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Australia Not In The Midst Of Budget Crisis. (Read 4862 times)
longweekend58
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Re: Australia Not In The Midst Of Budget Crisis.
Reply #30 - Apr 24th, 2014 at 11:42am
 
aquascoot wrote on Apr 24th, 2014 at 10:54am:
buzzanddidj wrote on Apr 24th, 2014 at 10:32am:
Quote:

Shadow assistant treasurer Andrew Leigh accused Mr Hockey of playing political games with the budget, after blocking the previous Labor government's savings measures when in opposition.

The treasurer should acknowledge the fiscal impact of coalition decisions to scrap measures such as the mining and carbon taxes, he said.

"What we've got now from Joe Hockey is really the shadow treasurer in drag," Dr Leigh told ABC Radio.





VERY smart fella



Quote:
Leigh's early years of education were in Sydney, Melbourne, Malaysia and Indonesia, before receiving secondary education at James Ruse Agricultural High School in Sydney, New South Wales.

Leigh holds a BA(Hons) and LLB(Hons) from the University of Sydney, and an MPA and PhD from the Kennedy School of Government at Harvard University.

He has published over 50 journal articles in the disciplines of economics, public policy and law, and over 100 opinion pieces.

His research findings have been discussed in The Australian, The Australian Financial Review, Christian Science Monitor, The Economist, New York Times, The Sydney Morning Herald, Time, Wall Street Journal and Washington Post.

Prior to entering politics, Leigh was a professor in the Research School of Economics at the Australian National University.

His research was in the fields of labour economics, public finance, and political economy.

He has also previously worked as a lawyer for Minter Ellison (Sydney) and Clifford Chance (London), and as Associate to Justice Michael Kirby of the High Court of Australia.

He has also worked as a researcher for UK Solicitor General Ross Cranston, as senior trade adviser to the late Senator Peter Cook, and as a research fellow with the Progressive Policy Institute (Washington, D.C.)





I'd expect him to be the Federal Treasurer, at some point






Yes, well, he seems to have spent a lot of time attending lectures (given by economists who hang out in universities because they couldn't cut it in the "real" economy.)
I'd be more impressed if he had run a business or two successfully


exactly. and to be treasurer this bozo will have to change parties because the ALP is doomed to opposition for a long time.
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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
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perceptions_now
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Re: Australia Not In The Midst Of Budget Crisis.
Reply #31 - Apr 24th, 2014 at 11:53am
 
Quote:
Aust not in midst of budget crisis: Labor

Date
    April 24, 2014
    The Age

Labor has dismissed Treasurer Joe Hockey's warnings about the spiralling costs of welfare, health and other government spending.      Huh

In a speech in Sydney on Wednesday night, Mr Hockey unveiled some details from the soon-to-be-released commission of audit, which shows government spending has almost tripled in the past 40 years.

Over the medium term, the commission expects the 15 largest and fastest growing programs to be welfare, health, education and defence - in most cases growing considerably faster than the economy.

Mr Hockey flagged cuts across the board in the May budget, adding that a greater reliance on means testing and co-payments could be on the way.

Opposition finance spokesman Tony Burke rubbished the treasurer's bleak portrait of the budget.

"Countries that have triple-A credit ratings are not in the midst of a budget crisis," Mr Burke told ABC Radio on Thursday.

"None of the information that Joe Hockey's referring to there is new. They're wanting to pretend that they've just realised this through the commission of audit."

In his speech, Mr Hockey made particular mention of the pension, following speculation the government would increase the retirement age to 70.   Angry        

The $40 billion spent annually on the aged pension was more than that given to defence, hospitals or schools, Mr Hockey said.

Mr Burke said the government was simply laying the groundwork for changes to the aged pension, breaking an election promise.      Sad

The commission of audit is due to be released next week.

It report makes 86 recommendations, but Mr Hockey says he will not automatically accept all them.

"Some can be actioned in the short term, others require further consideration and some will be rejected outright," he said in his speech on Wednesday.

