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What they said about Islam ... (Read 6300 times)
Lord Herbert
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What they said about Islam ...
Jul 13th, 2014 at 9:14pm
 
Carl Jung

Carl Gustav Jung (1875 – 1961) was the Swiss founder of analytical psychology. He created some of the best known psychological concepts and his work has been influential in psychiatry and in the study of religion, literature, and related fields.

"We do not know whether Hitler is going to found a new Islam. He is already on the way; he is like Muhammad. The emotion in Germany is Islamic; warlike and Islamic. They are all drunk with a wild god".


George S. Patton

George Smith Patton, Jr. (1885 – 1945 AD) was a United States Army officer most famous for his leadership commanding corps and armies as a general in World War II.

"To me it seems certain that the fatalistic teachings of Muhammad and the utter degradation of women is the outstanding cause for the arrested development of the Arab. He is exactly as he was around the year 700, while we have kept on developing".



Mark Twain

Samuel Langhorne Clemens (1835 – 1910), well known by his pen name Mark Twain, was an American author and humorist. Twain is noted for his novels Adventures of Huckleberry Finn, which has been called "the Great American Novel", and The Adventures of Tom Sawyer. He is extensively quoted, and was a friend to presidents, artists, industrialists, and European royalty.

"That is a simple rule, and easy to remember. When I, a thoughtful and unblessed Presbyterian, examine the Koran, I know that beyond any question every Mohammedan is insane; not in all things, but in religious matters".



Thomas Jefferson

Thomas Jefferson (1743 – 1826) was the third President of the United States, and the principal author of the Declaration of Independence. Jefferson was one of the most influential Founding Fathers, known for his promotion of the ideals of republicanism in the United States.

"In reference to the Islamic slave trade of Americans and Europeans by the Barbary states, Jefferson asked Tripoli's envoy to London, Ambassador Sidi Haji Abdrahaman, by what right he extorted money and took slaves in this way. He answered:

The ambassador answered us that [the right] was founded on the Laws of the Prophet, that it was written in their Koran, that all nations who should not have answered their authority were sinners, that it was their right and duty to make war upon them wherever they could be found, and to make slaves of all they could take as prisoners, and that every Mussulman who should be slain in battle was sure to go to Paradise".


Jefferson later went to war with the Barbary states.


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polite_gandalf
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Re: What they said about Islam ...
Reply #1 - Jul 14th, 2014 at 11:46am
 
Gandhi:

Quote:
I wanted to know the best of the life of one who holds today an undisputed sway over the hearts of millions of mankind.... I became more than ever convinced that it was not the sword that won a place for Islam in those days in the scheme of life. It was the rigid simplicity, the utter self-effacement of the Prophet the scrupulous regard for pledges, his intense devotion to his friends and followers, his intrepidity, his fearlessness, his absolute trust in God and in his own mission. These and not the sword carried everything before them and surmounted every obstacle. When I closed the second volume (of the Prophet's biography), I was sorry there was not more for me to read of that great life.


George Bernard Shaw:

Quote:
“I have always held the religion of Muhammad in high estimation because of its wonderful vitality. It is the only religion which appears to me to possess that assimilating capacity to the changing phase of existence which can make itself appeal to every age. I have studied him - the wonderful man and in my opinion for from being an anti-Christ, he must be called the Savior of Humanity."


Bernard Lewis:

Quote:
Muslim fighters are commanded not to kill women, children, or the aged unless they attack first; not to torture or otherwise ill-treat prisoners; to give fair warning of the opening of hostilities or their resumption after a truce; and to honor agreements. ... At no time did the classical jurists offer any approval or legitimacy to what we nowadays call terrorism. Nor indeed is there any evidence of the use of terrorism as it is practiced nowadays


James Michener in ‘Islam: The Misunderstood Religion,’

Quote:
No other religion in history spread so rapidly as Islam. The West has widely believed that this surge of religion was made possible by the sword. But no modern scholar accepts this idea, and the Qur’an is explicit in the support of the freedom of conscience.


Smiley
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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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moses
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Re: What they said about Islam ...
Reply #2 - Jul 14th, 2014 at 12:25pm
 
The proof is in the pudding, what is islam today?

