Australian Politics Forum - Is our PM legally able to hold office ?

Datalife

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Re: Is our PM legally able to hold office ?
Reply #45 - Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:12pm

Aussie wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:06pm:

Datalife wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:01pm:

RAussie wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 9:58pm:

Datalife. Questions:

1. Do you agree Abbott was born in the UK and emigrated with his parents (one of whom - his Father was a Pom) to Australia?

2. Do you agree that to be awarded a Rhodes Scholarship in Australia, one must be an Australian Citizen?

Go.

A I agree,

B. No idea. Another thing you can find along with proof that he has dual citizenship as well as proof that possession of dual citizenship precludes you from pm.

Not me making any claims or assumptions.

Get back to me when you have found out for yourself. You won't believe anyone else.

I am happy to look at any references or links you can provide. No need for me to go looking, I am not the one making claims.

It is no more than you demand from others. It this more lefty do as I say not as I do shoot of thought? Grin

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"If they’re out there in the high seas, what you would do is seek to turn them back through the agency of the Australian Navy".

Kevin Rudd on 2GB, July 12, 2007

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Setanta

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Re: Is our PM legally able to hold office ?
Reply #46 - Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:15pm

Datalife wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:01pm:

RAussie wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 9:58pm:

Datalife. Questions:

1. Do you agree Abbott was born in the UK and emigrated with his parents (one of whom - his Father was a Pom) to Australia?

2. Do you agree that to be awarded a Rhodes Scholarship in Australia, one must be an Australian Citizen?

Go.

A I agree,

B. No idea. Another thing you can find along with proof that he has dual citizenship as well as proof that possession of dual citizenship precludes you from pm.

Not me making any claims or assumptions.

Re B. I thought that was shown on the last page. You can't be an MP in the house of reps stuff. If you can't be an MP you can't be a PM as the PM is an MP.

As Peccary posted.
Quote:

"Any person who ... is under any acknowledgment of allegiance, obedience, or adherence to a foreign power, or is a subject or a citizen or entitled to the rights or privileges of a subject or a citizen of a foreign power ... shall be incapable of being chosen or of sitting as a senator or a member of the House of Representatives."

http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/cth/consol_act/coaca430/s44.html

Having dual cit would meet a number of those "ors".

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Datalife

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Re: Is our PM legally able to hold office ?
Reply #47 - Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:24pm

Setanta wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:15pm:

Datalife wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:01pm:

RAussie wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 9:58pm:

Datalife. Questions:

1. Do you agree Abbott was born in the UK and emigrated with his parents (one of whom - his Father was a Pom) to Australia?

2. Do you agree that to be awarded a Rhodes Scholarship in Australia, one must be an Australian Citizen?

Go.

A I agree,

B. No idea. Another thing you can find along with proof that he has dual citizenship as well as proof that possession of dual citizenship precludes you from pm.

Not me making any claims or assumptions.

Re B. I thought that was shown on the last page. You can't be an MP in the house of reps stuff. If you can't be an MP you can't be a PM as the PM is an MP.

As Peccary posted.
Quote:

"Any person who ... is under any acknowledgment of allegiance, obedience, or adherence to a foreign power, or is a subject or a citizen or entitled to the rights or privileges of a subject or a citizen of a foreign power ... shall be incapable of being chosen or of sitting as a senator or a member of the House of Representatives."

http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/cth/consol_act/coaca430/s44.html

Having dual cit would meet a number of those "ors".

Dual citizenship has not been demonstrated yet. The constitution and its interpretation with non codified powers and conventions is the next hurdle.

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"If they’re out there in the high seas, what you would do is seek to turn them back through the agency of the Australian Navy".

Kevin Rudd on 2GB, July 12, 2007

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Setanta

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Re: Is our PM legally able to hold office ?
Reply #48 - Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:31pm

Datalife wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:24pm:

Setanta wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:15pm:

Datalife wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:01pm:

RAussie wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 9:58pm:

Datalife. Questions:

1. Do you agree Abbott was born in the UK and emigrated with his parents (one of whom - his Father was a Pom) to Australia?

2. Do you agree that to be awarded a Rhodes Scholarship in Australia, one must be an Australian Citizen?

Go.

A I agree,

B. No idea. Another thing you can find along with proof that he has dual citizenship as well as proof that possession of dual citizenship precludes you from pm.

