gandalf wrote:
Quote:Good grief moses - way to misinterpret a theme!
The entire narration 5:15 - right up to 5:32 is a refutation of the christian jewish version of the exodus and conquest of Palestine. It refutes the traditional version of the jews sense of entitlement and their right to violently enforce their supremacy over the natives.
Thus the key 5:16 - imploring christians and jews to abandon their narrative of "dominance through violence", and instead embrace the islamic narrative of what amounts to "strength through peace". It recalls the history of the exodus, when Moses ordered his people to enter palestine "through the gate" (5:23) - interpreted to mean as guests of the locals, and not as aggressors. But the people rebelled and refused - insisting that the only after the inhabitants were expelled, would they enter. For this rebellion, they were made to wander the land for 40 days.
The moral in these verses is to reject the mindest amongst the Israelites at that time that assumed that violence was necessary to achieve dominance in the Holy Land, and that it was a fit and proper course of action. Basically the exact opposite of what you claim it to mean (plus your massive misinterpretation of thinking its about Muhammad's contemporaries, and not the ancient Israelites). The proof that these verses are a warning against non-peaceful conduct is a subsequent reference to the Cain and Abel story, and the wicked murder of Abel by his brother. This is followed by the key verse:
Because of that, We decreed upon the Children of Israel that whoever kills a soul unless for a soul or for corruption [done] in the land - it is as if he had slain mankind entirely. And whoever saves one - it is as if he had saved mankind entirely. (5:32)
Yes I misrepresented 5;20 & 5;21, (as I took the islamic character of these verses as speaking to muslims, explain more later) but I now more than ever take exception to these verses, I will explain my variance of opinion on these verses as I go through them
I've used bold print to highlight the points where I don't agree with you.
You have stated: 5:15 - right up to 5:32 is a refutation of the christian jewish version of the exodus and conquest of Palestine.
I'm assuming you're referring to biblical Canaan when you say the conquest of Palestine.
I will rebut your statement verse by verse
5 15. O People of the Scripture, there has come to you Our Messenger making clear to you much of what you used to conceal of the Scripture and overlooking much. There has come to you from Allah a light and a clear Book.
Absolutely nothing about the Exodus in this verse, it is a verse which accuses Jewish / Christian scriptures as being deceitful and wrong, it states muhammad and the qur'an are the right way.5 16. By which Allah guides those who pursue His pleasure to the ways of peace and brings them out from darknesses into the light, by His permission, and guides them to a straight path.
Again zilch about the exodus, just saying the qur'an is used by allah to guide people5 17 They have certainly disbelieved who say that Allah is Christ, the son of Mary. Say, "Then who could prevent Allah at all if He had intended to destroy Christ, the son of Mary, or his mother or everyone on the earth?" And to Allah belongs the dominion of the heavens and the earth and whatever is between them. He creates what He wills, and Allah is over all things competent.
Once again total absence of anything pertaining to the exodus, merely ranting against Christian beliefs as being wrong 5 18 But the Jews and the Christians say, "We are the children of Allah and His beloved." Say, "Then why does He punish you for your sins?" Rather, you are human beings from among those He has created. He forgives whom He wills, and He punishes whom He wills. And to Allah belongs the dominion of the heavens and the earth and whatever is between them, and to Him is the [final] destination.
This verse is a lie. Christians and Jews did not worship allah.
They claim they are the Spiritual sons and daughters of Y.H.W.H.
Also there is not one thing alluding to the exodus 5 19 O People of the Scripture, there has come to you Our Messenger to make clear to you [the religion] after a period [of suspension] of messengers, lest you say, "There came not to us any bringer of good tidings or a warner." But there has come to you a bringer of good tidings and a warner. And Allah is over all things competent.
Nothing about the exodus once again, just more of muhammad proclaiming his supposed self righteous status.
[b]5 20 And [mention, O Muhammad], when Moses said to his people, "O my people, remember the favor of Allah upon you when He appointed among you prophets and made you possessors and gave you that which He had not given anyone among the worlds.
Another lie, [I] Moses did not preach one single thing about a god called allah.
Moses's God was I AM / Y.H.W.H.5 21 O my people, enter the Holy Land which Allah has assigned to you and do not turn back [from fighting in Allah 's cause] and [thus] become losers."
Another lie Moses never once called upon, or cited a god called allahcontinued below
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