Australian Politics Forum - Nine asylum-seeker mums on self-harm watch

ian Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 9451	Re: Nine asylum-seeker mums on self-harm watch Reply #150 - Jul 13^th, 2014 at 10:56am Incorrect, you are confusing the literal translation of the words "asylum seeker' with the actual definition of the term.
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greggerypeccary

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Re: Nine asylum-seeker mums on self-harm watch
Reply #151 - Jul 13^th, 2014 at 10:59am

ian wrote on Jul 13^th, 2014 at 10:56am:

Incorrect, you are confusing the literal translation of the words "asylum seeker' with the actual definition of the term.

No, I'm 100% correct, and your definition proves that. Read it again.

If you say you're seeking asylum, you're a genuine asylum seeker. No arguments.

However, it doesn't meant that you are a genuine refugee.

There's no such thing as a "non genuine asylum seeker", however, there are plenty of non genuine refugees.

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Gnads Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 30182 Gender:	Re: Nine asylum-seeker mums on self-harm watch Reply #152 - Jul 13^th, 2014 at 11:02am Pedantic semantics
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ian

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Re: Nine asylum-seeker mums on self-harm watch
Reply #153 - Jul 13^th, 2014 at 11:05am

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 13^th, 2014 at 10:59am:

ian wrote on Jul 13^th, 2014 at 10:56am:

Incorrect, you are confusing the literal translation of the words "asylum seeker' with the actual definition of the term.

No, I'm 100% correct, and your definition proves that. Read it again.

If you say you're seeking asylum, you're a genuine asylum seeker. No arguments.

However, it doesn't meant that you are a genuine refugee.

There's no such thing as a "non genuine asylum seeker", however, there are plenty of non genuine refugees.

Incorrect. if a person seeks asylum and is found not to be a refugee that also means they are not a genuine asylum seeker.

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greggerypeccary

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Re: Nine asylum-seeker mums on self-harm watch
Reply #154 - Jul 13^th, 2014 at 11:09am

Quote:

The terms asylum-seeker and refugee are often confused: an asylum-seeker is someone who says he or she is a refugee, but whose claim has not yet been definitively evaluated.

Thanks for proving my point, ian.

" ... someone who says ... "

Not, "someone who is a refugee".

If they say they are a refugee, seeking asylum, they are indeed a genuine asylum seeker (your definition clearly proves that point).

However, they are not a genuine refugee until their claim has been (positively) evaluated.

This is not "pedantic semantics": asylum seekers and refugees are not the same thing, and it's important to understand the difference if one wants to engage in debate on the subject (I'm looking at you, Gnads).

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Gnads

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Re: Nine asylum-seeker mums on self-harm watch
Reply #155 - Jul 13^th, 2014 at 11:13am

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 13^th, 2014 at 11:09am:

Quote:

The terms asylum-seeker and refugee are often confused: an asylum-seeker is someone who says he or she is a refugee, but whose claim has not yet been definitively evaluated.

Thanks for proving my point, ian.

" ... someone who says ... "

Not, "someone who is a refugee".

If they say they are a refugee, seeking asylum, they are indeed a genuine asylum seeker (your definition clearly proves that point).

However, they are not a genuine refugee until their claim has been (positively) evaluated.

This is not "pedantic semantics": asylum seekers and refugees are not the same thing, and it's important to understand the difference if one wants to engage in debate on the subject (I'm looking at you, Gnads).

How's that going for you .... have they got new technology for your Labrador & White cane?

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"When you are dead, you do not know you are dead. It's only painful and difficult for others. The same applies when you are stupid." ~ Ricky Gervais

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greggerypeccary

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Re: Nine asylum-seeker mums on self-harm watch
Reply #156 - Jul 13^th, 2014 at 11:19am

Gnads wrote on Jul 13^th, 2014 at 11:13am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 13^th, 2014 at 11:09am:

Quote:

The terms asylum-seeker and refugee are often confused: an asylum-seeker is someone who says he or she is a refugee, but whose claim has not yet been definitively evaluated.

Thanks for proving my point, ian.

" ... someone who says ... "

Not, "someone who is a refugee".

If they say they are a refugee, seeking asylum, they are indeed a genuine asylum seeker (your definition clearly proves that point).

