Australian Politics Forum - Auto Industry Blasts Pointless Reform

John Smith

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Re: Auto Industry Blasts Pointless Reform
Reply #15 - Sep 5^th, 2014 at 9:01pm

Kytro wrote on Sep 5^th, 2014 at 8:59pm:

John Smith wrote on Sep 5^th, 2014 at 8:54pm:

Kytro wrote on Sep 5^th, 2014 at 7:20pm:

Let's get some facts straight. The industry was already struggling, and it was likely at some point soon the decision to go would have happened. This is more to do with global economic conditions than any particular government.

The Liberals basically forced the hand of the remaining players by saying you have to make it on your own. Had they provided money it might have staved off the moving for a while, but ultimately it isn't economically viable for the foreseeable future.

sure it was struggling, it was trying to compete with foreign companies that were being subsidised much more then aussie cars were being subsidised ... hardly a level playing field

Whilst I'm not a fan of subsidising private industry, it is to simplistic to just say no ... we were subsidising the auto industry about $400 million per annum and they employ in excess of 50 000 people .... you need to look at the cost of subsidising versus the cost of not ...

on the other hand, we subsidise mining $5 BILLION per annum and they employ 100 000 people ... there is no consistancy with this government. they say one thing with one group, and do the opposite with the other ... it looks to the averag eperson like they simply chose based on who donates the most money.

My point was despite subsidies, other players left and those that remained struggled to find reasons not to do the same, despite the support. There was a good possibility this was always going to happen, the lack of subsidies just made them announce it a bit sooner.

GM was waiting to see what the govt. would offer .. if the subsidies continued, so would they ... i know that through a contact that works with GM

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Kytro

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Re: Auto Industry Blasts Pointless Reform
Reply #16 - Sep 5^th, 2014 at 9:06pm

John Smith wrote on Sep 5^th, 2014 at 9:01pm:

GM was waiting to see what the govt. would offer .. if the subsidies continued, so would they ... i know that through a contact that works with GM

No offence, but that's kind of difficult to verify, so I tend to be sceptical on these sorts of claims. People have been known to offer their opinion as fact, and if not your contact, then wherever they got their information from.

Now I'm not saying it isn't true, it very well could be, but It's not something I can really accept as a valid argument.

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John Smith

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Re: Auto Industry Blasts Pointless Reform
Reply #17 - Sep 5^th, 2014 at 9:11pm

Kytro wrote on Sep 5^th, 2014 at 9:06pm:

John Smith wrote on Sep 5^th, 2014 at 9:01pm:

GM was waiting to see what the govt. would offer .. if the subsidies continued, so would they ... i know that through a contact that works with GM

No offence, but that's kind of difficult to verify, so I tend to be sceptical on these sorts of claims. People have been known to offer their opinion as fact, and if not your contact, then wherever they got their information from.

Now I'm not saying it isn't true, it very well could be, but It's not something I can really accept as a valid argument.

I don't expect you to verify it .. how could you? nevertheless, thats what I was told

If it'll make you feel better my contact is a dept. head at GM and not prone to exaggeration ... although I concede that again, its not something you can verify

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Kytro

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Re: Auto Industry Blasts Pointless Reform
Reply #18 - Sep 5^th, 2014 at 10:24pm

John Smith wrote on Sep 5^th, 2014 at 9:11pm:

Kytro wrote on Sep 5^th, 2014 at 9:06pm:

John Smith wrote on Sep 5^th, 2014 at 9:01pm:

GM was waiting to see what the govt. would offer .. if the subsidies continued, so would they ... i know that through a contact that works with GM

No offence, but that's kind of difficult to verify, so I tend to be sceptical on these sorts of claims. People have been known to offer their opinion as fact, and if not your contact, then wherever they got their information from.

Now I'm not saying it isn't true, it very well could be, but It's not something I can really accept as a valid argument.

I don't expect you to verify it .. how could you? nevertheless, thats what I was told

If it'll make you feel better my contact is a dept. head at GM and not prone to exaggeration ... although I concede that again, its not something you can verify

The biggest complaint I have about government and jobs is the lack of any decent forward planning. It's so reactionary, for the most part. If an industry is not economically viable, and not essential the government should be looking at alternatives and funding accelerated start ups and transitioning. There are cases of this happening, but it's all so hodge podge, there is no defining strategy.

The same can be said of the governments and budgeting. They only look to fix short term things with very little examination of how policies will help in the long term.

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St George of the Garden Gold Member Offline http://tinyurl.com/n 3o8m2x Posts: 9809 Gender:	Re: Auto Industry Blasts Pointless Reform Reply #19 - Sep 5^th, 2014 at 10:54pm The NBN could have created a lot of jobs.
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philperth2010 Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20518 Perth Gender:	Re: Auto Industry Blasts Pointless Reform Reply #20 - Sep 6^th, 2014 at 1:15am The Australian economy only has 23 million consumers (if you count children) which is not enough to support an automotive industry without generating exports for the global market.....The car industry was unsustainable without a viable export market no matter who was in Government!!!
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Armchair_Politician

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Re: Auto Industry Blasts Pointless Reform
Reply #21 - Sep 6^th, 2014 at 5:11am

John Smith wrote on Sep 5^th, 2014 at 5:39pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 5^th, 2014 at 8:48am:

John Smith wrote on Sep 5^th, 2014 at 8:19am:

there is no Australian car Industry any more ....Abbotts screwed that up All we have left are shops that sell impoted cars ... we can buy anything else from overseas, why not cars too? We've been getting ripped off for years.