Shadow assistant treasurer Andrew Leigh accused Mr Hockey of playing political games with the budget, after blocking the previous Labor government's savings measures when in opposition.      Sad

The treasurer should acknowledge the fiscal impact of coalition decisions to scrap measures such as the mining and carbon taxes, he said.

"What we've got now from Joe Hockey is really the shadow treasurer in drag," Dr Leigh told ABC Radio.


Labor are "somewhat" disingenuous, to say the least!
But then, so are the Liberals!

The fact is that BOTH LABOR & LIBERALS HAVE KNOWN OR SHOULD HAVE KNOWN, THAT A CRISIS WOULD OCCUR, THEY KNEW ROUGHLY WHEN IT WOULD START & NEITHER TOOK THE APPROPRIATE MEASURES, WHICH SHOULD HAVE BEEN TAKEN & THAT HAS BEEN GOING ON FOR SOME 40-50 YEARS!

There are a few major reason/s behind what are happening, But the Demographic & related issues are certainly the easiest to track & much of what is now raised, as if it has "suddenly" become known, should have been readily apparent for decades AND NONE OF THE MAJOR POLITICAL PARTY'S TOOK THE APPROPRIATE ACTIONS OR SUFFICIENT APPROPRIATE ACTIONS, TO SET ASIDE A SUFFICIENT POOL OF ADDITIONAL ASSETS, FOR WHAT WAS OBVIOUSLY GOING TO BE A VERY LONG & RAINY PERIOD, BETWEEN AROUND 2005-2040!

Even now, when it is apparent that Demographic issues are heavily influencing many issues, the major party's are not coming clean, with the full ramifications.

In short, given that neither Labor, nor Liberals have adequately prepared for what should have been apparent, we now are faced with multiple dilemma's & no easy fixes!

That said, I have frequently said that both EXPENDITURE & REVENUE MUST BE ADDRESSED & THAT ALL SECTIONS OF THE COMMUNITY MUST TAKE A HIT.

However, IF REVENUE, THE HIGHER INCOME, BIG BUSINESS, GLOBAL BUSINESS & CHURCH BUSINESS SECTORS DO NOT TAKE THEIR FAIR SHARE, THEN IT WILL SIMPLY BE A MATTER OF DELAYING THE INEVITABLE & NOT FOR LONG.

These Demographic issues, in addition to the direct Aged Pension costs, are also pushing Health Costs & other related issues and that will also continue for quite some time. 

All of this will be extremely difficult to sort out, if not impossible, this late into proceedings, even if Demographics were the only issue involved, But it is not.

There are also at least 2 other major influences pushing events & they are -
1) Energy Supply & Costs.
2) Climate Change

Cheers & Good Luck, But take note we now need a lot of honesty from all & a fair hair cut by all, WE DO NOT NEED A LARGE DOSE OF HOPIUM, BECAUSE WE CAN NOT JUST WISH THIS AWAY!   

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Vuk11
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Re: Australia Not In The Midst Of Budget Crisis.
Reply #32 - Apr 24th, 2014 at 12:17pm
 
perceptions_now wrote on Apr 24th, 2014 at 11:53am:
NONE OF THE MAJOR POLITICAL PARTY'S TOOK THE APPROPRIATE ACTIONS OR SUFFICIENT APPROPRIATE ACTIONS, TO SET ASIDE A SUFFICIENT POOL OF ADDITIONAL ASSETS, FOR WHAT WAS OBVIOUSLY GOING TO BE A VERY LONG & RAINY PERIOD, BETWEEN AROUND 2005-2040!


That's because actually advocating something different goes against the rhetoric fed to the majority of fairness and equality, it would be political suicide. All this shows is that they don't have the balls to lead the country. This is the problem with big government, it will never accept a downsize.

Quote:
Even now, when it is apparent that Demographic issues are heavily influencing many issues, the major party's are not coming clean, with the full ramifications.

In short, given that neither Labor, nor Liberals have adequately prepared for what should have been apparent, we now are faced with multiple dilemma's & no easy fixes!