However, they are not a genuine refugee until their claim has been (positively) evaluated.

This is not "pedantic semantics": asylum seekers and refugees are not the same thing, and it's important to understand the difference if one wants to engage in debate on the subject (I'm looking at you, Gnads).

How's that going for you .... have they got new technology for your Labrador & White cane?

Do you often mock people with disabilities?

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ian

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Re: Nine asylum-seeker mums on self-harm watch
Reply #157 - Jul 13^th, 2014 at 11:52am

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 13^th, 2014 at 11:09am:

Quote:

The terms asylum-seeker and refugee are often confused: an asylum-seeker is someone who says he or she is a refugee, but whose claim has not yet been definitively evaluated.

Thanks for proving my point, ian.

" ... someone who says ... "

Not, "someone who is a refugee".

If they say they are a refugee, seeking asylum, they are indeed a genuine asylum seeker (your definition clearly proves that point).

However, they are not a genuine refugee until their claim has been (positively) evaluated.

This is not "pedantic semantics": asylum seekers and refugees are not the same thing, and it's important to understand the difference if one wants to engage in debate on the subject (I'm looking at you, Gnads).

The UNHCR also states that an asylum seeker must be fleeing persecution so thats a double whammy for you chum. No fleeing persecution = non genuine asylum seeker. and you keep spouting the line about asylum seeker and refugee not being the same thing, again you seem to be arguing with yourself since no one is stating that is the case.

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ian Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 9451	Re: Nine asylum-seeker mums on self-harm watch Reply #158 - Jul 13^th, 2014 at 11:59am heh, heh, Greggary is frantically googling to see if I am right . Stand by for a post addressing anything except the fact he is wrong. My bet is an attempt to divert the argument to the difference between an asylum seeker and refugee, thats his usual tactic.
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hermoine Senior Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 364	Re: Nine asylum-seeker mums on self-harm watch Reply #159 - Jul 13^th, 2014 at 5:27pm Gweggory doesn't have any refugees living at his house. Classic left wing crusader. The solution to the biggest crisis he faces in his life involves action by others. This time it is the taxpayers of Australia; the group of people he despises the most. Ironic!!!
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Gnads

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Re: Nine asylum-seeker mums on self-harm watch
Reply #160 - Jul 13^th, 2014 at 5:29pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 13^th, 2014 at 11:19am:

Gnads wrote on Jul 13^th, 2014 at 11:13am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 13^th, 2014 at 11:09am:

Quote:

The terms asylum-seeker and refugee are often confused: an asylum-seeker is someone who says he or she is a refugee, but whose claim has not yet been definitively evaluated.

Thanks for proving my point, ian.

" ... someone who says ... "

Not, "someone who is a refugee".

If they say they are a refugee, seeking asylum, they are indeed a genuine asylum seeker (your definition clearly proves that point).

However, they are not a genuine refugee until their claim has been (positively) evaluated.

This is not "pedantic semantics": asylum seekers and refugees are not the same thing, and it's important to understand the difference if one wants to engage in debate on the subject (I'm looking at you, Gnads).

How's that going for you .... have they got new technology for your Labrador & White cane?

Do you often mock people with disabilities?

No ... but you seem blind to any other point of view but your own.

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"When you are dead, you do not know you are dead. It's only painful and difficult for others. The same applies when you are stupid." ~ Ricky Gervais

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greggerypeccary

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Re: Nine asylum-seeker mums on self-harm watch
Reply #161 - Jul 13^th, 2014 at 5:38pm

Gnads wrote on Jul 13^th, 2014 at 5:29pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 13^th, 2014 at 11:19am:

Gnads wrote on Jul 13^th, 2014 at 11:13am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 13^th, 2014 at 11:09am:

Quote:

The terms asylum-seeker and refugee are often confused: an asylum-seeker is someone who says he or she is a refugee, but whose claim has not yet been definitively evaluated.

Thanks for proving my point, ian.

" ... someone who says ... "

Not, "someone who is a refugee".

If they say they are a refugee, seeking asylum, they are indeed a genuine asylum seeker (your definition clearly proves that point).

However, they are not a genuine refugee until their claim has been (positively) evaluated.