The umbrella covering on a whole: the most backward, inbred, low I.Q., homicidal psychopaths who live to destroy each other's housing and health facilities, oppress women and work themselves into a maniacal trance screaming the islamic death chant allahua akbar, as they commit inhumane atrocities against their fellow man, because islam, allah, muhammad, qur'an tell them to.
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polite_gandalf
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Re: What they said about Islam ...
Reply #3 - Jul 14th, 2014 at 12:43pm
 
moses wrote on Jul 14th, 2014 at 12:25pm:
The proof is in the pudding, what is islam today?


moses: criticism of present day muslims is valid, and must be addressed. However it is a phase the great religion/civilization is going through - like all great civilizations go through dark times.

Thoughts on this very problem by Bernard Lewis:

Quote:
Islam over the last 14 centuries has brought dignity and meaning to millions of drab and impoverished lives. It has created a great civilization that has gone through several different phases in several different countries. It is now going through a major crisis, and it could go either way. It could descend into a fanatical tyranny, which would be devastating for Muslims and a threat to the rest of the world. Or they may succeed in developing their own brand of democracy. When we talk about the possibility of democracy in the Islamic world, it doesnt have to be our kind. Our kind results from our own history and institutions. Its not a universal model. They can, and I think will, develop their own brand of democracy, by which I mean limited, civilized, responsible government. And there are signs of that.


http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2008/08/19/seven_questions_bernard_lewis_o...
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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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Lord Herbert
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Re: What they said about Islam ...
Reply #4 - Jul 14th, 2014 at 1:20pm
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Jul 14th, 2014 at 11:46am:
Gandhi:

Quote:
I wanted to know the best of the life of one who holds today an undisputed sway over the hearts of millions of mankind.... I became more than ever convinced that it was not the sword that won a place for Islam in those days in the scheme of life. It was the rigid simplicity, the utter self-effacement of the Prophet the scrupulous regard for pledges, his intense devotion to his friends and followers, his intrepidity, his fearlessness, his absolute trust in God and in his own mission. These and not the sword carried everything before them and surmounted every obstacle. When I closed the second volume (of the Prophet's biography), I was sorry there was not more for me to read of that great life.


George Bernard Shaw:

Quote:
“I have always held the religion of Muhammad in high estimation because of its wonderful vitality. It is the only religion which appears to me to possess that assimilating capacity to the changing phase of existence which can make itself appeal to every age. I have studied him - the wonderful man and in my opinion for from being an anti-Christ, he must be called the Savior of Humanity."


Bernard Lewis:

Quote:
Muslim fighters are commanded not to kill women, children, or the aged unless they attack first; not to torture or otherwise ill-treat prisoners; to give fair warning of the opening of hostilities or their resumption after a truce; and to honor agreements. ... At no time did the classical jurists offer any approval or legitimacy to what we nowadays call terrorism. Nor indeed is there any evidence of the use of terrorism as it is practiced nowadays


James Michener in ‘Islam: The Misunderstood Religion,’

Quote:
No other religion in history spread so rapidly as Islam. The West has widely believed that this surge of religion was made possible by the sword. But no modern scholar accepts this idea, and the Qur’an is explicit in the support of the freedom of conscience.


Smiley


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moses
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Re: What they said about Islam ...
Reply #5 - Jul 14th, 2014 at 2:57pm
 
gandalf wrote:
Quote:
Islam over the last 14 centuries has brought dignity and meaning to millions of drab and impoverished lives. It has created a great civilization that has gone through several different phases in several different countries. It is now going through a major crisis, and it could go either way. It could descend into a fanatical tyranny, which would be devastating for Muslims and a threat to the rest of the world. Or they may succeed in developing their own brand of democracy. When we talk about the possibility of democracy in the Islamic world, it doesnt have to be our kind. Our kind results from our own history and institutions. Its not a universal model. They can, and I think will, develop their own brand of democracy, by which I mean limited, civilized, responsible government. And there are signs of that.


Well gandalf a reformation of islamic society / religion / politics would require you to question where islam / allah / muhammad / qur'an has positioned you today 2014.

You can stay in the 7th century quiet easily, by simply not acknowledging the many flawed evil verses, commands, teachings and tenets of the above aggregate.

Then again you can admit to the above flaws, of course this would mean the end of islam.

