Australian Politics Forum - Economic Refugees?

greggerypeccary Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 140099 Gender:	Re: Economic Refugees? Reply #30 - Jul 9^th, 2014 at 10:30am Soren wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 10:25am: There is no obligation to let in ANYONE who is not coming directly from a place where he is under threat or in danger. Link?
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woof woof Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 1518 Gender:	Re: Economic Refugees? Reply #31 - Jul 9^th, 2014 at 10:32am you like to include visa overstayers in your asylum argument, well I do now aswell
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sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Economic Refugees?
Reply #32 - Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:25am

Soren wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 10:25am:

John Smith wrote on Jul 8^th, 2014 at 8:55pm:

Soren wrote on Jul 8^th, 2014 at 6:04pm:

John Smith wrote on Jul 8^th, 2014 at 3:36pm:

what does it matter how they get here?

It is for Australia to decide who comes to Australia and how they come here.

That's why it matters.

Settlement in Australia is NOT for those who self-select by paying illegal people smugglers.

No it's not..... Australia waived that right when they signed the UN convention on refugees ....
if at any time Abbott decides to rescind that convention, then you can cry about Australia's rights, until then forget it.

There is no settlement obligation in the Convention.

correct

There is no obligation to let in ANYONE who is not coming directly from a place where he is under threat or in danger. Middle Easterners go freely and voluntarily to Indonesia so there is zero obligation on us to let them in without a visa.

how very, very wrong. Do you even understand the refugee convention, dumb dumb?

ZERO.

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Armchair_Politician

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Re: Economic Refugees?
Reply #33 - Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:32am

Fit of Absent Mindeness wrote on Jul 8^th, 2014 at 2:39pm:

woof woof wrote on Jul 8^th, 2014 at 9:57am:

how many asylum seekers should we accept?
Give me a yearly figure, the absolute maximum you think??
No answer means no credibility.

According to this:

http://unhcr.org.au/unhcr/images/Global%20Trends%202013.pdf

51.2 million forcibly displaced orcibly displaced worldwide
16.7 million refugees
33.3 million internally
displaced persons
1.2 million asylum-seekers

More than half (53%) of all refugees worldwide came from just three countries:
Afghanistan (2.56 million), the Syrian Arab
Republic (2.47 million), and Somalia (1.12 million)

The Worlds population is 7 billion.

Australia's population is 23 million or 0.33%.

This means for every 1 person in Australia, there is another 307 elsewhere.

So If Australia was to take 0.33% of refugees, my number would be 165,000 or so.

If we gave each of these the newstart allowance it would cost Australia 2.1 billion.

This is what it costs every year with our current "solution" anyway.

Of course I will be attacked by those who think we will be over run.

How many refugees do you think we should take every year?

It'd cost a hell of a lot more than $2bn. Where would you house them? Where would they live? It'd cost a fortune to build that much public housing, not to mention how long it'd take. Great idea, NOT!

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greggerypeccary

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Re: Economic Refugees?
Reply #34 - Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:35am

Soren wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 10:25am:

There is no obligation to let in ANYONE who is not coming directly from a place where he is under threat or in danger. Middle Easterners go freely and voluntarily to Indonesia so there is zero obligation on us to let them in without a visa.

You seem to be suggesting that asylum seekers can't pass through other countries before claiming asylum. i.e. they can't stop along the way to their destination country: they must go directly from their own country to the country they wish to seek asylum in, without stopping anywhere else.

If that is what you're suggesting, could you show me where you're getting that information from?

Is it from here:

http://www.unhcr.org/3b66c2aa10.html ?

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King FriYAY II

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Re: Economic Refugees?
Reply #35 - Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:42am

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:35am:

Soren wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 10:25am:

There is no obligation to let in ANYONE who is not coming directly from a place where he is under threat or in danger. Middle Easterners go freely and voluntarily to Indonesia so there is zero obligation on us to let them in without a visa.

You seem to be suggesting that asylum seekers can't pass through other countries before claiming asylum. i.e. they can't stop along the way to their destination country: they must go directly from their own country to the country they wish to seek asylum in, without stopping anywhere else.

If that is what you're suggesting, could you show me where you're getting that information from?

