Australian Islamic leader defends jihad
"I am telling you that my religion doesn't tolerate other religion. It doesn't tolerate," he said.
"The only one law which needs to spread, it can be here or anywhere else, is Islam."

http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200508/s1430551.htm



Yadda wrote on Jan 29th, 2014 at 9:54pm:
Many moslems here in Australia too, wanted to give all Australians a blessing, at the Melbourne Cricket Ground, on Grand Final day [a few years ago], it would have been a big firework blessing i'm told.

Such devotions of peace.

I'm sure that the moslem children would have had a peace sign for that big firework too.

Quote:
"Whoever would have thought such seemingly innocent youth as these were secretly murdering  Gud’s children? "





Google;
mcg bombing plot by 'terrorists'




And i found it funny [hilarious eh?], how the Australian mainstream media, couldn't bring themselves to associate the MCG bombing plot, with mainstream ISLAM or with mainstream moslems,
....so the Australian mainstream media just decided to refer to those bomb plotters as 'terrorists'.







The description of a YOUTUBE video;

Quote:
"A Melbourne Muslim cleric, found guilty of a terror plot to 'blow up' the Melbourne Cricket Ground speaks candidly about his intentions. It is revealed however, that he has been living off state handouts for 19 years, and married an Australian Muslim to prevent his deportation. They went on to have 7 kids together, all funded by state handouts."


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2jT6ldUu4-4



To me, that description, sounds more like a description of a destructive 'cancerous' growth, than a description of a human being.





+++





Quote:
Cleric preaches that violence is part of Islam
01/05/2007
In documents seen by The Daily Telegraph, al-Muhajiroun claimed: "Terrorism is a part of Islam" and "ALLAH MADE IT OBLIGATORY TO PREPARE AND TO TERRIFY THE ENEMY OF ALLAH".
The article advised: "The kuffar of USA and UK are without doubt our enemy.There is no such thing as an innocent kafir, innocence is only applicable for the Muslims. Not only is it obligatory to fight them, it is haram [forbidden] to feel sorry for them."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/05/01/nplot901.xml
The link is old, the news item is valid.


Moslems stirring up sedition ?

Moslems "conspiring with a hostile aggressor to bring down the state" ?

What should be the punishment for such individuals, gandalf ?



Dictionary;
sedition = = conduct or speech inciting rebellion against the authority of a state or monarch.

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31
 
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Yadda
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Re: the ever-convenient Muslim "war" excuse
Reply #32 - Apr 23rd, 2014 at 9:47am
 
But we can trust moslems like gandalf, because gandalf, is a moderate, tolerant moslem.

He assures us it is so.


Again voicing the concerns of the Silent Majority

http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1396769137/54#54
polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 17th, 2014 at 8:00pm:

My religion is a religion of tolerance and non-bigotry and peace.


You are of course free to ridicule this and call me a liar all you like. Become a Yadda drone and start telling everyone to google taqqiya if you think that will be constructive.






But don't ask moslems like gandalf, to do anything, to act, against the 'bad' moslems!

You know, those 'bad' moslems, who are bringing the name of ISLAM into disrepute!!!!


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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31
 
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freediver
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Re: the ever-convenient Muslim "war" excuse
Reply #33 - Apr 23rd, 2014 at 12:18pm
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 22nd, 2014 at 10:18pm:
freediver wrote on Apr 22nd, 2014 at 10:15pm:
There was no Islamic state at the time.


and...?


And this is irrelevant:

polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 22nd, 2014 at 10:06pm:
I think any state - muslim or non-muslim - could justifiably reserve the right to execute their own citizens who conspired with a hostile aggressor to bring down the state.



It was nothing at all like that. There was not state. There was no trial. There was no effort at all to figure out who was guilty of an actual crime. There was just Muhammed executing 800 unarmed prisoners because the tribe they belonged to was the last thing standing between Muhammed and total control over Medina - a strategic town from which he could rob and murder traders going to and from Mecca.

Does Islam permit the execution of POWs?
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polite_gandalf
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Re: the ever-convenient Muslim "war" excuse
Reply #34 - Apr 23rd, 2014 at 5:51pm
 
freediver wrote on Apr 23rd, 2014 at 12:18pm:
There was not state.


Incorrect.
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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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freediver
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Re: the ever-convenient Muslim "war" excuse
Reply #35 - Apr 23rd, 2014 at 6:37pm
 
Hold up Gandalf. You are moving this debate along too fast.

Does Islam permit the execution of POWs?
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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.
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freediver
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Re: the ever-convenient Muslim "war" excuse
Reply #36 - Apr 24th, 2014 at 7:07pm
 
Another interesting excuse - slaughtering all those Jews was necessary to protect the 'fledgling' state that Muhammed was trying to establish, which just happened to be in the Jews home town of Medina.

polite_gandalf wrote on Feb 10th, 2014 at 10:47am:
freediver wrote on Feb 10th, 2014 at 6:53am:
Yes you have already tried to justify Muhammed's actions. But you would never attempt to justify such behaviour in any other context. Hence my surprise that you described it as an excellent example to follow.


Why would that surprise you? I think executing traitors in time of war who are conspiring to commit genocide on your small nation is an excellent example to follow, and I doubt too many people would disagree. The only people who pretend to disagree is those who cynically use wishy-washy western liberal morals as a tool to smear Muhammad and Islam.

And my point about context is to emphasise the fact that it is not (as you love to claim ad-nauseum) blanket permission or "command" as you originally put it, to go forth and find POWs just so they can be beheaded. It was a drastic action for a most drastic time - and anyone who looks at it honestly and objectively (not you, I know) would concede that it was not a case of a warmongering leader being unnecessary bloodthirsty, but a strong leader doing what he had to do to protect his people and the survival of his fledgling state. Thus it is not even about islamic doctrine - this is not a "sunna" action of Muhammad the religious teacher - it is merely the earthly actions of a statesman protecting his people.


Gandalf, would you mind citing an example of a 'non-drastic' war where we could expect Muslims to not execute POWs?
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