So you are between the rock and the hard place: keep lying to yourself, saying that islam / allah / muhammad / quran are perfect examples of teachings, commands, verses and tenets for mankind, then you stay in your barbaric 7th century islamic world.

Or

Admit to the faults and failings of islam, it's satanic deity, it's psychopathic founder, it's satanic verses: E.G. the collapse of islam.
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Re: What they said about Islam ...
Reply #6 - Jul 14th, 2014 at 3:37pm
 
moses wrote on Jul 14th, 2014 at 12:25pm:
The proof is in the pudding, what is islam today?

The umbrella covering on a whole: the most backward, inbred, low I.Q., homicidal psychopaths who live to destroy each other's housing and health facilities, oppress women and work themselves into a maniacal trance screaming the islamic death chant allahua akbar, as they commit inhumane atrocities against their fellow man, because islam, allah, muhammad, qur'an tell them to.


Not to forget, most of the illegals are from the islamic countries.
They are escaping to western capitalistic secular democracies.

yep, the proof of the pie is in the eating. And muslims are vomiting.
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Soren
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Re: What they said about Islam ...
Reply #7 - Jul 14th, 2014 at 7:29pm
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Jul 14th, 2014 at 12:43pm:
moses wrote on Jul 14th, 2014 at 12:25pm:
The proof is in the pudding, what is islam today?


moses: criticism of present day muslims is valid, and must be addressed. However it is a phase the great religion/civilization is going through - like all great civilizations go through dark times.

Thoughts on this very problem by Bernard Lewis:

Quote:
Islam over the last 14 centuries has brought dignity and meaning to millions of drab and impoverished lives. It has created a great civilization that has gone through several different phases in several different countries. It is now going through a major crisis, and it could go either way. It could descend into a fanatical tyranny, which would be devastating for Muslims and a threat to the rest of the world. Or they may succeed in developing their own brand of democracy. When we talk about the possibility of democracy in the Islamic world, it doesnt have to be our kind. Our kind results from our own history and institutions. Its not a universal model. They can, and I think will, develop their own brand of democracy, by which I mean limited, civilized, responsible government. And there are signs of that.


http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2008/08/19/seven_questions_bernard_lewis_o...



Islam is an improvement only for the most savage and backward 6th century Arabians. Compared to savages, it is an improvement.

Compared to where the rest of the world has been able to progress since the advent of Islam, Islam must be seen as a strong force of regression and an oppressive break on human freedom, endeavour and flowering.


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Re: What they said about Islam ...
Reply #8 - Jul 14th, 2014 at 8:30pm
 
Soren wrote on Jul 14th, 2014 at 7:29pm:
Islam is an improvement only for the most savage and backward 6th century Arabians. Compared to savages, it is an improvement.

Compared to where the rest of the world has been able to progress since the advent of Islam, Islam must be seen as a strong force of regression and an oppressive break on human freedom, endeavour and flowering.


Soren, islam brought an unprecedented level of scientific learning and philosophical thinking to the world, as well as reintroduced Greek philosophy to the western world. You even quoted a historical source some months back that argued that islam was the primary driver of the scientific golden age of the arab world.

The muslim world today is in a glut, just like all great civilizations go through at stages of their existence. But history has proven to us what islamic cultures are capable of - great enlightenment and great thinking. It is entirely inadequate to simply dismiss the islamic civilization as incapable of anything apart from death and destruction - because of its proven record. As Bernard Lewis argues, there is no reason why the muslim world cannot reclaim its greatness and establish more enlightened and democratic societies - certainly nothing in terms of islamic doctrine.
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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:
Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.
 
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Soren
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Re: What they said about Islam ...
Reply #9 - Jul 15th, 2014 at 8:00am
 
That much cited golden age of Islam was despite Islam. The proof of it is that it was ended by greater adherence to Islam. It was ended by Islam's Cultural Revolution which has lasted to this day.  Independent thought has been replaced by the following of religious experts.
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Re: What they said about Islam ...
Reply #10 - Jul 15th, 2014 at 2:02pm
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Jul 14th, 2014 at 8:30pm:
islam brought an unprecedented level of scientific learning and philosophical thinking to the world, as well as reintroduced Greek philosophy to the western world. You even quoted a historical source some months back that argued that islam was the primary driver of the scientific golden age of the arab world.

