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The Christian Right - salvation of a nation? (Read 4225 times)
perceptions_now
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Re: The Christian Right - salvation of a nation?
Reply #15 - Apr 15th, 2014 at 9:33pm
 
NO!
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Frances
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Re: The Christian Right - salvation of a nation?
Reply #16 - Apr 16th, 2014 at 12:00am
 
GA wrote on Apr 15th, 2014 at 10:48am:
The Christian Right

Where in the article does it state that these eleven people demonstrating outside a Liberal MP's office were right wingers?

GA wrote on Apr 15th, 2014 at 10:48am:
Consider for example how superior the Exclusive Brethren are compared to the regular Aussie 'culture'.

The Exclusive Brethren are not a mainstream Christian group.  There is also no evidence contained in the article that they were involved in this protest.  Why are you dragging them into it?
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Sure God created man before woman. But then you always make a rough draft before the final masterpiece.
 
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GA
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Re: The Christian Right - salvation of a nation?
Reply #17 - Apr 16th, 2014 at 10:05am
 
Prime Minister for Canyons wrote on Apr 15th, 2014 at 11:40am:
Mmmm, not completely batshit crazy just tending towards it.


What's the point of conceding anything, if you then follow it up with an ad-hominem? But of course you are just allowing an 'out' for yourself (you're an opportunist?). Politics relates to people more than it does to individuals, so leave the ego aspect out, that is if you can manage to do that.
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GA
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Re: The Christian Right - salvation of a nation?
Reply #18 - Apr 16th, 2014 at 10:31am
 
Vuk11 wrote on Apr 15th, 2014 at 12:13pm:
Philosophy and ethics could have filled the void of religion but it sadly hasn't. There are many great writings that provide an excellent perspective and explanation for core values we all hold, while using the same approach to go one step further and question our current culture.


Philosophy has never had an effective hold on society because it's not really offering anything of of 'substance'. I mean it has no 'God' for example. Besides it's to lofty in most cases to appeal to a majority. And would be mostly irrelevant in a Godless universe anyhow, because it would be overridden in most instances by all 'survival of the fittest' type values. What religion needs to do is adopt a more philosophical approach, that way in itself it becomes a vector for logic as well as morality etc. But of course it must be kept in mind that there may be philosophies that are in themselves Darwinistic, capitalism for example.
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Re: The Christian Right - salvation of a nation?
Reply #19 - Apr 16th, 2014 at 10:34am
 
GA wrote on Apr 16th, 2014 at 10:05am:
Prime Minister for Canyons wrote on Apr 15th, 2014 at 11:40am:
Mmmm, not completely batshit crazy just tending towards it.


What's the point of conceding anything, if you then follow it up with an ad-hominem? But of course you are just allowing an 'out' for yourself (you're an opportunist?). Politics relates to people more than it does to individuals, so leave the ego aspect out, that is if you can manage to do that.



No i'm simply saying that I can trust religious folk as far as I can kick them.
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In a time of universal deceit — telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

No evidence whatsoever it can be attributed to George Orwell or Eric Arthur Blair (in fact the same guy)
 
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GA
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Re: The Christian Right - salvation of a nation?
Reply #20 - Apr 16th, 2014 at 11:20am
 
Peter Freedman wrote on Apr 15th, 2014 at 12:17pm:
The Exclusive Brethren are a dishonest and secretive organisation.


That's what the left will have you believe. Kevin Rudd, for example, and as you'll remember, branded them: " an extremist cult and sect". And followed it up with: "They split families and I am deeply concerned about their impact on communities across Australia." Only to backtrack on it all all later when no doubt he realized he had got his rhetoric all arse about. For example, the Brethren may split some families, but that's absolutely nothing in comparison to the destructive effects that our own Aussie 'cult'-ure has had on the family. That is the number of EB families that actually stay together is far greater as ratio than is just about any (I'm guessing) in the western world.

And they really are a culture, more than they are simply a 'cult', or just an organization. 

Quote:
Despite their "exclusiveness", they have interfered politically on both sides of the Tasman and tried to keep it secret.


They have just as much right to lobby politicians as does any other group or individual. And by lobbying they are in effect still staying as detached from politics as is possible without making too many concessions to those who want to impose 'alternate' moral values on society. 

Quote:
They need to be watched very carefully.


You bet. They're emerging as a cultural group that needs to be examined closely as an example of an improvement on our presently decaying society. 

Try 'watching' some of them yourself, the first thing you'll notice is that they are generally more physically attractive than are the typical Aussies. I'd noticed this about ten years back when I didn't know any thing at all about them, but I was of course looking at the 'sisteren' (their womenfolk).
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« Last Edit: Apr 16th, 2014 at 5:19pm by GA »  
 
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Re: The Christian Right - salvation of a nation?
Reply #21 - Apr 16th, 2014 at 11:25am
 
GA wrote on Apr 16th, 2014 at 11:20am:
Try 'watching' some of them yourself, the first thing you'll notice is that they are generally more physically attractive than are the typical Aussies. I'd noticed this about ten years back when I didn't know any thing at all about them, but I was of course looking at the 'sisteren' (their womenfolk).



