Australian Politics Forum - More Islamophobic attacks?

Soren

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Re: More Islamophobic attacks?
Reply #480 - May 4^th, 2015 at 4:56pm

polite_gandalf wrote on May 4^th, 2015 at 2:05pm:

Soren, the only person here conflating the two is you.

Every time I am critical of Islam, Brain and the other lunatics immediately protest - not all Muslims adhere to this or that Islamic doctrine!!

And with that, they - you - think that you have successfully avoided answering the critical questions about Islam. It's an old trick and it's very transparent.

Not every Nazi was in the Waffen SS - does that mean we can't criticise Nazism because some party members worked in a library?

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Soren

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Re: More Islamophobic attacks?
Reply #481 - May 4^th, 2015 at 4:58pm

polite_gandalf wrote on May 4^th, 2015 at 4:50pm:

Soren wrote on May 4^th, 2015 at 4:20pm:

Give me some examples of 'objective' criticism that you think is not Islamophobic on

sharia
Koran
Mohammed
jihad
segregation and subjugation of women
doctrines on apostasy
doctrines on dhimmis
superiority of the caliphate over liberal democracy

hmmm - how about ones that don't involve blatant lies? Now there's a thought Roll Eyes

Well, come on then, give us acceptable 'objective' criticisms of these. You don't have to accept them. I just want to know what you think is an acceptable, rational, objective criticism of any of these Islamic tenets.

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silverado6x6 New Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 45 Christies Beach SA Gender:	Re: More Islamophobic attacks? Reply #482 - May 4^th, 2015 at 5:57pm In Texas i just heard there was a Mohammed cartoon contest, the place was crawling with security and guess what? A pair of terrorists attack, they shoot a security guard, both get turned into swiss cheese, they say they even had grenades.
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Karnal

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Re: More Islamophobic attacks?
Reply #483 - May 4^th, 2015 at 6:43pm

Soren wrote on May 4^th, 2015 at 4:58pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on May 4^th, 2015 at 4:50pm:

Soren wrote on May 4^th, 2015 at 4:20pm:

Give me some examples of 'objective' criticism that you think is not Islamophobic on

sharia
Koran
Mohammed
jihad
segregation and subjugation of women
doctrines on apostasy
doctrines on dhimmis
superiority of the caliphate over liberal democracy

hmmm - how about ones that don't involve blatant lies? Now there's a thought Roll Eyes

Well, come on then, give us acceptable 'objective' criticisms of these. You don't have to accept them. I just want to know what you think is an acceptable, rational, objective criticism of any of these Islamic tenets.

The old boy’s been calling people mendacious for years, but here he admits that he doesn’t actually know what it means.

Sorry, old chap, we’re back to stupid. You’ll get mendacious back when you learn what a porkie is.

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polite_gandalf

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Re: More Islamophobic attacks?
Reply #484 - May 4^th, 2015 at 6:52pm

Soren wrote on May 4^th, 2015 at 4:58pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on May 4^th, 2015 at 4:50pm:

Soren wrote on May 4^th, 2015 at 4:20pm:

Give me some examples of 'objective' criticism that you think is not Islamophobic on

sharia
Koran
Mohammed
jihad
segregation and subjugation of women
doctrines on apostasy
doctrines on dhimmis
superiority of the caliphate over liberal democracy

hmmm - how about ones that don't involve blatant lies? Now there's a thought Roll Eyes

Well, come on then, give us acceptable 'objective' criticisms of these. You don't have to accept them. I just want to know what you think is an acceptable, rational, objective criticism of any of these Islamic tenets.

Any criticism that is not based on lies about muslims.

Exactly what part of that is confusing to you S?

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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Karnal Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 96187 Gender:	Re: More Islamophobic attacks? Reply #485 - May 4^th, 2015 at 7:22pm Well, G, you have to admit. Sometimes a question is just a question.
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Soren

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Re: More Islamophobic attacks?
Reply #486 - May 4^th, 2015 at 8:58pm

polite_gandalf wrote on May 4^th, 2015 at 6:52pm:

Soren wrote on May 4^th, 2015 at 4:58pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on May 4^th, 2015 at 4:50pm:

Soren wrote on May 4^th, 2015 at 4:20pm:

Give me some examples of 'objective' criticism that you think is not Islamophobic on

sharia
Koran
Mohammed
jihad
segregation and subjugation of women
doctrines on apostasy
doctrines on dhimmis
superiority of the caliphate over liberal democracy

hmmm - how about ones that don't involve blatant lies? Now there's a thought Roll Eyes

Well, come on then, give us acceptable 'objective' criticisms of these. You don't have to accept them. I just want to know what you think is an acceptable, rational, objective criticism of any of these Islamic tenets.

Any criticism that is not based on lies about muslims.

Exactly what part of that is confusing to you S?

The part where I ask you for examples and you repeatedly slither away with some pissy, miffy nonsense.

You are a mouthy git about how I should be 'objective' and offer only 'reasoned' and 'rational' criticism of Islam but of course in your eyes there are NO objective, reasoned, ratational criticisms of Islam because every criticism of it is 'Islamophobia'.

Give me examples of acceptable, rational, objective criticisms of Islam.

Or STFU.