I'm happy to have protections if we are protecting our industry, but now that the industry is finished, why should consumers pay more?

ford and Mitsubishi left under labor. GMH decided to do so under labor and Toyota were fed up with unions destroying their viability - under labor - and when GMH left, they followed.

get over it.

By the way, as usual, your facts are wrong ...GM did not decide to leave under labor, they decided to leave in December ... Abbott was the PM

If you honestly believe a global car manufacturing giant like GMH was struck by so much trouble between September and December last year that they decided to cease manufacturing here, you truly are delusional in every sense of the word. The truth is that GMH had made it's decision well before Abbott became PM, due to Labor policy and Union militancy.

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Armchair_Politician Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 26280 Gender:	Re: Auto Industry Blasts Pointless Reform Reply #22 - Sep 6^th, 2014 at 5:13am St George of the Garden wrote on Sep 5^th, 2014 at 10:54pm: The NBN could have created a lot of jobs. Only in the construction phase and we don't have enough skilled workers for that, hence Labor's use of 457 visa workers to fill that gap.
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St George of the Garden Gold Member Offline http://tinyurl.com/n 3o8m2x Posts: 9809 Gender:	Re: Auto Industry Blasts Pointless Reform Reply #23 - Sep 6^th, 2014 at 5:15am No, it would have created lots of jobs and improved productivity in most other industry including farming! Try reading the NBN thread, it is all spelled out there.
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Armchair_Politician Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 26280 Gender:	Re: Auto Industry Blasts Pointless Reform Reply #24 - Sep 6^th, 2014 at 6:27am St George of the Garden wrote on Sep 6^th, 2014 at 5:15am: No, it would have created lots of jobs and improved productivity in most other industry including farming! Try reading the NBN thread, it is all spelled out there. Is it in the Science Fiction part of the forum?
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St George of the Garden Gold Member Offline http://tinyurl.com/n 3o8m2x Posts: 9809 Gender:	Re: Auto Industry Blasts Pointless Reform Reply #25 - Sep 6^th, 2014 at 6:31am The main NBN thread here in Pol Sux. But you won’t read it—might learn a couple of things not complimentary to the Liberals and your crap hero Abbott. In fact I reckon a state NBN might be a way to help SA overcome the loss of Holdens and the subs: http://wp.me/p30JJG-5V
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John Smith

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Re: Auto Industry Blasts Pointless Reform
Reply #26 - Sep 6^th, 2014 at 8:15am

Armchair_Politician wrote on Sep 6^th, 2014 at 5:11am:

John Smith wrote on Sep 5^th, 2014 at 5:39pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 5^th, 2014 at 8:48am:

John Smith wrote on Sep 5^th, 2014 at 8:19am:

there is no Australian car Industry any more ....Abbotts screwed that up All we have left are shops that sell impoted cars ... we can buy anything else from overseas, why not cars too? We've been getting ripped off for years.

I'm happy to have protections if we are protecting our industry, but now that the industry is finished, why should consumers pay more?

ford and Mitsubishi left under labor. GMH decided to do so under labor and Toyota were fed up with unions destroying their viability - under labor - and when GMH left, they followed.

get over it.

By the way, as usual, your facts are wrong ...GM did not decide to leave under labor, they decided to leave in December ... Abbott was the PM

If you honestly believe a global car manufacturing giant like GMH was struck by so much trouble between September and December last year that they decided to cease manufacturing here, you truly are delusional in every sense of the word. The truth is that GMH had made it's decision well before Abbott became PM, due to Labor policy and Union militancy.

who said they had trouble between Sept. & December ? You make this sh1t up as you go? GM knew its exact financial position and exactly what they would need to stay. GM was quite prepared to stay long term if the subsidies were maintained ... Hockey and Abbott pulled the subsidies, GM pulled out .. was that simple enough for you?

not sure why you continue to struggle with it

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I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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St George of the Garden Gold Member Offline http://tinyurl.com/n 3o8m2x Posts: 9809 Gender:	Re: Auto Industry Blasts Pointless Reform Reply #27 - Sep 6^th, 2014 at 8:17am And now $A is lower GM would have found exports easier, it was the high dollar killed Holden. Have the shambles got some job creation lined up? Of course not!
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adelcrow Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20133 everywhere Gender:	Re: Auto Industry Blasts Pointless Reform Reply #28 - Sep 6^th, 2014 at 8:20am Abbott seems intent on destroying Australias manufacturing sector so we're gonna have to import everything in the near future.
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St George of the Garden

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Re: Auto Industry Blasts Pointless Reform
Reply #29 - Sep 6^th, 2014 at 8:33am

Did we not rush to sign some stupid FTA, with Japan or Korea, that let them export cars to Australia with zero tariff? (Of course, Aussie exports were very limited under this stupid FTA!) That is what caused GM to leave I believe.

I am beginning to think we need to reassess our tariff policy—why should Riverland orange growers have to go broke because Brazil is dumping OJ concentrate here? Have to unwind stupid neoconservatism!

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