Exactly, either they bite the bullet and make some hard choices people will hate or they continue to spit rhetoric into the eyes of the people in the hopes they keep eating it up. I really think they're playing hot potato with a bomb, hoping to get the most advantage they can and pass the bomb off to the other party before it explodes and they're blamed for it.

Quote:
That said, I have frequently said that both EXPENDITURE & REVENUE MUST BE ADDRESSED & THAT ALL SECTIONS OF THE COMMUNITY MUST TAKE A HIT.

However, IF REVENUE, THE HIGHER INCOME, BIG BUSINESS, GLOBAL BUSINESS & CHURCH BUSINESS SECTORS DO NOT TAKE THEIR FAIR SHARE, THEN IT WILL SIMPLY BE A MATTER OF DELAYING THE INEVITABLE & NOT FOR LONG.


Sadly we can't tax our way to prosperity, if you "tax the rich" it doesn't tax the rich it either hurts that business which hurts us all or it's passed on to employees/consumers or in the worst case they take their investments elsewhere.


Quote:
These Demographic issues, in addition to the direct Aged Pension costs, are also pushing Health Costs & other related issues and that will also continue for quite some time. 

All of this will be extremely difficult to sort out, if not impossible, this late into proceedings, even if Demographics were the only issue involved, But it is not.

There are also at least 2 other major influences pushing events & they are -
1) Energy Supply & Costs.
2) Climate Change

Cheers & Good Luck, But take note we now need a lot of honesty from all & a fair hair cut by all, WE DO NOT NEED A LARGE DOSE OF HOPIUM, BECAUSE WE CAN NOT JUST WISH THIS AWAY!   
[/b]


Here here!
Don't forget the housing and debt bubbles though.

Isn't it interesting that theses intellectuals in power pay no price for being wrong, we do. Thomas Sowell was right.
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mantra
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Re: Australia Not In The Midst Of Budget Crisis.
Reply #33 - Apr 24th, 2014 at 1:38pm
 
longweekend58 wrote on Apr 24th, 2014 at 10:03am:
Quote:
The Abbott government has doubled our debt already so we should be fearful.


it is that kind of stupidity and blatant lies that make you look so stupid.


And it is this kind of response from you which makes you look like an ignoramus and a nasty one at that.

Do the math's on how much our debt is today compared to 6 months ago. Labor left a $268 billion debt - today it is $468 billion thanks to the $200 billion borrowed when Abbott came to power. He may not have spent all of it yet, but we are still paying interest. He's splashing it around as though there's no tomorrow.
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longweekend58
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Re: Australia Not In The Midst Of Budget Crisis.
Reply #34 - Apr 24th, 2014 at 2:10pm
 
mantra wrote on Apr 24th, 2014 at 1:38pm:
longweekend58 wrote on Apr 24th, 2014 at 10:03am:
Quote:
The Abbott government has doubled our debt already so we should be fearful.


it is that kind of stupidity and blatant lies that make you look so stupid.


And it is this kind of response from you which makes you look like an ignoramus and a nasty one at that.

Do the math's on how much our debt is today compared to 6 months ago. Labor left a $268 billion debt - today it is $468 billion thanks to the $200 billion borrowed when Abbott came to power. He may not have spent all of it yet, but we are still paying interest. He's splashing it around as though there's no tomorrow.



I think I will still go with STUPID.  abbott didn't borrow $200B at all.  there is no no credit limit, that is all.  It is this level of lying or ignorance (not sure which) that so utterly discredits you as a poster.
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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
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perceptions_now
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Re: Australia Not In The Midst Of Budget Crisis.
Reply #35 - Apr 24th, 2014 at 3:44pm
 
Vuk11 wrote on Apr 24th, 2014 at 12:17pm:
perceptions_now wrote on Apr 24th, 2014 at 11:53am:
NONE OF THE MAJOR POLITICAL PARTY'S TOOK THE APPROPRIATE ACTIONS OR SUFFICIENT APPROPRIATE ACTIONS, TO SET ASIDE A SUFFICIENT POOL OF ADDITIONAL ASSETS, FOR WHAT WAS OBVIOUSLY GOING TO BE A VERY LONG & RAINY PERIOD, BETWEEN AROUND 2005-2040!


