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Question: Who can we blame for the war in Gaza?

Israel    
  3 (21.4%)
Hamas    
  6 (42.9%)
Palestinians    
  0 (0.0%)
The USA    
  1 (7.1%)
Egypt    
  0 (0.0%)
Iran    
  0 (0.0%)
All of the above    
  2 (14.3%)
Freemasons    
  2 (14.3%)




Total votes: 14
« Last Modified by: Bobby. on: Aug 9th, 2014 at 6:16pm »

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Israel invades Gaza (Read 41955 times)
gizmo_2655
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Re: Israel invades Gaza
Reply #450 - Aug 3rd, 2014 at 11:19pm
 
Bobby. wrote on Aug 3rd, 2014 at 11:14pm:
Soren wrote on Aug 3rd, 2014 at 11:01pm:
Bobby. wrote on Aug 3rd, 2014 at 10:24pm:
Dear Soren,
It is all to do with  Palestinians living under apartheid.

The Israelis want them to leave so they are making their life hell.

No smart Palestinian would stay in Gaza.

Bollocks.
Israel left Gaza in the hope of either giving the Palestinians a chance to show what they can do a as far as nation building is concerned - or to let the Palestinians act as they do and so show the world that the Palestinians are no people deserving nationhood.
The Israeli naivity was to think that the second possibility will be perceived by the world.



But Israel controlled the Land, sea & air around Gaza &
wouldn't let normal goods
or many people in & out.
They turned Gaza into a prison.

One of the first things they did in this war was to destroy the only power supply network
so no one will have electricity for 18 months.
The sewerage system is now not operating.
Perhaps 100,000 people will now die of disease?

The Israelis have done everything to make it impossible to live a normal life in Gaza
so that the Palestinians would leave.


No Bobby, they control the land, sea and air space to stop WEAPONS, not normal goods, getting into Gaza. Admittedly with only limited success, obviously.
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"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
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Re: Israel invades Gaza
Reply #451 - Aug 3rd, 2014 at 11:28pm
 
A clever response from the PM:



Thanks to Yadda.
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Re: Israel invades Gaza
Reply #452 - Aug 3rd, 2014 at 11:28pm
 
Quote:
No Bobby, they control the land, sea and air space to stop WEAPONS, not normal goods, getting into Gaza. Admittedly with only limited success, obviously.


They let only basic UN supplies through.

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Re: Israel invades Gaza
Reply #453 - Aug 4th, 2014 at 12:31am
 
Bobby. wrote on Aug 3rd, 2014 at 11:28pm:
Quote:
No Bobby, they control the land, sea and air space to stop WEAPONS, not normal goods, getting into Gaza. Admittedly with only limited success, obviously.


They let only basic UN supplies through.



Israel murders peace flotilla passengers.
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Please don't thank me. Effusive fawning and obeisance of disciples, mendicants, and foot-kissers embarrass me.
 
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Re: Israel invades Gaza
Reply #454 - Aug 4th, 2014 at 12:37am
 
Soren wrote on Aug 3rd, 2014 at 10:57pm:
Annie Anthrax wrote on Aug 3rd, 2014 at 10:31pm:
Soren wrote on Aug 3rd, 2014 at 10:27pm:
Annie Anthrax wrote on Aug 3rd, 2014 at 10:17pm:
Soren wrote on Aug 3rd, 2014 at 10:05pm:
Annie Anthrax wrote on Aug 3rd, 2014 at 4:59pm:
The only reason Gazan civilians are dying is because Israel is dropping bombs on them. Rationalise it all you want, but without the bombs there would be no dead.

I get it now. Gaza will not recover from this. There is a narrative emerging that isn't new for the Israelis and their supporters, but is appearing in new places.

In a few years, Israel will have absorbed Gaza and resettled the Palestinian people elsewhere.  What a tragedy - the 'final solution', I guess. We will have the true Catastrophe that the Israelis and their asshole supporters have been wanting since '48.

Israel doesn't need or want Gaza. It has always been Philistine territory.

But Hamas will be destroyed as a governing force. Egypt is destroying its paymasters the Muslim Brotherhood, Israel is destroying its tunnels and arsenal.

Islam meets modernity.




What - if anything - could Israel do that would be too much for you? Do you stand with Israel blindly no matter what?




There was peace until Hamas started the rockets. The way you deal with a bully like Hamas is that you do not start a war but when they start it, you hit back without mercy. Especially the third time.