The muslim world today is in a glut, just like all great civilizations go through at stages of their existence. But history has proven to us what islamic cultures are capable of - great enlightenment and great thinking.


Islam did not bring any scientific learning to the world,Al Ghazali and others decalared Ibn Sina was an atheist and apostate, al Razi you even conceded was not a muslim, all you have is al Haytham who wrote a book on optics while under house arrest and feigning madness because he feared a Caliph would have him killed.

The muslims like Biruni translated works from hindu mathematicians and passed them off as Islamic. Grin Grin Grin Cheesy Cheesy

Some famous Islamophobes -
themuslimissue.wordpress.com/islamophobes
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Leftists and the Ayatollahs have a lot in common when it comes to criticism of Islam, they don't tolerate it.
 
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Re: What they said about Islam ...
Reply #11 - Jul 15th, 2014 at 3:30pm
 
Sprintcyclist wrote on Jul 14th, 2014 at 3:37pm:
Not to forget, most of the illegals are from the islamic countries.




Ah yes, Islamic countries like the USA and Britain.

"THERE are enough illegal immigrants living in Australia to fill a large regional city, and nearly all of these 58,400 people arrive by plane."

"Figures obtained by The Advertiser from the Immigration Department and under the Freedom of Information Act show plane arrivals from the United States (5080) and Britain (3610) are near the top of the list of those in the country without a valid visa."

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/illegal-immigrants-arrive-by-plane/story-e6fr...
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Re: What they said about Islam ...
Reply #12 - Jul 17th, 2014 at 1:06am
 
Soren wrote on Jul 14th, 2014 at 7:29pm:
polite_gandalf wrote on Jul 14th, 2014 at 12:43pm:
moses wrote on Jul 14th, 2014 at 12:25pm:
The proof is in the pudding, what is islam today?


moses: criticism of present day muslims is valid, and must be addressed. However it is a phase the great religion/civilization is going through - like all great civilizations go through dark times.

Thoughts on this very problem by Bernard Lewis:

Quote:
Islam over the last 14 centuries has brought dignity and meaning to millions of drab and impoverished lives. It has created a great civilization that has gone through several different phases in several different countries. It is now going through a major crisis, and it could go either way. It could descend into a fanatical tyranny, which would be devastating for Muslims and a threat to the rest of the world. Or they may succeed in developing their own brand of democracy. When we talk about the possibility of democracy in the Islamic world, it doesnt have to be our kind. Our kind results from our own history and institutions. Its not a universal model. They can, and I think will, develop their own brand of democracy, by which I mean limited, civilized, responsible government. And there are signs of that.


http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2008/08/19/seven_questions_bernard_lewis_o...



Islam is an improvement only for the most savage and backward 6th century Arabians. Compared to savages, it is an improvement.

Compared to where the rest of the world has been able to progress since the advent of Islam, Islam must be seen as a strong force of regression and an oppressive break on human freedom, endeavour and flowering.




How marvellous. Shurely you’ll be converting, no?
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Re: What they said about Islam ...
Reply #13 - Jul 17th, 2014 at 1:14am
 
I was just wondering kamel if its possible for you to contribute or can we expect most of your posts to be inane in this thread like elsewhere ?
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Re: What they said about Islam ...
Reply #14 - Jul 17th, 2014 at 1:33am
 
Lord Herbert wrote on Jul 13th, 2014 at 9:14pm:
Mark Twain

[i]Samuel Langhorne Clemens (1835 – 1910), well known by his pen name Mark Twain, was an American author and humorist. Twain is noted for his novels Adventures of Huckleberry Finn, which has been called "the Great American Novel", and The Adventures of Tom Sawyer. He is extensively quoted, and was a friend to presidents, artists, industrialists, and European royalty.




"If Christ were here now there is one thing he would not be—a Christian."

- Mark Twain


"There is one notable thing about our Christianity: bad, bloody, merciless, money-grabbing, and predatory as it is...Measured by our Christianity of to-day, bad as it is, hypocritical as it is, empty and hollow as it is, neither the Deity nor his Son is a Christian, nor qualified for that moderately high place. Ours is a terrible religion. The fleets of the world could swim in spacious comfort in the innocent blood it has spilled."

- Mark Twain
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