That's because actually advocating something different goes against the rhetoric fed to the majority of fairness and equality, it would be political suicide. All this shows is that they don't have the balls to lead the country. This is the problem with big government, it will never accept a downsize.

Quote:
Even now, when it is apparent that Demographic issues are heavily influencing many issues, the major party's are not coming clean, with the full ramifications.

In short, given that neither Labor, nor Liberals have adequately prepared for what should have been apparent, we now are faced with multiple dilemma's & no easy fixes!


Exactly, either they bite the bullet and make some hard choices people will hate or they continue to spit rhetoric into the eyes of the people in the hopes they keep eating it up. I really think they're playing hot potato with a bomb, hoping to get the most advantage they can and pass the bomb off to the other party before it explodes and they're blamed for it.

Quote:
That said, I have frequently said that both EXPENDITURE & REVENUE MUST BE ADDRESSED & THAT ALL SECTIONS OF THE COMMUNITY MUST TAKE A HIT.

However, IF REVENUE, THE HIGHER INCOME, BIG BUSINESS, GLOBAL BUSINESS & CHURCH BUSINESS SECTORS DO NOT TAKE THEIR FAIR SHARE, THEN IT WILL SIMPLY BE A MATTER OF DELAYING THE INEVITABLE & NOT FOR LONG.


Sadly we can't tax our way to prosperity, if you "tax the rich" it doesn't tax the rich it either hurts that business which hurts us all or it's passed on to employees/consumers or in the worst case they take their investments elsewhere.


Quote:
These Demographic issues, in addition to the direct Aged Pension costs, are also pushing Health Costs & other related issues and that will also continue for quite some time. 

All of this will be extremely difficult to sort out, if not impossible, this late into proceedings, even if Demographics were the only issue involved, But it is not.

There are also at least 2 other major influences pushing events & they are -
1) Energy Supply & Costs.
2) Climate Change

Cheers & Good Luck, But take note we now need a lot of honesty from all & a fair hair cut by all, WE DO NOT NEED A LARGE DOSE OF HOPIUM, BECAUSE WE CAN NOT JUST WISH THIS AWAY!   
[/b]


Here here!
Don't forget the housing and debt bubbles though.

Isn't it interesting that theses intellectuals in power pay no price for being wrong, we do. Thomas Sowell was right.


I am not referring to prosperity, But simply trying to ensure that everyone carries their fair share of the load, otherwise the system will crash earlier & more heavily.

Then no one will win, no one will be exempt & we will all be worse off!

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perceptions_now
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Re: Australia Not In The Midst Of Budget Crisis.
Reply #36 - Apr 24th, 2014 at 4:01pm
 
perceptions_now wrote on Apr 24th, 2014 at 11:53am:
Quote:
Aust not in midst of budget crisis: Labor

Date
    April 24, 2014
    The Age

Labor has dismissed Treasurer Joe Hockey's warnings about the spiralling costs of welfare, health and other government spending.      Huh

In a speech in Sydney on Wednesday night, Mr Hockey unveiled some details from the soon-to-be-released commission of audit, which shows government spending has almost tripled in the past 40 years.

Over the medium term, the commission expects the 15 largest and fastest growing programs to be welfare, health, education and defence - in most cases growing considerably faster than the economy.

Mr Hockey flagged cuts across the board in the May budget, adding that a greater reliance on means testing and co-payments could be on the way.

Opposition finance spokesman Tony Burke rubbished the treasurer's bleak portrait of the budget.

"Countries that have triple-A credit ratings are not in the midst of a budget crisis," Mr Burke told ABC Radio on Thursday.

"None of the information that Joe Hockey's referring to there is new. They're wanting to pretend that they've just realised this through the commission of audit."