This is not the first time Hamas has been shelling Israel from Gaza. They have been in control of Gaza for 9 years now. They have done NOTHING for their people, they spent all that aid money on tunnels, rockets and high living. And they have been shelling Israel under the cover of 'international opinion' all along.

Enough is enough. Israel would be remiss if they didn't destroy Hamas this time around. In a war, one side needs to know it's beaten. There is no end until then. And it's not going to be the Jews. Wake up.









I know your opinion on that. I've read lots that are similar.

What I asked was: is there a line for you personally that Israel could cross that would make you question or withdraw your support?


Inherent in your question is an equation of Hamas, ISIS, Muslim Brotherhood, Iranian ayatollas, Saudi bastards - and Israel.

I do not accept that equivalence. Not all Middle R=Eastern powers are the same.

Israel is a real country, a real liberal democracy, with a real and open goal. There is no hidden agenda, there is no conspiracy. It is a remarkably normal country (considering the circumstances).

I also think that it will never ever capitulate to the open and often-stated Arab desire to destroy it.


So what would a normal, functioning liberal democracy, under constant siege by forces of backward despotism do to defend itself that I would find a step too far?

Giving in and not hitting back as hard as necessary would be a line in the sand for me. If Israel did not defend itself as it is now then I would say it doesn't deserve to exist and so I would not be on its side.

Does that answer your question?


The old boy loves questions like this. They give him.fuel for his never-ever speech.

Never underestimate the old boy’s willingness to play the complete and utter bastard. He just loves dressing up in his neatly-pressed Nazi uniform and playing his old marching band records.

The old boy will always posture and take the side of the thug. It’s his role.

Strange though, only a few days ago, the old boy was blaming the Muselman for refusing to submit to the Jude. Then, capitulation to brute force was presented as a virtue - the way gangsters promote the benefit of paying up on time.

Never ever, eh?
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Re: Israel invades Gaza
Reply #455 - Aug 4th, 2014 at 6:22am
 
http://beforeitsnews.com/alternative/2014/08/israel-changes-bar-code-to-avoid-bo...

Israel Changes Bar Code To Avoid Boycott!
Sunday, August 3, 2014 13:13


...

3 August 2014
Bt_sRh3CQAAOrNh - Many people had stopped buying ANYTHING with a barcode starting 729, so Israel has changed it to 871, if you don’t want to support Israel in their genocide of Palestinians, don’t buy with this bar code.
But upon investigating the bar codes of known Israeli goods people found the bar codes weren’t always correct.
So where does this leave us?
We recommend you read all the labels and not rely on the bar code as it clearly does not indicate the country of origin, although it might be accurate on many occasions.
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ॐ May Much LOVE and CHRISTS LIGHT be upon and within us all.... namasté ▲ - : )  ╰დ╮ॐ╭დ╯
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Re: Israel invades Gaza
Reply #456 - Aug 4th, 2014 at 6:33am
 
http://www.dailystar.com.lb/News/Lebanon-News/2014/Aug-03/265895-residents-flee-...

Aug. 03, 2014 | 01:37 PM (Last updated: August 03, 2014 | 04:57 PM)
Residents flee Arsal amid heavy clashes


...

ARSAL, Lebanon: Fleeing the clashes between the Army and Syrian armed groups, many residents of Arsal are leaving their town, while others are stuck in neighborhoods turned into battlefields.

A civilian Mohammad Qassem al-Fliti died after he was shot in the head by militant gunfire on his home's rooftop, a security source told The Daily Star

Also, two Syrian infants died and 23 Syrian refugees were wounded as a result on the ongoing clashes, the source added. The wounded refugees were being treated at one of Arsal's field hospitals.

According to The Daily Star correspondent in the area, there is a steady stream of cars leaving Arsal, carrying families who are afraid of the escalation of clashes inside the town.

“Whoever is able to flee is not hesitating, but we cannot flee because the clashes are taking place just down the street,” Mohammad Hujeiri, a Lebanese resident of Arsal told The Daily Star by phone.

“The clashes have become extremely violent since an hour ago [12:30 p.m.], and especially here in west Arsal,” he said, describing the sounds of bombs and armed clashes shaking his neighborhood.