Not me making any claims or assumptions.

Re B. I thought that was shown on the last page. You can't be an MP in the house of reps stuff. If you can't be an MP you can't be a PM as the PM is an MP.

As Peccary posted.
Quote:

"Any person who ... is under any acknowledgment of allegiance, obedience, or adherence to a foreign power, or is a subject or a citizen or entitled to the rights or privileges of a subject or a citizen of a foreign power ... shall be incapable of being chosen or of sitting as a senator or a member of the House of Representatives."

http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/cth/consol_act/coaca430/s44.html

Having dual cit would meet a number of those "ors".

Dual citizenship has not been demonstrated yet. The constitution and its interpretation with non codified powers and conventions is the next hurdle.

I know dual citizenship has not been determined but the constitution seems redundantly clear. I have my doubts about him holding dual citz, my dad had to give up his to work for the RAAF even after serving in 1RAR in Korea when it was OK.

That said, if he does have dual citizenship, everything he has done has no gravitas, no foundation, a fraud. I'll just watch for now. Wink

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Dnarever

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Re: Is our PM legally able to hold office ?
Reply #49 - Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:35pm

Datalife wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:24pm:

Setanta wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:15pm:

Datalife wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:01pm:

RAussie wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 9:58pm:

Datalife. Questions:

1. Do you agree Abbott was born in the UK and emigrated with his parents (one of whom - his Father was a Pom) to Australia?

2. Do you agree that to be awarded a Rhodes Scholarship in Australia, one must be an Australian Citizen?

Go.

A I agree,

B. No idea. Another thing you can find along with proof that he has dual citizenship as well as proof that possession of dual citizenship precludes you from pm.

Not me making any claims or assumptions.

Re B. I thought that was shown on the last page. You can't be an MP in the house of reps stuff. If you can't be an MP you can't be a PM as the PM is an MP.

As Peccary posted.
Quote:

"Any person who ... is under any acknowledgment of allegiance, obedience, or adherence to a foreign power, or is a subject or a citizen or entitled to the rights or privileges of a subject or a citizen of a foreign power ... shall be incapable of being chosen or of sitting as a senator or a member of the House of Representatives."

http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/cth/consol_act/coaca430/s44.html

Having dual cit would meet a number of those "ors".

Dual citizenship has not been demonstrated yet. The constitution and its interpretation with non codified powers and conventions is the next hurdle.

Dual citizenship has not been demonstrated yet.

And yet all the sources which could confirm that there is no duel citizenship refuse to do so.

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Aussie

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Re: Is our PM legally able to hold office ?
Reply #50 - Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:37pm

Datalife wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:24pm:

Setanta wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:15pm:

Datalife wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:01pm:

RAussie wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 9:58pm:

Datalife. Questions:

1. Do you agree Abbott was born in the UK and emigrated with his parents (one of whom - his Father was a Pom) to Australia?

2. Do you agree that to be awarded a Rhodes Scholarship in Australia, one must be an Australian Citizen?

Go.

A I agree,

B. No idea. Another thing you can find along with proof that he has dual citizenship as well as proof that possession of dual citizenship precludes you from pm.

Not me making any claims or assumptions.

Re B. I thought that was shown on the last page. You can't be an MP in the house of reps stuff. If you can't be an MP you can't be a PM as the PM is an MP.

As Peccary posted.
Quote:

"Any person who ... is under any acknowledgment of allegiance, obedience, or adherence to a foreign power, or is a subject or a citizen or entitled to the rights or privileges of a subject or a citizen of a foreign power ... shall be incapable of being chosen or of sitting as a senator or a member of the House of Representatives."

http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/cth/consol_act/coaca430/s44.html

Having dual cit would meet a number of those "ors".

Dual citizenship has not been demonstrated yet. The constitution and its interpretation with non codified powers and conventions is the next hurdle.

Jolly good. So....he remains a a British Citizen so far as you are concerned. Yes?

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Datalife

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Re: Is our PM legally able to hold office ?
Reply #51 - Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:39pm

Setanta wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:31pm:

Datalife wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:24pm:

Setanta wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:15pm:

Datalife wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:01pm:

RAussie wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 9:58pm:

Datalife. Questions:

1. Do you agree Abbott was born in the UK and emigrated with his parents (one of whom - his Father was a Pom) to Australia?