This is not "pedantic semantics":, and it's important to understand the difference if one wants to engage in debate on the subject (I'm looking at you, Gnads).

How's that going for you .... have they got new technology for your Labrador & White cane?

Do you often mock people with disabilities?

No ... but you seem blind to any other point of view but your own.

I'm not putting forward a "point of view", I'm pointing out simple facts.

Asylum seekers and refugees are not the same thing.

All refugees were once asylum seekers, but not all asylum seekers turn out to be refugees.

There's no such thing as a "non genuine asylum seeker".

Asylum seekers say they are refugees, but we don't know for sure if they are. What we do know for sure, is that if they say they are refugees seeking asylum, they are genuine asylum seekers.

However, that doesn't mean they are genuine refugees.

All facts. Not my personal "point of view", but facts.

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hermoine Senior Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 364	Re: Nine asylum-seeker mums on self-harm watch Reply #162 - Jul 13^th, 2014 at 5:42pm But you said you don't have any refugees living at your house. So what ARE you doing for the poor, oppressed masses of the world? Oh that's right, crying like an old drag queen on ozpolitics! Pathetic!
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greggerypeccary

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Re: Nine asylum-seeker mums on self-harm watch
Reply #163 - Jul 13^th, 2014 at 5:44pm

ian wrote on Jul 13^th, 2014 at 11:52am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 13^th, 2014 at 11:09am:

Quote:

The terms asylum-seeker and refugee are often confused: an asylum-seeker is someone who says he or she is a refugee, but whose claim has not yet been definitively evaluated.

Thanks for proving my point, ian.

" ... someone who says ... "

Not, "someone who is a refugee".

If they say they are a refugee, seeking asylum, they are indeed a genuine asylum seeker (your definition clearly proves that point).

However, they are not a genuine refugee until their claim has been (positively) evaluated.

This is not "pedantic semantics": asylum seekers and refugees are not the same thing, and it's important to understand the difference if one wants to engage in debate on the subject (I'm looking at you, Gnads).

The UNHCR also states that an asylum seeker must be fleeing persecution ...

To be an asylum seeker, one must say they are fleeing persecution. If they say they are a refugee fleeing persecution, then they are most certainly a genuine asylum seeker. Simple fact.

They may not, however, be a genuine refugee.

The definition you posted earlier on clarified this point beautifully (thankyou, by the way, for putting the last nail in your own coffin on this one). If they say they are fleeing persecution, they are asylum seekers.

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Gnads

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Re: Nine asylum-seeker mums on self-harm watch
Reply #164 - Jul 13^th, 2014 at 5:45pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 13^th, 2014 at 5:38pm:

Gnads wrote on Jul 13^th, 2014 at 5:29pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 13^th, 2014 at 11:19am:

Gnads wrote on Jul 13^th, 2014 at 11:13am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 13^th, 2014 at 11:09am:

Quote:

The terms asylum-seeker and refugee are often confused: an asylum-seeker is someone who says he or she is a refugee, but whose claim has not yet been definitively evaluated.

Thanks for proving my point, ian.

" ... someone who says ... "

Not, "someone who is a refugee".

If they say they are a refugee, seeking asylum, they are indeed a genuine asylum seeker (your definition clearly proves that point).

However, they are not a genuine refugee until their claim has been (positively) evaluated.

This is not "pedantic semantics":, and it's important to understand the difference if one wants to engage in debate on the subject (I'm looking at you, Gnads).

How's that going for you .... have they got new technology for your Labrador & White cane?

Do you often mock people with disabilities?

No ... but you seem blind to any other point of view but your own.

I'm not putting forward a "point of view", I'm pointing out simple facts.

Asylum seekers and refugees are not the same thing.

All refugees were once asylum seekers, but not all asylum seekers turn out to be refugees.

There's no such thing as a "non genuine asylum seeker".

Asylum seekers say they are refugees, but we don't know for sure if they are. What we do know for sure, is that if they say they are refugees seeking asylum, they are genuine asylum seekers.

However, that doesn't mean they are genuine refugees.

All facts. Not my personal "point of view", but facts.

What a lot of mumbo jumbo Roll Eyes

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"When you are dead, you do not know you are dead. It's only painful and difficult for others. The same applies when you are stupid." ~ Ricky Gervais

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