Residents of areas witnessing heavy clashes have been moving to safer neighborhoods inside Arsal, while others have left the town completely. Those leaving the town are mainly heading to Baalbek, or to other nearby villages such as Ras Baalbek and Fakiha.

However, some residents said they faced difficulty leaving. Merhi Fliti told The Daily Star that Arsalis were unable to leave the town due to the presence of "armed men from Labweh" blocking the only road connecting Arsal to the Bekaa Valley.

Labweh’s Mayor Ramez Amhaz rejected these accusations, telling The Daily Star that “the road from Arsal is fully opened and numerous cars have been bringing families to Labweh.”

“We don’t consider them immigrants; they should think of Labweh as their home and we will host them in our hearts,” he said. “We know that if they weren’t obliged too, they wouldn’t flee their own town.”

Stressing that many of those fleeing Arsal have relatives or own residences in Labweh, Amhaz said he is “not concerned about the expansion of clashes into his town,” saying that he is mainly concerned with the well-being of the Lebanese Army soldiers.

“Cooperate with the Army and the state, because this is the Army of all [Lebanese] and he is protecting you from the terrorists,” Amhaz said addressing those who chose not to leave Arsal.

The highest concentration of clashes lies in Wadi Hmayyed, where Syrian armed groups killed two Lebanese soldiers Saturday in an attack on a checkpoint, along with Mabyada and Masyada, also bordering Syria.

An Army checkpoint in a valley in Shoob, a neighborhood on the entrance to Arsal, has also been the target of excessive sniper fire by militants, who are deployed on the hills surrounding the checkpoint.

The clashes have so far resulted in at least 11 deaths among Army troops, and the kidnapping of 16 Internal Security Forces and 13 Army soldiers.

However, an Army unit was able to free two wounded soldiers after raiding a house in which they were apprehended, arresting many Nusra Front militants.

The extremist Nusra Front had posted a YouTube video allegedly showing 20 Lebanese Internal Security Forces members “announcing their defection from the Lebanese Army and Hezbollah.”



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ॐ May Much LOVE and CHRISTS LIGHT be upon and within us all.... namasté ▲ - : )  ╰დ╮ॐ╭დ╯
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Re: Israel invades Gaza
Reply #457 - Aug 4th, 2014 at 6:54am
 
Karnal wrote on Aug 4th, 2014 at 12:37am:
Soren wrote on Aug 3rd, 2014 at 10:57pm:
Annie Anthrax wrote on Aug 3rd, 2014 at 10:31pm:
Soren wrote on Aug 3rd, 2014 at 10:27pm:
Annie Anthrax wrote on Aug 3rd, 2014 at 10:17pm:
Soren wrote on Aug 3rd, 2014 at 10:05pm:
Annie Anthrax wrote on Aug 3rd, 2014 at 4:59pm:
The only reason Gazan civilians are dying is because Israel is dropping bombs on them. Rationalise it all you want, but without the bombs there would be no dead.

I get it now. Gaza will not recover from this. There is a narrative emerging that isn't new for the Israelis and their supporters, but is appearing in new places.

In a few years, Israel will have absorbed Gaza and resettled the Palestinian people elsewhere.  What a tragedy - the 'final solution', I guess. We will have the true Catastrophe that the Israelis and their asshole supporters have been wanting since '48.

Israel doesn't need or want Gaza. It has always been Philistine territory.

But Hamas will be destroyed as a governing force. Egypt is destroying its paymasters the Muslim Brotherhood, Israel is destroying its tunnels and arsenal.

Islam meets modernity.




What - if anything - could Israel do that would be too much for you? Do you stand with Israel blindly no matter what?




There was peace until Hamas started the rockets. The way you deal with a bully like Hamas is that you do not start a war but when they start it, you hit back without mercy. Especially the third time.

This is not the first time Hamas has been shelling Israel from Gaza. They have been in control of Gaza for 9 years now. They have done NOTHING for their people, they spent all that aid money on tunnels, rockets and high living. And they have been shelling Israel under the cover of 'international opinion' all along.

Enough is enough. Israel would be remiss if they didn't destroy Hamas this time around. In a war, one side needs to know it's beaten. There is no end until then. And it's not going to be the Jews. Wake up.









I know your opinion on that. I've read lots that are similar.

What I asked was: is there a line for you personally that Israel could cross that would make you question or withdraw your support?


Inherent in your question is an equation of Hamas, ISIS, Muslim Brotherhood, Iranian ayatollas, Saudi bastards - and Israel.