In his speech, Mr Hockey made particular mention of the pension, following speculation the government would increase the retirement age to 70.   Angry        

The $40 billion spent annually on the aged pension was more than that given to defence, hospitals or schools, Mr Hockey said.

Mr Burke said the government was simply laying the groundwork for changes to the aged pension, breaking an election promise.      Sad

The commission of audit is due to be released next week.

It report makes 86 recommendations, but Mr Hockey says he will not automatically accept all them.

"Some can be actioned in the short term, others require further consideration and some will be rejected outright," he said in his speech on Wednesday.

Shadow assistant treasurer Andrew Leigh accused Mr Hockey of playing political games with the budget, after blocking the previous Labor government's savings measures when in opposition.      Sad

The treasurer should acknowledge the fiscal impact of coalition decisions to scrap measures such as the mining and carbon taxes, he said.

"What we've got now from Joe Hockey is really the shadow treasurer in drag," Dr Leigh told ABC Radio.


Labor are "somewhat" disingenuous, to say the least!
But then, so are the Liberals!

The fact is that BOTH LABOR & LIBERALS HAVE KNOWN OR SHOULD HAVE KNOWN, THAT A CRISIS WOULD OCCUR, THEY KNEW ROUGHLY WHEN IT WOULD START & NEITHER TOOK THE APPROPRIATE MEASURES, WHICH SHOULD HAVE BEEN TAKEN & THAT HAS BEEN GOING ON FOR SOME 40-50 YEARS!

There are a few major reason/s behind what are happening, But the Demographic & related issues are certainly the easiest to track & much of what is now raised, as if it has "suddenly" become known, should have been readily apparent for decades AND NONE OF THE MAJOR POLITICAL PARTY'S TOOK THE APPROPRIATE ACTIONS OR SUFFICIENT APPROPRIATE ACTIONS, TO SET ASIDE A SUFFICIENT POOL OF ADDITIONAL ASSETS, FOR WHAT WAS OBVIOUSLY GOING TO BE A VERY LONG & RAINY PERIOD, BETWEEN AROUND 2005-2040!

Even now, when it is apparent that Demographic issues are heavily influencing many issues, the major party's are not coming clean, with the full ramifications.

In short, given that neither Labor, nor Liberals have adequately prepared for what should have been apparent, we now are faced with multiple dilemma's & no easy fixes!

That said, I have frequently said that both EXPENDITURE & REVENUE MUST BE ADDRESSED & THAT ALL SECTIONS OF THE COMMUNITY MUST TAKE A HIT.

However, IF REVENUE, THE HIGHER INCOME, BIG BUSINESS, GLOBAL BUSINESS & CHURCH BUSINESS SECTORS DO NOT TAKE THEIR FAIR SHARE, THEN IT WILL SIMPLY BE A MATTER OF DELAYING THE INEVITABLE & NOT FOR LONG.

These Demographic issues, in addition to the direct Aged Pension costs, are also pushing Health Costs & other related issues and that will also continue for quite some time. 

All of this will be extremely difficult to sort out, if not impossible, this late into proceedings, even if Demographics were the only issue involved, But it is not.

There are also at least 2 other major influences pushing events & they are -
1) Energy Supply & Costs.
2) Climate Change

Cheers & Good Luck, But take note we now need a lot of honesty from all & a fair hair cut by all, WE DO NOT NEED A LARGE DOSE OF HOPIUM, BECAUSE WE CAN NOT JUST WISH THIS AWAY!   