Hahahaha, wait you're serious, let me laugh even harder.
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In a time of universal deceit — telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

No evidence whatsoever it can be attributed to George Orwell or Eric Arthur Blair (in fact the same guy)
 
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GA
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Re: The Christian Right - salvation of a nation?
Reply #22 - Apr 16th, 2014 at 11:49am
 
Schu wrote on Apr 15th, 2014 at 12:32pm:
Doesn't the Exclusive Brethren dictate that their members can't vote in government elections? So they don't believe in democracy and take a dictatorial approach to those who are members.


Our society is presently dictating plenty of things to us. For example who has had the opportunity to vote against (or for) gay rights? (the argument being that it would be appropriate for a government to cater to those that are different, but should we the people be made to pander to them just because they are different?)

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If the Exclusive Brethren is so anti-society, why don't they buy an island and all just live there?


If you are so anti-Brethren wouldn't it be easier for you to buy the island and move to it.

The Brethren are well within their rights to express a bias by doing their best to remain as separate as is possible from the rest of society. So it's people like you that should follow that example and isolate yourselves rather than attack them for their values. It's the 'Aussies' that are on the attack here in this country, not the Brethren.
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Re: The Christian Right - salvation of a nation?
Reply #23 - Apr 16th, 2014 at 11:51am
 
GA wrote on Apr 16th, 2014 at 11:49am:
Schu wrote on Apr 15th, 2014 at 12:32pm:
Doesn't the Exclusive Brethren dictate that their members can't vote in government elections? So they don't believe in democracy and take a dictatorial approach to those who are members.


Our society is presently dictating plenty of things to us. For example who has had the opportunity to vote against (or for) gay rights? (the argument being that it would be appropriate for a government to cater to those that are different, but should we the people be made to pander to them just because they are different?)

Quote:
If the Exclusive Brethren is so anti-society, why don't they buy an island and all just live there?


If you are so anti-Brethren wouldn't it be easier for you to buy the island and move to it.

The Brethren are well within their rights to express a bias by doing their best to remain as separate as is possible from the rest of society. So it's people like you that should follow that example and isolate yourselves rather than attack them for their values. It's the 'Aussie's' that are on the attack here in this country, not the Brethren.




Why would we need to vote for or against gay rights? Do we need to vote for human rights? Shouldnt those rights just be assumed.
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In a time of universal deceit — telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

No evidence whatsoever it can be attributed to George Orwell or Eric Arthur Blair (in fact the same guy)
 
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GA
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Re: The Christian Right - salvation of a nation?
Reply #24 - Apr 16th, 2014 at 11:53am
 
Prime Minister for Canyons wrote on Apr 16th, 2014 at 11:51am:
GA wrote on Apr 16th, 2014 at 11:49am:
Schu wrote on Apr 15th, 2014 at 12:32pm:
Doesn't the Exclusive Brethren dictate that their members can't vote in government elections? So they don't believe in democracy and take a dictatorial approach to those who are members.


Our society is presently dictating plenty of things to us. For example who has had the opportunity to vote against (or for) gay rights? (the argument being that it would be appropriate for a government to cater to those that are different, but should we the people be made to pander to them just because they are different?)

Quote:
If the Exclusive Brethren is so anti-society, why don't they buy an island and all just live there?


If you are so anti-Brethren wouldn't it be easier for you to buy the island and move to it.

The Brethren are well within their rights to express a bias by doing their best to remain as separate as is possible from the rest of society. So it's people like you that should follow that example and isolate yourselves rather than attack them for their values. It's the 'Aussie's' that are on the attack here in this country, not the Brethren.




Why would we need to vote for or against gay rights? Do we need to vote for human rights? Shouldnt those rights just be assumed.


Gays aren't human?
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Re: The Christian Right - salvation of a nation?
Reply #25 - Apr 16th, 2014 at 11:54am
 
GA wrote on Apr 16th, 2014 at 11:53am:
Prime Minister for Canyons wrote on Apr 16th, 2014 at 11:51am:
GA wrote on Apr 16th, 2014 at 11:49am:
Schu wrote on Apr 15th, 2014 at 12:32pm:
Doesn't the Exclusive Brethren dictate that their members can't vote in government elections? So they don't believe in democracy and take a dictatorial approach to those who are members.


Our society is presently dictating plenty of things to us. For example who has had the opportunity to vote against (or for) gay rights? (the argument being that it would be appropriate for a government to cater to those that are different, but should we the people be made to pander to them just because they are different?)