I do not accept that equivalence. Not all Middle R=Eastern powers are the same.

Israel is a real country, a real liberal democracy, with a real and open goal. There is no hidden agenda, there is no conspiracy. It is a remarkably normal country (considering the circumstances).

I also think that it will never ever capitulate to the open and often-stated Arab desire to destroy it.


So what would a normal, functioning liberal democracy, under constant siege by forces of backward despotism do to defend itself that I would find a step too far?

Giving in and not hitting back as hard as necessary would be a line in the sand for me. If Israel did not defend itself as it is now then I would say it doesn't deserve to exist and so I would not be on its side.

Does that answer your question?


The old boy loves questions like this. They give him.fuel for his never-ever speech.

Never underestimate the old boy’s willingness to play the complete and utter bastard. He just loves dressing up in his neatly-pressed Nazi uniform and playing his old marching band records.

The old boy will always posture and take the side of the thug. It’s his role.

Strange though, only a few days ago, the old boy was blaming the Muselman for refusing to submit to the Jude. Then, capitulation to brute force was presented as a virtue - the way gangsters promote the benefit of paying up on time.

Never ever, eh?


Karmal , youre a smart guy.

there is a basic (perhaps sub-conscious) psycho-phenomenom going on here (and , indeed with many "causes").

if we look at who is barracking for the Palestinians, its all the usual suspects.
the unions
the greens
the human rights lawyers
the left wing politicians
the public school teachers
the light Wink

What common psychopathology has led to this.
I feel that the greens are failed farmers who couldn't cut it on the land.
I feel that unionists are failed businessmen who couldn't cut management
I feel that legal aid lawyers are failed corporate lawyers who were rejected by the big end of town.
left wing politicians seem failed university intellectuals or failed Hollywood stars. You could look at a guy like peter garrett and say (he was on a footing with AC/DC and INXS, he tried to crack the American market and failed, they succeeded, he resents success)
Anyway, I could go on but I think the barrackers of the Palestinians, see in the Palestinians, themselves.
They see the losers and the bleakness of failure and they identify with it.
The movers and shakers , see in the jews, a bunch of people who have carved out a successful country in a hostile environment (both hostile climate and hostile political climate).
When I see young Israeli women in tanks, I fear for their safety, I see my daughter.
I'm not saying I enjoy Palestinian casualties but
that's my "go-to" psychological position.
Thoughts?
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Re: Israel invades Gaza
Reply #458 - Aug 4th, 2014 at 7:38am
 
Bobby. wrote on Aug 3rd, 2014 at 9:20pm:
How did such a serious thread turn into D cups & dicks?



Correction: D-Cups and ducks.
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Re: Israel invades Gaza
Reply #459 - Aug 4th, 2014 at 7:49am
 
aquascoot wrote on Aug 4th, 2014 at 6:54am:
Anyway, I could go on but I think the barrackers of the Palestinians, see in the Palestinians, themselves.

They see the losers and the bleakness of failure and they identify with it.

Thoughts?


Exactly what I wrote a few days ago.

With some  ~ not all ~ the psychology is one of latent or overt self-pity identifying with a 'victim group'.


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Re: Israel invades Gaza
Reply #460 - Aug 4th, 2014 at 7:53am
 
Soren wrote on Aug 3rd, 2014 at 10:27pm:
There was peace until Hamas started the rockets. The way you deal with a bully like Hamas is that you do not start a war but when they start it, you hit back without mercy. Especially the third time.

This is not the first time Hamas has been shelling Israel from Gaza. They have been in control of Gaza for 9 years now. They have done NOTHING for their people, they spent all that aid money on tunnels, rockets and high living. And they have been shelling Israel under the cover of 'international opinion' all along.

Enough is enough. Israel would be remiss if they didn't destroy Hamas this time around. In a war, one side needs to know it's beaten. There is no end until then. And it's not going to be the Jews. Wake up.


Excellent editorial piece.
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Re: Israel invades Gaza
Reply #461 - Aug 4th, 2014 at 7:58am
 
Lord Herbert wrote on Aug 4th, 2014 at 7:53am:
Soren wrote on Aug 3rd, 2014 at 10:27pm:
There was peace until Hamas started the rockets. The way you deal with a bully like Hamas is that you do not start a war but when they start it, you hit back without mercy. Especially the third time.