One of those additional Demographic issues, is the sliding Worker to Retiree ratio, which has been on the decline everywhere and in the USA it has gone from 7/1 in 1950, to around 4/1 now, on its way to around 3.5/1 in 2050.
...
What does this mean
Well, in 1950, there were a great deal more workers supporting Retirees, NOW that ratio has nearly halved & it will Decline considerably again before 2050 which means those still in the Workforce & those Businesses, will have to pay much more tax comparatively speaking, to support the Retirees now & in 2050, compared to 1950!
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Re: Australia Not In The Midst Of Budget Crisis.
Reply #37 - Apr 24th, 2014 at 4:33pm
 
perceptions_now wrote on Apr 24th, 2014 at 4:01pm:
One of those additional Demographic issues, is the sliding Worker to Retiree ratio, which has been on the decline everywhere and in the USA it has gone from 7/1 in 1950, to around 4/1 now, on its way to around 3.5/1 in 2050


Thank you!
I've been looking for a graph to illustrate this point for some time.

Do you perhaps have a source lying around?
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Re: Australia Not In The Midst Of Budget Crisis.
Reply #38 - Apr 24th, 2014 at 4:41pm
 
longweekend58 wrote on Apr 24th, 2014 at 8:55am:
John Smith wrote on Apr 24th, 2014 at 8:20am:
Budget emergency my butt

scrap the $12 B on planes that don't fly ....    there's $12B
scrap the tax benefits to super ................    another $13B
scrap handouts to mining /energy sector ..... another $5B

thats $30 Billion saved just there ... I'm sure if I went through the budget they'd be a lot more

the government is being run by cretins who are only looking to line their own pockets or protect their own future interests



OR

you could cut the dole
get rid of single-parent welfare
get rid of income supplements


there is more than enough there to cover the deficit.

See, I can choose expenditures that don't affect me too!


It's not about choosing expenditure that doesn't affect me, its about choosing expenditure cuts that affects those that can afford it. To make life harder for people already struggling is in the long run counter productive.
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Re: Australia Not In The Midst Of Budget Crisis.
Reply #39 - Apr 24th, 2014 at 4:46pm
 
longweekend58 wrote on Apr 24th, 2014 at 9:42am:
Kat wrote on Apr 24th, 2014 at 9:00am:
longweekend58 wrote on Apr 24th, 2014 at 8:55am:
John Smith wrote on Apr 24th, 2014 at 8:20am:
Budget emergency my butt

scrap the $12 B on planes that don't fly ....    there's $12B
scrap the tax benefits to super ................    another $13B
scrap handouts to mining /energy sector ..... another $5B

thats $30 Billion saved just there ... I'm sure if I went through the budget they'd be a lot more

the government is being run by cretins who are only looking to line their own pockets or protect their own future interests



OR

you could cut the dole
get rid of single-parent welfare
get rid of income supplements


there is more than enough there to cover the deficit.

See, I can choose expenditures that don't affect me too!



Why does that not surprise me, coming from you?

You've always been pro-wealthfare and anti-welfare.


quite the contrary.  The problem is that you see everything thru the one biased eye in your head.  If someone supports a policy position you disagree with you then assume thy disagree with you on everything.  That is why you are so mocked on here. 

If you had half a brain you would have seen SATIRE in my response.


what does that say about you who is constantly mocked on here, by those on both sides of the political divide?
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Re: Australia Not In The Midst Of Budget Crisis.
Reply #40 - Apr 24th, 2014 at 4:47pm
 
John Smith wrote on Apr 24th, 2014 at 4:41pm:
It's not about choosing expenditure that doesn't affect me, its about choosing expenditure cuts that affects those that can afford it. To make life harder for people already struggling is in the long run counter productive.


What is your opinion on the myriad of alternatives to this debate of cutting welfare VS taxing business?

For example:
Take the entire Welfare Budget $138.1 Billion, completely get rid of centre link and job service providers (lol), swap to a negative income tax that would see all of those without an income (Newstart/Disability/Aged Pension etc) all getting more say from 500/600/700 per fortnight to a straight 800 per fortnight each, they'd have their dignity back instead of being interrogated by two different groups every fortnight and they'd be given incentive to work. Then saving all of those Billions to reduce the deficit and provide tax cuts to all?