Quote:
If the Exclusive Brethren is so anti-society, why don't they buy an island and all just live there?


If you are so anti-Brethren wouldn't it be easier for you to buy the island and move to it.

The Brethren are well within their rights to express a bias by doing their best to remain as separate as is possible from the rest of society. So it's people like you that should follow that example and isolate yourselves rather than attack them for their values. It's the 'Aussie's' that are on the attack here in this country, not the Brethren.




Why would we need to vote for or against gay rights? Do we need to vote for human rights? Shouldnt those rights just be assumed.


Gays aren't human?




Yes, yes they clearly are. So therefore we shouldnt need to vote for or against gay rights. They should be assumed.
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In a time of universal deceit — telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

No evidence whatsoever it can be attributed to George Orwell or Eric Arthur Blair (in fact the same guy)
 
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GA
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Re: The Christian Right - salvation of a nation?
Reply #26 - Apr 16th, 2014 at 4:15pm
 
Sprintcyclist wrote on Apr 15th, 2014 at 12:57pm:
I had the EB under the blanket of 'Cult'.


Cults usually have cult leaders, charismatic psychopath types. If Bruce Hales were one of these he'd be a lot better known, but he's not. It's the left that are trying to label the EB as being a cult, and Aussies in general want to see them lopped down for being tall poppies/successful types. 

The Aussie: " If my kids are always in trouble with the law, then why shouldn't theirs be too" kind of thing.

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Christianity is a nonpolitical movement. By Jesus's teachings.


That's right it's not a political movement. But that not saying it's not entitled to a political influence. Some people misunderstand what secular government exactly means. And it's not that religion can't have its influence, but is provided that religion is itself not 'legislated' in any way. Otherwise the theists have the same democratic rights as everyone else. Liberalism is taking  advantage of this freedom 'from' religion aspect to try and deny the democratic rights of believers.
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GA
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Re: The Christian Right - salvation of a nation?
Reply #27 - Apr 16th, 2014 at 4:50pm
 
Prime Minister for Canyons wrote on Apr 16th, 2014 at 11:25am:
GA wrote on Apr 16th, 2014 at 11:20am:
Try 'watching' some of them yourself, the first thing you'll notice is that they are generally more physically attractive than are the typical Aussies. I'd noticed this about ten years back when I didn't know any thing at all about them, but I was of course looking at the 'sisteren' (their womenfolk).



Hahahaha, wait you're serious, let me laugh even harder.


Until I'd become aware of what the Brethren were, I'd wondered why it is that Americans look so good. The answer I now believe relates to Christianity. I'm still not quite sure why this is so, but?


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Taipan
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Re: The Christian Right - salvation of a nation?
Reply #28 - Apr 17th, 2014 at 8:14am
 
fezz wrote on Apr 15th, 2014 at 4:50pm:
Take a trip around the wheatbelt towns of WA, you'll soon see how "inclusive' the EB are. Rule their own with an iron fist, generally have monopolies of town business through patient attrition and takeover, exclude the non EB members of town from dealings both public and private. But they are more than willing to fleece the non EB townsfolk of their hard earned with inflated prices on goods in a one price for us / one price for you deal.



Sounds a lot like the chinese.
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GA
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Re: The Christian Right - salvation of a nation?
Reply #29 - Apr 17th, 2014 at 10:19am
 
Frances wrote on Apr 16th, 2014 at 12:00am:
GA wrote on Apr 15th, 2014 at 10:48am:
The Christian Right

Where in the article does it state that these eleven people demonstrating outside a Liberal MP's office were right wingers?


It doesn't, and if anything they are from the Christian left. But it's still an example of a group that's on the right, in the social sense, standing up against the actions of nationalistic government.  And don't get me wrong, I'm not actually agreeing with their motivations anyhow, because for one thing they are showing signs typical of a group that's really being motivated by the X factor thing. That is they are concerned for the 'children' involved, when that concern is really the domain of the children's parents. What I mean is help the adults, and those that are parents then are allowed to carry out the responsibility for taking care of their own children. The response is an 'emotionally based one rather than a combination of emotion and logic. But still it's better than no-one doing anything.

Quote:
GA wrote on Apr 15th, 2014 at 10:48am:
Consider for example how superior the Exclusive Brethren are compared to the regular Aussie 'culture'.


The Exclusive Brethren are not a mainstream Christian group.  There is also no evidence contained in the article that they were involved in this protest.  Why are you dragging them into it?


Once again you are right, but they were brought into the picture as being an example of what might be a superior culture that has arisen separate (out of necessity) from our own. What I mean is the only way possible that something 'new', in a cultural sense, can come about here in Underdogland, with it's enforced egalitarianism, is if it starts off for example as a religious cult. A diversity that being brought about by necessity kind of thing too .
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« Last Edit: Apr 17th, 2014 at 6:08pm by GA »  
 
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