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polite_gandalf

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Re: More Islamophobic attacks?
Reply #487 - May 4^th, 2015 at 10:38pm

Soren wrote on May 4^th, 2015 at 8:58pm:

Give me examples of acceptable, rational, objective criticisms of Islam.

Soren my criteria was so broad that I really thought its obvious that its better to list what *ISN'T* acceptable. It doesn't require further elaboration - except to say you really can criticise absolutely anything you want that doesn't involve inventing porky pies - like for example your Portuguese honour-killer whopper. I heartily welcome answering criticism and concerns on every one of the issues you listed a couple of posts back. In fact I will join in on the side of concerned and critical citizens on many if not all those issues. There is so much that muslims need to address and fix - but making up lies to make your case just discredits your cause - thats a pretty bloody basic point Soren.

You are pretending to be dense - and I have no idea why.

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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Karnal Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 96187 Gender:	Re: More Islamophobic attacks? Reply #488 - May 4^th, 2015 at 10:45pm Now now, G, you’ve been ordered to be quiet. No one has the right to not be offended - except the old boy.
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Soren

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Re: More Islamophobic attacks?
Reply #489 - May 5^th, 2015 at 7:19am

polite_gandalf wrote on May 4^th, 2015 at 10:38pm:

Soren wrote on May 4^th, 2015 at 8:58pm:

Give me examples of acceptable, rational, objective criticisms of Islam.

Soren my criteria was so broad that I really thought its obvious that its better to list what *ISN'T* acceptable. It doesn't require further elaboration - except to say you really can criticise absolutely anything you want that doesn't involve inventing porky pies - like for example your Portuguese honour-killer whopper. I heartily welcome answering criticism and concerns on every one of the issues you listed a couple of posts back. In fact I will join in on the side of concerned and critical citizens on many if not all those issues. There is so much that muslims need to address and fix - but making up lies to make your case just discredits your cause - thats a pretty bloody basic point Soren.

You are pretending to be dense - and I have no idea why.

The Portugese honour killing was years ago and I acknowledged my mistake when the evidence was in. Who committed what terrorist attacks in Australia has al;so been cleared up some years ago - some were Armenians attacking Turks because of the continued denial of the genocide.

Anything else I said over the years that was a porky and thereby 'Islamophobic'?

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polite_gandalf

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Re: More Islamophobic attacks?
Reply #490 - May 5^th, 2015 at 7:38am

lol - you just don't get it Soren.

You think the only problem was that you got caught out with your lies: invent an outrageous lie to smear muslims - but as long as someone can point out that its an outrageous lie, then everythings fine - we have ourselves a healthy debate, apparently.

What utter nonsense. Thats precisely what I was talking about before when I said the Islamophobes start with muslimphobia as the premise - not the rational outcome of a calm, objective analysis of the facts. And your "acknowledgement" of that particular lie at the time exemplified everything that is wrong with your attitude: instead of showing some contrition and acknowledging how such antics are part and parcel of the Islam-critics debate - to the detriment of a healthy discussion, rather your response was basically "yeah ok, but I'm still basically right about muslims - and I'm not sorry for expressing the sentiment".

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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Karnal

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Re: More Islamophobic attacks?
Reply #491 - May 5^th, 2015 at 10:14am

Actually, pointing out the porkies is a problem. The old boy’s never happy when you do. He sees it as a form of treason.

The old boy’s first tactic is to ignore it and hope no one notices. His second is to change the subject and throw the question back to you. His third is to pout and play the victim - so unfair. Then, last but not least, he’ll tell you to FV ck orf.

FD has his Freeeeedom. SE has his self-critical insight.

It is a jolly world, ni?

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Karnal Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 96187 Gender:	Re: More Islamophobic attacks? Reply #492 - May 5^th, 2015 at 10:15am Intelligence and integrity, innit.
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Soren Gold Member Offline Posts: 25654 Gender:	Re: More Islamophobic attacks? Reply #493 - May 5^th, 2015 at 11:29am You can think what you like about me. The question is not about me. Can you give some examples of 'objective' criticism that you think is not Islamophobic on sharia Koran Mohammed jihad segregation and subjugation of women doctrines on apostasy doctrines on dhimmis superiority of the caliphate over liberal democracy
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polite_gandalf

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Re: More Islamophobic attacks?
Reply #494 - May 5^th, 2015 at 1:59pm

Soren wrote on May 5^th, 2015 at 11:29am:

You can think what you like about me. The question is not about me.

Can you give some examples of 'objective' criticism that you think is not Islamophobic on

sharia -

I completely reject both your and the jihadists version of sharia. I am totally against man-made laws enforcing religious beliefs and practices

Koran

I completely reject both your and the jihadist's 'spread by the sword' version of the Quran

Mohammed

I completely reject the jihadist's (and presumably your) version of the warmongering, inflict his will via the sword, Muhammad

jihad

I completely reject any notion that 'jihad' is about war and violence

segregation and subjugation of women

I completely reject the idea that the subjugation of women is ordained by Islam

doctrines on apostasy

I completely reject the idea that apostasy has a man-made punishment

doctrines on dhimmis

I completely reject the idea that non-muslims have an inferior status under a muslim-majority state

superiority of the caliphate over liberal democracy

I completely reject the notion of a caliphate in Islamic doctrine

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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