(ignoring for a moment those cut from public employment - their transition into the private sector would be a different topic)

Just out of curiosity.
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Re: Australia Not In The Midst Of Budget Crisis.
Reply #41 - Apr 24th, 2014 at 5:07pm
 
Vuk11 wrote on Apr 24th, 2014 at 4:47pm:
John Smith wrote on Apr 24th, 2014 at 4:41pm:
It's not about choosing expenditure that doesn't affect me, its about choosing expenditure cuts that affects those that can afford it. To make life harder for people already struggling is in the long run counter productive.


What is your opinion on the myriad of alternatives to this debate of cutting welfare VS taxing business?

For example:
Take the entire Welfare Budget $138.1 Billion, completely get rid of centre link and job service providers (lol), swap to a negative income tax that would see all of those without an income (Newstart/Disability/Aged Pension etc) all getting more say from 500/600/700 per fortnight to a straight 800 per fortnight each, they'd have their dignity back instead of being interrogated by two different groups every fortnight and they'd be given incentive to work. Then saving all of those Billions to reduce the deficit and provide tax cuts to all?

(ignoring for a moment those cut from public employment - their transition into the private sector would be a different topic)

Just out of curiosity.


I'm good with the general concept, it's what I've been calling-for for years.

Won't be long before we're both howled-down on this one. I always am, no
matter what I suggest.
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...
 
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Re: Australia Not In The Midst Of Budget Crisis.
Reply #42 - Apr 24th, 2014 at 5:24pm
 
OldnCrusty wrote on Apr 24th, 2014 at 8:44am:
And that is what I think makes him dangerous. Basically every thing I read and hear tells me Australia is in a pretty good economic and social position, no drastic measures are required. There are some big issue on the horizon which need to be addressed but the mindless ideologue/slogan driven cutting the of the budget may not be the only or best way forward, neither economically or socially.

They are peddling the lies as a vehicle for imposing their flawed ideology on an unwilling public.


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You are not entitled to your opinion. You are only entitled to hold opinions that you can defend through sound, reasoned argument.
 
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Re: Australia Not In The Midst Of Budget Crisis.
Reply #43 - Apr 24th, 2014 at 5:49pm
 
Vuk11 wrote on Apr 24th, 2014 at 4:47pm:
John Smith wrote on Apr 24th, 2014 at 4:41pm:
It's not about choosing expenditure that doesn't affect me, its about choosing expenditure cuts that affects those that can afford it. To make life harder for people already struggling is in the long run counter productive.


What is your opinion on the myriad of alternatives to this debate of cutting welfare VS taxing business?

For example:
Take the entire Welfare Budget $138.1 Billion, completely get rid of centre link and job service providers (lol), swap to a negative income tax that would see all of those without an income (Newstart/Disability/Aged Pension etc) all getting more say from 500/600/700 per fortnight to a straight 800 per fortnight each, they'd have their dignity back instead of being interrogated by two different groups every fortnight and they'd be given incentive to work. Then saving all of those Billions to reduce the deficit and provide tax cuts to all?

(ignoring for a moment those cut from public employment - their transition into the private sector would be a different topic)

Just out of curiosity.


i have no problem with making changes to how pensions or newstart work, that even means testing them ... but it cannot have a negative affect on those that cannot afford it.  We as a society can do better than that .. we are on of the richest countries in the world


I know a retired guy who on his investments earns $350 000 per year ...and thats without touching his principle ... but because it's all run through his super fund, its tax free ...  plus he gets an seniors card which he shoves in everyones face when he buys something (he must get his 10% discount) ...  he earns 5x the average wage and yet abbott wants to target pensioners and unemployed
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Re: Australia Not In The Midst Of Budget Crisis.
Reply #44 - Apr 24th, 2014 at 5:56pm
 
John Smith wrote on Apr 24th, 2014 at 5:49pm:
i have no problem with making changes to how pensions or newstart work, that even means testing them ... but it cannot have a negative affect on those that cannot afford it.  We as a society can do better than that .. we are on of the richest countries in the world


Is that a yes or no to considering alternatives as drastic as a negative income tax combined with the abolition of Centrelink and Job Service Providers?
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