This is not the first time Hamas has been shelling Israel from Gaza. They have been in control of Gaza for 9 years now. They have done NOTHING for their people, they spent all that aid money on tunnels, rockets and high living. And they have been shelling Israel under the cover of 'international opinion' all along.

Enough is enough. Israel would be remiss if they didn't destroy Hamas this time around. In a war, one side needs to know it's beaten. There is no end until then. And it's not going to be the Jews. Wake up.


Excellent editorial piece.



Except that after a certain number of civilian casualties Israel will be told to stop by Obama.

Hamas will still be there.
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Re: Israel invades Gaza
Reply #462 - Aug 4th, 2014 at 7:59am
 
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/03/gaza-israel-united-nations-school-s...

Quote:
A third deadly attack on a United Nations school sheltering people fleeing bombardment in Gaza was strongly condemned by both the UN and the US on Sunday, with UN chief, Ban Ki-moon, calling it a "moral outrage and a criminal act" and pleading for an end to "this madness"
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Re: Israel invades Gaza
Reply #463 - Aug 4th, 2014 at 8:01am
 
Annie Anthrax wrote on Aug 3rd, 2014 at 10:31pm:
I know your opinion on that. I've read lots that are similar.

What I asked was: is there a line for you personally that Israel could cross that would make you question or withdraw your support?


Grin Grin Grin

She can't fault your logic on the realities of the current Israeli-Gaza conflict, so she needs to shift you into a hypothetical scenario where you then become vulnerable to a justified moral outrage that loses you your credibility.

Don't take the bait.

Quote:
What - if anything - could Israel do that would be too much for you? Do you stand with Israel blindly no matter what?


Grin Grin Grin

I wonder what size hook she's using?
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« Last Edit: Aug 4th, 2014 at 8:32am by Lord Herbert »  
 
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Re: Israel invades Gaza
Reply #464 - Aug 4th, 2014 at 8:10am
 
Bobby. wrote on Aug 3rd, 2014 at 11:14pm:
Soren wrote on Aug 3rd, 2014 at 11:01pm:
Bobby. wrote on Aug 3rd, 2014 at 10:24pm:
Dear Soren,
It is all to do with  Palestinians living under apartheid.

The Israelis want them to leave so they are making their life hell.

No smart Palestinian would stay in Gaza.


Bollocks.
Israel left Gaza in the hope of either giving the Palestinians a chance to show what they can do a as far as nation building is concerned - or to let the Palestinians act as they do and so show the world that the Palestinians are no people deserving nationhood.
The Israeli naivity was to think that the second possibility will be perceived by the world.



But Israel controlled the Land, sea & air around Gaza &
wouldn't let normal goods or many people in & out.
They turned Gaza into a prison.


One of the first things they did in this war was to destroy the only power supply network
so no one will have electricity for 18 months.
The sewerage system is now not operating.
Perhaps 100,000 people will now die of disease?

The Israelis have done everything to make it impossible to live a normal life in Gaza
so that the Palestinians would leave.





bobby,

Recent history in Gaza has demonstrated to the world, that Hamas is - NOT - trying to build a viable nation in Gaza.

Hamas's primary aim in Gaza, has always been,
             to import military equipment into Gaza - so that Gaza becomes an armed ISLAMIC camp, from which to launch attacks against Gaza's - neighbour - Israel.

Observing the behaviour of Hamas in Gaza - the Israelis soon concluded - that permitting open borders in Gaza would simply facilitate [more quickly] the single objective that Hamas wanted to achieve in Gaza - which is, bringing war materiel into Gaza.

By now [2014] it must be obvious to everyone, except a dolt, that open borders in Gaza is simply going to facilitate - what Hamas wants to achieve [NOT NATION BUILDING] - BUT MORE CONFLICT [not less] WITH THE ISRAELIS.




bobby,

Further.......

And across the border, in Israel ?

Today, Israel exists, is strong, and is thriving.

Why is that, bobby?

Israel exists, and is a strong nation, because in the last 66 years, the Israelis have been engaged in >> nation building <<.



But shame on the moslems, in all of the nations surrounding Israel, for their bickering [among themselves], for their graft, for their corruption, and for all of their wicked, wicked choices.




God bless Israel!!




....Thus saith the LORD, Israel is my son, even my firstborn:

Exodus 4:22




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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31
 
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