2. Do you agree that to be awarded a Rhodes Scholarship in Australia, one must be an Australian Citizen?

Go.

A I agree,

B. No idea. Another thing you can find along with proof that he has dual citizenship as well as proof that possession of dual citizenship precludes you from pm.

Not me making any claims or assumptions.

Re B. I thought that was shown on the last page. You can't be an MP in the house of reps stuff. If you can't be an MP you can't be a PM as the PM is an MP.

As Peccary posted.
Quote:

"Any person who ... is under any acknowledgment of allegiance, obedience, or adherence to a foreign power, or is a subject or a citizen or entitled to the rights or privileges of a subject or a citizen of a foreign power ... shall be incapable of being chosen or of sitting as a senator or a member of the House of Representatives."

http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/cth/consol_act/coaca430/s44.html

Having dual cit would meet a number of those "ors".

Dual citizenship has not been demonstrated yet. The constitution and its interpretation with non codified powers and conventions is the next hurdle.

I know dual citizenship has not been determined but the constitution seems redundantly clear. I have my doubts about him holding dual citz, my dad had to give up his to work for the RAAF even after serving in 1RAR in Korea when it was OK.

That said, if he does have dual citizenship, everything he has done has no gravitas, no foundation, a fraud. I'll just watch for now. Wink

If the constitution is as you say, redundantly clear why is the federal govt not looking after my dental care? That also is "reduntantly" clear. But I am not an constitutional lawyer nor do I play one on the interwebs.

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"If they’re out there in the high seas, what you would do is seek to turn them back through the agency of the Australian Navy".

Kevin Rudd on 2GB, July 12, 2007

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DaS Energy

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Re: Is our PM legally able to hold office ?
Reply #52 - Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:44pm

How can a person put their hand up to become an elected representative of Australia when part of their heart belongs to another land? What is good for the pollies is good for the people. Citizenship should be openly and profoundly cherished by those born with it as much as those who seek it.

If Tony Abbott can not produce the relevant form RN this means he has entered parliament 8 times as a dual national. Once may be construed as a mistake, 8 times is a matter the police should investigate.

An online petition with more than 5400 signatories has called on Mr Abbott, who was born in London to a British father, to produce his British citizenship renunciation form.
A spokesman for Mr Abbott last night would say only: “The Prime Minister is an Australian citizen and he does not hold citizenship of any other country.”
His office refused to provide documents verifying this and would not say if Mr Abbott had renounced British citizenship.

Both the Australian and British Home Offices have been offering vague responses to a Queensland blogger’s probe into Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbotts citizenship.

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DaS Energy

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Re: Is our PM legally able to hold office ?
Reply #53 - Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:45pm

How can a person put their hand up to become an elected representative of Australia when part of their heart belongs to another land? What is good for the pollies is good for the people. Citizenship should be openly and profoundly cherished by those born with it as much as those who seek it.

If Tony Abbott can not produce the relevant form RN this means he has entered parliament 8 times as a dual national. Once may be construed as a mistake, 8 times is a matter the police should investigate.

An online petition with more than 5400 signatories has called on Mr Abbott, who was born in London to a British father, to produce his British citizenship renunciation form.
A spokesman for Mr Abbott last night would say only: “The Prime Minister is an Australian citizen and he does not hold citizenship of any other country.”
His office refused to provide documents verifying this and would not say if Mr Abbott had renounced British citizenship.

Both the Australian and British Home Offices have been offering vague responses to a Queensland blogger’s probe into Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbotts citizenship.

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Aussie

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Re: Is our PM legally able to hold office ?
Reply #54 - Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:48pm

Aussie wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:37pm:

Datalife wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:24pm:

Setanta wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:15pm:

Datalife wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:01pm:

RAussie wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 9:58pm:

Datalife. Questions:

1. Do you agree Abbott was born in the UK and emigrated with his parents (one of whom - his Father was a Pom) to Australia?

2. Do you agree that to be awarded a Rhodes Scholarship in Australia, one must be an Australian Citizen?

Go.

A I agree,

B. No idea. Another thing you can find along with proof that he has dual citizenship as well as proof that possession of dual citizenship precludes you from pm.

Not me making any claims or assumptions.

Re B. I thought that was shown on the last page. You can't be an MP in the house of reps stuff. If you can't be an MP you can't be a PM as the PM is an MP.