Is it from here:

http://www.unhcr.org/3b66c2aa10.html ?

Country shoppers.....

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sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Economic Refugees?
Reply #36 - Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:56am

King FriYAY II wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:42am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:35am:

Soren wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 10:25am:

There is no obligation to let in ANYONE who is not coming directly from a place where he is under threat or in danger. Middle Easterners go freely and voluntarily to Indonesia so there is zero obligation on us to let them in without a visa.

You seem to be suggesting that asylum seekers can't pass through other countries before claiming asylum. i.e. they can't stop along the way to their destination country: they must go directly from their own country to the country they wish to seek asylum in, without stopping anywhere else.

If that is what you're suggesting, could you show me where you're getting that information from?

Is it from here:

http://www.unhcr.org/3b66c2aa10.html ?

Country shoppers.....

Nope, not according to the refugee convention.

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King FriYAY II

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Re: Economic Refugees?
Reply #37 - Jul 9^th, 2014 at 12:02pm

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:56am:

King FriYAY II wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:42am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:35am:

Soren wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 10:25am:

There is no obligation to let in ANYONE who is not coming directly from a place where he is under threat or in danger. Middle Easterners go freely and voluntarily to Indonesia so there is zero obligation on us to let them in without a visa.

You seem to be suggesting that asylum seekers can't pass through other countries before claiming asylum. i.e. they can't stop along the way to their destination country: they must go directly from their own country to the country they wish to seek asylum in, without stopping anywhere else.

If that is what you're suggesting, could you show me where you're getting that information from?

Is it from here:

http://www.unhcr.org/3b66c2aa10.html ?

Country shoppers.....

Nope, not according to the refugee convention.

Illegal entrants....

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sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Economic Refugees?
Reply #38 - Jul 9^th, 2014 at 12:08pm

King FriYAY II wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 12:02pm:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:56am:

King FriYAY II wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:42am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:35am:

Soren wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 10:25am:

There is no obligation to let in ANYONE who is not coming directly from a place where he is under threat or in danger. Middle Easterners go freely and voluntarily to Indonesia so there is zero obligation on us to let them in without a visa.

You seem to be suggesting that asylum seekers can't pass through other countries before claiming asylum. i.e. they can't stop along the way to their destination country: they must go directly from their own country to the country they wish to seek asylum in, without stopping anywhere else.

If that is what you're suggesting, could you show me where you're getting that information from?

Is it from here:

http://www.unhcr.org/3b66c2aa10.html ?

Country shoppers.....

Nope, not according to the refugee convention.

Illegal entrants....

Not even that. Unlawful entrants maybe.

And also, how can they be "illegal entrants" if they didn't enter the migration zone? Migration Act doesn't apply to them, remember?

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King FriYAY II

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Re: Economic Refugees?
Reply #39 - Jul 9^th, 2014 at 12:12pm

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 12:08pm:

King FriYAY II wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 12:02pm:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:56am:

King FriYAY II wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:42am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:35am:

Soren wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 10:25am:

There is no obligation to let in ANYONE who is not coming directly from a place where he is under threat or in danger. Middle Easterners go freely and voluntarily to Indonesia so there is zero obligation on us to let them in without a visa.

You seem to be suggesting that asylum seekers can't pass through other countries before claiming asylum. i.e. they can't stop along the way to their destination country: they must go directly from their own country to the country they wish to seek asylum in, without stopping anywhere else.

If that is what you're suggesting, could you show me where you're getting that information from?

Is it from here:

http://www.unhcr.org/3b66c2aa10.html ?

Country shoppers.....

Nope, not according to the refugee convention.

Illegal entrants....

Not even that. Unlawful entrants maybe.

And also, how can they be "illegal entrants" if they didn't enter the migration zone? Migration Act doesn't apply to them, remember?

Fair enough, bloody potential illegals.

Explain your "illegal entry" said the UN convention...

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sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Economic Refugees?
Reply #40 - Jul 9^th, 2014 at 12:14pm

King FriYAY II wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 12:12pm:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 12:08pm:

King FriYAY II wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 12:02pm:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:56am:

King FriYAY II wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:42am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:35am:

Soren wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 10:25am:

There is no obligation to let in ANYONE who is not coming directly from a place where he is under threat or in danger. Middle Easterners go freely and voluntarily to Indonesia so there is zero obligation on us to let them in without a visa.