As Peccary posted.
Quote:

"Any person who ... is under any acknowledgment of allegiance, obedience, or adherence to a foreign power, or is a subject or a citizen or entitled to the rights or privileges of a subject or a citizen of a foreign power ... shall be incapable of being chosen or of sitting as a senator or a member of the House of Representatives."

http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/cth/consol_act/coaca430/s44.html

Having dual cit would meet a number of those "ors".

Dual citizenship has not been demonstrated yet. The constitution and its interpretation with non codified powers and conventions is the next hurdle.

Jolly good. So....he remains a a British Citizen so far as you are concerned. Yes?

Datalife?

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Datalife

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Re: Is our PM legally able to hold office ?
Reply #55 - Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:55pm

QAussie wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:48pm:

Aussie wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:37pm:

Datalife wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:24pm:

Setanta wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:15pm:

Datalife wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:01pm:

RAussie wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 9:58pm:

Datalife. Questions:

1. Do you agree Abbott was born in the UK and emigrated with his parents (one of whom - his Father was a Pom) to Australia?

2. Do you agree that to be awarded a Rhodes Scholarship in Australia, one must be an Australian Citizen?

Go.

A I agree,

B. No idea. Another thing you can find along with proof that he has dual citizenship as well as proof that possession of dual citizenship precludes you from pm.

Not me making any claims or assumptions.

Re B. I thought that was shown on the last page. You can't be an MP in the house of reps stuff. If you can't be an MP you can't be a PM as the PM is an MP.

As Peccary posted.
Quote:

"Any person who ... is under any acknowledgment of allegiance, obedience, or adherence to a foreign power, or is a subject or a citizen or entitled to the rights or privileges of a subject or a citizen of a foreign power ... shall be incapable of being chosen or of sitting as a senator or a member of the House of Representatives."

http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/cth/consol_act/coaca430/s44.html

Having dual cit would meet a number of those "ors".

Dual citizenship has not been demonstrated yet. The constitution and its interpretation with non codified powers and conventions is the next hurdle.

Jolly good. So....he remains a a British Citizen so far as you are concerned. Yes?

Datalife?

Hi aussie, you found any reference or link yet to support your claims? After all they were basic facts.....

Anything at all bozo?

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"If they’re out there in the high seas, what you would do is seek to turn them back through the agency of the Australian Navy".

Kevin Rudd on 2GB, July 12, 2007

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Grappler Deep State Feller Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 85343 Always was always will be HOME Gender:	Re: Is our PM legally able to hold office ? Reply #56 - Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:57pm Legally? I have no idea based on observed fact. Morally? Not on your life Mentally? Not on your life.
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DaS Energy

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Re: Is our PM legally able to hold office ?
Reply #57 - Oct 11^th, 2014 at 11:02pm

Datalife wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:55pm:

QAussie wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:48pm:

Aussie wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:37pm:

Datalife wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:24pm:

Setanta wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:15pm:

Datalife wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:01pm:

RAussie wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 9:58pm:

Datalife. Questions:

1. Do you agree Abbott was born in the UK and emigrated with his parents (one of whom - his Father was a Pom) to Australia?

2. Do you agree that to be awarded a Rhodes Scholarship in Australia, one must be an Australian Citizen?

Go.

A I agree,

B. No idea. Another thing you can find along with proof that he has dual citizenship as well as proof that possession of dual citizenship precludes you from pm.

Not me making any claims or assumptions.

Re B. I thought that was shown on the last page. You can't be an MP in the house of reps stuff. If you can't be an MP you can't be a PM as the PM is an MP.

As Peccary posted.
Quote:

"Any person who ... is under any acknowledgment of allegiance, obedience, or adherence to a foreign power, or is a subject or a citizen or entitled to the rights or privileges of a subject or a citizen of a foreign power ... shall be incapable of being chosen or of sitting as a senator or a member of the House of Representatives."

http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/cth/consol_act/coaca430/s44.html

Having dual cit would meet a number of those "ors".

Dual citizenship has not been demonstrated yet. The constitution and its interpretation with non codified powers and conventions is the next hurdle.

Jolly good. So....he remains a a British Citizen so far as you are concerned. Yes?

Datalife?

Hi aussie, you found any reference or link yet to support your claims? After all they were basic facts.....

Anything at all bozo?

Wrong! Demonstrate. Clearly show the existence or truth of (something) by giving proof or evidence:
‘their shameful silence demonstrates their ineptitude’

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DaS Energy

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Re: Is our PM legally able to hold office ?
Reply #58 - Oct 11^th, 2014 at 11:03pm

Datalife wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:55pm:

QAussie wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:48pm:

Aussie wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:37pm:

Datalife wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:24pm:

Setanta wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:15pm:

Datalife wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:01pm:

RAussie wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 9:58pm:

Datalife. Questions:

1. Do you agree Abbott was born in the UK and emigrated with his parents (one of whom - his Father was a Pom) to Australia?

2. Do you agree that to be awarded a Rhodes Scholarship in Australia, one must be an Australian Citizen?

Go.

A I agree,

B. No idea. Another thing you can find along with proof that he has dual citizenship as well as proof that possession of dual citizenship precludes you from pm.

Not me making any claims or assumptions.

Re B. I thought that was shown on the last page. You can't be an MP in the house of reps stuff. If you can't be an MP you can't be a PM as the PM is an MP.

As Peccary posted.
Quote:

"Any person who ... is under any acknowledgment of allegiance, obedience, or adherence to a foreign power, or is a subject or a citizen or entitled to the rights or privileges of a subject or a citizen of a foreign power ... shall be incapable of being chosen or of sitting as a senator or a member of the House of Representatives."

http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/cth/consol_act/coaca430/s44.html

Having dual cit would meet a number of those "ors".

Dual citizenship has not been demonstrated yet. The constitution and its interpretation with non codified powers and conventions is the next hurdle.

Jolly good. So....he remains a a British Citizen so far as you are concerned. Yes?

Datalife?

Hi aussie, you found any reference or link yet to support your claims? After all they were basic facts.....

Anything at all bozo?

Wrong! Demonstrate. Clearly show the existence or truth of (something) by giving proof or evidence:
‘their shameful silence demonstrates their ineptitude’

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Datalife

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Re: Is our PM legally able to hold office ?
Reply #59 - Oct 11^th, 2014 at 11:07pm

DaS Energy wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 11:02pm:

Datalife wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:55pm:

QAussie wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:48pm:

Aussie wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:37pm:

Datalife wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:24pm:

Setanta wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:15pm:

Datalife wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 10:01pm:

RAussie wrote on Oct 11^th, 2014 at 9:58pm:

Datalife. Questions:

1. Do you agree Abbott was born in the UK and emigrated with his parents (one of whom - his Father was a Pom) to Australia?

2. Do you agree that to be awarded a Rhodes Scholarship in Australia, one must be an Australian Citizen?

Go.

A I agree,

B. No idea. Another thing you can find along with proof that he has dual citizenship as well as proof that possession of dual citizenship precludes you from pm.

Not me making any claims or assumptions.

Re B. I thought that was shown on the last page. You can't be an MP in the house of reps stuff. If you can't be an MP you can't be a PM as the PM is an MP.

As Peccary posted.
Quote:

"Any person who ... is under any acknowledgment of allegiance, obedience, or adherence to a foreign power, or is a subject or a citizen or entitled to the rights or privileges of a subject or a citizen of a foreign power ... shall be incapable of being chosen or of sitting as a senator or a member of the House of Representatives."

http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/cth/consol_act/coaca430/s44.html

Having dual cit would meet a number of those "ors".

Dual citizenship has not been demonstrated yet. The constitution and its interpretation with non codified powers and conventions is the next hurdle.

Jolly good. So....he remains a a British Citizen so far as you are concerned. Yes?

Datalife?

Hi aussie, you found any reference or link yet to support your claims? After all they were basic facts.....

Anything at all bozo?

Wrong! Demonstrate. Clearly show the existence or truth of (something) by giving proof or evidence:
‘their shameful silence demonstrates their ineptitude’

Indeed, proof or evidence is all that is required. First of all that he has dual citizenship and second, that this precludes him from being PM.

Not a big ask, just some basic facts.

This forum is starting to sound like the conspiracy nuts who attempt to oust Obama via citizenship and legality matters.

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"If they’re out there in the high seas, what you would do is seek to turn them back through the agency of the Australian Navy".

Kevin Rudd on 2GB, July 12, 2007

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