You seem to be suggesting that asylum seekers can't pass through other countries before claiming asylum. i.e. they can't stop along the way to their destination country: they must go directly from their own country to the country they wish to seek asylum in, without stopping anywhere else.

If that is what you're suggesting, could you show me where you're getting that information from?

Is it from here:

http://www.unhcr.org/3b66c2aa10.html ?

Country shoppers.....

Nope, not according to the refugee convention.

Illegal entrants....

Not even that. Unlawful entrants maybe.

And also, how can they be "illegal entrants" if they didn't enter the migration zone? Migration Act doesn't apply to them, remember?

Fair enough, bloody potential illegals.

Explain your "illegal entry" said the UN convention...

potential unlawfuls, maybe.

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Disclaimer for Mothra per POST so it is forever acknowledged: Saying 'Islam' or 'Muslims' doesn't mean ALL muslims. This does not target individual muslims who's opinion I am not aware of.

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greggerypeccary

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Re: Economic Refugees?
Reply #41 - Jul 9^th, 2014 at 12:41pm

King FriYAY II wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:42am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:35am:

Soren wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 10:25am:

There is no obligation to let in ANYONE who is not coming directly from a place where he is under threat or in danger. Middle Easterners go freely and voluntarily to Indonesia so there is zero obligation on us to let them in without a visa.

You seem to be suggesting that asylum seekers can't pass through other countries before claiming asylum. i.e. they can't stop along the way to their destination country: they must go directly from their own country to the country they wish to seek asylum in, without stopping anywhere else.

If that is what you're suggesting, could you show me where you're getting that information from?

Is it from here:

http://www.unhcr.org/3b66c2aa10.html ?

Country shoppers.....

Where does it say that country shopping is not permitted?

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greggerypeccary

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Re: Economic Refugees?
Reply #42 - Jul 9^th, 2014 at 12:41pm

King FriYAY II wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 12:02pm:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:56am:

King FriYAY II wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:42am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 11:35am:

Soren wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 10:25am:

There is no obligation to let in ANYONE who is not coming directly from a place where he is under threat or in danger. Middle Easterners go freely and voluntarily to Indonesia so there is zero obligation on us to let them in without a visa.

You seem to be suggesting that asylum seekers can't pass through other countries before claiming asylum. i.e. they can't stop along the way to their destination country: they must go directly from their own country to the country they wish to seek asylum in, without stopping anywhere else.

If that is what you're suggesting, could you show me where you're getting that information from?

Is it from here:

http://www.unhcr.org/3b66c2aa10.html ?

Country shoppers.....

Nope, not according to the refugee convention.

Illegal entrants....

Not according to Australian law.

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Karnal

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Re: Economic Refugees?
Reply #43 - Jul 9^th, 2014 at 12:49pm

aquascoot wrote on Jul 8^th, 2014 at 3:38pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 8^th, 2014 at 3:33pm:

aquascoot wrote on Jul 8^th, 2014 at 3:31pm:

woof woof wrote on Jul 8^th, 2014 at 9:57am:

how many asylum seekers should we accept?

Give me a yearly figure, the absolute maximum you think??

No answer means no credibility.

none, there is a queue already.

No queue.

yep, those doing the right thing , already processed in camps have their spots stolen by those with the means to pay criminals. terriblely unfair, very selfish.
you'd have to be an asshole to think you were more important than those waiting their turn. the sort of asshole who'd pull a knife at a westfield shopping centre.
evil

That's right, dear. You'd have to be an asshole to to think your life is important enough to save.

All those Afghanis, Somalians and Syrians fleeing war must have tickets on themselves, no?

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John Smith Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 75379 Gender:	Re: Economic Refugees? Reply #44 - Jul 9^th, 2014 at 1:26pm King FriYAY II wrote on Jul 9^th, 2014 at 12:12pm: Fair enough, bloody potential illegals we're all potential illegals . you have the potential to enter my property illegally ..... shall we jail you for it now or send you back to England?
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